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To: mark502inf
Kosta, the problem is not drawing borders--that has already been done

Mark, it was done wrong. Borders are human creations, not something carved in stone. They can be changed and they have changed. We can't just all of a sudden, because it suits our interests, stop people from pursuing their inalianable rights. We can't arbitrarily start a moratorium on border changes. Border changes will become surperfluous wehn they are done right.

Your answer reminds me of the way many analysts think. You are looking at the problem of the Balkans (or for that matter of the Middle East) through the prism of an American approaching an illogical conflict logically.

In the past, decentralization has led to chaos, local sherifs, and above all separatism. We are talking different culture here. The conflict in the Balkans is ethnic, spiced with historical emnity and bloodshed.

The problem with minorities in Serbia is not that they have too little, but too much to say. They expect the government to provide them with ethnic schools and radio and television stations -- all on taxpayers' account. Serbia has the largest number of minorities in all of the former Yugoslaviav republics not because they are discriminated agianast, but because Serbia gave them more than other republics did -- and some are still not happy with that.

Decentralization of Voyvodina resulted in local sherif mentality of the local chieftans. If challenged, they will create or even back separatism in order to keep their jobs and privileges. If decentralized regions with majority Serbs leads to separatism, can anyone be surprised it does so where the majorities are not Serbs?

You are right about the individual rights. A democracy has an obligation to protect individuals' rights, not ethnic group rights. But you know very well that we have a method of pushing agendas of special-interest groups by peddling our lobbists through the back door and using "incentives" to win over the hearts and minds for a specific narrow-interest cause.

Again, this is not about violations of civil rights. In fact it is the very government we consider democratic in Serbia that is actually straying from such democratic principles, but generally speaking the onoy place where human right sare being violated is in Albanian controlled areas on our watch -- Kosovo, where Serbs are being killed for being Serbs, and their churches desecrated or destroyed because they are Serbia's cultural treasure that cannot be replaced. It is, by all definitions, genocide -- an attempt at physical and cultural annihilation of an ethnic group by another ethnic group -- as we stand there and pretend that nothing of the sort is happening in Kosovo.

This is an ethnic and religious and cultural clash, with an elephant memory. Applying civil solutions to an uncivilized people (Albanians) is a waste of time, just as neogtiations between Sharon and the Palestinians is a waste of time unless the Palestinians are willing to kiss Sharon's feet.

Again, you can use the same yardstick in FYROM or Serbia as in your local neighborhood. But, the Serbs should use the same method that has been applied in the US. They should create suitable "reservations" for self-governing "nations," and not get involved in their affairs, but also not do much beyond provide roads, schools and hopsitals. All ethnic autonomous geography is to be erased and autonomous regions obliterated. All Serb minorities are to be taught that they are Serb nationals of various colorful ethnic backgrounds, and all should pledge their loylaty to the state of their birth, not of their origin. Minorities are to be free to have their own Sunday schools or private ethnic schools, but not expect central or local governments to use taxpayers' money for such gifts. Expression of ethnicity and customs should be a private prerogative of each individualand not a secular or political issue.

But this still leaves the borders unsettled. Land claims there go back hundreds of years. One third of all Serbs live in artificially and illegally creatred "countries" on the corpse of the former-former Yugoslavia. Before anyone accepts the borders drawn by communist internaitonalists in 1943, one must ask and answer positively the question why should a multiethnic Bosnia be expected to work any better than multiethnic Yugoslavia did? And why should the Serbs in Bosnia not have the same right to secded form Bosnia as the right invoked by Bosnian Muslins and Croatians to break up thre country?

15 posted on 06/25/2003 8:55:35 PM PDT by kosta50
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To: kosta50
Kosta for President!

:)
16 posted on 06/26/2003 6:03:52 PM PDT by bob808
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To: kosta50
We can't just all of a sudden, because it suits our interests, stop people from pursuing their inalianable rights. We can't arbitrarily start a moratorium on border changes. Border changes will become surperfluous wehn they are done right.

Kosta, your implication is that "inalienable rights" are linked to borders, i.e. what country you live in. Inalienable rights are the inherent human rights of every person--they are not bestowed and cannot be taken by any government, although sadly, many governments have prevented their exercise. Further, basic human rights are not a function of race or ethnicity. Recognition and protection of those rights for every person, regardless of where they live or their ethnicity, is the basic task of government. And that is where the focus should be, not in re-drawing borders with the implication that people are only safe or protected when in a state comprised of people just like them. Attempts to do that are inherently divisive and are guaranteed to lead to more hard feelings, bitterness, and perceived "winners" and "losers".

You say Border changes will become surperfluous wehn they are done right. and I contend that you will never get them right. Border changes will become superfluous (heckuva word) when governments safeguard and respect the rights of all their citizens.

And I still contend that a parallel strategy is devolution of powers to the local level--you say:

The problem with minorities in Serbia is not that they have too little, but too much to say. They expect the government to provide them with ethnic schools and radio and television stations -- all on taxpayers' account What I say is: Eliminate that problem--get the central government out of that business. Devolution means to let the local governments elect their own officials, raise their own taxes, hire their own police and firemen, build & staff their own schools and libraries. Not only is locally run government more responsive to the people, but when there is a problem, the local people decide the solution--not the central government. Can't blame far-off bureaucrats whose decisons may be perceived--fairly or unfairly--to be influenced by race, religion or ethnicity. Ergo, eliminate the problem you just described above.

17 posted on 06/28/2003 3:32:15 PM PDT by mark502inf
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