[soothsayer99]

I disagree. Character only counts when you don't like the guy in the other party. I think the proof is in the bashing of Wes Clark. You may not think he'd be a good president, but he served his country well, is about as honorable as they come, and might be a good leader for us, just like Powell. But what do I read on these forums about him? Trash about how he "almost started WW3" and related garbage. He deserves on honest hearing if for no other reason than he served us all with bravery and distinction.

But no, he is bashed. It's not about character, it's about his joining the democrats.

[SolutionsOnly]

You're wrong. Character counts across the board. There's absolutely nothing conditional about character. Wes Clark has already tripped up in this regard - fabricating claims that the White House attempted to coerce and intimidate him. That sort of behavior opens the door to legitimate critisism.

[cyncooper]

but he served his country well, is about as honorable as they come,

Even Ed Koch, a democrat as he reminds us, who plans on voting for President Bush in 2004, said last night on Hannity and Colmes that Clark has been disgraceful in his criticism of this war and this president while our troops are engaged as they are.

You'll need to realize that all complaints are not created equal, and it is a fact that the dems warrant theirs and are forced to manufacture accusations against honorable Republicans in order to maintain an "everybody does it" atmosphere. You'll note that when a legitimate charge is proven against a Republican, it is that very party that removes the offender from a leadership position.

[ModelBreaker]

I disagree. Character only counts when you don't like the guy in the other party. I think the proof is in the bashing of Wes Clark. You may not think he'd be a good president, but he served his country well, is about as honorable as they come, and might be a good leader for us, just like Powell. But what do I read on these forums about him? Trash about how he "almost started WW3" and related garbage. He deserves on honest hearing if for no other reason than he served us all with bravery and distinction. But no, he is bashed. It's not about character, it's about his joining the democrats.

Why do you think the accusations about almost starting WWIII are about character? Seems to me they are about judgment. He ordered troops into Pristina Airpart, where an armed confrontation with Russian troops was almost inevitable.

Then you speak about the 'honor' with which he served his country. Seems to me you are raising the character issue. That is, he has honor (you claim) so he would be a good president.

Seems to me character is as important as judgment. Based on what I have seen, Bill and Hill have execrable character. The disasters of their presidency directly resulted from their character defects. So why should character be off the table?

The nearest historic comparison is Nixon. Like Clinton, a real smart guy with deep and serious character problems. Those problems convulsed our nation as much or even more than did Clinton's.

The difference in the historic comparison lies in the reaction of Clinton and Nixon's respective supporters. When Nixon's lies and obstruction of justice were exposed, Republicans stopped supporting him. When Clinton's were exposed, Democrats just clung to Clinton harder.

Seems to me one real dividing line is between Conservatives and Liberal supporters here. Conservatives think character counts and will abandon their president when he is exposed. Liberals think character doesn't count and will defend their president no matter how execrable his behavior.

Seems to me the other is between the moral relativists and absolutists. After the 60's, most folks who bought into the moral relativism of the 60's became democrats. Thus the stock of potential candidates for the dems is comprised of folks who think there are only shades of gray. And thus, the democrats have more 'character challenged' candidates than the republicans.

So taking character off the table would help the democrats.

Is it possible you don't like assessing character type issues because you are a liberal and understand, correctly I think, that since the breakdown in morals in the 60's, character is more often a problem for Democrat presidential candidates than it is for Republicans?

[STARWISE]

You mean "Waco Weasley?"