Fátima to become interfaith shrine

The Portugese News ^ | 11/01/03

[Maeve]

You may wish to read this if you have not seen it:

EU ministers discuss Europe's religious faiths

Following on the "Congress on The Future of God" held at the Shrine of Fátima in October, EU interior ministers met in Rome last week to map out proposals on how to better integrate Europe's major religions.

[franky]

“Religious observers at the conference suggested that there should be a sharing of mosques, Christian church buildings and other places of worship between the various faiths. They pointed to the example set by Pope John Paul II in Assisi in 1986 when he encouraged the leaders of the world's religions, including Buddhists and Muslims, to celebrate their religious ceremonies in the city's Catholic churches."

Wow!!!

[Maeve]

I posted another thread with this new article on it:

http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-religion/1017038/posts

[fatima]

Hi Maeve,Thanks for the ping,I have been following this and just printed out the article for a priest friend who is well connected to Fatima to read.How is your Mom,tell her I said hello.

[NYer]

"I didn't post the story or any links."

Sorry, Max, I should have double checked before posting. You have taught me a lesson in humility.

"I notice that the link is up on Seattle Catholic where Land of the Irish finds a lot of his posts. "

Thanks ... haven't had time to visit SC ... is that where he also finds his scurrilous photos ;-D ?

"As a general rule, it's not usual for religious conferences in Fatima to generate world-wide headlines"

Do they hold conferences there on a frequent basis? Perhaps it's the wording of the headline: Fatima To Become Interfaith Shrine ... as if though this had already been decided and a date established for handing it over to who??? Who IS responsible for the shrine? To whom do they report? Is there a Vatican Commission that oversees 'recognized' shrines? Who runs that commission.

I have no doubt that some whacko priest would think this was a great idea but, ultimately, who makes the decision? Any Marian shrine is open to the public ... public includes Muslims, Jews, Protestants, heathens, atheists, et al. Is there someone at the entrance to the shrine checking baptismal certificates to limit entry to catholics only? Of course not. If the shrine is open to the public, then anyone can go there and pray to whomever they choose, right? This article seems to imply that the 'caretakers' of the shrine wish to expand that but no specifics are given as to just how that would be done. Surely, someone at a higher level, who is responsible for THIS shrine, would squelch this movement before goes any further, don't you think?

The whole thing is absurdly irrational.

[Maximilian]

Thanks ... haven't had time to visit SC ... is that where he also finds his scurrilous photos ;-D ?

The best source for scurrilous photos is this page:

Novus Ordo Watch

[GOP_Thug_Mom]

"Oh my Jesus, I offer this for the love of thee, for the conversion of sinners, and in reparation for all the wrongs done to the immaculate heart of Mary."

A tearful, chest-pounding "AMEN" to that prayer!

Think I'll go and read some of Blessed Catherine Emmerich's prophecies again...

[ckca]

From a Catholic friend:

I've searched LEXIS-NEXIS, Zenit, CWN, Google News, Newsgroups, and found nothing. Considering the anticlerical nature of many Portuguese newspeople, I would take this piece of news with considerable skepticism.

Something seems to be afoot to tarnish the Fatima movement.

[Hermann the Cherusker]

Previously, the Orthodox Church has declined to participate in Ecumenical celebrations with Pagans. Hopefully, they will maintain this.

I wouldn't have a problem with an ecumenical celebration with pagans, provided it ends with blowing up their shrine with a large amount of dynamite, or perhaps knocking it down with a blessed bulldozer.

St. Boniface set us German's on the straight path by cutting down the sacred oak tree of Thor at Geismar during an Ecumenical shindig he held with the German pagans.

[FormerLib]

Ahem, yes well that would solve the problem but I do believe that would be a bit of an extreme response.

One of the things that is very disturbing is continued participation in the National Council of Churches by many of the Orthodox Christian dioceses in the US, including those under SCOBA. It is quite clear that the hierarchs resonsible just can't bring themselves to "shake the dust from their sandals" and move on just yet. This is in spite of the mountains of proof that Orthodox participation in NCC is doing more harm than good.

A few years ago, the NCC announced a worship service that would welcome all, even a large Pagan contingent was to participate and even lead some prayers. Thankfully, every Orthodox group associated with the NCC refused to participate and each cited the participation of the Pagans as the reason.

There is a great deal of hope for those of us in the OCA that the Metropolitan Herman will use his unswerving support of Pro-Life policies and statements to finally sever us from the NCC.

[Canticle_of_Deborah]

The conference was attended by the head of the Paris Mosque, Dalil Boubaker, and the Catholic Archbishop Antonio Llovera. The leader of the German Jewish community, Charlotte Knobloch, was also present together with the Anglican Bishop Christopher Herbert and Bishop Athanasius Shatzopoulos, who represented the Orthodox churches.

This is from Maeve's link in #141. Who is this Orthodox Bishop?

[FormerLib]

Who is this Orthodox Bishop?

I am unfamiliar with the name and a Google search yeilds nothing at all. It sounds as if it could be a Greek surname but that's about all I have to offen.

[Land of the Irish]

The best source for scurrilous photos is this page:

No, the best source for scurrilous photos is the Novus Ordo Mass, itself.

One of the many "fruits" of VC II.

[BlackVeil]

In a few years the Muslims will claim it was always a Muslim shrine ...

Redgolum, that claim has been around for quite some time already. One particular sect of Islam - the Shia - have always believed that the shrine at Fatima was originally a Shia shrine, sacred to "Lady Fatemeh". Fatima is an Arabic name, it is the name of the Prophet Mohammed's daughter, and Shia revere her as the founder of their branch of Islam.

Shia Muslims from Iran have visited Fatima in Portugal for some time, and at one point were arriving in such numbers that the Portuguese were alarmed. However, they have not made any claims on the site, or tried to change the worship. They merely circulate around, pray by bowing down to the ground, and often stay up all night for devotions. The Iranian media has reported many miracles and graces received by them at the shrine.

Oddly, the Shia will be very annoyed by this new initiative, when they hear of it. They consider Hinduism and Buddhism to be pagan religions, so don't think they should have a footing at a Christian shrine.

[Grigeo]

And people wonder why I'm a sedevacantist.

The Church is not without a Pope, the situation is worse than that.

[missyme]

A Better Hindu with a belief in Christ this article made no sense? all religions might have to unite but with the beleif Christ is the Son of God the Saviour you cannot beleive that and practice hinduism? Go figure???

[missyme]

This article made as much sense as the Episcopalian Gay Bishop.

[kstewskis]

I talk to Lee Penn, the author of the article linked in post 62 as well as the articles I linked, fairly often. I'll ask him. He has told me in the past that the LA archdiocese has many members, both laity & priests as well as some hierarchy, actively involved in the URI.

Thanks, that would be great when you talk to him.

All the more reason to continue to pray for those faithful trapped in the LA Diocese.

That diocese is trying to be led to hell in a handbasket, if the priests, hierarchy and laiety are not harnessed.

[Hermann the Cherusker]

One of the things that is very disturbing is continued participation in the National Council of Churches by many of the Orthodox Christian dioceses in the US, including those under SCOBA. It is quite clear that the hierarchs resonsible just can't bring themselves to "shake the dust from their sandals" and move on just yet. This is in spite of the mountains of proof that Orthodox participation in NCC is doing more harm than good.

Even once you are out of it, you may not be free of these influences. We Catholics have never been a part of the NCC and WCC and we still have folks in up to the hip-waders in this inter-religious nonesense.

I've said this elsewhere, but it bears continuous repeating. Worthwhile ecumenical discussions, visits, and collaboration can occur between Christians with whom there is a real hope for coming to a common ground. Say Roman and Eastern Catholics, Eastern Orthodox, Oriental Orthodox, Polish National Catholics, Church of the East, Continuing Anglicans, Forward in Faith portion of the Episcopalians. It was in fact the intention of men like Fr. Yves Congar, who forced Catholics to confront ecumenism that this be the focus.

The rest of it is just all so much silliness and a waste of time and a production of scandal. I don't understand "dialogue" and "joint worship services" and "lending of Churches" with the Evangelical Lutheran Church, for example, which pays for abortions as a medical benefit to female pastors and to pastors wives. We have NOTHING in common with them. They are pagans with a shiny gloss of Christian beliefs over their excremental essence.

The past 35 years are like a strong madness has come upon the world. Everything is topsy-turvy.

[potlatch]

This article made as much sense as the Episcopalian Gay Bishop

True. Our churches are being infiltrated by the irreverant liberals. If it keeps happening, there will be many 'break away' churches in the future!