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A Freeper Review of The Passion of Christ
Vanity | 2/21/04 | John Fields

Posted on 02/21/2004 3:50:43 PM PST by jonboy

I'm not sure where to start. I'm a fellow Freeper who also happens to be minister. I was invited today to see a screening of the Passion of the Christ at our local theater. I have been fascinated, and you might even be able to say obsessed with this movie ever since I heard about it a few months ago and first saw the trailer (I cried every time I saw it).

Given that I have watched and listened to several interviews and read several news stories about this movie I was as prepared as I thought I could be to watch it. I HAVE NEVER BEEN THROUGH ANYTHING LIKE THIS MOVIE! I sobbed, I throbbed, my Kleenex became a fairly useless mess that occupied the hand not tightly gripping the seat. IT WAS HARD TO WATCH. The cruelty was overwhelming, but approximated what we have a glimpse from in scripture. The violence and horror of what was done to Him nearly overwhelming, but not gratuitous as some have claimed.

As to the charges of anti-semitism, I can understand how a Jew who does not believe that Jesus is their Messiah would be frightened by this film. However, it was NOT anti-semitic. I could just as easily be moved to be against Italians for what the Romans did as I could be against the Jews. If one were inspired to hate the perpetrators if this event, they would be anti-Christian, anti-Semitic, anti-Arab, anti-Japanese, and anti-__________ (fill in your own blanks). I was filled with the grim overwhelming knowledge of my own guilt as much as anything else. As I watched Him writhing in pain, the ribs virtually exposed from the beating that He had taken, as I watched His shoulder ripped out of socket as they stretched his hand to make it to the pre-drilled nail hole, as I watched the blood flowing and the breath ripped from His body from the pain, one thing entered into my mind above all else. I PUT HIM THERE! He could have come down, He could have called in excess of ten-thousand angels. He could have stopped that horrible mockery and evil in its tracks by coming down off of that cross, healing His own wounds, and then saying go to it boys as He releases the angels to take care of business. BUT HE DIDN'T. I am in awe.

I admit that I has moments when I felt like ripping the Jewish and Roman perpetrators apart. How dare they laugh in the face of such agony! How dare they spit on Him! How dare they stand in pompous, arrogant, self-righteous judgment of the King of Kings and Lord of Lords (how dare MYSELF go on sinning after what He did for me)! But as the High Priest is walking away from making fun and mocking. He hears Jesus softly say, taking up precious breath, "Father forgive them, they don't know what they are doing." The High Priest pauses in uncomfortable silence, then walks on. Later, after Jesus has died and the earthquake has damaged the temple and they are very aware that they have done something terribly wrong the High Priest is seen crying out and holding his face in grief and horror.

This movie was about love and forgiveness and about our sin and what God and His Son did together about that sin. It is about the horrible things that men do to their fellow men which can still be forgiven if they will but repent. Some of the Jews were depraved and some were compassionate. Some of the Romans were depraved, and some of them were inclined towards compassion. Anti-Jewish? NO WAY! Besides, the early church was exlusively Jewish. The movie is not about Mel Gibson having some kind of point to prove to anyone, let alone the Jews. It was Mel's passion, a labor of love. Will it profit Him? Unbelievably! Did he do it for the money, not a chance.

Were there any liberties taken with the scripture? Maybe a few. Poetic/artistic license was taken to a degree. There were some scenes with Judas that were extra Biblical, but imaginable. Surprisingly, he was shown as a somewhat sympathetic character, which is something I've felt to a degree for him. I doubt that he was a completely depraved man, he just wanted to speed things along so that Jesus would have to rise to the throne and have to take His true place. When he realized he had been horribly mis-lead he admitted guilt but then went out and killed himself. There was a scene in which the unrepentant thief had his eyes pecked out by a crow. I thought that didn't gel well with the theme of forgiveness and should have been left out. It seemed to represent Divine retribution since the thief had just been blaspheming Jesus. But the cross wasn't about retribution, that will come later at Judgment, it was about mercy.

As to this movie being appropriate for children? That's a hard call. I think it would be best if conscientous parents screened it for themselves first. It is hard enough for mature adults to stomach. However, there is something to be said for exposing young tender hearts to the truth of what He did. Maybe knowing what He did at a younger age would lead to more mature Christians later. Again, it's an individual call.

Is this movie Catholic? Yes and no. Those who see the relationship between Jesus and Mary who are Catholic will likely see Mary as divine. Those of us who believe that Mary was a mere woman who was blessed enough to have been chosen to be the mother of the Christ will see the relationship between a mother and her Son. THIS MOVIE IS FOR ALL!!! I can wholeheartedly recommend this movie to others for personal devotion or to touch the hearts of those who are lost. I believe very much that it will be a culturally defining movie and that it will break most IF NOT ALL of the box office records both nationally and world-wide. The Lord will not be silenced. I truly feel He has spoken through this movie. Maybe its His way of saying WAKE UP before He comes again. If it is, this Christian is awake (wiping away tears).


TOPICS: Current Events
KEYWORDS: catholiclist; christianlist
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To: Pharmboy
Or woman. LOL.
51 posted on 02/21/2004 5:05:45 PM PST by Yaelle
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To: jonboy
Thank you for your review. Does this movie show the resurrection also? I understand that it is just the last 12 hours of Christ's life but I am wondering how it will affect those who do not know 'the story' and leave feeling that the death of Christ is the end.
52 posted on 02/21/2004 5:07:52 PM PST by BlessedAmerican (Pray for our President and those who are fighting to preserve our freedom!)
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To: LS
I see your point, but even in the Garden, He was able to pray to the Father.

On the cross He cried, "My God, My God, why hast Thou forsaken Me."

That, to me was the ultimate sacrifice. To be forsaken of the Father, for me, so that I would not have to be forsaken.

53 posted on 02/21/2004 5:08:12 PM PST by dawn53
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To: steplock
if you believe that Jesus Christ was truly the Son of GOD, how could NOT Mary be more than a "mere woman" ???

When God came to walk among His people, he chose not to come as a mighty king, but a humble servant. He chose Mary because she was faithful and had all the qualities He wanted to project to men.

You should be thankful that most people see Mary as a 'mere woman'. It gives us all hope that we too can be useful in God's will.

54 posted on 02/21/2004 5:08:29 PM PST by Krodg ("My faith frees me"...G.W. Bush........'A Charge To Keep')
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To: Yaelle
LOL!! I am all man and can love you even more!
55 posted on 02/21/2004 5:08:48 PM PST by Pharmboy (History's greatest agent for freedom: The US Armed Forces)
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To: LisaMalia
Channel 3. Well, for me, anyway.
56 posted on 02/21/2004 5:09:12 PM PST by Senator Pardek
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To: BlessedAmerican
The word I have gotten is that the final scene of the movie is of the empty tomb. I do not know that as fact, but everything I have heard and read says that the Resurrection is what the viewer is left to contemplate.
57 posted on 02/21/2004 5:10:00 PM PST by commish (Freedom Tastes Sweetest to Those Who Have Fought to Preserve It)
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To: jwalsh07
OK, since you explained the Mary part so nicely, so that even I could understand, I herewith dare to ask a question that may seem silly to Christians but I truly would like to understand.

What does it mean that Jesus died for people's sins? Because people sinned, he died, or so that people would not sin? Or something entirely different? Thanks for not flaming me but simply explaining.

58 posted on 02/21/2004 5:10:17 PM PST by Yaelle
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To: jonboy
I'm planning to see the Passion. What I'm looking forward to is hearing what Aramaic sounds like. From my point of view, the story of Jesus is part of the story of the struggle against the Roman Empire. There were many Jews who opposed the Romans and their puppet king Herod. This eventually broke out into open revolt more than once and the Romans lost several entire legions in Judea. Many of my fellow Jews are concerned about the Passion instigating anti-Jewish feelings. I'm not worried about that here, in the US. As for elsewhere, time will tell (the arabs already hate us - so, big deal). But I understand their concern. In a way, Jesus' life can be viewed as a snapshot of Jewish history.
59 posted on 02/21/2004 5:11:14 PM PST by captain_dave
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To: TheGeezer
Thank you. Love and blessings to you and yours...
60 posted on 02/21/2004 5:11:41 PM PST by Pharmboy (History's greatest agent for freedom: The US Armed Forces)
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To: Yaelle
Ones sins is what seperates us from god. As sinners we are unworthy of the kingdom of heaven. Jesus was the perfect man and walked the earth without sin, yet in the end he gave up heaven and took upon himself all the sins of all people. He absolved us of our sins so that we may enter the kingdom of heaven, and all we have to do is accept his sacrifice to claim his prize.
61 posted on 02/21/2004 5:13:31 PM PST by commish (Freedom Tastes Sweetest to Those Who Have Fought to Preserve It)
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To: jonboy
Jesus was a Jew.
62 posted on 02/21/2004 5:15:15 PM PST by ChadGore (Viva Bush. He's EARNED a second term.)
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To: Yaelle
When Adam and Eve sinned by eating the fruit of the Tree of the Knowledge of Good and Evil, sin came into the world. God cannot accept sin.

Israel was given the Law, but it was not possible for people to follow it completely.

To save man, God sent his Son as a substitute for the massive blood sacrifice that would be needed to redeem us all. He did this becuse of His love for Mankind. It is a gift.

It is important to understand that our sinfulness and our separation from God was a rule as absolute as the law of gravity. God had set up the rules, and Satan enticed man to break them. God used Jesus to defeat Satan and reclaim Man for His own.

63 posted on 02/21/2004 5:15:31 PM PST by Miss Marple
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To: LowOiL
I don't know what is taugh at the local Catholic Church here in my small town, but I do know that of people at my work most are Hispanic and Catholic. I can count no less that 4 or 5 images per day on cars (at any time of day or night at our work) that have pictures of Mary with the halo holy style. Most the cars have a small statue of Mary on the dash of the car too.

If those were Mexicans then it was probably Our Lady of Guadalupe. An Indian, not Mary.

64 posted on 02/21/2004 5:17:07 PM PST by PJ-Comix (Saddam Hussein was only 537 Florida votes away from still being in power)
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To: LowOiL
I don't know what is taugh at the local Catholic Church here in my small town, but I do know that of people at my work most are Hispanic and Catholic. I can count no less that 4 or 5 images per day on cars (at any time of day or night at our work) that have pictures of Mary with the halo holy style. Most the cars have a small statue of Mary on the dash of the car too. When you see a full size van daily with Mary on the hood then you have to wonder if Mary is not a saint to these particular people. Call me bias, call me simple-minded, call me over for supper, I don't care, but that is my daily world life work senerio.

I do not understand. A "saint" is not Divine. A halo is only a symbol of the holiness bestowed by Jesus upon a mortal human by His love for them. A statue is no more than a way to inspire remembrance, like a photograph is a way to help one remember loved ones. Devotion for a saint is not adoration. Asking a saint to pray for oneself is no different than asking a prayer chain for help.....

65 posted on 02/21/2004 5:17:13 PM PST by TheGeezer (If only I had skin as thick as Ann Coulter, and but half her intelligence...)
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To: ladylib
My mother is a devout Catholic (mass every day) and she said she won't see it.

Yet, it's the story she bases her entire existence on. Strange - isn't it? I remember my grandmother being a very delicate Christian lady. I really doubt she could sit through much of what is in this film.

66 posted on 02/21/2004 5:18:59 PM PST by Libloather (Charter member - VRWC - # EIB-04151982)
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To: jonboy
in case anyone didn't know, Gibson is in the movie. His hand holds the nail that crucifies Christ.
67 posted on 02/21/2004 5:20:06 PM PST by votelife (Elect a Filibuster Proof Majority)
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To: jonboy
Thank you for the wonderful review. I just told my husband we're taking a box of tissues..I hope we can make it through the entire movie.

Bumped and bookmarked.
68 posted on 02/21/2004 5:20:24 PM PST by Freedom2specul8 (Please pray for our troops.... http://anyservicemember.navy.mil/)
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To: votelife
I wondered about that..thanks...
69 posted on 02/21/2004 5:21:05 PM PST by Freedom2specul8 (Please pray for our troops.... http://anyservicemember.navy.mil/)
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To: Senator Pardek
Thanks! That helps....:)
70 posted on 02/21/2004 5:23:08 PM PST by LisaMalia (In Memory of Sgt. James W. Lunsford..KIA 11-29-69 Binh Dinh S. Vietnam)
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To: giotto
I've never understood why Jews were blamed for Christ's death. He was a Jew who lived among Jews. Jesus Himself said that a prophet is never accepted in his own country.

Simple. Because a lot of religious literature did blame the Jews. A good example was a religious book I saw yesterday at a thrift shop. It was a 1940 reprint of a book originally published in 1898. Reading through it the basic theme was Jews Bad. Jews Killed Christ. It's their fault. Ironically enough I saw this book at a Jewish thrift shop.

71 posted on 02/21/2004 5:24:04 PM PST by PJ-Comix (Saddam Hussein was only 537 Florida votes away from still being in power)
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To: jonboy
Thank you for your review and for sharing your thoughts.
72 posted on 02/21/2004 5:25:14 PM PST by 4integrity (AJ)
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To: hunter112
It may not have the effect that many here on FR think that it will.

Perhaps not, but never underestimate the power of the Holy Spirit.

73 posted on 02/21/2004 5:26:13 PM PST by Southflanknorthpawsis
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To: Yaelle
The other poster would probably have said it better, but this is one of my favorites: From Isaiah---the Dead Sea Scrolls don't vary by much.

Surely he took up our infirmities and carried our sorrows, yet we considered him stricken by God, smitten by him, and afflicted.

But he was pierced for our transgressions, he was crushed for our iniquities; the punishment that brought us peace was upon him, and by his wounds we are healed.

We all, like sheep, have gone astray, each of us has turned to his own way; and the Lord has laid on him the iniquity of us all.

He became the Paschal Lamb

74 posted on 02/21/2004 5:26:40 PM PST by madison10
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To: votelife
Gibson is in the movie. His hand holds the nail that crucifies Christ.

How do you know that?

75 posted on 02/21/2004 5:27:36 PM PST by Libloather (Charter member - VRWC - # EIB-04151982)
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To: jonboy
When he realized he had been horribly mis-lead he admitted guilt but then went out and killed himself.

...misled...

As to this movie being appropriate for children?

Is being present at a crucifixion or even at the open heart surgery of a parent (granted the successful outcome and consequences of either) appropriate for children?

There's something interesting, though disturbing, going on here. Whereas Thomas, who saw the crucifixion, said he wouldn't believe in the resurrected Christ until he touched the nail marks (too bad Mel went for artistic rather than historical accuracy here) and put his hand into the wounded side of Jesus, we now have Christians, who believe in the resurrection, saying that their faith has become much deeper because of having seen a reenactment of the crucifixion. If their faith was strengthened that much, it must not have been much to begin with or of the kind Jesus spoke to Thomas about: "Because you have seen me, you have believed; blessed are those who have not seen and yet have believed." And if they equate with a deepening of faith the reacting emotionally to a depiction of pain, then they have deviated from the Path in the same way as did the sect of flagellantes.

This idea of seeing as believing (instead of the other way round) approaches being the same idolatry as practiced by the What Would Jesus Do* movement. It erects in the imagination a simulacrum of Jesus and reacts to it, imagining that the reaction is essentially the same thing as, or as good as, having actually encountered Jesus.


*WWJD is the modern version of pin sticking, a form of divination practiced in earlier centuries in which people would open a Bible and stick a pin to the page at random and read the pin-pointed verse. The assumption was that God would be guiding their hands to show them something he wanted to communicate to them. At least this had the virtue of limiting outcome to something actually in the Bible--well, to a product of something in the Bible and the imagination of the reader as he tried to shape the import of an isolated verse into a means of communicating something to him about a particular problem or decision he should make. WWJD skips the Bible and just goes directly to the imagination part, informed more or less by people's more or less (usually less) accurate images of Jesus derived from the Bible, Sunday School stories, movies, and other popular sources. The aim of both methods of divination is to shift responsibility for some action to an agent outside of oneself. In the letters of Paul and other apostles, Jesus as an example is referred to, but in very specific ways, not as a plectrum of the imagination to divine the future or to decide what to do.
76 posted on 02/21/2004 5:30:48 PM PST by aruanan
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To: hunter112
It may not have the effect that many here on FR think that it will.

But, then again, it may. That would be good news - eh?

77 posted on 02/21/2004 5:31:37 PM PST by Libloather (Charter member - VRWC - # EIB-04151982)
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To: Libloather
Gibson is in the movie. His hand holds the nail that crucifies Christ.

How do you know that?

Mel said it in the Diane Sawyer interview.

78 posted on 02/21/2004 5:31:52 PM PST by RoseyT
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To: Libloather
Gibson said in his interview with Diane Sawyer that the hand holding the nail is his. It is his personal statement of culpbility in Jesus Death, and his personal recognition that Jesus died because of his sins.
79 posted on 02/21/2004 5:33:33 PM PST by commish (Freedom Tastes Sweetest to Those Who Have Fought to Preserve It)
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To: Yaelle
What does it mean that Jesus died for people's sins?

In Catholicism it means that we were estranged from God the Father and God being benevolent, as well as stern when necessary, decided to give us sinners another chance through his only son Jesus Christ.

Because people sinned, he died, or so that people would not sin?

He died and suffered so that we might once again have a relationship with God and a path to His knee, heaven. Think of it to the lesser extent of a soldier dying that his brothers may live, except in Jesus' case we are given the option of eternal life. That is up to us all because another of Gods great gifts is free will and to sin or not to sin is up to us all.

Or something entirely different? Thanks for not flaming me but simply explaining.

LOL, no flames. I'm a Catholic but not the best of Catholics for sure. Many here are much more conversant than I in the scriptures and I have been a sinner in my life. I'm trying to do better but the liberals are entirely too much temptation at times which causes me to utter unChristian commentary :-}

80 posted on 02/21/2004 5:34:24 PM PST by jwalsh07
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To: aruanan
...saying that their faith has become much deeper because of having seen a reenactment of the crucifixion.

Is that bad?

81 posted on 02/21/2004 5:34:45 PM PST by Libloather (Charter member - VRWC - # EIB-04151982)
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To: Cicero
"no Catholic ever saw Mary as divine"

This may be, but what is the Immaculate Conception Doctrine all about (this centers around Mary as being sinless.)

Also, I sure would love a Catholic explaining where they get the Anunciation thing (where Mary is swept up into Heaven miraculously).

I may be wrong but I believe these 2 doctrines were just introduced by the Catholic Church in the last century. Can a Catholic corroborate this?

82 posted on 02/21/2004 5:36:48 PM PST by what's up
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To: RoseyT; commish; votelife
Mel said it...

KEWL BEANS! I'll look for it during my many trips to the theatre.

83 posted on 02/21/2004 5:37:53 PM PST by Libloather (Charter member - VRWC - # EIB-04151982)
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To: aruanan
I consider the movie a vehicle for reminding me of the sacrifice Jesus made, much as the morality plays of medeival times.

Unfortunately (and I include myself in this group), many Christians don't have the imagination nor the historical knowledge to understand the depth of Jesus sacrifice. We grow up hearing "Jesus died for our sins" but we don't really internalize this message. Intellectually, I know this, but I feel a need for a visceral knowledge which will make me more active in my faith.

If you don't wish to see the movie, that is fine. Your faith is farther along on the path than mine. Please don't disparage believers who want to see this. Most are trying, like I am, to come to a deeper belief.

84 posted on 02/21/2004 5:39:24 PM PST by Miss Marple
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To: jonboy
Those who see the relationship between Jesus and Mary who are Catholic will likely see Mary as divine.

No Catholic can possibly see Mary as divine. That's a heresy. It even has a name; it's called "Collyridianism," after an obscure sect in modern-day Saudi Arabia which actually did see Mary as divine.

Those of us who believe that Mary was a mere woman who was blessed enough to have been chosen to be the mother of the Christ

That would include every Catholic on earth.

85 posted on 02/21/2004 5:39:25 PM PST by Campion
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To: TheGeezer
Wow, what a thread.

I have no problem with how anyone feels about Mary, but I don't pray to anyone but God, Jesus and the Holy Spirit. I don't need an intersessor. I go straight to them.

As to the person who asked what it means that Jesus died for our sins: when God turned his back on Jesus as he died it was because at that moment he was bearing the sins of all mankind. God would not look upon those sins. Because Jesus did this, I don't have to die for my sins but can, if I believe in Jesus Christ as my Lord and Saviour, live forever with God. It's all about forgiveness. Because of Jesus I am forgiven.

At least these are my beliefs.
86 posted on 02/21/2004 5:40:58 PM PST by GOP_Proud (Those who preach tolerance seem to have the least for my views.)
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To: PJ-Comix
If those were Mexicans then it was probably Our Lady of Guadalupe. An Indian, not Mary.

I don't know, I'll ask Monday and see what I find out. Thanks for the thought provoking statement.

87 posted on 02/21/2004 5:44:03 PM PST by LowOiL (Christian and proud of it !)
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To: commish; jonboy
She wants to see the movie, but just is not sure if she will be able to handle it emotionally.

I want to see the film too, in time for Lent - there could be no perfect way to prepare for the Holy Week and Easter.

I'm afraid I will sob the whole movie too, but after reading this review and the comments - I won't be alone.

88 posted on 02/21/2004 5:45:17 PM PST by SunnyUsa
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To: jwalsh07
LOL, no flames. I'm a Catholic but not the best of Catholics for sure

LOL....I'm not Catholic and agree with your explanation.

Sinless Jesus took upon himself the sins of the world so that believers may be reconciled to God the Father.

Now try to explain the triune God. ; *)

89 posted on 02/21/2004 5:45:26 PM PST by Southflanknorthpawsis
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To: aruanan
So I guess you wont be seeing the movie then.
90 posted on 02/21/2004 5:45:55 PM PST by ocean
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To: Libloather
But, then again, it may. That would be good news - eh?

I think its a bit naive to think that even a powerful movie will motivate today's people in the same way that the "fire and brimstone" sermons did in the days before television. I even shudder to think that someone on trial for the brutal beating of an innocent will claim that he was motivated by this movie.

Mel's taking a sizable gamble here, but usually we honor the people who take the risks in our society, unless they flop spectacularly.

91 posted on 02/21/2004 5:46:22 PM PST by hunter112
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To: jonboy
thanks! great review. I can't wait to see it!
92 posted on 02/21/2004 5:50:59 PM PST by knak (wasknaknowknid)
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To: PJ-Comix; LowOiL
If those were Mexicans then it was probably Our Lady of Guadalupe. An Indian, not Mary.

Our Lady of Guadalupe is one of the names Mary is called by, because of her appearance as an Indian princess to a Mexican named Juan Diego, back in the 1500's. Her image was mysteriously transferred to his tilma (a poncho type garment) as proof to the Bishop that Juan Diego had actually had an encounter with the Blessed Mother.

93 posted on 02/21/2004 5:51:26 PM PST by Ohioan from Florida (The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing.- Edmund Burke)
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To: hunter112
...usually we honor the people who take the risks in our society...

And, I'm sure, you'll be first in line to announce the success of this film - no? How would you define success? Box office? DVD sales? The converted?

94 posted on 02/21/2004 5:51:36 PM PST by Libloather (Charter member - VRWC - # EIB-04151982)
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To: Libloather
Gibson said so in the Diane Sawyer TV interview. He also says he's first in line as to "Who killed Christ?"
95 posted on 02/21/2004 5:51:59 PM PST by votelife (Elect a Filibuster Proof Majority)
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To: GOP_Proud
It is a good thread, isn't it?

I don't need an intersessor

Do you ever ask anyone for prayer? It's the same thing. God bless.

96 posted on 02/21/2004 5:54:32 PM PST by TheGeezer (If only I had skin as thick as Ann Coulter, and but half her intelligence...)
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To: steplock
But .. if I may comment just for clarification .. Mary had to be HUMAN because if she was divine like God, then Jesus could not have been OUR human representative. God (the divine) was His father, but Mary (the human) was His mother.

God sent Jesus to the earth to represent MAN. Man had sinned (Adam and Eve disobeyed God). Jesus was to be the sacrifice for MAN's sin .. unless Jesus was a true representative of MAN, He would not be able to sacrifice FOR US.
97 posted on 02/21/2004 5:56:34 PM PST by The Final Harvest (The 2004 Election is for the SOUL of AMERICA)
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To: Southflanknorthpawsis
Now try to explain the triune God. ; *)

St. Patrick is credited with the explanation using a shamrock (3-leaved clover type of plant) as a tool. In basic terms, the shamrock has three small leaves all attached that makes up one whole. It can be used as a model to describe one God, but three persons (or personalities, if you would like). Each of them are all God, are all divine, yet distinct in the way we know or understand Him; hence, the Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit.

98 posted on 02/21/2004 5:59:42 PM PST by Ohioan from Florida (The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing.- Edmund Burke)
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To: padfoot_lover
I first sent this to you as a FReepmail, and you took me to task for not posting it for all to see. So here:

Do you pray, "Hail Mary, full of grace. The Lord is with thee. Blessed art thou amongst women, and blessed is the fruit of thy womb, Jesus. Holy Mary, Mother of God, pray for us sinners, now and at the hour of our death. Amen."?

If so, and you don't consider Mary to be divine, then you are practicing necromancy, forbidden by God. So, is she divine or not? There is no middle ground, though some may try to slide around this by playing with words.

99 posted on 02/21/2004 6:00:15 PM PST by savedbygrace
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To: CyberAnt
Good explanation!
100 posted on 02/21/2004 6:01:20 PM PST by Ohioan from Florida (The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing.- Edmund Burke)
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