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Many evangelicals unwittingly live as feminists, Moore says
Florida Baptist Witness ^ | Published December 8, 2005 | Russell D. Moore

Posted on 12/31/2005 5:12:35 AM PST by Popman

VALLEY FORGE, Pa. (BP)–Egalitarians are winning the gender debate because evangelical complementarian men have largely abdicated their biblically ordained roles as head of the home and have, in practice, embraced contemporary pagan feminism, Russell D. Moore said in a presentation at the 57th annual meeting of the Evangelical Theological Society (ETS) Nov. 17 in Valley Forge, Pa.

Complementarianism is the view that men and women have been created equally in God’s image but have different, yet complementary, roles. Egalitarianism is the view that men and women have been gifted equally so that no role is limited to one sex.

Moore called for a complementarian response built upon a thoroughly biblical vision of male headship in which men lead their families and churches by mirroring God the Father, whom Scripture portrays as the loving, sacrificial, protective Patriarch of His people. Moore is dean of the school of theology and senior vice president for academic administration at Southern Baptist Theological Seminary in Louisville, Ky.

Many complementarians are living according to egalitarian presumptions, and research has shown many conservative and evangelical households to be among the “softest” when it comes to familial harmony, relational happiness and emotional health, Moore said.

“Evangelicals maintain headship in the sphere of ideas, but practical decisions are made in most evangelical homes through a process of negotiation, mutual submission, and consensus,” Moore said. “That’s what our forefathers would have called feminism – and our foremothers, too.”

Egalitarian views are carrying the day within evangelical churches and homes, Moore said, because complementarians have not dealt sufficiently with the forces that drive the feminist impulse: Western notions of consumerism and therapy.

This therapeutic and consumerist atmosphere has led evangelicals away from a view that sees Scripture as the external, objective standard of truth and has pushed them to look inside themselves to find ultimate truth, Moore said. Because self and not Scripture is the final authority, evangelical homes and churches hold complementarian views but practice egalitarianism, he said.

“Complementarian churches are just as captive to the consumerist drive of American culture as egalitarians, if not more so,” Moore said.

If evangelical homes and churches are to recover from the confusion of egalitarianism, Moore said, they must embrace a full-orbed vision of biblical patriarchy that restores the male to his divinely ordained station as head of the home and church.

Moore pointed out that the word “patriarchy” has developed negative connotations, even among evangelicals, in direct proportion to the rise of so-called “evangelical feminism,” a movement that began in the 1970s. But the historic Christian faith itself is built upon a thoroughly biblical vision of patriarchy, he said.

“Evangelicals should ask why patriarchy seems negative to those of us who serve the God of Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob – the God and Father of Jesus Christ,” Moore said.

“We must remember that ‘evangelical’ is also a negative term in many contexts. We must allow the patriarchs and apostles themselves, not the editors of Playboy or Ms. Magazine, to define the grammar of our faith.”

The model of biblical patriarchy/male headship that evangelicals must rediscover is tied to Scripture’s teaching of the fatherhood of God, Moore said. The Bible portrays God the Father as existing in covenant relationship with the Son in a way that defines the covenantal standing and inheritance of believers, he said.

The fatherhood of God is central to the Gospel and male headship, and, when practiced biblically, offers a living picture of the redemption believers have in Christ, Moore said.

“Even the so-called ‘egalitarian proof-texts’ not only fail to demonstrate an evangelical feminist argument, [but] they actually prove the opposite,” he said. “Galatians 3:28, for example, is all about patriarchy – a Father who provides his firstborn son with a cosmic inheritance, an inheritance that is shared by all who find their identity in Christ, Jew or Greek, male or female, slave or free.

“This understanding of archetypal patriarchy is grounded, then, in the overarching theme of all of Scripture – the summing up of all things in Christ [in Ephesians 1:10]. It does not divide God’s purposes, His role as Father from His role as Creator from His role as Savior from His role as King.

“To the contrary, the patriarchal structures that exist in the creation order point to His headship – a headship that is oriented toward redemption in Christ [in Hebrews 12:5-11].”

An embrace of biblical patriarchy also protects the doctrine of God from aberrations such as the impersonal deity of Protestant liberalism and the unstable “most moved mover” of open theism, he said.

A rejection of male headship leads to a redefinition of divine Fatherhood and divine sovereignty, Moore said. He pointed to open theism (a view that argues God’s knowledge of the future is limited) as an example of the dangers of rejecting biblical patriarchy. Open theism is built upon a denial of the Scripture’s portrayal of God as the sovereign Head of His creation, he said.

“Open theism is not more dangerous than evangelical feminism, or even all that different,” Moore said. “It is only the end result of a doctrine of God shorn of patriarchy.”

Moore pointed out that a growing trend exists within evangelicalism in which “soft” complementarians seek to indict other complementarians for not writing frequently against spousal abuse. This charge is a red herring, Moore said, because complementarians address the issue consistently.

This charge itself, however, reveals a tacit acceptance by evangelicals of a false egalitarian charge that says male headship leads to abuse, he said. Instead, Moore said, a biblical view of male headship and gender roles actually protect against spousal and child abuse because it does not posit male privilege, but instead demands male responsibility.

“Ironically, a more patriarchal complementarianism will resonate among a generation seeking stability in a family-fractured Western culture in ways that soft-bellied, big-tent complementarianism never can,” Moore said.

“And it will also address the needs of hurting women and children far better, because it is rooted in the primary biblical means for protecting women and children–calling men to responsibility. Patriarchy is good for women, good for children, and good for families.”


TOPICS:
KEYWORDS: evangelicals; feminists; religion; submission

1 posted on 12/31/2005 5:12:37 AM PST by Popman
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To: Fzob

Ping


2 posted on 12/31/2005 5:13:03 AM PST by Popman (In politics, ideas are more important than individuals.)
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To: Popman

Get ur b!tch ars3 in da kitchen!

he he


3 posted on 12/31/2005 5:14:21 AM PST by LesbianThespianGymnasticMidget (God punishes Conservatives by making them argue with fools.)
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To: LesbianThespianGymnasticMidget

Well, I guess if your religion doesn't allow sex for fun, beer, or dancing, then controlling one's wife is all that's left.


4 posted on 12/31/2005 5:20:12 AM PST by Mercat (It's still Christmas)
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To: LesbianThespianGymnasticMidget
“Evangelicals maintain headship in the sphere of ideas, but practical decisions are made in most evangelical homes through a process of negotiation, mutual submission, and consensus,”

Not quite the same as "Get ur b!tch ars3 in da kitchen!"

5 posted on 12/31/2005 5:20:52 AM PST by Popman (In politics, ideas are more important than individuals.)
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To: Mercat
Well, I guess if your religion doesn't allow sex for fun, beer, or dancing, then controlling one's wife is all that's left.

I must have missed that in the article.

6 posted on 12/31/2005 5:22:00 AM PST by Popman (In politics, ideas are more important than individuals.)
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To: Popman

Thanks, that was a nice way to tell me that my post was really stupid and I do apologize.


7 posted on 12/31/2005 5:23:06 AM PST by Mercat (It's still Christmas)
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To: Popman
I think the guy has a point, but this statement is proving hard to digets:
“Evangelicals maintain headship in the sphere of ideas, but practical decisions are made in most evangelical homes through a process of negotiation, mutual submission, and consensus,” Moore said. “That’s what our forefathers would have called feminism – and our foremothers, too.”

I attempt to operate as the biblical head, but the above sounds like a fair description of my household, and it also sounds like Ephesians 5. Headship implies an ultimate authority, but it would seem to be an abuse of that authority not to take the other person's wishes into account and, unless there's a good reason not to, accommodating them.

8 posted on 12/31/2005 5:23:06 AM PST by Shalom Israel (Pray for the peace of Jerusalem.)
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To: Popman
The feminization of Christianity. It doesn't work.
9 posted on 12/31/2005 5:24:22 AM PST by bella1
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To: Mercat

No problem. Got that first cup of coffee in you yet? Always helps me


10 posted on 12/31/2005 5:29:15 AM PST by Popman (In politics, ideas are more important than individuals.)
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To: Mercat

One of our friends was (is still) married to a man who believed all of this.

He keeps all of the family savings in an account that only he has access to. He, a gamefully employed computer programmer, would give her $300 per month for groceries, gas and food. This was supposed to cover expenses for her and the five kids. He forbid her to get a job. When she did, he sold her car.

He would routinely get her up at 2:00 am and lecture her for two hours about submission. He told me that in today's society, that if he tried to be the Biblical leader of the family (as he understood the Bible) he would be in jail.

She has slept with a knife under her pillow for last 5 years.


11 posted on 12/31/2005 5:30:34 AM PST by Mr. Brightside
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To: Mercat

Well stated. That's about the sum and substance of it, so it seems.


12 posted on 12/31/2005 5:32:34 AM PST by A Jovial Cad (The updated AJC profile page for 2006 is now available!***)
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To: bella1
The feminization of Christianity. It doesn't work.

I believe that was point of the article. Most Christians don't realize the extent of the feminization of their homes and culture

13 posted on 12/31/2005 5:32:38 AM PST by Popman (In politics, ideas are more important than individuals.)
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To: Popman

FYI...

The author thinks that "negotiation, mutual submission, and consensus" is a BAD thing.


14 posted on 12/31/2005 5:33:12 AM PST by Mr. Brightside
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To: Popman
?Egalitarian views are carrying the day within evangelical-&-catholic churches and homes, Moore said, because complementarians have not dealt sufficiently with the forces that drive the feminist impulse: Western notions of consumerism-666 and therapy-666?

1st Timothy 2:11-15

1st Timothy 2:5

Hebrews 1:1-3

/Narnia pagan nonsense

15 posted on 12/31/2005 5:33:57 AM PST by maestro
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To: Shalom Israel
Husbands, love your wives, even as Christ also loved the church, and gave himself for it;...
So ought men to love their wives as their own bodies. He that loveth his wife loveth himself....
For no man ever yet hated his own flesh; but nourisheth and cherisheth it, even as the Lord the church:

The rest of Ephesians about covers your concerns

16 posted on 12/31/2005 5:37:39 AM PST by Popman (In politics, ideas are more important than individuals.)
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To: Mr. Brightside
Moore said, a biblical view of male headship and gender roles actually protect against spousal and child abuse because it does not posit male privilege, but instead demands male responsibility.

Your friends husband has confused his maleness as a privilege rather than a responsibility.

He is not living according to Scriptures if he is treating his wife in that manner

Of course for that one nut case your friend is married to, there are millions of husbands who lead their homes like real loving husbands and Christians.

17 posted on 12/31/2005 5:49:39 AM PST by Popman (In politics, ideas are more important than individuals.)
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To: maestro

Could you please show me where it says Catholic?

I do agree with you and these are the groups that need to stick together when it comes to family issues. No matter what our differences of faith, we should be the hand that rocks the cradle in family issues of this country.

I love my hubby. He loves me. When he gives an absolute, it is just that. I do it because I am so very blessed by God with the gift of him. Why don't some women get this?


18 posted on 12/31/2005 5:50:29 AM PST by netmilsmom (God blessed me with a wonderful husband.)
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To: Popman
research has shown many conservative and evangelical households to be among the “softest” when it comes to familial harmony, relational happiness and emotional health, Moore said

Does this mean anything in English, or did it come from a Random Gibberish Generator?

19 posted on 12/31/2005 5:53:26 AM PST by Tax-chick (I am just not sure how to get from here to where we want to be.)
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To: Popman
“Evangelicals maintain headship in the sphere of ideas, but practical decisions are made in most evangelical homes through a process of negotiation, mutual submission, and consensus,” Moore said. “That’s what our forefathers would have called feminism – and our foremothers, too.”

A lot of our forefathers supported slavery, too ... and used the bible to justify it.

The concept of "submission" has historically been abused and taken to an extreme. But it's only simple biblical law and order that starts in the home. When a decision has to be made and cannot be agreed to, someone has to be in charge. And it's the husband's responsibility, not right.

This "submission" the bible speaks is the the wife's responsibility to agree to a husband's decision only after negotiation, mutual submission and consensus should fail.

20 posted on 12/31/2005 5:56:05 AM PST by manwiththehands (My Christmas wish: I wish Republicans were running the country.)
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To: netmilsmom
In today's 'femmi' world of evangelicalism....it is ALWAYS...'Evangelicals and Catholics TOGETHER'....etc.....!!!

visit any theological SEMANARY.....

/Narnia pagan nonsense

21 posted on 12/31/2005 5:58:38 AM PST by maestro
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To: Tax-chick

I think he was saying in a nice gibberish sort of way, that "many conservative and evangelical households" are just like the heathens down the street.


22 posted on 12/31/2005 6:00:39 AM PST by Popman (In politics, ideas are more important than individuals.)
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To: maestro

Is your cat using your computer this morning?


23 posted on 12/31/2005 6:00:49 AM PST by Tax-chick (I am just not sure how to get from here to where we want to be.)
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To: Mr. Brightside
There is an element of men in the church whom I refer to as the "Taliban wing" of the Christian church.

These men have twisted Scripture into something alien; something that in their own minds gives them license to lord over women their superior physical strength and in the process, terrorize their families into cowering, fearful, unhappy victims. These are men who generally have very low self-esteem, have issues with women that have not been resolved through therapy, and derive enormous satisfaction from behaving like power nazis in their own homes- the only place where the behavior is tolerated.

These are men who are living in sin- they are not living according to the Scriptural mandates for the roles of men and women in marriage, but according to their own fantasies of the "lowly" status of women, and their own perceived superiority.

Nowhere in Scripture can any validation of this behavior be found. I hope that your friend's situation can be made better at some point. She may have to leave the jerk.

24 posted on 12/31/2005 6:01:31 AM PST by GiovannaNicoletta
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To: maestro

OH! I get it!


25 posted on 12/31/2005 6:03:27 AM PST by netmilsmom (God blessed me with a wonderful husband.)
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To: Popman

Could be. I think he makes some reasonable points, and that, often, "mutual submission, negotiation and consensus" is code for "the man doesn't want to be bothered with the minutiae of life, like the credit card bill and the children's education."


26 posted on 12/31/2005 6:03:45 AM PST by Tax-chick (I am just not sure how to get from here to where we want to be.)
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To: Popman
The rest of Ephesians about covers your concerns

Right, but it seems to contradict Moore.

27 posted on 12/31/2005 6:14:38 AM PST by Shalom Israel (Pray for the peace of Jerusalem.)
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To: Shalom Israel
Right, but it seems to contradict Moore.

Where exactly in the article does Moore contradict the principles of Ephesians?

28 posted on 12/31/2005 6:21:09 AM PST by Popman (In politics, ideas are more important than individuals.)
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To: Tax-chick
"mutual submission, negotiation and consensus"

Bear in mind, Moore is using these terms in the context of the way feminist use them.

These terms has semantic meaning to the radical feminist that are far different than the avg person.............which he should have pointed out.

29 posted on 12/31/2005 6:25:24 AM PST by Popman (In politics, ideas are more important than individuals.)
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To: Popman
I quoted it in #8 already. Moore describes "negotiation, musual submission and consensus" as "feminism", meaning that it's not the proper way to operate in a family.
30 posted on 12/31/2005 6:28:02 AM PST by Shalom Israel (Pray for the peace of Jerusalem.)
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To: GiovannaNicoletta
I hope that your friend's situation can be made better at some point. She may have to leave the jerk.

It is being made better. She served him with divorce papers. He skipped the meeting with the judge and left the state with one of the kids.

And the judge threw the book at him.

31 posted on 12/31/2005 7:14:47 AM PST by Mr. Brightside
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To: Popman

That's a good point. Too much negotiation and consensus is just a waste of time, in my opinion. Many issues aren't worth the effort. If everything is being negotiated and compromised, that could indicate a power struggle in the marriage, which is certainly not the Biblical model.

I tend to disagree with using "feminism" as an explanation, though, because that suggests that men have no opportunity to take responsibility for their families, when they do. While it's true that some men are abusive and use religion as their excuse, and some are (in my opinion) overcontrolling out of genuinely loving motives, there are many who have made the choice not to make an effort outside their jobs and hobbies.


32 posted on 12/31/2005 8:00:56 AM PST by Tax-chick (I am just not sure how to get from here to where we want to be.)
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To: Popman
Its also the name of a book, "The Feminization of Christianity". A must read.
33 posted on 12/31/2005 8:39:28 AM PST by bella1
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To: GiovannaNicoletta

"These men have twisted Scripture into something alien; something that in their own minds gives them license to lord over women their superior physical strength and in the process, terrorize their families into cowering, fearful, unhappy victims. These are men who generally have very low self-esteem, have issues with women that have not been resolved through therapy, and derive enormous satisfaction from behaving like power nazis in their own homes- the only place where the behavior is tolerated.

These are men who are living in sin- they are not living according to the Scriptural mandates for the roles of men and women in marriage, but according to their own fantasies of the "lowly" status of women, and their own perceived superiority."

Perversely just like Muslims.


34 posted on 01/04/2006 9:25:15 AM PST by Niuhuru
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To: Popman
Instead, Moore said, a biblical view of male headship and gender roles actually protect against spousal and child abuse because it does not posit male privilege, but instead demands male responsibility.

Something that needs to be kept front-and-center, IMO. The same passage which calls on wives to submit to their husbands also calls on husbands to love their wives as Christ loved the Church. My wife is called upon to submit to my headship. I'm called upon to be crucified for her.

"Could we please re-negotiate this package, honey? I'm not sure this trade is as fair as I thought it'd be ..."

35 posted on 01/04/2006 9:48:34 AM PST by Campion ("I am so tired of you, liberal church in America" -- Mother Angelica, 1993)
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