Posted on 02/15/2007 2:16:28 PM PST by NYer
I do know that there are women who have better luck with differing forms of NFP.
I originally started with the sympto-thermal, now I just use the creighton method. Sympto-thermal isn't as widely used, but I found it to be the most reliable.
I tried it all.
Keeping track of temp was fairly accurate showing day of ovulation - but didn't make up for the fact that (despite what they keep saying!) sperm really must not die out by the 5th day.
I have a medical condition that has hindered the ability to properly read the sympto-signs.
So basically I'm left with celibacy.
You are in my prayers.
God knows your efforts and your struggles. I pray that you find peace and comfort in Him.
I am really, really sorry. You have a great cross indeed.
thank you for the kind words.
There are many who have it much worse than me.
I have alot to be thankful for - obviously this issue drives me batty though :)
Maybe this will help, or perhaps...
LOL
I deserved it with my rash post, etc.
;)
Wow, 7 children.... what a blessing! We tried for 8 years before our first, and then we now have a 7,5,3 and 2 year old with one due in early June. We are so blessed. We hope for as many as the Lord will bless us with. I think that our time fellowshipping with conservative mennonites and their 12-14 plus children per family really challenged our views on acceptable/normal family sizes. It's all relative.
I will pray that Our Lord will give you peace and direction in the way that you should go. I also pray that He will bless you with strength of mind and of body.
------"It seems like the field of pharmacy is very hostile to those who hold christian beliefs and for those who consider human life as sacred."-------
I've had the Lord's protection in the few years that I have practiced. Regarding the morning after pill(for anyone), and the dispensing of birth control to minors, I have had to go head to head with county directors, physicians, employers, and most recently with the whole European Regional Medical Command over Army Medicine. I have had the opportunity to discuss my convictions with 3 star general and army surgeon general kevin kiley as well as several full bird colonels over europe. I had to actually repeatedly say no to my boss, commanding officers and ultimately to the full bird over europe... my ultimate boss. I will not even allow it to enter my pharmacy and I've worried about my job more than once.... still, the Lord has been very protective of me.
Regarding other contraceptives, while they are abortifacient in action, it is not the intent of the patient to use it this way. It is also used for acne, to regulate menses temporarily, etc. These are some considerations that I use to ease my conscience in allowing it, though there are many pharmacists who don't dispense birth control at all. I see it as an opportunity to educate women who are prescribed these types of medicine. They aren't told how it works by anyone.
Thanks for your thoughts. I appreciate your prayers. It is something that is very heavy on my heart.
" I also pray that He will bless you with strength of mind and of body."
Thank you -it's "the mind" that gets to me the most.
I am by nature someone who likes a peaceful and orderly environment.
The noise and chaos that comes with having many children seems to be turning me into a nasty person.
congratulations on the new little one!
------"How do they know how many zygotes they are dealing with and how do they know they are being flushed away?"-------
Not sure about THIS study. I know that various methods of IVF(In Vitro Fertilization) boast different pregnancy rates in those who've experienced repeated implantation failures. The numbers here are from a population of people who have struggled with having children and are more likely to have more implantation failures. Certain methods boast implantation rates of somewhere in the range of 15 - 20 percent with this population of people.
Within normal populations, it is very invasive to try and capture all material exiting the vagina for a month's period of time, and examine it under microscopes to determine whether a zygote was flushed. Implantation rates are really hard to come by 'in the wild'. Still, they really vary between people.... as you were saying scotswife, you are one fertile woman. I would imagine your implantation rate is MUCH higher than 20 percent.
Here we have a scenario where it makes sense to think of the Lord opening and closing the womb. Some people are going to have varying levels of fertility.
Normal implantation rates should be somewhere in the 75 percent range or higher. There are many other factors that lead to ultimate pregnancy, so the implantation is not the only stopping point.
If you want to search the primary literature, try medline(pubmed). They have many articles for your perusal. Of course, all the research you are going to see is regarding implantation rates of fertilized eggs that are being artificially introduced to the mother. Not really what you're looking for, but its the best that you're going to get. Remember that these people are infertile in the first place, and will have a much higher probability of having lower implantation rates.
Thank you.
Do you have fellowship with other large families? I think that this is key..... since you are the 'freak' large family and everyone thinks a school field trip is occurring every time you walk your children somewhere......
I feel you.... not that we're any where near seven.... but we fellowship with families that have 9 children on up to 14 and going anywhere with them really turns eyes. Having fellowship with large families really helps add sanity to the whole situation. May I ask the ages of your children? Older ones in other families really seem to help with all of the chaos as well. A large home to host the invasion really helps as well!
"If you want to search the primary literature, try medline(pubmed). They have many articles for your perusal. Of course, all the research you are going to see is regarding implantation rates of fertilized eggs that are being artificially introduced to the mother. Not really what you're looking for, but its the best that you're going to get. Remember that these people are infertile in the first place, and will have a much higher probability of having lower implantation rates."
Thank you, yes - this 80% figure just seems too high, but it makes sense that studies would be done with the couples struggling with fertility.
So really in the end...we don't know what the rate really is - and this 80% number gets bandied about to justify using hormonal contraception/abortificants.
"Do you have fellowship with other large families?"
fellowship?
What's that? hee hee!
On the rare occasion we do get out there are some couples who already have large families or couples who are working on it.
Yes - there are many who look at us as freaks and take the time to kindly point out to us how we should go about taking care of the "problem".
The ages are 17, 14, a child who would have been 12 (died at the age of 4), 7,5,4, and 3 mos.
The older ones do help, and the house is large enough (although still incredibly messy).
I really handled it fine up until the second to last pregnancy...and then this last pregnancy has sent me over the edge.
Alot of people think this should just come naturally - but it doesn't to me.
It seems like everyone is getting only a little slice of the attention they need.
I wish I could be doing more for each of them - but just taking care of the daily essentials seems to take up the entire day.
It all is making me mean and cranky.
Can't answer; I'm not a scientist. But as for your earlier post, I said that I do err on the side of caution ("I'm not going to go out and get shot up with Depo-Provera" which is a birth control injection). I do, however, believe that birth control should be and should remain legal, and I think conflating it with abortion does the pro-life movement a huge disservice.
"I do, however, believe that birth control should be and should remain legal, and I think conflating it with abortion does the pro-life movement a huge disservice."
you don't have to be a scientist to know the difference between birth control and abortion.
"birth control" : NFP, condoms, vasectomy, tubal ligation, spermicide, sponge.....
abortificants: hormonal pills, shots, and patches, IUDS
the pro-life movement is exactly that - pro-life.
When there are practices that result in the death of human beings it is necessarily a "pro-life" issue.
----"and this 80% number gets bandied about to justify using hormonal contraception/abortificants."-----
People are very intelligent and they can use all sorts of logical game playing, including yours truly, to justify sinful behavior. This is our nature. While biblical truth(and scientific truth to a much lesser extent) can be used to demolish these arguments, the word tells us that the people wielding these arguments really aren't fooling themselves..... they KNOW that they are committing sin. As to degrees of sin.... I know that each and every sin is capable of sending a soul to everlasting punishment..... but human killing...... I imagine the consequences are grave.
That's why I like reading the website maintained by the atheist pro-lifers...(godlessprolifers.com - I think is what it is)
You don't need to bring in religion or discussion of sin to make a good argument.
Well, I guess I'm not pro-life enough for Free Republic. Conflating IUDs and hormonal pills with the movement to ban abortion will assure one thing: failure of the movement.
"Well, I guess I'm not pro-life enough for Free Republic. Conflating IUDs and hormonal pills with the movement to ban abortion will assure one thing: failure of the movement"
Quit pouting.
This is a discussion forum and pro-lifers have found your opinion less than persuasive.
The pro-life movement is dedicated to educating people about these issues. Many women do not understand the abortificant properties of the pill and the IUD.
Giving people more information - raising awareness is always a good thing.
When people have better access to the truth of the matter they can make better decisions.
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