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With the Help of Catholics…Obama’s Victory
LifeSiteNews.com ^ | November 5, 2008 | Deal Hudson

Posted on 11/05/2008 10:42:55 AM PST by Alex Murphy

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To: HarleyD; wmfights; Alex Murphy; Marysecretary; Dr. Eckleburg; Forest Keeper; RJR_fan; Frumanchu

***My pastor made a comment last Sunday that conservative Christians tend to vote for moral issues while liberal Christians tend to vote for social issues; but they were both Christians.***

There are social issues that should cover the spectrum of Christianity, but not at the cost of moral issues.


101 posted on 11/10/2008 2:15:31 PM PST by Gamecock ("...Christ crucified, a stumbling block to Jews and folly to Gentiles" and both to Americans.)
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To: Gamecock; HarleyD; wmfights; Alex Murphy; Marysecretary; Dr. Eckleburg; Forest Keeper; RJR_fan; ...
***My pastor made a comment last Sunday that conservative Christians tend to vote for moral issues while liberal Christians tend to vote for social issues; but they were both Christians.***

With all respect the pastor is illustrating the problem. The question is how to fix it.

102 posted on 11/10/2008 2:32:19 PM PST by wmfights (Elections have Consequences!)
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To: wmfights

I believe they are, at least the ones I know who voted for Obama are. I just think they voted their party before their beliefs. How sad is that?


103 posted on 11/10/2008 8:50:36 PM PST by Marysecretary (.GOD IS STILL IN CONTROL)
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To: sandyeggo

I hope and pray that the churches will get off their apathetic behinds and get a heads up on this before it goes too much further. Love, Mary


104 posted on 11/10/2008 9:09:44 PM PST by Marysecretary (.GOD IS STILL IN CONTROL)
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To: VermiciousKnid

Please do post it. Wow! Our deacon brought his own intentions for the last weekend’s Masses. There was pro-life inttention.

Anti-FOCA intention.

Pro family intention.

New elected leader to protect life intention

It was awesome.


105 posted on 11/10/2008 9:18:33 PM PST by Salvation ( †With God all things are possible.†)
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To: Marysecretary
I believe they are,...

I'm not as sure as you are. Voting for a candidate that believes infanticide is okay does not strike me as someone who is guided by the Holy Spirit.

106 posted on 11/11/2008 5:01:52 AM PST by wmfights (Elections have Consequences!)
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To: Gamecock; wmfights; Alex Murphy; Marysecretary; Dr. Eckleburg; Forest Keeper; RJR_fan; Frumanchu
There are social issues that should cover the spectrum of Christianity, but not at the cost of moral issues.

I agree. To me social issues are secondary concerns. Moral issues are primary issues.

107 posted on 11/11/2008 6:06:41 AM PST by HarleyD
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To: VermiciousKnid

I fear no man, but God alone... Saint Thomas More, guide us forward to the fight, for as you “I am the King’s good servant, but God’s first.” Sancte Pie Decime, gloriose patrone, ora pro nobis!

Catholic Martyrs arise... not as feeble lambs led to the slaughter... but as fighting men and women of God. Fasten your armor, make ready your weapons, grasp the Holy Cross and straddle your mount.

For my portion, I shall not lay down my life in mere passive resistance to Marxist thugs, their wretched conspirators, and the evil soon to flood our native land. In the spirit of Joan de Arc, I choose the sword of truth. Yes, weep over the lost souls of the enemy, as the great saint once did; but spare them not their freely chosen fate.

Those who have betrayed the Catholic Faith from within are the worst foes of the Church; they must be exposed and expunged from the flock. Respect not their rank, for they have thrown the Holy Cross to the ground and trampled it in the mud. The time is arrived to engage not with soft word but by hard deed. What say you, my fellows?


108 posted on 11/11/2008 7:10:38 AM PST by TCH (Another redneck clinging to guns and religion)
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To: Radl

Here we go with the anti-Catholic bs again. I voted Maverick and begrudgingly due to what I perceived as deficient(although physically appealing) Veep choice. Still to pin this one on the faltering Catholics is such a stretch. Heck as a Catholic, I am concerned at the dramatic drop in church attendance, in parishes and schools closing, in rise of lawsuits against numerous pedophiles allowed near our children and the drop in donations. So while there those in our church that think there is only one way or the highway, it’s this same mantra that got the Republican party in a bind. Remember, no matter how much you hate to hear this - without the center-rights like us (the doctors, the scientists, the white collars, and even blue collars) we’ll never win again. Don’t bite the hand that feeds you - and this goes for my fellow Catholics (regardless of whether you use a capital C or not)


109 posted on 11/11/2008 7:16:37 AM PST by GerardKempf (Let's Get Over This)
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To: P-Marlowe
I'd venture to guess that there is no real difference between number of Catholics and Protestants who go to church every Sunday and who voted for Obama and the Catholics and Protestants who rarely go to Church who voted for Obama. It's about 50/50.

Wrong, unfortunately. There's a correlation between frequency of attendance and conservatism. While not the whole voting chart, here's the relevant subset:

65% McCain, xx% Obama - Weekly church-attending Protestants7
55% McCain, 43% Obama - Weekly mass-attending Catholics 6,9
54% McCain, 44% Obama - Weekly church-goers1,4,7,12
54% McCain, 45% Obama - Protestants6,8
52% McCain, 47% Obama - White "regular-mass-attending" Catholics12
46% McCain, 52% Obama - Non-Evangelical Protestants 12
xx% McCain, 53% Obama - Monthly church-goers 4**
45% McCain, 54% Obama - Catholics1,4,6,8,9,10,11,12
xx% McCain, 59% Obama - Semi-annual church-goers4**
38% McCain, 61% Obama - Occasional churchgoers1
37% McCain, 61% Obama - Non-weekly-mass-attending Catholics6,12
xx% McCain, 68% Obama - Don't attend church4 **
23% McCain, 75% Obama - Unaffliliated with any religion11

110 posted on 11/11/2008 8:28:08 AM PST by Alex Murphy ( "Every country has the government it deserves" - Joseph Marie de Maistre)
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To: Salvation; NYer

Salvation,

Good news! I’ve just been informed that Father plans to publish a re-creation of last Sunday’s homily in our parish bulliten next week, so as soon as it becomes available, I’ll post it and ping you and NYer.

Keep in mind, that what Father is doing is re-creating the homily. He is a skilled author, so while I’m sure it will be equally moving, I’m not sure he can write it out word-for-word. I only wish someone had had a video camera at Mass on Sunday. It was riveting. Stay tuned!

Regards,


111 posted on 11/11/2008 8:50:41 AM PST by VermiciousKnid (Wake up and smell the incense!)
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To: GerardKempf

Well the people on this board have to blame somebody and Catholics are their prime choice.


112 posted on 11/11/2008 10:04:16 AM PST by Radl (rtr)
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To: VermiciousKnid

Cool!

Freegards


113 posted on 11/11/2008 10:17:19 AM PST by Ransomed (Son of Ransomed Says Keep the Faith!)
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To: Radl
Well the people on this board have to blame somebody and Catholics are their prime choice.

With respects, I disagree.

There are SOME people on this board who have set out to blame EVERYTHING on Catholics...no credit for the good, just blame for the bad.

114 posted on 11/11/2008 12:09:38 PM PST by Petronski (Things fall apart, it's scientific.)
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To: Petronski

Nothing new. Hate is addictive.


115 posted on 11/11/2008 12:11:21 PM PST by big'ol_freeper (Gen. George S. Patton to Michael Moore... American Carol: "I really like slapping you.")
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To: Petronski

I can agree with that.


116 posted on 11/11/2008 12:32:02 PM PST by Radl (rtr)
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To: wmfights

Too many put the party first and God second. I don’t understand it either.


117 posted on 11/11/2008 8:49:48 PM PST by Marysecretary (.GOD IS STILL IN CONTROL)
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To: Alex Murphy; P-Marlowe
65% McCain, xx% Obama - Weekly church-attending Protestants7

I am assuming this figure includes Blacks and Hispanics, bringing the 75% figure for White protestants as a sub group down to 65% for all Protestants. I'm figuring the Hispanic figure doesn't impact the Protestant % as much as Blacks because more of them are Roman Catholic.

118 posted on 11/12/2008 9:07:50 AM PST by wmfights (Elections have Consequences!)
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To: Marysecretary
Too many put the party first and God second. I don’t understand it either.

If they are doing that they are placing something in front of God, not Christian behavior.

119 posted on 11/12/2008 9:10:31 AM PST by wmfights (Elections have Consequences!)
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To: HarleyD; Gamecock; wmfights; Alex Murphy; Marysecretary; Dr. Eckleburg; Forest Keeper; RJR_fan; ...
To me social issues are secondary concerns. Moral issues are primary issues.

FWIW, my pastor this Sunday instructed the congregation that we should pray for 0bama, to which a small group applauded. My pastor then gave a sermon on election after which I couldn't help but wonder how many of those that applauded were not among the elect.

I think you are so right, moral issues are the primary issues and if we pursue dealing with them social issues get resolved. If we are placing social issues first we really are only trying to engineer society to our preference.

120 posted on 11/12/2008 9:19:21 AM PST by wmfights (Elections have Consequences!)
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To: wmfights; Gamecock; Alex Murphy; Marysecretary; Dr. Eckleburg; Forest Keeper; RJR_fan
FWIW, my pastor this Sunday instructed the congregation that we should pray for 0bama

I've heard this phrase an awful lot but never really thought about it. I quipped on one of these posts, where someone posted "Obama is my President", that if Christians had the Internet in the first century I wonder if they would have posted "Nero is my Emperor". The more I've thought about that, the more profound I found it. Did Elijah pray for Jezebel? Did Moses pray for Pharaoh?

My more profound moments often come when I'm not thinking. (Although some would argue that most of the time I'm 1) not thinking and 2) not profound. But I digress.)

I looked up the verses that spawn this sort of "we must pray for our leaders" mentality. What are we to pray for and why should we pray? This is what the scriptures state:

The reason we are to pray for leaders, is so that we can live a peaceful life. It does seem a bit self-serving but there you have it.

Christians who say we should pray for particular leaders need to ask themselves what precisely are we to pray for? That they make "wise" decisions? Clearly we wouldn't have abortion. The best we can do is that they will come to know the Lord in a personal way and repent of their sins. The worst is that they leave us alone.

121 posted on 11/12/2008 4:34:46 PM PST by HarleyD
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To: HarleyD; wmfights; Gamecock; Marysecretary; Dr. Eckleburg; Forest Keeper; RJR_fan
...if Christians had the Internet in the first century I wonder if they would have posted "Nero is my Emperor"

IMO this exchange is close:

So the tribune came and said to him, "Tell me, are you a Roman citizen?" And he said, "Yes."
The tribune answered, "I bought this citizenship for a large sum." Paul said, "But I am a citizen by birth."
- Acts 22:27-28

122 posted on 11/12/2008 4:52:45 PM PST by Alex Murphy ( "Every country has the government it deserves" - Joseph Marie de Maistre)
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To: HarleyD; wmfights; Alex Murphy; Marysecretary; Gamecock; Dr. Eckleburg; RJR_fan; Frumanchu
A Christian cannot support abortion yet rally against a war. A Christian can (and should) be against abortion yet may be in support of a war. There is a subtle difference.

Wow, for me that was about as subtle as a ton of bricks. :) Thanks for that great insight. If the moral has already been decided, that to legally kill innocents is OK, then it cannot be argued that legally killing anyone is wrong. However, if the moral is that it is wrong to legally kill innocents, then whether it is right to legally kill anyone else is unknown (based only on this moral). If that's a reasonable explanation then I'm definitely going to remember this one. :)

123 posted on 11/13/2008 2:33:13 AM PST by Forest Keeper (It is a joy to me to know that God had my number, before He created numbers.)
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