Skip to comments.Scranton bishop threatens to deny sacrament to Casey
Posted on 04/30/2009 5:40:25 AM PDT by NYer
And his father, Bob Casey, who actually WAS pro-life, gets a new job as St. Peter’s office fan.
Casey has never been fully PRO-life....
Good for the Bishop!
I hope this guy keeps up the pressure.
And for those of you not familiar with Penna. politics, Sen. Bob Casey, Jr. is the son of the late, great, radically pro-life governor Bob Casey. This was the same Gov. Casey who spoke at the 1992 GOP convention after being kicked out of the DNC for his opposition to abortion. This is also the same Gov. Casey who was so opposed to abortion that he refused to campaign for his fellow Democrat Lt. Governor in his own bid for the governorship because said candidate was pro-choice.
The late governor must be rolling over in his grave over his son's betrayal of his legacy.
Thanks you Bishop Joseph F. Martino.
Bishop Martino is something of a joke when it comes to theology and a loose canon to boot but he certainly has the authority to say this to Casey and to bar him from the sacraments if he decides that’s necessary.
I wonder how much longer Latin Rite Catholics will or should hold elective office in this country? Personally, I doubt I would vote for any pol who gets his/her voting instructions from a bishop or any other cleric or preacher for that matter. In fact, it probably would be a good idea from here on out to ask Latin Rite politicians if they intend to represent their bishops’ interpretation of Latin Church dogma or their constituents.
How about eliminating her because she didn’t pay her taxes..
Would you, then, only vote for unprincipled spineless poll-driven morons?
Seems like Bill Clinton is the very model of the perfect politician, for you.
Or, perhaps you'd like to revise and extend your remarks ...
Good for him !!!!
“Are you going to ask the same question of Baptist, Presbyterian, Orthodox, Mohammedan, Zoroastrian politicians?”
Of the first three, absolutely; in fact I have. I’d never vote for a Mohammedan and the only Zoroastrian I know isn’t a citizen.
“Would you, then, only vote for unprincipled spineless poll-driven morons?”
No, likely I’d vote for the first politician willing to stand up and proclaim that the floor of hell is paved with the skulls of bishops.
“Seems like Bill Clinton is the very model of the perfect politician, for you.”
Never voted for the man.
You know, AB, principled politicians are rare birds and often worth voting for for that single reason alone. What I won’t vote for is a craven lickspittel of any cleric, who quakes at the thought that he/she will be denied communion for voting in a manner the cleric finds objectionable.
And once again, the stupid media try to make it look like the bishop is the bad guy by "denying" the sacrament. He is protecting Casey from committing a sacrilege. Receiving the eucharist is not a right ... it's a gift. And if someone received is while not in a state of grace, they "eat and drink damnation upon themselves."
LOL, and good post
Since when has any of these pro-abort politicians heeded the advise of the bishops? Like Casey, Pelosi, Kennedy, Kerry etc.
Time for dialogue has long passed. It’s time for the bishops to act with real action, or shut up.
These pro-death bozos are going around
1) Claiming to be Catholic
2) Supporting in every way possible the bloody murder of unborn children.
Their behaviour is scandalous. They need to be told, flat out, that (2) above is incompatible with (1) above ... and that if they persist in (2) that (1) will be declared null. Bishop Martino (and others) should simply declare them excommunicated and be done with it. If Bishop Martino's skull becomes a flagstone in Satan's Courtyard, it may very likely be because of what he hasn't done. And the flagstone next over may well be Casey's skull.
You seem to forget that part of a Bishop's job is to teach.
That's frightening. Does in not matter to you at all what those principles are?
***voting in a manner the cleric finds objectionable.***
It’s not what the “cleric” finds objectionable, it’s what the Church, the Bride of Christ, finds objectionable. Surely you know that the Church has always condemned abortion - even back to the “Didache” of the second century. The “cleric” has a duty to warn people that if they receieve the Blessed Sacrament in a state of mortal sin, they are condemning themselves to hell. “Wherefore whosoever shall eat this bread, and drink this cup of the Lord, unworthily, shall be guilty of the body and blood of the Lord.” I Cor. 11:27 I know you, as a member of the Orthodox church, know this. You are just trying to pick fights with whatever position the “Latin Rite” Church takes. You can never say one good thing about us - there’s always something wrong.
No, Casey did not speak at the convention. He was denied a slot because he was pro-life.
A bishop tells a politician to vote agaisnt abortion. Notre Dame invites an abortionist to speak. The Catholic Church sounds as divided as the GOP.
“You seem to be missing the point ...”
I don’t think so. My point is that I, as an Orthodox Christian, do not hold that a pro-life position trumps all other Christian positions, or conversely, that a pro abortion position necessarily outweighs all other Christian positions. I can and I have voted for politicians whose public positions support what you and I call a pro abortion stance, and I have done that while being active in our state’s Right to Life movement. My Church does not teach me that a pro life position is the only test for my vote. Under the circumstances, I don’t want to be represented by someone who votes a certain way because his/her bishop holds a position not held by Orthodoxy and insists that a politician under obedience to him vote in accordance with that theological position.
“Their behaviour is scandalous. They need to be told, flat out, that (2) above is incompatible with (1) above ... and that if they persist in (2) that (1) will be declared null. Bishop Martino (and others) should simply declare them excommunicated and be done with it.”
AB, that’s fine with me. Like I said, its the bishop’s call. But if I lived in his diocese, I’d NEVER vote for any pol who qualifies as or hopes to qualify as a good Latin Rite Catholic.
“Does in not matter to you at all what those principles are?”
Sure, especially in comparison to a politician whose “principles” are venial, materialistic and self centered.
But you would never vote for a "Latin Rite" politician who espouses explicitly Christian principles ... because a Bishop had the temerity to also espouse said principles.
If I didn't know any better, I'd think you were getting carried away with either "anti-Latinism" or "anticleiricalism". Your right, of course. It's still a more-or-less free country. But it seems bizarre to me.
Party No. 2 nominates a spineless, poll-driven moron.
Third parties offer no nomination.
How do you cast your vote?
I hear a lot of talk about this, but have never seen a published report where this has actually happened. Did I miss it, or is this all just a bunch of hot air?
Indeed. Or because she lied about campaign contributions.
Key words: “might eventually.”
Apparently, you don't realize that this isn't about YOU and who you would vote for. It's about this individual politician doing something that is in direct conflict with deeply held convictions of the Catholic Church, and the church taking action in relation to that.
You may not agree, and that's fine. Your "orthodox" church is a bit more "laizze faire" concerning pro-life issues, and that's up to them. (I use quotations on "orthodox" because it would seem to be completely unorthodox for a church to shrug its collective shoulders at the murder of innocents. But that's just my opinion.)
If you don't like what the "Latin Rite" church teaches, then I suggest you stay away from it. I'm quite sure they will be staying away from yours.
“How do you cast your vote?”
“Apparently, you don’t realize that this isn’t about YOU and who you would vote for.”
No, when it comes to politicians being driven to vote the way his/her bishop wants under threat of what amouts to excommunication, it is very much my business and that of every other voter.
“If you don’t like what the “Latin Rite” church teaches, then I suggest you stay away from it. I’m quite sure they will be staying away from yours.”
Well, see, the overwhelming number of Orthodox laity, lower clergy and monastics, and, I suspect, hierarchs, want to stay very far away from the Latin Church. The Latin Church, however, seems determined to save itself from the consequences of its Vatican II folly by reuniting with us. I sincerely hope that Rome will decide that given our attitudes, it would be best for them to go it alone. :)
Party No. 1 nominates a committed Catholic.
Party No. 2 nominates a spineless, poll-driven moron.
Third parties offer no nominations.
How do you vote?
Please wake us when this bishop actually stops Casey at the rail.
” How do you vote? “
Where I live? All things being equal, the Catholic. In Scranton? Write in.
Personally, I would have a very hard time attending a church that was indifferent to the murder of innocents.
13 You are the salt of the earth. But if the salt lose its savour, wherewith shall it be salted? It is good for nothing any more but to be cast out, and to be trodden on by men. 14 You are the light of the world. A city seated on a mountain cannot be hid. 15 Neither do men light a candle and put it under a bushel, but upon a candlestick, that it may shine to all that are in the house. 16 So let your light shine before men, that they may see your good works, and glorify your Father who is in heaven.
I fail to understand why anyone who professes to be a Christian would want other Christians to "put [their candle] under a bushel". Yet this is precisely what you want Catholic Bishops to do.
The gum flapping of an ignorant schismatic is irrelevant.
FRiend, I'm not as learned a man as you. I do not have a Legal Degree. But it appears to me that your statement quoted above is tantamount to saying that you are in favor of a religious test to hold public office in the US. And while you did not explicitly advocate that for everyone, you certainly announced here that it was your criteria. And your other posts drive home the point that you do in fact have as your number one criteria the religious affiliation of the candidate. You have every right to your opinion.
But I believe the historical record shows that Our Founders considered that view anathema to a Republican form of government conceived in liberty and dedicated to the proposition that all men are created equal. And as such are entitled to be judged as individuals when seeking public office irrespective of their religious affiliations. If any criteria can be said to be Un-American it is yours ,Sir.
Be careful what you try to impose on others, lest it is imposed upon you.
Two many “clerics,” however, had their roots in Democratic households, and so the bishops have been slow to make their opposition to Democratic social policies that have become more and more radically opposed to the teachings of the Church. This has led to the split in the Church that we see evident in the Notre Dame flap. The Democrats have made abortion rights and gay rights party shibboleths. Whatever you think of Martino he is simply telling us the way the cow ate the cabbage. If you don't like the way he is doing it, I suggest you look at the tact taken Archbishop Chaput, who as he has pointed out, grew up as a Democrat and shares many opinions with the Democrats but is telling his flock that the Democrats now support many policies that no one who calls himself a Catholic can consistently support.
Casey cannot be compelled to do anything. If he wants to remain a Catholic in good standing, he must put into practice the teachings of the Church.
It's up to him.
Bishop Martino is something of a joke when it comes to theology and a loose canon to boot but he certainly has the authority to say this to Casey and to bar him from the sacraments if he decides thats necessary.
I think the incredibly dumb, schimatic Greek Orthodox Church is even worse... And especially who believe in such non-sense...
Especially, it should be conveyed that if politician votes for FOCA, they may not receive a Catholic funeral Mass or other sacraments -- without a public recantation...
You'd rather vote for someone who defends and abets the murder of innocent infants?
I cannot go along with calling the Greek Orthodox Church “incredibly dumb”. Schismatic, yes. But not dumb.
I have to agree.
Of course politicians should quake at that thought. They only have power because God gave them power. A politician who defies the Prince of the Church is an usurper of power, who should be driven out of office tarred and feathered.
The Orthodox Church is very pro-life. I could easily see my Priest refuse Communion to a politician that in any way supported abortion.
In fact the Catholic and Orthodox view is nearly identical. We should stand with our Catholic brethren when they are right. The fighting between our Churches has gone on too long and even the Patriarchs (Pope) seems to have buried the hatchet, the laity should do the same.
If a person claims to hold a particular faith, I expect them to act in accordance with it. It they are Catholic or Orthodox they should be following the teaching of their Church, otherwise it is a significant character flaw.
It it truly hypocritical for us Orthodox to criticise a Catholic for following the teachings of his Church/Bishop as we should do the same. Please note I typed teachings and not opinions.
I’m proud of the Catholic Bishop that has finally stood up and done the right thing. More of our Bishops should do the same. It is not a flaw with the Churches that keep the Bishops (of both faiths) from speaking the truth, but rather a flaw with those Bishops individually.
The Orthodox and Catholic faiths are so close that politically there should be no difference. Please don’t create a rift between us that should not be there.
As to schizmatic the mutual excommunications were lifted so neither is schimatic in the eyes of their Church. Catholics that call Orthodox (or the other way around) schizmatic are being the hypocrits that I mentioned in the previous posting.
I’m assuming that those comments here are just in fun, or out of ignorance and will be corrected. Besides when you start with One Church comprised of seven Patriarchates and only one is separated from the other six, it is ususally the one that is called schizmatic, not the other way around (got to have some fun with you Cat Lickers)
The Orthodox and Catholic faiths are so close that politically there should be no difference. Please dont create a rift between us that should not be there.
Amen. Absolutely right, and well said.
>>The gum flapping of an ignorant schismatic is irrelevant.<<
I don’t know that I would call that very Christian.