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Mormons and Christianity: What has the Mormon Church historically taught about Christianity?
Rethinking Mormonism ^

Posted on 12/02/2010 5:18:31 PM PST by delacoert

While some current church leaders portray the LDS Church as Christian, the church actually has a long history of condemning Christianity. The church has also stated repeatedly that no one can be saved without the permission of Joseph Smith. The church has even suggested that Islam is better than Christianity.

Mormon Church Condemns Christians

"This is not just another Church. This is not just one of a family of Christian churches. This is the Church and kingdom of God, the only true Church upon the face of the earth..."
- Prophet Ezra Taft Benson, Teachings of Ezra Taft Benson, p.164-165

"In bearing testimony of Jesus Christ, President Hinckley spoke of those outside the Church who say Latter-day Saints 'do not believe in the traditional Christ.' 'No, I don't. The traditional Christ of whom they speak is not the Christ of whom I speak. For the Christ of whom I speak has been revealed in this the Dispensation of the Fullness of Times. He together with His Father, appeared to the boy Joseph Smith in the year 1820, and when Joseph left the grove that day, he knew more of the nature of God than all the learned ministers of the gospel of the ages.'"
- Prophet Gordon B. Hinckley, LDS Church News, June 20, 1998, p.7

"My object in going to inquire of the Lord was to know which of all the sects was right, that I might know which to join. No sooner, therefore, did I get possession of myself, so as to be able to speak, thanI asked the Personages who stood above me in the light, which of all the sects was right (for at this time it had never entered into my heart that all were wrong)—and which I should join."

"I was answered by God that I must join none of them, for they were all wrong; and the Personage who addressed me said that all their creeds were an abomination in his sight; that those professors were all corrupt; that: “they draw near to me with their lips, but their hearts are far from me, they teach for doctrines the commandments of men, having a form of godliness, but they deny the power thereof.” He again forbade me to join with any of them;..."
- Prophet Joseph Smith, Joseph Smith History 1:18-20

"What is it that inspires professors of Christianity generally with a hope of salvation? It is that smooth, sophisticated influence of the devil, by which he deceives the whole world"
- Prophet Joseph Smith, Teachings of the Prophet Joseph Smith, p.270 

"...all the priests who adhere to the sectarian religions of the day with all their followers, without one exception, receive their portion with the devil and his angels."
- Prophet Joseph Smith , The Elders Journal, Joseph Smith Jr., editor, vol.1, no.4, p.60

"For centuries men gathered and argued concerning the nature of Deity.Constantine assembled scholars of various factions at Nicaea in the year 325. After two months of bitter debate, they compromised on a definition which for generations has been the doctrinal statement among Christians concerning the Godhead."

"I invite you to read that definition and compare it with the statement of the boy Joseph. He simply says that God stood before him and spoke to him. Joseph could see Him and could hear Him. He was in form like a man, a being of substance. Beside Him was the resurrected Lord, a separate being, whom He introduced as His Beloved Son and with whom Joseph also spoke."

"I submit that in the short time of that remarkable vision Joseph learned more concerning Deity than all of the scholars and clerics of the past."

"This knowledge of Deity, hidden from the world for centuries, was the first and great thing which God revealed to His chosen servant. And upon the reality and truth of this vision rests the validity of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints."
- Prophet Gordon B. Hinckley, "The Great Things Which God Has Revealed" Spring Church Confernece 2005

"Both Catholics and Protestants are nothing less than the 'whore of Babylon' whom the Lord denounces by the mouth of John the Revelator as having corrupted all the earth by their fornications and wickedness. Any person who shall be so corrupt as to receive a holy ordinance of the Gospel from the ministers of any of these apostate churches will be sent down to hell with them, unless they repent"
- Apostle Orson Pratt, The Seer, p. 255

"And the angel of God said unto me: Beholdthere are save two churches only; the one is the church of the Lamb of God, and the other is the church of the devil; wherefore, whoso belongeth not to the church of the Lamb of God belongeth to that great church, which is the mother of abominations; and she is the whore of all the earth. And it came to pass that I looked and beheld the whore of all the earth, and she sat upon many waters; and she had dominion over all the earth, among all nations, kindreds, tongues, and people."
- Book of Mormon, 1 Nephi 14:10-11

"After the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints was organized, there were only two churches upon the earth. They were known respectively as the Church of the Lamb of God and Babylon. The various organizations which are called churches throughout Christendom, though differing in their creeds and organizations, have one common origin. They all belong to Babylon"
- Apostle George Q. Cannon said, Gospel Truth, p.324


"When the light came to me I saw that all the so-called Christian world was grovelling in darkness."
- Prophet Brigham Young, Journal of Discourses 5:73 

"With a regard to true theology, a more ignorant people never lived than the present so-called Christian world."
- Prophet Brigham Young, Journal of Discourses 8:199

"The Christian world, so-called, are heathens as to the knowledge of the salvation of God"
- Prophet Brigham Young, Journal of Discourses 8:171

"Brother Taylor has just said that the religions of the day were hatched in hell. The eggs were laid in hell, hatched on its borders, and then kicked on to the earth."
- Prophet Brigham Young, Journal of Discourses 6:176

"Christians—those poor, miserable priests brother Brigham was speaking about—some of them are the biggest whoremasters there are on the earth, and at the same time preaching righteousness to the children of men. The poor devils, they could not get up here and preach an oral discourse, to save themselves from hell; they are preaching their fathers' sermons —preaching sermons that were written a hundred years before they were born. ...You may get a Methodist priest to pour water on you, or sprinkle it on you, and baptize you face foremost, or lay you down the other way, and whatever mode you please, and you will be damned with your priest."
- Apostle Heber C. Kimball, Journal of Discourses, 5:89

"The Gospel of modern Christendom shuts up the Lord, and stops all communication with Him. I want nothing to do with such a Gospel, I would rather prefer the Gospel of the dark ages, so called"
- Prophet Wilford Woodruff, Journal of Discourses, vol. 2, p.196 

"But as there has been no Christian Church on the earth for a great many centuries past, until the present century, the people have lost sight of the pattern that God has given according to which the Christian Church should be established, and they have denominated a great variety of Christian Churches ... But there has been a long apostasy, during which the nations have been cursed with apostate churches in great abundance"
- Apostle Orson Pratt, Journal of Discourses, 18:172 

"Christianity...is a perfect pack of nonsense...the devil could not invent a better engine to spread his work than the Christianity of the nineteenth century."
- Prophet Brigham Young, 
Journal of Discourses, vol. 6, p.167

"Where shall we look for the true order or authority of God? It cannot be found in any nation of Christendom."
- Prophet John Taylor, Journal of Discourses, 10:127 

"What! Are Christians ignorant? Yes, as ignorant of the things of God as the brute beast."
- Prophet John Taylor, Journal of Discourses 13:225

"What does the Christian world know about God? Nothing... Why so far as the things of God are concerned, they are the veriest fools; they know neither God nor the things of God."
- Prophet John Taylor, Journal of Discourses 13:225

"Doctrines were corrupted, authority lost, and a false order of religion took the place of the gospel of Jesus Christ, just as it had been the case in former dispensations, and the people were left in spiritual darkness." (p. 266). "For hundreds of years the world was wrapped in a veil of spiritual darkness, until there was not one fundamental truth belonging to the place of salvation ...Joseph Smith declared that in the year 1820 the Lord revealed to him that all the 'Christian' churches were in error, teaching for commandments the doctrines of men."
- Prophet Joseph Fielding Smith, Doctrines of Salvation, vol. 3, p.282

"Instead of having apostles, prophets, and other inspired men in the church now, receiving visions, dreams, revelations, ministry of angels and prophesies for the calling of officers, and for the government of the church--they have a wicked, corrupt, uninspired pope, or uninspired archbishops, bishops, clergymen, etc., who have a great variety of corrupt forms of godliness, but utterly deny the gift of revelation, and every other miraculous power which always characterized Christ's Church."

"These manmade, powerless, hypocritical, false teachers, make merchandise of the people, by preaching for large salaries, amounting in many instances to tens of thousands of dollars annually. They and their deluded followers are reprobate, denouncing the faith once delivered to the Saints."
- Apostle Orson Pratt, "Divine Authenticity of the Book of Mormon," page 20

"...the Book of Mormon remains secure, unchanged and unchangeable, ...But with the Bible it was not and is not so....it was once in the sole and exclusive care and custody of an abominable organization (Christianity), founded by the devil himself, likened prophetically unto a great whore, whose great aim and purpose was to destroy the souls of men in the name of religion. In these hands it ceased to be the book it once was."
- Apostle Bruce R. McConkie, The Joseph Smith Translation, pp. 12, 13

"Must we, under the broad folds of the American Constitution, be compelled to bow down to the narrow contracted notions of Apostate Christianity? Must we shut up our consciences in a nut shell, and be compelled to submit to the bigoted notions, and whims, and customs of the dark ages of popery, transferred to us through the superstitious of our fathers? Must we be slaves to custom and render homage to the soul-destroying, sickening influences of modern Christianity? No!"
- Apostle Orson Pratt, The Seer, Vol.1, No.7, p.111

"And also those to whom these commandments were given, might have power to lay the foudation of this (Mormon) church, and to bring it forth out of obscurity and out of darkness, the only true and living church upon the face of the whole earth..."
- Supposedly Jesus Christ Himself, Doctrine and Covenants 1:30 

Salvation not Through Jesus Christ, but Joseph Smith?

"If we get our salvation, we shall have to pass by the Prophet Joseph Smith; if we enter our glory, it will be through the authority he has received. We cannot get around him. "
- 1988 Melchizedek Priesthood Study Guide, p. 142, Apostle George Q. Cannon quoted

"Our entire case as members of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints rests on the validity of this glorious First Vision. ... Nothing on which we base our doctrine, nothing we teach, nothing we live by is of greater importance than this initial declaration. I submit that if Joseph Smith talked with God the Father and His Beloved Son, then all else of which he spoke is true. This is the hinge on which turns the gate that leads to the path of salvation and eternal life."
- Prophet Gordon B. Hinckley, Ensign Mag., Nov. 1998, pp.70-71

[There is] "no salvation without accepting Joseph Smith. If Joseph Smith was verily a prophet, and if he told the truth...no man can reject that testimony without incurring the most dreadful consequences, for he cannot enter the kingdom of God"
- Prophet Joseph Fielding Smith, Doctrines of Salvation, vol. 1, p.190

"No man or woman in this dispensation will ever enter into the celestial kingdom of God without the consent of Joseph Smith...every man and woman must have the certificate of Joseph Smith, junior, as a passport to their entrance into the mansion where God and Christ are... [Joseph Smith] reigns there as supreme a being in his sphere, capacity, and calling, as God does in heaven. Many will exclaim—"Oh, that is very disagreeable! It is preposterous! We cannot bear the thought!" But it is true."
- Prophet Brigham Young, Journal of Discourses, vol. 7, p.289-91

"He that confesseth not that Jesus has come in the flesh and sent Joseph Smith with the fullness of the Gospel to this generation, is not of God, but is anti-christ"
- Prophet Brigham Young, Journal of Discourses, vol. 9, p.312 

"I tell you, Joseph holds the keys, and none of us can get into the celestial kingdom without passing by him. We have not got rid of him, but he stands there as the sentinel, holding the keys of the kingdom of God; and there are many of them beside him. I tell you, if we get past those who have mingled with us, and know us best, and have a right to know us best, probably we can pass all other sentinels as far as it is necessary, or as far as we may desire. But I tell you, the pinch will be with those that have mingled with us, stood next to us, weighed our spirits, tried us, and proven us: there will be a pinch, in my view, to get past them. The others, perhaps, will say, If brother Joseph is satisfied with you, you may pass. If it is all right with him, it is all right with me. Then if Joseph shall say to a man, or if brother Brigham say to a man, I forgive you your sins, "Whosoever sins ye remit they are remitted unto them;" if you who have suffered and felt the weight of transgression—if you have generosity enough to forgive the sinner, I will forgive him: you cannot have more generosity than I have. I have given you power to forgive sins, and when the Lord gives a gift, he does not take it back again."
- Apostle Orson Hyde, Journal of Discourses, Vol. 6, p.154-155

"It is to be feared that in course of a century, some gifted man like Paul, some splendid orator, who will be able by his eloquence to attract crowds of the thousands who are ever ready to hear, and be carried away by, the sounding brass and tinkling cymbal of sparkling oratory, may command a hearing, may succeed in breathing a new life into this modern Mahometanism, and make the name of the martyred Joseph ring as loud, and stir the souls of men as much, as the mighty name of Christ itself. Sharon, Palmyra, Manchester, Kirtland, Far West, Adam-ondi-Ahman, Ramus. Nauvoo, and the Carthage Jail, may become holy and venerable names, places of classic interest, in another age; like Jerusalem, the Garden of Gethsemane, the Mount of Olives, and Mount Calvary to the Christian, and Mecca and Medina to the Turk." 
- Prophet Brigham Young, History of the Church, Vol. 7, p.40-41

Islam Better than Chistianity?

"The Greek and Roman Churches, which have been called Christian, and which take the name of Christians as a cloak, have worshipped innumerable idols. On this account, on the simple subject of the Deity and His worship, if nothing more, I should rather incline, of the two, after all my early traditions, education, and prejudices, to the side of Mahomet, for on this point he is on the side of truth, and the Christian world on the side of idolatry and heathenism."
- Apostle Parley P. Pratt, Journal of Discourses, Vol. 3, p.38

"..instead of saying that Mahometanism prevailed against Christianity, and that Christianity was in danger of being done away by its prevalence, we would rather say, that where Mahometanism prevailed, it taught and established one truth at least, viz., the true and living God, and so far as this went, it did preserve people from worshipping idols. And had the crescent waved on the tower of London, or on the church of St. Paul, instead of the cross, and had the Mahometan religion been enforced instead of the Roman religion that was enforced for a series of generations, and had tradition riveted what the sword enforced, then that nation and the surrounding nations would have been worshippers of one true God instead of idols; they would have recognized it in theory at least, whether they would have worshipped Him in spirit and in truth or not. But now [Christians] do not recognize Him in theory, for they acknowledge as their god an imaginary being without body, parts, or passions."
- Apostle Parley P. Pratt, Journal of Discourses, Vol. 3, p.39

"Now, if we take Mahometanism during those dark ages, and the corruptions that are so universally prevalent over the earth, and the idolatrous systems of religion, falsely called Christianity, and weigh them in a balance; with all my education in favor of Christian nations and Christian powers, and Christian institutions, so called, with all my prejudices of early youth, and habits of thought and reading, my rational faculties would compel me to admit that the Mahometan history and Mahometan doctrine was a standard raised against the most corrupt and abominable idolatry that over perverted our earth, found in the creeds and worship of Christians, falsely so named."
- Apostle Parley P. Pratt, Journal of Discourses, Vol. 3, p.40

"Though Mahometan institutions are corrupt enough, and need reforming by the Gospel, I am inclined to think, upon the whole, leaving out the corruptions of men in high places among them, that they have better morals and better institutions than many Christian nations; and in many localities there have been high standards of morals. So far as that one point is concerned, of worshipping the one true God under the name of Mahometanism, together with many moral precepts, and in war only acting on the defensive, I think they have exceeded in righteousness and truthfulness of religion, the idolatrous and corrupt church that has borne the name of Christianity."
- Apostle Parley P. Pratt, Journal of Discourses, Vol. 3, p.41


TOPICS: Other non-Christian
KEYWORDS: inman; lds; mormon
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1 posted on 12/02/2010 5:18:33 PM PST by delacoert
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To: delacoert

Another Xenu thread!

I love these!!


2 posted on 12/02/2010 5:20:11 PM PST by freedumb2003 (FYI: everything I post is IMHO -- YOU JACKWAGON! [no offense -- I just like that word])
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To: delacoert

Continuing to pray Mormons out of their cult.


3 posted on 12/02/2010 5:21:29 PM PST by anniegetyourgun
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To: delacoert
"This is not just another Church. This is not just one of a family of Christian churches. This is the Church and kingdom of God, the only true Church upon the face of the earth..."

- Prophet Ezra Taft Benson, Teachings of Ezra Taft Benson, p.164-165

Yet, lds weep and wail to be called Christians.

psst D, you know you aren't supposed to expose lds beliefs.........especially using direct quotes and documentation.

4 posted on 12/02/2010 5:25:23 PM PST by svcw
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To: delacoert

Jesus faced a mob that was eager to execute a woman caught in adultery. He put a stop to it with a simple challenge: anyone who has no sin in their life should step forward and throw the first stone. That sentence is often cited as a reminder to avoid judging others when there are faults in your own life that need to be addressed.


5 posted on 12/02/2010 5:26:00 PM PST by HospiceNurse
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To: delacoert

What joy! Another anti-mormon thread, there is such a shortage of these on FR with the tens of thousands wanting more.


6 posted on 12/02/2010 5:30:09 PM PST by Goreknowshowtocheat
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To: delacoert; All
Seekers of truth,

If you peruse the Free Republic religion forums you will notice a pattern. There's an anti-Mormon group of people here that spends a great deal of their time attacking the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints. They post regurgitated propaganda on an almost daily basis.

They have a misguided obsession. You can witness many different tactics employed that you might find quite interesting. The straw man argument is a big favorite and is frequently preceded by cherry-picking quotes or other material. After the "quotation" the attacker will misrepresent what has been said or what was meant and then attack their own interpretation.Later they will have the audacity to claim they were "only" quoting our own material.  

They will of course insist ad nauseum that they are merely using our sources and are therefore innocent of any deceptive practice. LDS persons have no issue whatsoever having our scriptures or leaders quoted as long as it is presented fairly and accurately. This is rarely (if ever) done.

Another favorite is posting scripture or statements which on their own really present no dilemma. They make something out of nothing while never bringing up a single objection that hasn't been addressed a hundred times before.

You might note a couple of other tactics used to try to antagonize is the use of disrespectful or insulting terms or language and/or pictures. That's a Christlike thing to do right? Yeah I don't think so either. It does speak volumes about them though.

Sometimes they cruise the headlines of the day seeking any story that might be twisted into making the Church look bad. Anything will do, just watch the progression of posts following it and see what I mean.

After reading their posts, I invite you to seek the truth about whatever "issue" they seem to be "revealing" or "exposing". I promise that if you do so with honest intent, the "ahah" moments you will have will be many and frequent. You will start to recognize the tactics employed to cleverly twist and attack and will likely chuckle the more you see. In actuality, there's nothing new here. It's all been addressed many times before.

The latest twist in the anti-Mormon propaganda machine is to actually go to the links provided, but then they cherry pick what they want, then quote and straw man attack that. Clever. It almost appears that they are helping you, the seeker of truth out by doing some footwork for you. Not so much. Don't be insulted, look for yourself. It's not the haystack they want you to think.

Here's a few links to get your started from a different viewpoint. I have found that the vast majority of the "issues" brought up can be found and addressed at http://www.fairlds.org/ but here's more:

http://scriptures.lds.org/
http://www.lds.org
http://www.fairlds.org/
http://www.mormonapologetics.org/
http://www.mormonwiki.com/Main_Page
http://www.lightplanet.com/response/index.html
http://www.jefflindsay.com/LDS_Intro.shtml
http://www.answeringantimormons.com/index.htm
http://promormon.blogspot.com/

Now you will likely notice the "you never address our points" posts pop up as usual. All after providing the answers just as you have here.

Sometimes it is claimed that these sites present a needle in a haystack. Far from it. But if you give up before you try you won't know will you?

Will you wear blinders too? Seek truth. Find out for yourself. Want to chat with someone on any topic? A few of these sites provide just that. So do your homework sincere seeker of truth. Listen and read from both "sides". Make up your own mind.

I witness to you of these truths and wish you the best, in the name of our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ. Amen.

 


7 posted on 12/02/2010 5:31:24 PM PST by Paragon Defender
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To: HospiceNurse; delacoert
No actually we can and are supposed to judge those who say they are Christians against the Word of God. Everything is to be judged against God's Word. Are we permitted to judge one’s heart - no, that is God's preview.
8 posted on 12/02/2010 5:33:29 PM PST by svcw
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To: Paragon Defender; delacoert
So, PD what in the post is incorrect. Just one example, just one.
psst all the quotes are documented and from official lds sources (unlike most of your links).

9 posted on 12/02/2010 5:36:03 PM PST by svcw
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To: Goreknowshowtocheat

Show me from the post one anti-mormon statement.


10 posted on 12/02/2010 5:37:07 PM PST by svcw
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To: HospiceNurse

Please don’t confuse personal sin with doctrine. Or as in the case of the lds - false doctrine.

Jesus commanded truth, not falsehood, (John 17:17) and he aggressively went after those who taught lies/false doctrine (Matt. 15:9; Mark 7:7; Matt. 23-24). Paul said that any other or false gospel is ‘anathema’ (Galatians 1:9). Paul continually went after those who taught falsely: Eph. 4:14; 1 Tim. 1:3-4; I Tim. 4:1-6; 2 Tim. 4:3; Titus 1:9; Titus 2:1, 7.

Over and over in the New Testament (and the old for that matter) false religious systems are to be refuted. Start with the Book of Jude then work your way into III John and then end up with Christ swinging his whip in the Temple - - literally. You’re playing with fire when you twist a section of Scripture into an excuse to never confront error.


11 posted on 12/02/2010 5:40:52 PM PST by conservativegramma
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To: Paragon Defender

In your zeal to make yourself appear superior by whacking the ‘anti-mormons’so that you can continue to abuse FR as your own personal proselytizing site - please feel free to provide proof that all the above source citations from your own church/leaders are false.

We await with baited breath..........


12 posted on 12/02/2010 5:47:41 PM PST by conservativegramma
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To: Paragon Defender
There's an anti-Mormon group of people here that spends a great deal of their time attacking the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints.

The basic premise of Mormonism cannot be true.

Mormon’s believe that the Church Christ founded somehow needed a restoration. Unfortunately, this cannot be true, unless Christ is a liar. The LDS claims that God chose Joseph Smith to reestablish the Church of Jesus Christ after it had disappeared some 1,700 years earlier following the death of the first apostles.

But let's look at Scripture.

“And I say also unto thee, That thou art Peter, and upon this rock I will build my church; and the gates of hell shall not prevail against it.” Mat 6:18

Here Christ says his Church will not be destroyed.

“I have yet many things to say unto you, but ye cannot bear them now. Howbeit when he, the Spirit of truth, is come, he will guide you into all truth: for he shall not speak of himself; but whatsoever he shall hear, that shall he speak: and he will shew you things to come.” John 16:12-13

“But if I tarry long, that thou mayest know how thou oughtest to behave thyself in the house of God, which is the church of the living God, the pillar and foundation of the truth.” 1Tim 3:15

Here Christ says, and Paul reaffirms, that the Church will always teach the TRUTH.

Then Jesus came to them and said, "All authority in heaven and on earth has been given to me. Therefore go and make disciples of all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit, and teaching them to obey everything I have commanded you. And surely I am with you always, to the very end of the age." Mat 28:18-20

Again, here Jesus assures us that He is always with us, to the very end.

So Christ says His Church will not be destroyed or fall away from him, that the Holy Spirit will guide the Church to always teach the Truth, and He will always be with us.

The only reason for a ‘restoration’ is that Christ lied.

13 posted on 12/02/2010 5:51:01 PM PST by FatherofFive (Islam is evil and must be eradicated)
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To: Paragon Defender; All
Seekers of truth,


14 posted on 12/02/2010 6:14:55 PM PST by Godzilla (3-7-77)
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To: conservativegramma
We await with baited breath..........

Hi CG, long time no read. Yep a lot of us waiting for a real answer. Lots of crickets though. . . . .

15 posted on 12/02/2010 6:16:21 PM PST by Godzilla (3-7-77)
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To: Paragon Defender

Properly and convincingly explain away these five mormonisms and maybe I’ll listen:

1. The planet Kolab
2. The clearly written statement that Joseph Smith, Jr. will sit next to Jesus Christ in the next world to judge whether we will go into heaven or not
3. There are hundreds of thousands of gods
4. The historical anacronisms of chariots, wheels, draft animals, horses, and various old world metals that the book of mormon claim to have been found in the new world.
5. Jesus is Lucifer’s brother

O.K. start . . . .


16 posted on 12/02/2010 6:19:15 PM PST by laweeks
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To: delacoert
As a nonbeliever in any religion, these threads kind of baffle me. The people I know who comfortable with their Christianity are some of the finest people I've ever met. Raised around a heap of Mormons, and having rejected it, I still must admit that good Mormons are among the finest people I have ever met. As an atheist, I must admit that most of the worst people I've met have been atheists, though that end of the spectrum of character and behavior which is bad spans pretty much every discipline, or non discipline. Our constitution was written by people profoundly moral, based in their belief in God, and I benefit greatly from their morality and sacrifice. Even as an atheist, I can very much appreciate and support any belief that improves personal character and behavior and thus raises our standard of living or quality of life. I see this trait in both Mormons and Christians. Tis greatly sad to me to see them at each others’ throats, when so much truly evil liberalism gathers at our doorstep.
17 posted on 12/02/2010 6:20:39 PM PST by wgflyer (Liberalism is to society what HIV is to the immune system.)
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To: svcw

Oh...then the posting was a mistake. I did not know you could make such a long post by accident.


18 posted on 12/02/2010 6:21:22 PM PST by Goreknowshowtocheat
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To: conservativegramma; Paragon Defender

“...so that you can continue to abuse FR as your own personal proselytizing site...”

You must be kidding, right?

Nobody abuses this great website more than the gang of anti-Mormon fanatics who disregard EVERY American’s right to “Freedom of Religion”.

Let them believe and practice as they wish. They’re not hurting you. There are far greater issues facing our country at this time that should command your attention.


19 posted on 12/02/2010 6:27:29 PM PST by panaxanax (IMPEACH THE MUSLIM MARXIST....NOW!!!)
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To: delacoert
Christianity has not been to easy on Christianity either..
The word heretic is used quite easily on some places..
A little less common but still potent in other places..

The word cult is also used commonly to describe problems in dogma..
The lack of the right ceremonies are viewed harshly in other places..

20 posted on 12/02/2010 6:32:55 PM PST by hosepipe (This propaganda has been edited to include some fully orbed hyperbole....)
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To: Godzilla

Thx. Been deliberately not posting to most of this stuff anymore — just spinning my wheels most of the time and it ends up devolving into personal attacks (usually at me, then when I respond back to the abusive poster I’m the one who gets banned from the thread rather than the abusive LDS apologist!)

And if the above doesn’t happen it just seems to end up in general argumentativeness which really doesn’t further the Gospel. Mormons sad to say are blinder than bats when it comes to their founders and founding documents.

But every once in a while there is a stupid post I just can’t keep myself from responding to! Woe is me......


21 posted on 12/02/2010 6:34:54 PM PST by conservativegramma
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To: Goreknowshowtocheat

Well, you win the cupie doll because your response has nothing to do with what I asked of you.
Really just one untruth from the original post, just one.


22 posted on 12/02/2010 6:36:50 PM PST by svcw
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To: panaxanax

Non-believer here. Tell you what. Any interest I might have had in Christianity has been snuffed out as a result of the nasty sh*t I’ve been exposed to by the Christians who post about Mormons here.


23 posted on 12/02/2010 6:37:37 PM PST by behzinlea
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To: panaxanax
Oh please. Show me one post or one statement that any freeper has said they want to deny any lds from practicing what they want.
What freepers want to do is expose the blasphemy of lds.
24 posted on 12/02/2010 6:39:44 PM PST by svcw
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To: behzinlea

Ye, right. (roll eyes)


25 posted on 12/02/2010 6:40:28 PM PST by svcw
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To: panaxanax
Nobody abuses this great website more than the gang of anti-Mormon fanatics who disregard EVERY American’s right to “Freedom of Religion”.

that has got to be the biggest pile of bovine excrement I've seen whinned by a mormon in a long time. Thanks panamax, your comments juxtaposed to the documented words of your PROPHETS and APOSTLES are priceless.

26 posted on 12/02/2010 6:41:26 PM PST by Godzilla (3-7-77)
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To: conservativegramma
But every once in a while there is a stupid post I just can’t keep myself from responding to! Woe is me......

I understand fully, but then some time you feel like a nut. . . . . .

27 posted on 12/02/2010 6:42:36 PM PST by Godzilla (3-7-77)
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To: panaxanax

I wish I were kidding. Unfortunately not. From the very first night I joined FR — I noticed almost every thread pushing the LDS under the religion category. It still does, although now it appears to be LDS caucus and posts are about equal with Catholicism caucus and posts.

Tell me exactly how refuting the error of a gaggle of LDS zealots is abusing ‘freedom of religion’. Are not the anti’s allowed to practice their religion as well (which mandates refutation of error btw)? Or is it just Mormons who are a protected class allowed to preach LDS ‘truth’ over mainline church ‘apostasy’? I believe elevating one religion above another is prohibited by the 1st amendment. Therefore the only ones ‘abusing freedom of religion’ on this forum are those who want to mandate that one religion’s viewpoints are to be suppressed while another is allowed to freely propagate.

Regarding ‘not hurting me’ consider this: for every Christian they lead away into error results in eternal damnation. Unless you think the destruction of the soul is a harmless matter? Christ didn’t think it was harmless. I serve Him not you - no offense.

As far as greater issues facing our country, I would argue there is not a greater issue than restoring our countries foundational roots. You can’t fight liberalism, socialism, marxism, moral and cultural wars, homosexuality, gay marriage, etc. etc. without a return to biblical truth. And you aren’t going to find biblical truth within the LDS. A gentle reminder: it wasn’t Mormons who founded this country, it was those mainline Christians who Mormons brand apostates who founded this nation.


28 posted on 12/02/2010 6:53:39 PM PST by conservativegramma
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To: behzinlea

I agree with you, behzinlea. It does get tiresome listening to their stale attacks.

I’ll defend your choice to be a “non-believer” as strongly as I will defend Mormons to worship as they choose.

Hint: Don’t waste any of your valuable time trying to argue with these anti-Mormon bigots. Ignoring them really ticks them off, which brings a wide smile to my face.


29 posted on 12/02/2010 6:55:16 PM PST by panaxanax (IMPEACH THE MUSLIM MARXIST....NOW!!!)
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To: behzinlea
Any interest I might have had in Christianity has been snuffed out as a result of the nasty sh*t I’ve been exposed to by the Christians who post about Mormons here.

If you bothered to look up the source citations you'd know that all that nasty stuff Christians have posted are in fact the written documentation and teachings of Mormon leaders, founders, and prophets. If you think its nasty I would suggest writing the hierarchy in Salt Lake City.

30 posted on 12/02/2010 6:59:00 PM PST by conservativegramma
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To: panaxanax
Don’t waste any of your valuable time trying to argue with these anti-Mormon bigots. Ignoring them really ticks them off, which brings a wide smile to my face.

LOL! Thanks for that quite humorous post, really made my day!

So being anti-mormon makes you a bigot????? And I suppose being an LDS anti-Christian apostate mainline church basher ISN'T being bigoted? Not even a teeeeeny wittle bit???? (eye roll).

31 posted on 12/02/2010 7:05:36 PM PST by conservativegramma
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To: HospiceNurse
Jesus faced a mob that was eager to execute a woman caught in adultery. He put a stop to it with a simple challenge: anyone who has no sin in their life should step forward and throw the first stone. That sentence is often cited as a reminder to avoid judging others when there are faults in your own life that need to be addressed.

And yet we are also tasked by Jesus himself to be Holy as he is Holy, to emulate him in all facets of our life.

Jesus spent roughly half of his time on earth rebuking sin and pointing out the Error of Man.

We as "Christ"ians, can do no less.

Which means in no uncertain terms that we are required by God himself to rebuke those caught up in sin and to point those in error, such as Mormons, back to the Narrow Way of the Gospel as recorded in the Bible.
32 posted on 12/02/2010 7:13:58 PM PST by SoConPubbie
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To: panaxanax; conservativegramma
I agree with you, behzinlea. It does get tiresome listening to their stale attacks.

Ever notice that when you point out the fallasies of the Mormon religion using their own leader's comments that the only response you get from some Mormons is one of the following?

1. It's an attack
2. You're a bigot
3. You're a hater


Mind you, there is never any evidence given by them nor can they prove it by the postings of the posters they're actually attacking.
33 posted on 12/02/2010 7:17:09 PM PST by SoConPubbie
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To: HospiceNurse
"Jesus faced a mob that was eager to execute a woman caught in adultery. He put a stop to it with a simple challenge: anyone who has no sin in their life should step forward and throw the first stone. That sentence is often cited as a reminder to avoid judging others when there are faults in your own life that need to be addressed."

============================================================ To: se_ohio_young_conservative
Bristol doesn’t appear to be either.

Underage sex, teen pregnancy, unwed mother to a baby daddy who appears in sex magazines and whose mother is a meth dealer. Conservatives, except those blinded by a cult of personality, condemn such things.
27 posted on Friday, November 26, 2010 4:01:49 AM by HospiceNurse

34 posted on 12/02/2010 7:55:33 PM PST by ansel12
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To: svcw

I suppose you could quote a thousand pastors saying something that is not politically correct by today’s standards and use that against some denomination. This is what was done here. You may have your fun quoting from the 19th century to your heart’s content. If some quote makes a good anti-mormon vehicle you may use it. There are thousands here that need a daily anti-mormon piece. Be sure when you post you never look at the other side. That is important. And yes, we do believe in the restoration of the Gospel in it’s fullness, long lost during the dark ages. I suppose looking through the glasses of the restoration, we would look askance at the remnants of a forgotten purity with regard to other Christian groups. However, much has changed and we generally have good relations with most Christian groups. I have a family full of Baptists and Methodists and Catholics. We get along. My children went to Catholic and Protestant schools. They were nice people.


35 posted on 12/02/2010 8:00:07 PM PST by Goreknowshowtocheat
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To: Paragon Defender

The Apostle Peter warns about false teachers secretly entering the church. We are also admonished to watch and warn. In our estimation, the LDS (Mormon) Church is filled with false teachers. And we warn otherwise gullible people to beware. The LDS has NO proof that the Christian Church is apostate. Interestingly, there is zero archeological evidence to support the claims of the LDS here in North America...and that is from the Smithsonian...no friend of Christianity by any stretch of the imagination.


36 posted on 12/02/2010 8:06:01 PM PST by LiteKeeper ("Psalm 109:8")
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To: conservativegramma

A bigot is “a person who is obstinately or intolerantly devoted to his or her own opinions and prejudices; especially : one who regards or treats the members of a group (as a racial or ethnic group) with hatred and intolerance”

http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/bigot

LDS are taught and encouraged NOT to be bigoted. We believe in being tolerant, understanding and friendly with people who believe differently and I have found that Mormons generally live up to that counsel.


37 posted on 12/02/2010 8:24:21 PM PST by Normandy
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To: Normandy; conservativegramma
LDS are taught and encouraged NOT to be bigoted.

Then perhaps you should council this brother of yours in this point.

38 posted on 12/02/2010 8:30:45 PM PST by Godzilla (3-7-77)
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To: Normandy

#1 Exposing error is not being hateful or intolerant. If that were so, then Christ and His Apostles were all hateful and intolerant.

#2 the notion that all Mormons believe in being tolerant and understanding with people who believe differently is an outright lie. You might want to reprimand the 2 Mormon missionaries who came to my door recently telling me how apostate my church was and I needed the Gospel ‘restored’. I’m sorry but being called an apostate is not very kind, nor is it friendly, nor is it ‘tolerant’ of others beliefs. Seems to me love and tolerance for LDS is a one way street, tolerance for me but not for thee seems to be the motto.


39 posted on 12/02/2010 8:41:03 PM PST by conservativegramma
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To: hosepipe

I think that’s a good point. To be sure, the vast majority of the time when one Freeper calls another’s faith unChristian on FR, it comes from another sort of Christian Freeper, not LDS.

Freegards


40 posted on 12/02/2010 8:45:37 PM PST by Ransomed
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To: svcw

I remember one post that called for the gubberment to repress the LDS. To be fair, this poster was then ridiculed for this view by the usual anti-LDS Freepers.

Freegards


41 posted on 12/02/2010 8:47:30 PM PST by Ransomed
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To: Normandy

#3 - And oh yeah, calling others who are NOT Mormon ‘Apostates’ is most definitely BIGOTED. “LDS are taught and encourage NOT to be bigoted” = lie #2. Every single time you come to the door and preach your vile ‘restored full Gospel’ to a mainline church Christian ‘apostate’ you are being bigoted — and you are being trained to be bigots. Stop the missionary work and then you’ll cease to be bigots. As long as the missionary work continues your bigotry continues in spades.


42 posted on 12/02/2010 8:48:19 PM PST by conservativegramma
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To: panaxanax; conservativegramma
Nobody abuses this great website more than the gang of anti-Mormon fanatics who disregard EVERY American’s right to “Freedom of Religion”.

Now that is a new one for Mormons and their defenders.

Just as lacking in supporting evidence and logic though.

Nobody on this thread is threatening anybody's "Freedom of Religion".

I think you probably think there is some type of right guaranteed to you to a "Freedom to be critized".

I got news for you, it doesn't exist in the Constitution.
43 posted on 12/02/2010 11:35:37 PM PST by SoConPubbie
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To: SoConPubbie; panaxanax; conservativegramma
I think you probably think there is some type of right guaranteed to you to a "Freedom to be critized".

That should be:

I think you probably think there is some type of right guaranteed to you to a "Freedom from being critized".
44 posted on 12/02/2010 11:37:30 PM PST by SoConPubbie
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To: Goreknowshowtocheat

One critical flaw in your argument is that the statements of a thousand pastors cannot be equated with the statements of men who, at the time they made the statements, were proclaimed (by themselves and others) as being the unique mouthpieces of God, every bit as authoritative in their proclamations as Jesus and the apostles.

And we’re not talking about “political correctness,” either. We’re talking about contradictions between official LDS teachings and the Bible; and often between LDS teachings and your own scriptures.


45 posted on 12/02/2010 11:42:12 PM PST by william clark (Ecclesiastes 10:2)
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To: william clark

Well, I guess we need another thread, get to it. There are thousands waiting with baited breath.


46 posted on 12/03/2010 5:54:26 AM PST by Goreknowshowtocheat
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To: Goreknowshowtocheat

Thanks but it still doesn’t answer the question. What from the original post is untrue?


47 posted on 12/03/2010 6:52:54 AM PST by svcw
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To: Ransomed

Ok, so you have a vague recollection of some poster sometime ago saying that the government should suppress lds beliefs and it was the so called anti’s who shot them down. So it was the so called anti’s who actually came to defense of religious freedom. That is good to know.


48 posted on 12/03/2010 6:55:29 AM PST by svcw
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To: wgflyer

Well said.


49 posted on 12/03/2010 6:55:45 AM PST by LanPB01
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To: Paragon Defender

Question to you: why do you say “our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ. “ — do you really believe that Jesus came for our salvation? To allow us to enter heaven?


50 posted on 12/03/2010 7:00:52 AM PST by Cronos (Et Verbum caro factum est et habitavit in nobis (And the word was made flesh, and dwelt amonst us))
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