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What Are We To Make of the Anti-Catholics.
Self | Jan 8, 2011 | Natural Law

Posted on 01/08/2011 4:15:03 PM PST by Natural Law

What are we to make of the anti-Catholics?

What are we to make of the anti-Catholics? How can we explain the assault on the Church by those who profess in their words the same mission of the Church, the Salvation of mankind, but through their deeds deny it? Are the fabrications, falsehoods, and lies about the supporting beliefs of the Church, about the lives of its saints and clergy, about the verifiable facts of history justified because of doctrinal disagreements? Does any of this matter in the face of the greater assault on Christ and his flock? It defies rational thinking.

In the face of a Muslim onslaught that is bombing Christmas Masses, executing Christians for a nonexistent heresy and apostasy, and a jihad against Christians of all stripes on a massive scale we get shrill unwarranted criticism of how Catholics peaceably worship the One true God. Is smells and bells really a greater sin than sawing off heads in the name of the prophet?

In the face of a secular socialist assault that is killing babies at a pace that outpaces the crimes of Hitler, Stalin and Mao combined there are degrading insults and accusations over the difference between worship and veneration. Corrections and explanations are ignored and the apologists are pilloried. For what purpose?

In the face of the threat of Communist China that suppresses worship of all kinds and enforces forced abortions we get feeble ad naseum criticism of the Real Presence in spite of the acceptance by Catholics, both Eastern and Latin Rite, Lutherans, Anglicans, and Methodists. All the while the anti-Catholics continue the charade of Christian unity, minus those damned Catholics of course.

So in the face of the advance of worldwide evil some would have us believe that it is the Catholic Church should be destroyed when the destruction of the Church would serve to provide aid and comfort to that evil. Why? Qui Bono, for whom the benefit?

That the Church is and has always been a target of evil cannot be denied. Neither can it be denied that the Church has never been harmed or compromised by that evil. Satan can only work in this world through the actions of his willing accomplices. Those accomplices have long ago recognized that the greatest harm can be done from within the Church and history has produced numerous examples of sinners wearing the collars of priests. Regardless of the contentions of the anti-Catholics that does not negate the good that the Church has done not diminish the saints who have served God through her. Nor does it excuse those who blame one of the victims of the evil doers, the Church itself.

Perhaps those who irrationally assault the Church daily, those who spend inordinate hours researching the internet looking for dirt, those who accept any lie or indiscretion on nothing more than its bias against the Church are consciously or unconsciously in league with evil. Lex Parsimoniae, the principle which generally recommends accepting the answer that requires the fewest assumptions, when the potential answers are equal in all other respects. Is there a simpler answer?


TOPICS: Catholic; Religion & Culture
KEYWORDS: anticatholicism; catholics; vanity
Navigation: use the links below to view more comments.
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To: bkaycee
God the Son gained our salvation by his death and resurrection; no one else did these things
God the Father planned our salvation, not man.
And God the Holy Spirit infused the very love of God into our hearts by his presence (cf. Rom. 5:5).

All that we do is respond with faith and obedience to God’s offer of grace in Christ. This is a lifelong commitment that we should grow in God's love. God’s grace grows within us as we trust in God more and follow his commandments. The final outcome of a life of faith and obedience is eternal life with God.

Acts 16:31 says, "Believe in the Lord Jesus, and you will be saved"
Romans 10:9: "If you confess with your lips that Jesus is Lord and believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead, you will be saved."

The Church affirms the teaching of these texts. They are calling us to decisive trust in Christ. Trust in Christ is essential to salvation.
201 posted on 01/11/2011 6:13:53 AM PST by Cronos (Bobby Jindal 2012)
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To: Religion Moderator; Zionist Conspirator

Valid enough, RM. Since it is an ethno-religious group, it has different connotations.


202 posted on 01/11/2011 6:15:29 AM PST by Cronos (Bobby Jindal 2012)
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To: TheDingoAteMyBaby
No, he was not excommunicated -- whatever gave you that idea? Cutie :-P converted of his own accord to the Episcopal Church (you know the one with the gay and lesbian "married" clergy).

Cutie ;-P could have remained in the Catholic Church by foregoing being a priest. I have a grand-uncle in my family who was a priest, but asked to be allowed to resign his post to marry a woman -- that was granted. The Catholic Church realises we are all human and if a priest wants to leave the priesthood to marry, so be it. Cutie had that option, but he didn't exercise it.

The Catholic Church also allows married men to become priests (but not priests to get married) in the Eastern Catholic Churches.
203 posted on 01/11/2011 6:19:57 AM PST by Cronos (Bobby Jindal 2012)
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To: TheDingoAteMyBaby
laicization and formal excommunication are two different things. the former is reserved to the Pope and is a long process with many steps. It may be done on the request of the priest for instance by a priest who wishes to leave and get married. According to published reports of which there are dozens of existing threads here, this priest did NOT choose to go that route but simply left without even, according to his bishop, asking or telling his superior of his decision.
204 posted on 01/11/2011 6:37:03 AM PST by Cronos (Bobby Jindal 2012)
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To: malkee
Here’s the main point — Catholics believe Christ died knowing that his death wouldn’t “cover” all believers.

John 6:37 "All that the Father gives Me will come to Me, and the one who comes to Me I will certainly not cast out. 38 "For I have come down from heaven, not to do My own will, but the will of Him who sent Me. 39 "This is the will of Him who sent Me, that of all that He has given Me I lose nothing, but raise it up on the last day. 40"For this is the will of My Father, that everyone who beholds the Son and believes in Him will have eternal life, and I Myself will raise him up on the last day."

The scripture clearly states that ALL those drawn by the father will become believers and Christ will lose none.

Hence the verse about how many will say “Lord, Lord,” and be surprised when they’re denied heaven. Many believe that the cup Christ begged to be delivered from before his death was not the Crucifixion but the fact that not all sinners would be saved by his death. (That last part is not Catholic dogma, just something written by a Catholic)

Matt 7:21" Not everyone who says to Me, 'Lord, Lord,' will enter the kingdom of heaven, but he who does the will of My Father who is in heaven will enter. 22"Many will say to Me on that day, 'Lord, Lord, did we not prophesy in Your name, and in Your name cast out demons, and in Your name perform many miracles?' 23"And then I will declare to them, 'I never knew you; DEPART FROM ME, YOU WHO PRACTICE LAWLESSNESS.'

Those rejected were NEVER known by Christ, were never real Christians. They were tares posing as believers, most likely self deluded into thinking rituals and forms of Godliness was a means to Heaven and did not have a saving Faith (trust in Christ's work and substitutionary atonement alone).

205 posted on 01/11/2011 6:37:25 AM PST by bkaycee
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To: Cronos
Acts 16:31 says, "Believe in the Lord Jesus, and you will be saved" Romans 10:9: "If you confess with your lips that Jesus is Lord and believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead, you will be saved."

The Church affirms the teaching of these texts. They are calling us to decisive trust in Christ. Trust in Christ is essential to salvation.

Trust in Christ is Essential? But not enough?

206 posted on 01/11/2011 6:55:54 AM PST by bkaycee
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To: bkaycee

Trust in Christ is essential, yet scripture also tells us to repent and be saved, to hear the word of God and be saved, that love is also essential. We need all of these things — it is not “only”, yet remember, I repeat, without Christ’s sacrifice, the essential component, all of our hearing, repenting, love would be useless, worse than useless. Christ’s sacrifice is what saved us.


207 posted on 01/11/2011 6:59:55 AM PST by Cronos (Bobby Jindal 2012)
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To: bkaycee
Trust in Christ is Essential? But not enough?

Try this, since what you say is clearly unsatisfactory (to me, anyway.)

Trust (faith) is dynamic in some respects. It doesn't just sit there on your chest like a competency badge: Marksmanship, First Aid, Faithfulness. If one is just sitting there vegging, faith is probably not what's going on.

We had a wonderful Epiphany (three kings day -- but that's not the half of it) sermon. The friar said that the faith of the wisemen caused them to travel after what was strange and foreign -- even unattainable. It was a star, for crying out loud!

And the star led them to a strange king and then to what has to be one of the world's strangest gatherings - the traditional (but see Isaiah 1:3a) ox and ass, some shepherds, a carpenter and his young wife, and a baby -- all in some kind of stable.

And then they have to go home by another way -- not even the pleasure of retracing one's steps and saying, "Oh, yes, I remember this."

Even we, who say such extravagant things about Mary, say she sought her Son anxiously.

So I would offer that, in and through 'trust in Christ,' we are called and enabled to journey, to move, to leave things behind, to go home another way, to travel light, and to follow strange things, things utterly outside our world yet revealed in it.

So in some sense the opposition between 'trust in Christ' and other stuff is as bogus as the opposition between opening one's mouth to receive food and swallowing that food. If we just ate a carrot seed, we'd starve. But when it grows, it's good food.

Just a thought.

208 posted on 01/11/2011 7:57:10 AM PST by Mad Dawg (Oh Mary, conceived without sin, pray for us who have recourse to thee.)
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To: seemoAR
Quick, old wise one. What was the title and context of this thread? Do you think any one that does not drink your kool- aid has any reason to be insulted?

We're talking about your post in particular, not the whole thread. But since you brought it up, why would anybody be insulted by the title of the thread, unless they were anti-Catholic? If there were a thread called "What are we to make of the anti-Mormons?" I wouldn't be the least bit insulted even though I'm not Mormon, because I'm not anti-Mormon, either. And if you are insulted because you are, indeed, anti-Catholic, then maybe you deserve to be insulted.
209 posted on 01/11/2011 9:53:19 AM PST by fr_freak
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To: fr_freak

I am unable to carry on with this folly. I wasn’t anti Catholic. I won’t be wasting any more time with you.

I do pity you however.


210 posted on 01/11/2011 1:30:34 PM PST by seemoAR
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To: seemoAR
I wasn’t anti Catholic.

But are you now, or have you ever been UNCLE Catholic? Hah? Answer me that. Hah!

Let the record show that the witness is placing his face in his palm while shaking his head. Clearly he is overwhelmed with the incisive brilliance of this question.]

No further questions, your honor.

211 posted on 01/11/2011 5:44:22 PM PST by Mad Dawg (Oh Mary, conceived without sin, pray for us who have recourse to thee.)
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To: Mad Dawg

Damn, I’m good.


212 posted on 01/11/2011 5:45:38 PM PST by Mad Dawg (Oh Mary, conceived without sin, pray for us who have recourse to thee.)
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To: Cronos
Anti-Catholics are of two types:

There are a few more such as the useful idiots of those who support the main harpies, but I think that you have more than adequately described the bulk of anti Catholics.

213 posted on 01/11/2011 5:59:46 PM PST by MarkBsnr (I would not believe in the Gospel if the authority of the Catholic Church did not move me to do so..)
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To: bkaycee

More single verses of the Gospel of Paul? Any teachings of Christ in your Christianity?


214 posted on 01/11/2011 6:10:09 PM PST by MarkBsnr (I would not believe in the Gospel if the authority of the Catholic Church did not move me to do so..)
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To: Religion Moderator
Thick skin is required for "open" Religion Forum debate and the RM must have exceptionally thick skin.

For obvious reasons. Still, this RF is moderated as well as I've seen before and better than most. I hear tell of a change of RMs. Could that be true?

215 posted on 01/11/2011 6:13:42 PM PST by MarkBsnr (I would not believe in the Gospel if the authority of the Catholic Church did not move me to do so..)
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To: RFEngineer
I happen to know that more than 9 out of 10 Catholics today are against burning at the stake for the heresy.

I'd like to see the figures. Is this Rasmussen, Zogby, Gallup or Pew?

216 posted on 01/11/2011 6:15:14 PM PST by MarkBsnr (I would not believe in the Gospel if the authority of the Catholic Church did not move me to do so..)
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To: Judith Anne
What is different about the Jesuit and Dominican Orders?”

“Met any Albigensians lately?”


217 posted on 01/11/2011 6:19:38 PM PST by MarkBsnr (I would not believe in the Gospel if the authority of the Catholic Church did not move me to do so..)
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To: Mad Dawg
Damn, I’m good.

A tad punchy, though...

218 posted on 01/11/2011 6:25:08 PM PST by MarkBsnr (I would not believe in the Gospel if the authority of the Catholic Church did not move me to do so..)
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To: seemoAR
I do pity you however.

Of course you do. I'm sure you pity anyone who isn't you.
219 posted on 01/11/2011 6:55:49 PM PST by fr_freak
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To: MarkBsnr

Are you offering?


220 posted on 01/11/2011 7:22:36 PM PST by Religion Moderator
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To: Religion Moderator

I’m not sure I’d be up to the task.


221 posted on 01/11/2011 7:35:03 PM PST by MarkBsnr (I would not believe in the Gospel if the authority of the Catholic Church did not move me to do so..)
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To: Mad Dawg

OOH! Is you a lawyer. How can I answer a question if I don’t know what it is. What in the name of anything does “UNCLE Catholic” mean? Is it a Catholic thing? I do have a Catholic Aunt. She likes the booze now also.

Why do you have your face in your palm. Are you that embarrassed? I don’t care to be “Your Honor”. Thank you anyway. {:0)


222 posted on 01/12/2011 3:33:27 AM PST by seemoAR
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To: fr_freak
No. I don't pity people because they are not me. I know who and what I am. I wouldn't wish that on anyone.

Get real, grow up. Do a little research on your Religion on the Internet or the local Library if your religion allows. You are as guilty of the Inquisitions as I am of having slaves.

Does “fr_” mean Friar, as in Friar Tuck? :0)

223 posted on 01/12/2011 3:47:51 AM PST by seemoAR
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To: MarkBsnr

ah, yes, the useful idiots, or the “pay-for-a-screed” groupies.


224 posted on 01/12/2011 4:17:02 AM PST by Cronos (Bobby Jindal 2012)
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To: TheDingoAteMyBaby

so, please stop the knee-jerk anti-Catholicism. The difference between what an anti-Catholic thinks the Church is all about and what the Church actually teaches is quite wide.


225 posted on 01/12/2011 4:22:51 AM PST by Cronos (Bobby Jindal 2012)
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To: seemoAR

No. You haz your face in YOUR palm because of the devastating incisiveness (not to mention the stoopiddiddy) of my cross-examination.

You might also be shaking as if weeping. (All suggestions that you might be laughing at moi are naturally rejected as being dethpicable.)

And, well, harrumph, if YOU innerdooce into evidence the concept of auntie-calflick, you can count on my alert cerebral cortex to bring up uncle-catholic

You have been warned.


226 posted on 01/12/2011 4:29:39 AM PST by Mad Dawg (Oh Mary, conceived without sin, pray for us who have recourse to thee.)
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To: MarkBsnr
More single verses of the Gospel of Paul? Any teachings of Christ in your Christianity?

Yeah, I guess the Holy Spirit screwed up with Paul, although when I was Catholic Paul's writing were part of the New Testament.

You do understand that the 4 Gospels and ACTS are more of a narrative of what happend and not meant to be theological teaching and instruction from the Apostles to the churches. It is more description rather than prescription. In the Gospels Jesus is still teaching in parables to HIDE the truth from some.

Matt 13:10 The disciples came to him and asked, “Why do you speak to the people in parables?” 11 He replied, “Because the knowledge of the secrets of the kingdom of heaven has been given to you, but not to them.

Mark 1:15 And saying, “The time is fulfilled, and the kingdom of God is at hand; repent and believe in the gospel.”

Like 18:9 To some who were confident of their own righteousness and looked down on everyone else, Jesus told this parable: 10 “Two men went up to the temple to pray, one a Pharisee and the other a tax collector. 11 The Pharisee stood by himself and prayed: ‘God, I thank you that I am not like other people—robbers, evildoers, adulterers—or even like this tax collector. 12 I fast twice a week and give a tenth of all I get.’ 13 “But the tax collector stood at a distance. He would not even look up to heaven, but beat his breast and said, ‘God, have mercy on me, a sinner.’ 14 “I tell you that this man, rather than the other, went home justified before God. For all those who exalt themselves will be humbled, and those who humble themselves will be exalted.”

Luke 24:45 Then he opened their minds so they could understand the Scriptures. 46 He told them, “This is what is written: The Messiah will suffer and rise from the dead on the third day, 47 and repentance for the forgiveness of sins will be preached in his name to all nations, beginning at Jerusalem. John 3:18 Whoever believes in him is not condemned, but whoever does not believe stands condemned already because they have not believed in the name of God’s one and only Son.

John 5:24 Truly, truly, I say to you, whoever hears my word and believes him who sent me has eternal life. He does not come into judgment, but has passed from death to life.

John 6:40 For my Father’s will is that everyone who looks to the Son and believes in him shall have eternal life, and I will raise them up at the last day.”

John 8:23 But he continued, “You are from below; I am from above. You are of this world; I am not of this world. 24 I told you that you would die in your sins; if you do not believe that I am he, you will indeed die in your sins.”

227 posted on 01/12/2011 8:16:52 AM PST by bkaycee
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To: Cronos; TheDingoAteMyBaby
I wouldn't say, because I don't know, that TDAMB is succumbing to knee-jerk anything -- except the knee-jerk reporting by somebody else, maybe.

I think we all, including Catholics, need to be prudent when we encounter stories that prompt an "Ah-HAH!" in us. If things that are 'too good to be true' rarely are true, so, more than likely, are things too 'juicy' or too perfect to be true.

Right now the MSM are doing everything they can to pin the Tucson massacre on the right in general and on Palin in particular. But the more facts come to the surface, the harder it is to pin that tail on those donkeys, uh, elephants, whatever.

We ought at least to think about using the same discretion we expect the newsies to practice. We're all outraged when they don't use their critical faculties, and rightly so. Maybe when a story appears that "perfectly" shows how weird the Catholics or the OPC's are, maybe we could step back and take a breath and check our assumptions and our sources.

228 posted on 01/12/2011 10:11:49 AM PST by Mad Dawg (Oh Mary, conceived without sin, pray for us who have recourse to thee.)
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To: Natural Law

The whole post is a false dichotomy between evil in the world and true religion.


229 posted on 01/12/2011 10:15:24 AM PST by the_conscience (We ought to obey God, rather than men. (Acts 5:29b))
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To: seemoAR
Get real, grow up. Do a little research on your Religion on the Internet or the local Library if your religion allows. You are as guilty of the Inquisitions as I am of having slaves.

Now where, exactly, does this come from? Slaves? Inquisition? What does that have to do with anything we've been discussing? Are you sure you're not mixing conversations with other people?
230 posted on 01/12/2011 10:18:56 AM PST by fr_freak
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To: Cronos

My apologies, then. I was not familiar with the differences. So does he have any chance of returning to the RCC and keeping his wife?


231 posted on 01/12/2011 12:09:12 PM PST by TheDingoAteMyBaby
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To: TheDingoAteMyBaby

I’m certain he could be allowed back. I’m guessing not as a priest.


232 posted on 01/12/2011 1:39:09 PM PST by Mad Dawg (Oh Mary, conceived without sin, pray for us who have recourse to thee.)
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To: Mad Dawg

Darn, little fellow. Your panties seem to be in a knot.

Again, What is an uncle catholic? :0)


233 posted on 01/13/2011 3:52:51 AM PST by seemoAR
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To: fr_freak
Using your logic, the holocaust never happened. Again, does fr_ mean Friar as in Friar Tuck?
234 posted on 01/13/2011 3:57:09 AM PST by seemoAR
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To: TheDingoAteMyBaby
No worries -- we all make mistakes. I do believe that a lot of times people hate what the "image" of the Church which can be quite different from the reality, as in this case! Sticking to the same non-theological point, the "bad priest" percentage who did these heinuous acts are estimated globally to be 1-2%, which is less than the number of child molesters in society at large and about par with Protestant pastors and scout masters and less than teachers. HOWEVER, this does NOT condone their actions. If the present Pope had the kind of power that popes are accused of, Ratzinger would excommunicate these perverted monsters (it's another story about the fact that the papacy and bishops isn't quite like the Pres and governors, with less control). What is astonishing is how the liberal MSM has taken these 1-2% bad eggs to smear the remaining 98% of hard-working priests and taken it to smear all of Christianity.

To your question specifically, can Cutie return to the Church and keep his wife -- technically YES, but NOT as a priest. I say technically, because by joining the ECUSA he seems to be indicating that he supports the gay marriages, etc that the ECUSA stands for -- and while I consider conservative Anglicans to be true Christians and very orthodoxy, I scorn what the ECUSA has become in these days of Gene Robinson. To my mind, Cutie has now become a liberal and it should be strongly checked whether he retains orthodox conservative beliefs -- only then should he be let back in.

He cannot become a priest again, that's final as he has given up his vocation. This is quite different from Anglican priests who are already married and quite different from CAtholic married men who become priests (this is allowed in the Eastern Catholic Churchs)
235 posted on 01/13/2011 4:03:54 AM PST by Cronos (Bobby Jindal 2012)
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To: seemoAR; fr_freak
FF: Generally speaking, people who call themselves Christian, but are anti-Catholic (not to be confused with merely disagreeing with Catholic belief, but in despising or insulting the Church) are simply fools for whom vanity is the driving force in what passes for their faith.
SAR: Generally speaking, According to my Bible, I am not supposed to think people like you are a fool. This will be settled when we die. I’m not worried, are you?
ff: Nope, not worried about it in the least. And subtle implications may be clever concealment among men, but I hardly think they fool God for a second.
SAR: I do pity you however.
ff: Of course you do. I'm sure you pity anyone who isn't you.
SAR: Get real, grow up. Do a little research on your Religion on the Internet or the local Library if your religion allows. You are as guilty of the Inquisitions as I am of having slaves.
ff: Now where, exactly, does this come from? Slaves? Inquisition? What does that have to do with anything we've been discussing?
sar: Using your logic, the holocaust never happened

Seemo -- huh? the is no chain of logic in this. No living American today is guilty of slavery of African-Americans(millions of them) or the Inquisition (3000 people executed over 300 years, conviction rate of 3%, lower than civil courts of the time). In fact many people may actually have had ancestors on BOTH sides.

Seemo-What exactly is your point? Seriously? FF started off differentiating between non-Catholic Christians who are just happy to live in the love of Christ and non-Catholic ANTI-Catholics. As you said yourself, you are not in that latter list, hence whatever ff said in post 10 was not applicable to you, correct?
236 posted on 01/13/2011 4:13:18 AM PST by Cronos (Bobby Jindal 2012)
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To: seemoAR
Is THAT why I can't get comfortable in this chair?

How should I know what an uncle Catholic is? I'm too busy being ridiculous.

[I'm sorry, this is what happens to my alleged brain when I have too much stuff to do.]

237 posted on 01/13/2011 8:50:07 AM PST by Mad Dawg (Oh Mary, conceived without sin, pray for us who have recourse to thee.)
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To: bkaycee
You do understand that the 4 Gospels and ACTS are more of a narrative of what happend and not meant to be theological teaching and instruction from the Apostles to the churches. It is more description rather than prescription. In the Gospels Jesus is still teaching in parables to HIDE the truth from some.

Scripture please - chapter and verse, which claims this. Until then, there are a couple of useful statements. If you follow the words of Christ, then you are Christian. If you follow the words of Paul, then you are Paulian. Paulianity has been proscribed as heresy for over a millennium and a half.

238 posted on 01/13/2011 10:21:54 AM PST by MarkBsnr (I would not believe in the Gospel if the authority of the Catholic Church did not move me to do so..)
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To: MarkBsnr; Mad Dawg; Cronos; Judith Anne
"Paulianity has been proscribed as heresy for over a millennium and a half."

I'm sure that to some there is a conflict between Christianity and Paulianty, but with the overall lack of Christian good will displayed by the anti-Catholics I suspect this has nothing to do with religion at all. I think it is filling the void left in their lives by the collapse of racism as an acceptable feel good outlet within their limited culture and circles. There always has to be a "them" to hate and being anti-Catholics doesn't bring down the PC police like hating blacks and Jews.

239 posted on 01/14/2011 3:35:19 PM PST by Natural Law
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To: Natural Law
I'm sure that to some there is a conflict between Christianity and Paulianty, but with the overall lack of Christian good will displayed by the anti-Catholics I suspect this has nothing to do with religion at all.

The basis of the Reformation rests largely on first millennium heresies among which Paulianity is prominent. The Reformation was a repudiation of Christianity and that meant that they left no heretical stones unturned in the development of their various doctrines. Which, of course, immediately diverged in all directions, as individual men discovered that suddenly all stops were out; there was no Church and you could come up with whatever beliefs that you wanted, with no limit on the imagination.

The antiCatholics here are simply following in their own sacred tradition of antiCatholicism. Look at the incessant antiCatholicism of the 1800s in the US, Canada and the UK for evidence of that.

240 posted on 01/14/2011 3:45:56 PM PST by MarkBsnr (I would not believe in the Gospel if the authority of the Catholic Church did not move me to do so..)
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To: MarkBsnr
"The antiCatholics here are simply following in their own sacred tradition of antiCatholicism."

The anti-Catholics here aren't your garden variety, sane Protestants. They are fringe creatures at best that in no way represent the decent and pious people of Lutheranism, Anglicism, Baptists, Methodists and Episcopalians who differ from Catholicism in doctrine but are not disageeable. My guess is that if you were able to check their attics you would find pillow cases with eye-holes cut in the corners.....

241 posted on 01/14/2011 4:00:28 PM PST by Natural Law
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To: Natural Law
The anti-Catholics here aren't your garden variety, sane Protestants.

Well, true. But we must remember that we have sane Godfearing Protestants, we have the basis of the Reformation, and we have the individual and group beliefs of each sect.

My guess is that if you were able to check their attics you would find pillow cases with eye-holes cut in the corners.....

The KKK was founded more on hating Catholics than on hating blacks.

242 posted on 01/14/2011 4:14:11 PM PST by MarkBsnr (I would not believe in the Gospel if the authority of the Catholic Church did not move me to do so..)
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To: MarkBsnr; Natural Law

It’s a shame, really, because there are brethren among the Protestants who really think and argue well and who bring me up short in a useful way. The breaking of the Body harms every part. I miss them.


243 posted on 01/14/2011 6:45:10 PM PST by Mad Dawg (Oh Mary, conceived without sin, pray for us who have recourse to thee.)
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To: Mad Dawg; MarkBsnr
"It’s a shame, really, because there are brethren among the Protestants who really think and argue well and who bring me up short in a useful way. The breaking of the Body harms every part. I miss them."

The understanding of any subject or great work requires a definition of terms and a context. Scripture is no different. Along with Scripture, God, through the Holy Spirit, has provided these in the form of Holy Tradition and the Magisterium.

Unfortunately, absent these Protestantism must fabricate their own. Hence the reliance on the so-called fathers of the Reformation, and even less reliably, their own "gut feelings" driven by their own personal experiences, prejudices, and ignorance.

That they differ from the teachings is not a surprise. The very name of their movement, Protestantism declares their differences. That they must falsify the teachings of the Church to justify those differences is actually quite comforting.

When the teachings of the Church are misrepresented on these forums we have a duty to correct them. It is not our obligation to achieve communion with those who disagree by coercing their enlightenment, nor is it acceptable for us to compromise the teachings of the Church for the sake of civil discourse. Those that continue to misrepresent the teachings of the Church after being corrected are lying. Remember what Scripture tells us about these liars:

" You are of your father the devil, and you want to do the desires of your father He was a murderer from the beginning, and does not stand in the truth because there is no truth in him Whenever he speaks a lie, he speaks from his own nature, for he is a liar and the father of lies." - John 8:44

244 posted on 01/15/2011 10:44:08 AM PST by Natural Law
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To: Natural Law
The understanding of any subject or great work requires a definition of terms and a context. Scripture is no different. Along with Scripture, God, through the Holy Spirit, has provided these in the form of Holy Tradition and the Magisterium.

Unfortunately, absent these Protestantism must fabricate their own. Hence the reliance on the so-called fathers of the Reformation, and even less reliably, their own "gut feelings" driven by their own personal experiences, prejudices, and ignorance.

That they differ from the teachings is not a surprise. The very name of their movement, Protestantism declares their differences. That they must falsify the teachings of the Church to justify those differences is actually quite comforting.

When the teachings of the Church are misrepresented on these forums we have a duty to correct them. It is not our obligation to achieve communion with those who disagree by coercing their enlightenment, nor is it acceptable for us to compromise the teachings of the Church for the sake of civil discourse. Those that continue to misrepresent the teachings of the Church after being corrected are lying. Remember what Scripture tells us about these liars:

" You are of your father the devil, and you want to do the desires of your father He was a murderer from the beginning, and does not stand in the truth because there is no truth in him Whenever he speaks a lie, he speaks from his own nature, for he is a liar and the father of lies." - John 8:44

Standing applause. I'm with you, fellow Christian and true defender of the faith.

245 posted on 01/15/2011 2:02:51 PM PST by MarkBsnr (I would not believe in the Gospel if the authority of the Catholic Church did not move me to do so..)
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To: MarkBsnr

How to deal with anti-Catholicism.

HHhttp://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nxNXznho4EQ&feature=relmfu


246 posted on 07/22/2012 9:18:53 PM PDT by NKP_Vet
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To: NKP_Vet
Excellent. Thank you. Of course, one approach is the appeal to the words of Christ and those who wrote the NT, invoking the revelation of Our Lord to we, his humble creation. He is the Creator and we the created.

On the other hand, it's remarkably seductive when embarking in dialogue with, for example, our Presbyterian brethren, to resort to:


247 posted on 07/23/2012 5:49:56 PM PDT by MarkBsnr (I would not believe in the Gospel, if the authority of the Catholic Church did not move me to do so.)
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