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Paul, Timothy and the End Times
BibleProphecyBlog.com ^ | March 27, 2011 | Jack Kelley

Posted on 03/28/2011 3:36:19 PM PDT by GiovannaNicoletta

Paul’s letters to Timothy are the instructions from a mentor to a young pastor, one of the first ever, and contain advice on what to do and how to do it, as well as what not to do. It’s the kind of thing you’d expect given the relationship.

But for no apparent reason Paul tucked several warnings about the end times into various places in his instructions. These are things Paul knew Timothy wouldn’t have to deal with because he clearly described them as characteristics of the Latter Days. We’ll take them each in turn.

1 Timothy 4:1-2

The Spirit clearly says that in later times some will abandon the faith and follow deceiving spirits and things taught by demons. Such teachings come through hypocritical liars, whose consciences have been seared as with a hot iron.

When I read this one I always think of certain televangelists who espouse a perversion of the prosperity gospel. They know what they’re teaching is a compilation of half truths and outright lies, so in effect they’re twisting God’s word to steal from their followers. And without the least bit of shame they enjoy the lifestyles of the rich and famous at the expense of their contributors who, according to some reports, come primarily from the bottom 25% of the economic scale.

Taking advantage of their followers’ lack of Bible knowledge and misguided desire for a more abundant life , these predators foist one get rich quick scheme after another on their desperate flocks, bilking them out of the few discretionary dollars they have and leaving them worse off in the bargain. And they do it in the name of God. It makes you wonder what He’ll say to them come judgment time.

But the prosperity teachers aren’t the only ones in this category. There are others who teach things they know are contrary to what the Bible says. Some of these things come under the heading of conditional salvation, grace plus works, partial rapture, and other false teaching that can steal the joy of your salvation and rob you of your certainty. Their objective is to imprison you within boundaries of rules they themselves can’t follow. Read Colossians 2:8-23 for Paul’s opinion on these modern day legalists.

Then there are those who either treat the prophecies of our time as if they were already accomplished in history, or as if they’re never going to be accomplished because they’re all allegorical. These teachers also know what they’re saying can’t be reconciled with Scripture, but they ask you to believe it anyway, trusting in their superior intellect or advanced education instead of your own common sense. They take passages that can be clearly understood just as they’re written by anyone with an average intellect and make them hopelessly confusing by violating the rules of context, re-defining terms, and making that which is real into something symbolic.

2 Timothy 3:1-5

But mark this: There will be terrible times in the last days. People will be lovers of themselves, lovers of money, boastful, proud, abusive, disobedient to their parents, ungrateful, unholy, without love, unforgiving, slanderous, without self-control, brutal, not lovers of the good, treacherous, rash, conceited, lovers of pleasure rather than lovers of God – having a form of godliness but denying its power. Have nothing to do with them.

Just as you become convinced that Paul is describing the unbelieving world in our time and are vigorously nodding your head in agreement, he says that these people have a form of godliness but deny its power. Then you realize he was writing about those believers in name only, who spend 6½ days each week living lives indistinguishable from unbelievers, grabbing all they can get from our material world by any means necessary while contributing little or nothing to the work of the Kingdom. These people lead two lives, the one they’re serious about, and the one that’s just for show. Guess which is which.

Paul was not blind to the behavior of these people, nor was this the only time he warned us to stay away from them. Listen to what he told the Corinthians.

I have written you in my letter not to associate with sexually immoral people – not at all meaning the people of this world who are immoral, or the greedy and swindlers, or idolaters. In that case you would have to leave this world. But now I am writing you that you must not associate with anyone who calls himself a brother but is sexually immoral or greedy, an idolater or a slanderer, a drunkard or a swindler. With such a man do not even eat. (1 Cor. 5:9-11).

Notice he said “anyone who calls himself a brother” instead of “anyone who is a brother.” I think he was doubting that someone who behaves in this manner could have been saved in the first place.

2 Timothy 4:3-4

For the time will come when men will not put up with sound doctrine. Instead, to suit their own desires, they will gather around them a great number of teachers to say what their itching ears want to hear. They will turn their ears away from the truth and turn aside to myths.

Here the focus is on the emerging church movement in all its various forms. In business schools, students learn to develop strategies based on a driving force. One such driving force is the market. A market driven strategy requires the business enterprise to focus on what they perceive to be the wants and needs of their target customers and adapt themselves to meet these needs in a more effective way.

Correctly predicting the growing demand for a religious organization that could meet the needs of a self centered, self sufficient generation, the leaders of the emerging church movement developed such a strategy. They took the focus off God and put it on the congregation. Entertainment replaced worship, philosophy replaced theology, and good works replaced victorious living.

Borrowing a phrase from Dominion Theology they began calling it “bringing Heaven to Earth” to make it sound more appealing to their idealistic target market. Little do their followers realize that for believers, these good works will be burned up in the fire (1 Cor. 3:14-15), and for unbelievers they’ll be woefully insufficient for entry into the kingdom (John 3:3). God has His own strategy for bringing Heaven to Earth and it doesn’t include the emerging church. Commenting on their works in his letter to Laodicea, Jesus said,

“I know your deeds, that you are neither cold nor hot. I wish you were either one or the other! So, because you are lukewarm — neither hot nor cold — I am about to spit you out of my mouth.” (Rev. 3:15-16)

They’re excited about the great entertainment, the stimulating talk, and the good works, but not about the Lord.

Irrespective of that, both the seats and the coffers soon filled, signs that their market driven strategy was working, and for many the emerging church was soon the place to be. This was especially true for those who had become bored with traditional Church and wanted a place where they could feel good and do good with no messages about sin and salvation to convict them. The gospel was not missed in its absence.

Besides, “All of our attempts to define the right form of the Gospel are just human interpretations,” the movement’s leaders claim. “We must avoid a naive or excessive confidence in any telling of the Gospel story, since no articulation of the gospel today can presume to be exactly identical to the original meaning Christ and the apostles proclaimed.” In a sense, they’re saying since its impossible to know what the Gospel story really is we shouldn’t put too much faith in it.

Learning about the rapidly approaching End Times and the need to be ready for it has also been skipped. Instead, the “excessive” study of prophecy is called a distraction from the real work of the Church. These things were done by design, since the goal is to have non-believers make up at least half of the congregation. The market is much bigger that way and the non-believers help move the believers away from theological absolutes, like the need to be born again and the importance of prophecy.

In the next verse of His letter Jesus offered additional criticism.

"You say, ‘I am rich; I have acquired wealth and do not need a thing.’ But you do not realize that you are wretched, pitiful, poor, blind and naked.” (Rev. 3:17)

His letter to the Church in Laodicea contains no commendation for their works and offers no escape from the end times judgments, just a plea to be allowed back into their midst (Rev. 3:20).

But Wait There’s More

Over fourteen years earlier in his second letter to the Thessalonians Paul had first warned us about the apostasy of the latter days, calling it one of the signs that would mark the end of the age. In 2 Thes. 2:1 Paul began to address their questions about two events, the (2nd) coming of our Lord, and our being gathered to Him (the rapture). He was responding to information they had received saying the day of the Lord had already come. He told them not to worry because several things had to happen first.

Paul didn’t go into things like the regathering of Israel, the beginning of Daniel’s 70th Week, or the building of a Temple. Israel had not been dispersed yet, and the Second Temple was still standing. He focused on events that are more gentile in nature.

A careful reading of 2 Thes. 2:3-8 shows the order in which he said these things would take place. He said the apostasy would happen first (verse 3), then the rapture of the Church when the Holy Spirit is taken out of the way (verse 7), and finally the revealing of the anti-Christ followed by the 2nd Coming (verse 8). (If you don’t read this passage carefully, you could become confused by Paul’s mention of the anti-Christ in verses 3-4. But verse 8 clearly places the official unveiling of the anti-Christ after the removal of the Holy Spirit.) Even a casual observation shows that we’re well into the time of the first sign.

What should be our reaction to this? First is to remember that God’s Word said this would happen so there’s no point in bemoaning the fact that it’s happening. Instead we should be encouraged to know the end of the Age is getting closer. Jesus said the true Church would become weaker and less influential as the end approaches (Rev. 3:8). As the world moves further and further from God, those of us who follow Him will naturally feel less comfortable and be less welcome here.

If you live in the United States, stop confusing your country with your church. No believer outside the US makes this mistake, and the fact is the Church has neither a home nor a land on Earth. Our citizenship is in Heaven (Phil. 3:20) and we look for a city whose architect and builder is God (Hebr. 11:10).

No matter where we live in the world we have to remember that we’re aliens here and our visit is about over. Soon we’ll be going home where we belong.

In the mean time we have to stop depending on organized religion to meet our needs. In some places the Church is being forced underground. In others we’re going willingly. But either way the gulf between religion and the Church is growing wider by the day.

If you can’t find a God worshiping, Bible teaching church where you live, don’t settle for what you can get. Gather a small group of like minded believers and worship at home. Paul and Timothy didn’t have a huge bureaucracy behind them. They didn’t have million dollar buildings or professionally designed programs. They didn’t even have the New Testament. Yet they found a way to worship God, and to help others do the same.

Stop supporting groups who are trying to bring Heaven to Earth and start sending your treasure to Heaven. I could tell you stories all day long about what God can do with a hand full of people He can trust. Ask the Lord to identify a need for you to meet in His name and then work in His strength to meet it. Apart from Him nothing you do has any value to the Kingdom (John 15:5).

Dig into prophecy. It’s the single biggest topic in the Bible and more is written about our life and times than any other period in history. Know what you believe and why you believe it.

Do these things and you can make the time we have left the most rewarding and enjoyable time you’ve ever known. You can almost hear the Footsteps Of The Messiah.


TOPICS: Current Events; General Discusssion
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1 posted on 03/28/2011 3:36:26 PM PDT by GiovannaNicoletta
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To: HushTX; righttackle44; patriot preacher; FrdmLvr; caww; Buddygirl; bareford101; fishtank; ...

Ping!


2 posted on 03/28/2011 3:38:03 PM PDT by GiovannaNicoletta
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To: GiovannaNicoletta

Good article! Thanks.


3 posted on 03/28/2011 4:16:30 PM PDT by kindred (Come Lord Jesus, rule and reign over all thine enemies.)
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To: GiovannaNicoletta
The great apostasy is nothing more than those who depart from the faith in Jesus Christ, or more to the point, departing from trusting on, and in the finished work of the vicarious sacrifice of Jesus Christ.

The will of the father, or, doing his work is the great commission, his commandment, his priority.

The great commission is spreading the Gospel of the Good News of Jesus Christ to all the ends of the Earth.
For the lord will be coming back and see if his faithful servants are working in the fields that are white unto harvest.
Yes, we better be ready for the end times and doing the Lord's work of spreading the Gospel.
4 posted on 03/28/2011 4:26:57 PM PDT by American Constitutionalist (The fool has said in his heart, " there is no GOD " ..)
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To: GiovannaNicoletta

Great article...and so true.


5 posted on 03/28/2011 4:29:58 PM PDT by Florida native
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To: American Constitutionalist
The great commission is spreading the Gospel of the Good News of Jesus Christ to all the ends of the Earth.

And as we see from events which are going on in the world, which are both fulfillment and stage-setting for the return of Christ, time is rapidly running out for the Church to carry out the Great Commission.

6 posted on 03/28/2011 4:33:26 PM PDT by GiovannaNicoletta
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To: GiovannaNicoletta
Is Obama's Team Ready to Dump the Dollar?

Saturday, March 19, 2011 10:01:54 AM · 29 of 34

American Constitutionalist to Iam1ru1-2

Trust in the Lord with all your heart, lean not onto your own understanding.


China is not the Great Tiger that the world sees.

Inspite of what the world powers say !

Inspite of what Obama and his administration says !

Inspite of what George Soros says !

Inspite of what the New World Order people say !


THE GOD OF ISRAEL IS ON HIS THRONE AND HE IS IN CONTROL AND IS IN CHARGE !

China is NOT ! the Great Tiger that the world sees !


The days are coming ! The communist government of China will be split into two , cut in half and there will be a civil war in China that the world will be astonished to see that will happen over night, for the GOD of Israel will cause it to accelerate and been seen at neck break speed.

The world will be astonished and see the arm of the GOD of Israel in action and in power.

The GOD of Israel WILL ! show his power and might !

China will be split into two and the Gospel of Jesus Christ WILL be preached openly and freely in China for the God of Israel WILL ! open the door for the Gospel of Jesus Christ in China and he will come to the rescue of HIS persecuted people in China.


THOU SHALT NOT TOUCH THE LORD'S ANOINTED ONES ! HIS ISRAEL AND HIS BODY ( THE CHURCH ).

The cry for the Gospel to be preached in China will be heard around the world.


THE COMMUNIST GOVERNMENT OF CHINA DAYS ARE NUMBERED !
THE COMMUNIST GOVERNMENT OF CHINA DAYS ARE NUMBERED !
THE COMMUNIST GOVERNMENT OF CHINA DAYS ARE NUMBERED !
THE COMMUNIST GOVERNMENT OF CHINA DAYS ARE NUMBERED !
THE COMMUNIST GOVERNMENT OF CHINA DAYS ARE NUMBERED !
THE COMMUNIST GOVERNMENT OF CHINA DAYS ARE NUMBERED !
THE COMMUNIST GOVERNMENT OF CHINA DAYS ARE NUMBERED !

7 posted on 03/28/2011 4:39:12 PM PDT by American Constitutionalist (The fool has said in his heart, " there is no GOD " ..)
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To: GiovannaNicoletta
Sunday, January 30, 2011 7:41:24 PM · 23 of 39

American Constitutionalist to fightinJAG


Thou shall not touch the LORD's anointed ones, his chosen people, his beloved Children ISRAEL ! and the body of Christ, the Church.

The GOD of Israel will rise up in his wrath and show the whole world just WHO is in charge.
For it is HE who stretches out the heavens and the stars as a curtain canopy.
For the God of Israel sits on the circle of the Earth as his throne.
The GOD of Israel teaches the Leopards to run swift in the wind.

Touch NOT the head or hair of Israel's head or the body of Christ !
The GOD of Israel's wrath will not be quenched.

The GOD of Israel will cause the whole Earth to shake !
WAKE UP PEOPLE !
The Christmas Tsunami was just a drop in the bucket, a drop of water in a pond that ripples out.
There will be a shaking like the Earth has never seen before, and Tsunami's will be seen and felt all the world over.
The Earth will be shaken and rattled, the stars in their place will seem to be shaking , the SUN will seem to be shaking as the Earth wobbles out of it's course and moves closer to the SUN.

THOU SHALT NOT TOUCH THE LORD's ANOINTED ONES !



Thursday, February 10, 2011 4:12:37 AM · 19 of 39

American Constitutionalist to moonshinner_09

Woe to Nineveh !!

Touch not, or harm the God of Israel's beloved ISRAEL !

Neither touch the Lord's anointed one's the church, the body of Christ.

Think it not strange that floods will come, cities will be overwhelmed with floods.
Think it not strange when you see the Earth shaken, and see whole mountains crumble and the waters over flow them.
Think it not strange when you see the GOD of Israel ride the waves with his horse in his anger because you harmed his beloved one, his Israel.
Think it not strange when you see the Earth shaken and see world wide tsunamis.
Think it not strange when you see both the SUN and MOON stop in their place.
Think it not strange when you see the Earth shaken, that even the stars seem to move out of their place, along with the Sun and Moon.

8 posted on 03/28/2011 4:42:57 PM PDT by American Constitutionalist (The fool has said in his heart, " there is no GOD " ..)
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To: GiovannaNicoletta

The caucus label will be removed because the article compares beliefs to non-member beliefs.


9 posted on 03/28/2011 8:04:38 PM PDT by Religion Moderator
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To: GiovannaNicoletta

Good article — but I don’t know of any Christians who actually mistake the United States for a Church. I think that’s sort of a fallacious idea some portray about patriotic Christians because it suits their lack of patriotism, or justifies their lack of concern about such issues. But other than that one small issue, good post.


10 posted on 03/28/2011 9:39:23 PM PDT by patriot preacher
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To: GiovannaNicoletta; metmom; Quix; Outlaw Woman

Giovanna...just found this video of interest...thought you’d appreciate in light of current events in ME. Appears this will be mass produced and sent to all Muslims in ME for viewing....they are pushing hard the arrival of the Maudi as well pushing the revolts throughout the ME....seen as the prelude to attacking Israel....(the site is from a former double agent working in the iranian Guard...now protected.)

http://atimetobetray.com/blog/iran-leaders-the-coming-is-upon-us-%E2%80%93-israel-shall-be-destroyed-watch-the-video/


11 posted on 03/28/2011 10:26:17 PM PDT by caww
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To: caww

THX THX.

Sounds exciting.


12 posted on 03/28/2011 10:29:40 PM PDT by Quix (Times are a changin' INSURE you have believed in your heart & confessed Jesus as Lord Come NtheFlesh)
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To: American Constitutionalist

INDEED.

THX THX.


13 posted on 03/28/2011 10:31:14 PM PDT by Quix (Times are a changin' INSURE you have believed in your heart & confessed Jesus as Lord Come NtheFlesh)
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To: caww

Thank you for including me in this ‘ping’. The vid is 28 minutes long and that breaks my heart because I’m on dial up and it would take literally about 20 or more hours to load.

Wish it had been broken up into smaller parts. :(


14 posted on 03/28/2011 10:50:38 PM PDT by Outlaw Woman
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To: Outlaw Woman

Sorry....but in a nut shell Iran is claiming the arrival of the Maudi is very soon, the death of the Saudi Leader is expected, that all these protests are written in the Hadith or and spoken of by their Clerics, that Abendaaaaajjadde..is one of the chosen to usher him in, that there must be a take down of the leaders in these ME countries... and why these are happening now is the prelude to his coming. Later they mention three primary figures to be on the scene...Khorasani, Yamani, Shocib.

Once again we see Islam’s counterfeit to the coming of Christ....

What is most interesting is the mass production of this video to all Muslims worldwide...and sanctioned by Iran. That our leadership has not taken measures against Iran is seen as a green light for iran to pursue this and the ME to do as we now see them doing.

Am hoping you can maybe go to the library and pull this up. I did that before i got my own computer.It’s worth the view as as Christians it is letting us see exactly what the Islamic leaders are currently pushing on their people. Islamic leaders


15 posted on 03/28/2011 11:09:04 PM PDT by caww
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To: caww

I had heard about this this morning or last nite but for the life of me cannot remember where. I listen to BOT radio alot on the weekends so it may have been there.

You are spot on regarding the counterfeit. The more I see the more convinced I am that Islam is absolutely the ‘one-world’ religion that is coming. And from which the antichrist will originate. Back in the 90’s I knew a few people into prophecy as well as studying it myself. Anyway all of them declared that Catholicism was going to be the one-world religion and the pope would usher in and be the one to make alliance with the anti christ etc. I’m not discounting that Catholicism may play a part or that the pope may be involved but...we are witnessing satanic actions out of Islam.

Sorry so windy. Thanks for your concise summary. I appreciate it.


16 posted on 03/28/2011 11:28:57 PM PDT by Outlaw Woman
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To: Outlaw Woman

This from ‘Frontpage’ might be very helpful in knowing what they are putting out there...explains the video very well.

In the video the female host is dressed so she almost looks like a Catholic Nun...which surprised me. I am convinced the Catholic church will surely play a role from the religious aspect...as well Hinduism, which would include non-believers of any God...and likely Mormonism for all the assets they have. All three are getting very chummy with Islam....which might be the military arm of that dreaded time.

http://frontpagemag.com/2011/03/29/iran%E2%80%99s-end-times-documentary/


17 posted on 03/28/2011 11:42:54 PM PDT by caww
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To: caww

Thank you for the link. I appreciate it.

REgarding catholicism-I’m not convinced regarding the Catholic church; I’m not rejecting it out right but it never made sense to me as far as the anti-christ aspect of it. But we do know that at the end there will be one religion...many religions will blend into one (like you said ‘chummy). But as far as Catholicism taking a lead role in the end times...I’m just not convinced now, especially in light of what we are witnessing with Islam.

Well time for bed. Thanks again caww. Have a great nite.


18 posted on 03/29/2011 12:23:33 AM PDT by Outlaw Woman
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To: Outlaw Woman; caww
It's actually a lie

here's the truth: http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/1702111/posts

Pope's Speech at University of Regensburg (full prepared text)

I was reminded of all this recently, when I read the edition by Professor Theodore Khoury (Münster) of part of the dialogue carried on-- perhaps in 1391 in the winter barracks near Ankara-- by the erudite Byzantine emperor Manuel II Paleologus and an educated Persian on the subject of Christianity and Islam, and the truth of both. It was probably the emperor himself who set down this dialogue, during the siege of Constantinople between 1394 and 1402; and this would explain why his arguments are given in greater detail than the responses of the learned Persian.

The dialogue ranges widely over the structures of faith contained in the Bible and in the Qur'an, and deals especially with the image of God and of man, while necessarily returning repeatedly to the relationship of the three Laws: the Old Testament, the New Testament, and the Qur'an. In this lecture I would like to discuss only one point-- itself rather marginal to the dialogue itself-- which, in the context of the issue of faith and reason, I found interesting and which can serve as the starting-point for my reflections on this issue.

In the seventh conversation edited by Professor Khoury, the emperor touches on the theme of the jihad (holy war). The emperor must have known that surah 2, 256 reads: There is no compulsion in religion. It is one of the suras of the early period, when Mohammed was still powerless and under threat.

But naturally the emperor also knew the instructions, developed later and recorded in the Qur’an, concerning holy war. Without descending to details, such as the difference in treatment accorded to those who have the “Book” and the “infidels,” he turns to his interlocutor somewhat brusquely with the central question on the relationship between religion and violence in general, in these words:

Show me just what Mohammed brought that was new, and there you will find things only evil and inhuman, such as his command to spread by the sword the faith he preached.

The emperor goes on to explain in detail the reasons why spreading the faith through violence is something unreasonable. Violence is incompatible with the nature of God and the nature of the soul.

God is not pleased by blood, and not acting reasonably is contrary to God's nature. Faith is born of the soul, not the body. Whoever would lead someone to faith needs the ability to speak well and to reason properly, without violence and threats... To convince a reasonable soul, one does not need a strong arm, or weapons of any kind, or any other means of threatening a person with death.... The decisive statement in this argument against violent conversion is this: not to act in accordance with reason is contrary to God's nature. The editor, Theodore Khoury, observes "For the emperor, as a Byzantine shaped by Greek philosophy, this statement is self-evident. But for Muslim teaching, God is absolutely transcendent. His will is not bound up with any of our categories, even that of rationality." Here Khoury quotes a work of the noted French Islamist R. Arnaldez, who points out thatbn Hazn went so far as to state that God is not bound even by his own word, and that nothing would oblige him to reveal the truth to us. Were it God's will, we would even have to practice idolatry.


19 posted on 03/29/2011 1:10:08 AM PDT by Cronos (Palin: 2012)
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To: Outlaw Woman; caww
The Battle of Vienna (9/10/1683 -- note the date, Al Q chose 9/11 for a reason) when Catholic Austro-Hungaria, Poland, Spain, Czechs, Southern Catholic Germans pushed back the Moslem forces and started the decline of the Ottomans

Polish winged Hussars


Polish King Jan Sobieski III at Vienna


Jan Sobieski III sending message of Victory to the Pope.

We are on the frontlines of the battle against Islam -- in Africa, in Asia, in Europe and yet we face lies by folks who stay at home in the US, far away from the front lines and dream up conspiracy theories???

20 posted on 03/29/2011 1:18:42 AM PDT by Cronos (Palin: 2012)
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To: caww

300 year commemoration in which the Ottomans were pushed back.

Don't make up illogical claims.

21 posted on 03/29/2011 1:19:51 AM PDT by Cronos (Palin: 2012)
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To: caww; Arjun; James C. Bennett; swarthyguy; marshmallow; Outlaw Woman; MarkBsnr
Caww: Hinduism, which would include non-believers of any God.... All three are getting very chummy with Islam

Caww -- sorry, but you are talking through your hat. Hinduism getting chummy with Islam???

if you knew anything you would not make such false statements

22 posted on 03/29/2011 1:49:51 AM PDT by Cronos (Palin: 2012)
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To: caww; Arjun; James C. Bennett; swarthyguy; marshmallow; Outlaw Woman; MarkBsnr
Caww: Hinduism, which would include non-believers of any God.... All three are getting very chummy with Islam

Caww -- sorry, but you are talking through your hat. Hinduism getting chummy with Islam???

Some more proof from here

Another example would be the slaughter of the Jews of Medina by Mohammed in 626 CE: after expelling two Jewish tribes, the third one, the Banu Quraiza, were exterminated: all the ca. 700 men were beheaded, while the women and children were sold into slavery, with the Prophet keeping the most beautiful woman as his concubine (she refused to marry him).

Hindus too experienced this treatment at the hands of Islamic conquerors, e.g. when Mohammed bin Qasim conquered the lower Indus basin in 712 CE. Thus, in Multan, according to the Chach-Nama, "six thousand warriors were put to death, and all their relations and dependents were taken as slaves". This is why Rajput women committed mass suicide to save their honour in the face of the imminent entry of victorious Muslim armies, e.g. 8,000 women immolated themselves during Akbar's capture of Chittorgarh in 1568 (where this most enlightened ruler also killed 30,000 non-combatants). During the Partition pogroms and the East Bengali genocide, mass rape of Hindu women after the slaughter of their fathers and husbands was a frequent event.

Or Daniel Pipes: Moslem genocide of hindus
The Muslim conquests, down to the 16th century, were for the Hindus a pure struggle of life and death. Entire cities were burnt down and the populations massacred, with hundreds of thousands killed in every campaign, and similar numbers deported as slaves. Every new invader made (often literally) his hills of Hindus skulls. Thus, the conquest of Afghanistan in the year 1000 was followed by the annihilation of the Hindu population; the region is still called the Hindu Kush, i.e. Hindu slaughter. The Bahmani sultans (1347-1480) in central India made it a rule to kill 100,000 captives in a single day, and many more on other occasions. The conquest of the Vijayanagar empire in 1564 left the capital plus large areas of Karnataka depopulated. And so on.

According to some calculations, the Indian (subcontinent) population decreased by 80 million between 1000 (conquest of Afghanistan) and 1525 (end of Delhi Sultanate).

Or Hindu Kush and the Hindu genocide
{AFghanistan was Buddhist/Hindu/Zoroastrian until the advent of Islam}

Now Afganistan is a Moslem country. Logically, this means either one or more of the following must have happened:

a) original residents of Hindu Kush converted to Islam, or
b) they were slaughtered and the conquerors took over, or
c) they were driven out.

Encyclopedia Britannica (3) already informs us above about the resistance to conversion and frequent revolt against to the Moslem conqueror's rule from 8 th thru 11 th Century AD. The name 'Hindu Kush' itself tells us about the fate of the original residents of Gandhaar and Vaahic Pradesh during the later period of Moslem conquests, because HINDU KUSH in Persian MEANS HINDU SLAUGHTER (13) (as per Koenraad Elst in his book 'Ayodhya and After'). Let us look into what other standard references say about Hindu Kush.

Persian-English dictionary (14) indicates that the word 'Kush' is derived from the verb Kushtar - to slaughter or carnage. Kush is probably also related to the verb Koshtan meaning to kill. In Urdu, the word Khud-kushi means act of killing oneself (khud - self, Kushi- act of killing). Encyclopedia Americana comments on the Hindu Kush as follows: The name Hindu Kush means literally 'Kills the Hindu', a reminder of the days when (Hindu) SLAVES from Indian subcontinent died in harsh Afgan mountains while being transported to Moslem courts of Central Asia (15). The National Geographic Article 'West of Khyber Pass' informs that 'Generations of raiders brought captive Hindus past these peaks of perpetual snow. Such bitter journeys gave the range its name Hindu Kush - "Killer of Hindus"'(10). The World Book Encyclopedia informs that the name Kush, .. means Death ..(16). While Encyclopedia Britannica says 'The name Hindu Kush first appears in 1333 AD in the writings of Ibn Battutah, the medieval Berber traveller, who said the name meant 'Hindu Killer', a meaning still given by Afgan mountain dwellers who are traditional enemies of Indian plainsmen (i.e. Hindus)(2). However, later the Encyclopedia Britannica gives a negationist twist by adding that 'more likely the name is a corruption of Hindu-Koh meaning Hindu mountains'. This is unlikely, since the term Koh is used in its proper, uncorrupted form for the western portion of Hindu Kush, viz. Koh-i-Baba, for the region Swat Kohistan, and in the names of the three peaks of this range, viz. Koh-i-Langer, Koh-i-Bandakor, and Koh-i-Mondi. Thus to say that corruption of term Koh to Kush occurred only in case of Hindu Kush is merely an effort to fit in a deviant observation to a theory already proposed. In science, a theory is rejected if it does not agree with the observations, and not the other way around. Hence the latter negationist statement in the Encyclopedia Britannica must be rejected.

Encyclopedia Britannica informs that in December 1398 AD, Timur Lane ordered the execution of at least 50,000 captives before the battle for Delhi, .. and after the battle those inhabitants (of Delhi) not killed were removed (as slaves) (17), while other reference says that the number of captives butchered by Timur Lane's army was about 100,000 (18). Later on Encyclopedia Britannica mentions that the (secular?) Mughal emperor Akbar 'ordered the massacre of about 30,000 (captured) Rajput Hindus on February 24, 1568 AD, after the battle for Chitod' (19). Another reference indicates that this massacre of 30,000 Hindu peasants at Chitod is recorded by Abul Fazl, Akbar's court historian himself (20). These two 'one day' massacres are sufficient to provide a reference point for estimating the scale of Hindu genocide. The Afgan historian Khondamir records that during one of the many repeated invasions on the city of Herat in western Afganistan, 1,500,000 residents perished (11).

And there is far, far more valuable proof of the hatred for hinduism expressed by Islam. James can probably supply more

23 posted on 03/29/2011 1:59:37 AM PDT by Cronos (Palin: 2012)
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To: caww; Arjun; James C. Bennett; swarthyguy; marshmallow; Outlaw Woman; MarkBsnr
Caww: Hinduism, which would include non-believers of any God.... All three are getting very chummy with Islam

Caww -- finally, note that there are no people who hate Islam as much as Hindus. If you ever travel in India (and I have as well as helped out (minor help) in some charities, you will realise that Hindus HATE, utterly irrevocably HATE Islam. There is no compromise, it's ingrained after having 10 centuries of genocide perpetuated against hindus by Moslems.

So, I repeat your statements about Hindus or Catholics getting "chummy" with Islam is historically, factually and in every way wrong.

24 posted on 03/29/2011 2:02:43 AM PDT by Cronos (Palin: 2012)
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To: Cronos
The name 'Hindu Kush' itself tells us about the fate of the original residents of Gandhaar and Vaahic Pradesh during the later period of Moslem conquests, because HINDU KUSH in Persian MEANS HINDU SLAUGHTER (13) (as per Koenraad Elst in his book 'Ayodhya and After').

Interesting stuff there, Cronos. Thanks.

25 posted on 03/29/2011 2:21:32 AM PDT by GOPJ (http://hisz.rsoe.hu/alertmap/index2.php - It's only uncivil when someone on the right does it.- Laz)
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To: GOPJ; caww; James C. Bennett; Fred Nerks; swarthyguy
Thank you -- though I got to thank caww for making me fetch the details after she made the silly statement about Hindus getting chummy with Islam -- that's like good getting chummy with evil -- Islam and Hinduism are so 180 degrees opposite of each other.

I'd suggest reading about the Somnath temple, about the slaughter of Mangalorean Catholics by Tipu Sultan and also the actions of Aurangzeb.

There was a very interesting Hindu website which dissected Mohound's life and the hadiths in very good detail as well as expressed itself on the history of Islam. Perhaps James or Fred or swarthyguy may have the link (I can't remember the website name)

26 posted on 03/29/2011 2:25:56 AM PDT by Cronos (Palin: 2012)
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To: caww; James C. Bennett; Fred Nerks; swarthyguy
Caww: "Hindus, catholics getting chummy with Islam"

Caww -- if you read some history, you'd find this the most false statement you've ever made

27 posted on 03/29/2011 2:27:03 AM PDT by Cronos (Palin: 2012)
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To: Cronos

Hinduism tells us that the “Self” which dwells in each and every being in this universe is one and the same with Godhead. Every soul in this uinverse is a reflection of this Supreme Self. Thus every individual has the potential to realize Godhead by the realization of this “Self”.

~

Islam imposes a threat to the whole world which is far worse than deforestation, nuclear destruction or AIDS. It is an insidious, devilish disease creeping into the veins of the world. Every individual must realise the destructive and evil nature of this religion, for it eats away at the very foundation of humanity which is an individual’s ability to think individually and act accordingly. The following articles logically analyse different aspects of this so called religion and bring forth the true nature of Islam.

http://www.flex.com/~jai/satyamevajayate/


28 posted on 03/29/2011 2:34:06 AM PDT by Fred Nerks (FAIR DINKUM!)
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To: Fred Nerks; caww
Perfect -- thank you, caww, here is the website for you to read: http://www.flex.com/~jai/satyamevajayate/
29 posted on 03/29/2011 2:39:25 AM PDT by Cronos (Palin: 2012)
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To: Cronos; All

Cronos...Japan and America also use to be hateful toward one another...’you need to get current’ with what they are doing, their actions toward one another. People can proclaim many differences and yet unite...which is the push now between Hinduism and Muslims. Of course history is good to know in understanding just that...but this is now and there is a heavy movement to unite.

Further the push for one world religion is not about all believing the same thing..it is about allowing and respecting all faiths under one roof of unity.

So you are wrong Cronos to say this is not happening..read the news in the nations and you will see their actions, despite the conflicts, are moving toward acceptance of one another. The links below are only a few of the many you can find on line...

Muslims welcoming Hindus...celebration

http://news.oneindia.in/2010/11/21/muslimswelcome-hindu-statesman-zed-to-id-al-adhacelebratiohtml

another example of unity...in pictures.

http://www.hindustantimes.com/photos-news/Photos-India/welcomeganesha/Article4-598763.aspx

Hindus welcome Muslims....

http://www.hindustantimes.com/photos-news/Photos-India/welcomeganesha/Article4-598763.aspx


30 posted on 03/29/2011 8:38:43 AM PDT by caww
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To: Cronos

Please refer to my links in rebuttal to your statement that Hindus are hateful toward Islam...their actions speak louder than their history today. They are indeed attempting to bridge the gap between them....despite the history..as many religions are attempting to do today...despite their history.


31 posted on 03/29/2011 8:43:22 AM PDT by caww
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To: Cronos

For those interested in the history of Hinduism and the conflicts with Muslims....this might be interesting. But I am refering to today and what is taking place Cronos...like it or not they are interacting with the idea of “peace” between them...and this will continue as more and more come on board to unite religions under one roof...which as said does not mean they all believe the same thing...but they will accept one anothers difference and unite just the same.


32 posted on 03/29/2011 8:48:32 AM PDT by caww
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To: GiovannaNicoletta
Every time I hear someone speak of a great revival going on, I know we are one day closer to Christ's coming for the Church the Body of Christ. Our last days are times filled with apostasy, NOT revival, according to Paul. And the apostasy is indeed growing.
33 posted on 03/29/2011 8:51:19 AM PDT by smvoice (The Cross was NOT God's Plan B.)
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To: GiovannaNicoletta; Cronos

Giovanna...I see Cronos has once again slathered a thread with various historical sites on the issue of Hinduism among the faiths. I’m sorry for that as links would have been just fine, along with personal comments or assessments in how viewed.

Thank you again for posting this thread.

CW


34 posted on 03/29/2011 8:52:16 AM PDT by caww
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To: smvoice
Hello smvoice.....I agree...and I have fears that this “counterfeit” revival is setting the stage for the arrival of the anti-Christ and his prophet/spokesman. I fear only in that so many are and will continue to be deceived....and we ,with this, now see fewer and fewer who are receptive to the Christ of Christianity...just as it was written it would be so.

When you add into the fray an overall Universal approach to mankind from the secular community and nonbelievers it is rather amazing the speed this is going. I noted CNN consistent at pushing Universalism and One world in many of their commercials.

35 posted on 03/29/2011 8:59:02 AM PDT by caww
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To: Cronos; Shermy; caww; Kenny Bunk

I do not know how caww has stumbled upon the Great Saffron “Blue”print, the Protocols of the Younger Shiva(s).

But all emanates from the great Vishnu, including Islam.

And who were those three mysterious men from the East, heralding the birth of Jesus?

And Cronos, why do Catholics mimic the dotheads of the East on Ash Wednesday......why don’t they use colors instead of that monochromatic hue.

Connections everywhere if you wish to look!


36 posted on 03/29/2011 11:21:00 AM PDT by swarthyguy (KIDS! Deficit, Debt,Taxes! Pfft Lookit the bright side of our legacy -America is almost SmokFrei!)
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To: Cronos

Here’s a couple more stating the Unity push between Muslims and Hinduism....I think that we need to watch what they are doing Cronos...and this apparently is flying in the face of the old school thought of the two being in idrect opposition with each other...despite their history.

President of the Nepalese section of the World Hindu Federation: “We are never against communal harmony. If celebration of festival together with other religious people prevails in communal harmony, then we are ready to celebrate Isamic or Christian or any other religious festival.”

http://dharmadeen.com/2011/01/18/nepal-unity/

Muslim statement...”The Hindus respect Vavar, and we believe also that he was a great saint. So where is the problem? They believe what they believe. But if they come here we must be hospitable and make them welcome…The whole world is fighting about religion. But this is a place where you can show the light of peace, a place that brings all religions together. All human beings are equal here. There is a lesson here for everybody.”

http://www.abna.ir/data.asp?lang=3&Id=213320


37 posted on 03/29/2011 11:54:14 AM PDT by caww
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To: swarthyguy; Cronos; Shermy; caww
Pax domini sit semper vobiscum

38 posted on 03/29/2011 12:41:00 PM PDT by Kenny Bunk (Anybody notice that BOTH Barry and Michelle were asked off the Illinois Bar? Anybody wonder why?)
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To: caww
Wow- that is amazing, caww. Thanks for the link.

I am becoming more and more convinced that the Antichrist will be Muslim and the rise of Islam could very well mean that that the one world religion will be Islam.

As we know, prophecy doesn't come into sharp focus until is is about to happen or is in the process of happening. We're watching prophetic Scripture playing across the world like a movie.

The Antichrist of the Bible will be perceived by the Muslims as their Messiah. And while I don't give any credence to Islamic eschatology, I find it very interesting that their "prophecies" appear to be happening at the same time as those given to us by the Holy Spirit are definitely coming to pass.

39 posted on 03/29/2011 5:07:55 PM PDT by GiovannaNicoletta
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To: GiovannaNicoletta

Yes it is interesting and should be required listening for every American as well....then they would see what we are up against. Islam dictates all aspects of muslims life and life is structured around their belief system....thus they can use videos such as this to manipulate their masses at will...and this will certainly impact them since it’s going worldwide now....including their military.

I do not believe Islam will be the the one world religion, rather it will be the main line religions allied together of which Islam will be a part of...perhaps those who will be called on for the beheadings prophecy speaks of.

More like Islam, Catholicisim, Mormons, Hindus and the world Council of Churches...each playing a specific roll assigned to them but under one Universal Collective name yet to be determined. Similar to the UN or Nato and such...still maintainimg their individuality yet a collective...and of course an “elected representative” from them.

These are the Organizations/Religions with fast sums of monies and real-estate, as well as business ventures so they will be brought under one roof to control those monies.

As for ‘their’ eschatology....well, there is always a counterfeit the enemy of mens souls uses to deceive the masses with...been that way for centuries. So no surprise Islam, yet again, borrows from Christianity and twists it to their own liking.


40 posted on 03/29/2011 7:16:55 PM PDT by caww
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To: Kenny Bunk
When posting something in a foreign language on the Religion Forum (unless it is very common like adio) be sure to include the English translation of it.
41 posted on 03/29/2011 8:23:30 PM PDT by Religion Moderator
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To: Religion Moderator
Pax Domini Sit Semper Vobiscum
trans: May the peace of the Lord be with ye always.

The response: Et cum spiritu tuo
.. and with thy spirit.

In Latin for the Romans. In English for the Anglicans.

Thank you, Religion Moderator. Verbum sat sapientes
A single word is all that is needed for the wise. Let's hope.

42 posted on 03/29/2011 8:35:27 PM PDT by Kenny Bunk (Anybody notice that BOTH Barry and Michelle were asked off the Illinois Bar? Anybody wonder why?)
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To: caww; Fred Nerks; swarthyguy
Japan and America also use to be hateful toward one another

horse-pucky, you're comparing national priorities to millenia of attacks. There was no ideological hatred stretching back centuries between the US and Japan. In fact they were allies in WWI

You need to read history please

100 million Hindus kiled is no joke. Hinduism is the utter antithesis of Islam -- no comparison, like white and black, utter opposites

And nice try to clip articles from Indian papers trying to promote communal harmony --> have you ever been in India? Have you ever met any Indians that you comment? No --> your statements are utterly wrong.

43 posted on 03/30/2011 12:39:48 AM PDT by Cronos (Palin: 2012)
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To: caww; Fred Nerks; swarthyguy
For those interested in the history of Hinduism and the conflicts with Muslims....this might be interesting. But I am refering to today and what is taking place Cronos...like it or not they are interacting with the idea of “peace” between them...and this will continue as more and more come on board to unite religions under one roof...which as said does not mean they all believe the same thing...but they will accept one anothers difference and unite just the same.

Again -- go visit India, befriend some Indians in America and ask the question -- your assumptions are utterly wrong.

44 posted on 03/30/2011 12:40:39 AM PDT by Cronos (Palin: 2012)
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To: caww; GiovannaNicoletta
I see Cronos has once again slathered a thread with various historical sites on the issue of Hinduism among the faiths. I’m sorry for that as links would have been just fine, along with personal comments or assessments in how viewed.

On the contrary -- you raised this up by making false statements about which, respectfully, you do not know anything besides googling. Have you read the vedas or the gita? Do you know anything about Indian history? Do you know any Indians today?

Have you heard of the riots in India in 1993? Have you heard of the Gujarat massacres? Have you heard of the communal tension in India?

No you do not and you are commenting on things that you do not know about -- why?

45 posted on 03/30/2011 12:43:05 AM PDT by Cronos (Palin: 2012)
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To: swarthyguy; Shermy; caww; Kenny Bunk
Swarthyguy -- caww isn't going to understand your references or your sarcasm

You need to explain who Shiva and Vishnu are -- about the avatars of Vishnu.

Then you need to explain the sarcasm.

46 posted on 03/30/2011 12:44:35 AM PDT by Cronos (Palin: 2012)
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To: caww
“We are never against communal harmony. If celebration of festival together with other religious people prevails in communal harmony, then we are ready to celebrate Isamic or Christian or any other religious festival.”

Google Vishwa hindu Parishad and understand why they are saying this -- they normally are accused (and rightly so IMHO) of preaching communal war. This is PR work

Second your "Moslem statement" -- you're talking about a Sufi saint. Mainline Islam considers these "saints" as paganism

47 posted on 03/30/2011 12:46:30 AM PDT by Cronos (Palin: 2012)
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To: caww; GiovannaNicoletta
I actually think the anti-Christ will be someone from outside the orthodox faith -- maybe from your group caww, like Obama:

Most famous United Church of Christ politicians:
Barrack Obama
Howard Dean
Hubert Humphrey


Baptist:
Bill Clinton
Al Gore
John Edwards
Hillary Clinton
Jimmy Carter

Presbyterian:
Walter Mondale Adlai Stevenson

Supreme Court Justices
John Paul Stevens, Presbyterian
Lewis Powell, Presbyterian
Warren Burger, Presbyterian
The three contemporary Presbyterian judges are all radical leftists.

48 posted on 03/30/2011 12:47:46 AM PDT by Cronos (Palin: 2012)
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To: caww

Caww — respectfully, you guys seem to have no clue about anything beside spouting off. Go on the ground, actually read instead of parroting false statements


49 posted on 03/30/2011 12:51:05 AM PDT by Cronos (Palin: 2012)
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To: Cronos

You are sadly wasting your time communicating with someone who quotes a Shia Muslim propaganda website, example:

How I Found the Right Path

My journey began when, on starting a new job, I first met a follower of Ahl ul-Bayt. Up until that time, I knew little about those who were called Shi’as - except what I had heard from Sunni brothers, which to say the least was not very complimentary. I had read nothing about them, for I had never found anything to read: all the books on Islam I came across over a period of many years were about Sunni Islam, written by Sunni Muslims. All the Muslims I had met, in my country of residence and in places like Egypt, were Sunni, and even on that modern medium of communication, the Internet, I had not come across any Shia sites, probably because I had not looked for them specifically and just followed links from one Sunni site to another Sunni site.

http://www.abna.ir/list.asp?lang=3&gId=1756


Satyameva Jayate
(Truth Alone Triumphs)

Genocide committed in the name of Allah: 3,000,000 Bangladeshi Hindus Killed during the Pakistan-Bangladesh war in 1971. From 1894 to 1896 Abdul Hamid, Sultan of the Ottoman Empire, killed 150,000 Armenian Christians. In India, Sikh Guru Tegh Bahadur along with his disciples was burned to death by the Moghul ruler Aurangzeb in 1675. Another Sikh, Bhai Mati Das was sawn into right and left halves while he was still alive. In July 1974, 4,000 Christians living in Cyprus were killed by Fahri Koroturk, president of Turkey and his Islamic army. From 1843 to 1846 10,000 Assyrian Christians including women and children were massacred by the Muslims. From 1915 to 1918 750,000 Assyrians were killed in the name of Islamic Jihad. In 1933 thousands of Assyrian villagers were murdered by the Iraqi soldiers in Northern Iraq. Since 1990 more than 10,000 Kashmiri Hindus have been brutally murdered by Islamic fundamentalists. Over 280,000 Ugandans killed during the reign of Idi Amin from 1971 to 1979. Over 30,000 Mauritanians have been killed by the Islamic dictators since 1960. In 1980, 20,000 Syrians were murdered under the rule of Hafez Al-Assad, President of Syria. Since 1992 120,000 Algerians have been murdered by the Islamic fundamentalist army.

http://www.flex.com/~jai/satyamevajayate/

HINDU & MUSLIM UNITE? ONLY IF THE HINDUS LEARN TO RECITE THE KORAN BY ROTE & CONVERT TO ISLAM!


50 posted on 03/30/2011 1:07:44 AM PDT by Fred Nerks (FAIR DINKUM!)
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