Posted on 04/20/2011 12:07:28 PM PDT by AnalogReigns
I graduated from Loyola High School in Los Angeles. Reese graduated in 1962 and taught there as a scholastic (Jesuits must teach before they can become ordained). Mr Reese SJ was called Peewee because he had the same last name as the famous baseball player. Reese came from a rich family. There were a lot of rich kids there, including sons of movie stars. Michael Reagan flunked out.
Well, some parts of the Mass are the same every week. No getting around that. ;-)
Those mentioned in the survey are talking about "my needs"......., "my likes.........".
Reese actually uses the word "product".
That's religion totally backwards, as far as I'm concerned. It's not about me.
It seems fairly clear (if we accept this at face value); those leaving are dissatisfied customers and Reese is parroting the old cliche that the "customer is always right" and we're not satisfying the customer.
When it comes to religion, he's not always right. The Church is right because it was founded by Jesus Christ. We're the sinners.
That concept appears to be entirely absent from his essay.
The church is teaching fine, but not at the parish level, where (in many parishes) you won't hear anything about what the church actually teaches.
But it's more than just teaching; it's the liturgy, too. Lex orandi, lex credendi ("The law of praying is the law of believing", or more loosely: "how you pray reflects what you believe".)
If the orandi is vapid, childish mush, the credendi will follow obediently along.
But isn't that what the article is saying, too?
Yeah, in about three sentences, before going on to talk about how we need more liturgies catering to teenagers. Uh, no, actually, that's what we don't need.
JenB:
That is precisely the problem, the We are the Church is a stupid hym and has no place in Catholic worship.
As for prayers, the entire Liturgy is a prayer and contains beautiful prayers, Kyrie, Gloria, Creed, Agnus Dei along with the entire Canon of the Mass, the Lords Prayer. If the Homily is 15 minutes of nothing, then that is the problem with the Priest and I am sorry that is what you had to deal with.
And yes, I do believe the partaking of the Eucharist is communion with the Body and Blood of the Lord and it is a sacrament of his Body and Blodd that is, it is a visible sign of an invisible reality, i.e. Grace.
His nickname was complimentary since Peewee Reese was a hero to many of us baseballers. We had scholastics as well. Valedictorian of my year is the Stanford prof and former Representative out your way Tom Campbell. So you had Michael Reagan, which was much preferable to our illuminati: the Daley brothers.
A lesson ~ John Wesley, et al, must have written a gazillion sermons. Methodist ministers are given fairly reasonable latitude in USING them.
They almost always pick the worst of the lot.
Fellow I used to work with had been a Methodist minister. He agreed it was a problem ~ he tried to resist ~ then BOOM ~ same old boring stuff.
To figure this out, you need to make a distinction between protestant churches (think of the large mainline denominations) and evangelical churchs (Baptist, independent, and fundamentalist denominations).
The truth is mainline protestant churches are also losing members at a huge rate. Evangelcal chruches, on the other hand, have been growing at a rapid pace. The serious churches are gowing, while the lukewarm churches are shrinking.
I suspect if you apply that same logic to the Catholic church, you'll find that the churches that are preaching a lukewarm message are shrinking, while those that are standing firm on doctrine are growing.
In other words, this isn't a protestant vs. Catholic issue, it is a liberal vs. conservative issue. The liberal wings of both protestants and Catholics is shrinking, while the conservative wing of both is growing.
Given that assumption, it's easy to see how someone attending a liberal (lukewarm) Catholic church could be attracted to a conservative evangelical church, or that someone attending a liberal (lukewarm) protestant church could be attracted to a conservative Catholic church.
That false doctrine is what holds Catholics in the church.. they think that is the ONLY place they can actually eat Jesus and get holier because of it..
The truth is there is no apostolic succession taught in the NT church.. and no priesthood in the NT church of Christ.. so IF it a real doctrine.. then every ordained pastor actually would have that gift..
I think few evangelical Protestants would accept this. Those thinkers are not inclined to stay with the Catholic church, I imagine.
Great analogy
It seems to me that about a third of the bishops in the US are solid, a third are cowards, and a third are knowingly or unknowingly working for the enemy. I may be over-estimating the "solid" category.
Under these circumstances, I am surprised that they approved the new liturgical texts. On the other hand, I think they were basically ordered to approve them from Rome. However it happened, I'm grateful and am looking forward to Advent 2011.
AMEN
Just saying, there’s more reasons to not be spiritually filled in a Catholic mass than just that there aren’t enough pyrotechnics.
And not to get too specific about doctrines because that’s not on this thread but as a Reformed Christian I believe in partaking the body and blood through communion as well; I have a disagreement with your theology about the mechanics involved as well as the sacrifice aspects but don’t think that you’re the only ones who consider communion a sacrament.
Every ordained pastor does have “that gift.”
Evangelical Protestants think how you worship doesn’t really matter?
My problem with the analysis in the last statement above is that it ignores what I suspect was the likely manner in which the question was asked, and therefor how the scope of the answers were predetermined and limited, concerning the specific categories of belief some said were part of the cause for which they "stopped believing in Catholic teaching".
While no single category of Catholic teaching, whether "abortion and homosexuality" or any other was given as the cause by a majority of the respondents, it was likely not possible for people to pick more than one category as part of "the reason".
I suspect that most likely they were only able to select one category, though more than one possibly concerned them. They were likely forced to pick one as if it was the priority, even though in their mind they held more than one with the same priority.
If there were five categories and the respondents were allowed to select each and every one of the categories that concerned them, or none, then one of the categories may have emerged with a clear majority. I suspect that was not done with the survey in the report.
And that true doctrine is what brings Protestants into it.
Isn’t the National Catholic Reporter on the verge of bankruptcy as the 60’s hippies fade away? Happy Easter, by the way, Campion. We’ll both enjoy the gorgeous Liturgy on Easter morning. [forehead slap] Dang! We have a Liturgy!
;-o)
BTW, pick up the book on Ignatius by Brad Pitre. It is awesome.
That’s a good point made in your post.
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