Free Republic
Browse · Search
Religion
Topics · Post Article

Skip to comments.

Is Prodigal Son Church and Older Brother Israel?
http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Luke%2015:11-32&version=KJV | marbren

Posted on 10/15/2011 9:30:31 AM PDT by marbren

Luke 15:11-32

(KJV)

11And he said, A certain man had two sons:

12And the younger of them said to his father, Father, give me the portion of goods that falleth to me. And he divided unto them his living.

13And not many days after the younger son gathered all together, and took his journey into a far country, and there wasted his substance with riotous living.

14And when he had spent all, there arose a mighty famine in that land; and he began to be in want.

15And he went and joined himself to a citizen of that country; and he sent him into his fields to feed swine.

16And he would fain have filled his belly with the husks that the swine did eat: and no man gave unto him.

17And when he came to himself, he said, How many hired servants of my father's have bread enough and to spare, and I perish with hunger!

18I will arise and go to my father, and will say unto him, Father, I have sinned against heaven, and before thee,


TOPICS: Apologetics
KEYWORDS:
Navigation: use the links below to view more comments.
first previous 1-5051-100101-150151-200201-212 next last
To: patlin
In context, the younger son is Isra’el, the older is Judah...

Jeremiah 31:31

That is exactly the opposite of how the NT is read and understood. The NT interprets the OT, not the OT unlocking the NT as you have it. You might want to check out how our LORD and ALL of the Apostles seemed to apply the "mystery revealed" through the ministry of Jesus Christ and the Paraclete (1 Cor 2:14) to the OT passages cracking the code and showing how they all spoke of the Messiah.

101 posted on 10/15/2011 8:53:25 PM PDT by The Theophilus (Obama's Key to win 2012: Ban Haloperidol)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 30 | View Replies]

To: one Lord one faith one baptism

So, you reject the bodily assumption of Mary, then?


102 posted on 10/15/2011 8:55:26 PM PDT by RegulatorCountry
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 100 | View Replies]

To: RegulatorCountry

no.

if you do, please direct me to where here grave is.


103 posted on 10/15/2011 8:58:44 PM PDT by one Lord one faith one baptism
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 102 | View Replies]

To: one Lord one faith one baptism

Far be it from ME to judge; but; this CLOSES the subject permanently as far as I’m concerned. I have no interest in debating with a bunch of Jehovah’s Witnesses, which I’m suspecting is what has been going on. Go rag on someone else. I’m not buying what you’re selling! Goodbye!


104 posted on 10/15/2011 9:03:01 PM PDT by Tucker39
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 39 | View Replies]

To: one Lord one faith one baptism

Well, to me it would appear that you actually don’t agree, then, with the staement you wrote that compelled me to initially respond on this thread, that all were subject to sin and death, other than Jesus Christ.


105 posted on 10/15/2011 9:05:14 PM PDT by RegulatorCountry
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 103 | View Replies]

To: Tucker39

LOL, i have been called a lot of things in my life, but a Jehovah Witness is not one of them!!


106 posted on 10/15/2011 9:06:24 PM PDT by one Lord one faith one baptism
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 104 | View Replies]

To: RegulatorCountry

i am not suprised that you don’t understand based on past threads.
you didn’t answer my question, you do agree Mary was blessed?


107 posted on 10/15/2011 9:08:46 PM PDT by one Lord one faith one baptism
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 105 | View Replies]

To: one Lord one faith one baptism
Paul tells us in Romans who a true Jew is and Galatians 6 that the Church is the Israel of God.

Slight problem with going to Galatians 6:16. EVERYONE but the Futurist knows that the "Israel of God" is to be distinguished from "Israel of the Flesh" (Romans 2:29; 4:12; 9:6,7). If the Futurists were to ever concede that there was a distinction, then they wouldn't be Dispensationalists. Being a Dispy is far more important than being faithful to the Scriptures.

108 posted on 10/15/2011 9:12:59 PM PDT by The Theophilus (Obama's Key to win 2012: Ban Haloperidol)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 42 | View Replies]

To: one Lord one faith one baptism
Reading the mind of another Freeper is a form of "making it personal."

Discuss the issues all you want, but do not make it personal.

109 posted on 10/15/2011 9:18:07 PM PDT by Religion Moderator
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 107 | View Replies]

To: The Theophilus

amen. please accept my apology for not pinging you like i did lee n. field, i know you very good at defending orthodoxy against the dispensationalist heresy.


110 posted on 10/15/2011 9:18:20 PM PDT by one Lord one faith one baptism
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 108 | View Replies]

To: one Lord one faith one baptism

I agree to the extent that can be supported via scripture, and disagree with those beliefs and doctrines that depart from scripture, oLofob. There have been many convoluted attempts to intellectualize just how Jesus Christ was born sinless of a virgin, and from just whence the sin nature arises. I see no justification for elevating Mary to a status approaching that of a demigoddess to accomodate this intellectualization. Suffice it to say that it was as it is written. Beyond that is at best speculation.


111 posted on 10/15/2011 9:20:23 PM PDT by RegulatorCountry
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 107 | View Replies]

To: Religion Moderator; RegulatorCountry

well, when someone tells me i don’t agree with my own statement, that’s evidence they don’t understand my statement. but you make the rules, so i will abide by them.


112 posted on 10/15/2011 9:21:26 PM PDT by one Lord one faith one baptism
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 109 | View Replies]

To: RegulatorCountry

i am happy to agree with you, we shouldn’t elevate Mary to a status approaching demigoddess. She is a created human being just like you and me, except God chose her to be the vehicle where Jesus would derive His humanity and give birth to our Savior.


113 posted on 10/15/2011 9:26:59 PM PDT by one Lord one faith one baptism
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 111 | View Replies]

To: smvoice; one Lord one faith one baptism
Oh, really now. You don’t think that Jesus Christ understood dispensations and rightly dividing God’s word of truth?

Perhaps you can be so kind as to give us any example in Scripture that supports your idea that "Jesus Christ understood Dispensations".

Is it in the Parables of the Tares and the Wheat? (Mt 13:24-30)?

Let me guess, in your Bible it reads:

"Let both grow together until the harvest, and at the time of harvest I will say to the reapers, 'First lets secretly go gather the wheat to the barn for seven years and then during that time infect the fields with droughts, plagues, locusts, earthquakes, fires and floods, then lets return and scatter the wheat among what is left of the scorched earth and weakened tares for a thousand years, then regather all of the wheat, set fire to the tares and then go back to the barn.'

Maybe it was during the Olivet Discourse (Mt 24:37-) where our LORD compared the times to the time of antediluvian Noah? Um, no. He didn't say that they were in the age of Conscience did He? Or was that the Patriarchal Age as the Four Dispensational Scheme theologians teach it? No, maybe our LORD sided with the Three Dispensational Theologians and called Noah's Day the Age of "Law". You guys can't even agree on it being eight, seven, four or three Ages yet you claim Jesus taught it?

Do you know how it reads in Genesis 6:8? It says "But Noah found grace in the eyes of the LORD.Sounds like an Age of Grace that goes back to the Garden and is strongly supported in Hebrews 11.

I have a better idea, lets see what our LORD really said regarding the number of Ages.

Matt 12:32 Anyone who speaks a word against the Son of Man, it will be forgiven him; but whoever speaks against the Holy Spirit, it will not be forgiven him, either in this age or in the age to come.

Or how about a direct quote from the aforementioned (and legitimate version) of the Parable of the Wheat and Tares?

"...so it will be at the end of this age"

I don't see our LORD recognizing either a Mosaic, Ecclesial or Zionic age here.

Luke 18:30 who shall not receive many times more in this present time, and in the age to come eternal life."

What seems strange is that our LORD only speaks of the Present Age and the Age to Come. Two ages.

Now I have actually provided the Words of our LORD where He recognizes only two ages - now its your job to contradict those facts.

Are you up to it?

114 posted on 10/15/2011 9:34:51 PM PDT by The Theophilus (Obama's Key to win 2012: Ban Haloperidol)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 52 | View Replies]

To: marbren
Thank you so much for sharing your engaging speculation on the Prodigal Son, dear brother in Christ!

It would have been an even better metaphor had the brother who stayed home been an adopted son.

They have moved me to jealousy with [that which is] not God; they have provoked me to anger with their vanities: and I will move them to jealousy with [those which are] not a people; I will provoke them to anger with a foolish nation. – Deuteronomy 32:21

But I say, Did not Israel know? First Moses saith, I will provoke you to jealousy by [them that are] no people, [and] by a foolish nation I will anger you. - Romans 10:19

I say then, Have they stumbled that they should fall? God forbid: but [rather] through their fall salvation [is come] unto the Gentiles, for to provoke them to jealousy. - Romans 11:11

And again,

Boast not against the branches. But if thou boast, thou bearest not the root, but the root thee.

Thou wilt say then, The branches were broken off, that I might be graffed in.

Well; because of unbelief they were broken off, and thou standest by faith. Be not highminded, but fear: For if God spared not the natural branches, [take heed] lest he also spare not thee.

Behold therefore the goodness and severity of God: on them which fell, severity; but toward thee, goodness, if thou continue in [his] goodness: otherwise thou also shalt be cut off.

And they also, if they abide not still in unbelief, shall be graffed in: for God is able to graff them in again. For if thou wert cut out of the olive tree which is wild by nature, and wert graffed contrary to nature into a good olive tree: how much more shall these, which be the natural [branches], be graffed into their own olive tree?

For I would not, brethren, that ye should be ignorant of this mystery, lest ye should be wise in your own conceits; that blindness in part is happened to Israel, until the fulness of the Gentiles be come in.

And so all Israel shall be saved: as it is written, There shall come out of Sion the Deliverer, and shall turn away ungodliness from Jacob: For this [is] my covenant unto them, when I shall take away their sins.

As concerning the gospel, [they are] enemies for your sakes: but as touching the election, [they are] beloved for the fathers' sakes.

For the gifts and calling of God [are] without repentance. - Romans 11:18-29

God's Name is I AM.

115 posted on 10/15/2011 9:37:25 PM PDT by Alamo-Girl
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 16 | View Replies]

To: one Lord one faith one baptism

... and mankind fell with Adam, when sin entered the world and by sin came death, to which all mankind has been subject other than Jesus Christ himself.

So, we’ve come full circle here, right back where we started. You’ve since written words to the effect that Mary was not subject to sin, and that her grave is not known, apparently implying that she was assumed bodily into heaven. These statements would seem to contradict your initial statement that originally compelled me to respond in astonished agreement, while being very uncertain whether you actually agreed yourself.

You’ve certainly cleared up that uncertainty, oLofob. We’ve made progress here tonight.


116 posted on 10/15/2011 9:50:10 PM PDT by RegulatorCountry
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 113 | View Replies]

To: smvoice
What exactly did the Abrahamic Covenant consist of?

It ain't what you think.

Heb 11:8-10 By faith Abraham obeyed when he was called to go out to the place which he would receive as an inheritance. And he went out, not knowing where he was going. By faith he dwelt in the land of promise as in a foreign country, dwelling in tents with Isaac and Jacob, the heirs with him of the same promise; for he waited for the city which has foundations, whose builder and maker is God.

Now it would seem mighty strange for Abraham, the guy who was actually there and wrestled with God, to be wrong in understanding the Covenant that God made with him. That is what Dispensationalists claim. They claim that Abraham had no idea about the meaning of the Covenant, and neither has thousands of years of people "of like faith of Abraham" (Gal 3). Instead, beginning in the middle 19th century from the same place, time and culture as the birth of Marxism and Evolution comes this idea that Abraham was gravely mistaken and foolish in looking at the Heavenly Kingdom when in fact he should have been thinking of 21st century Israel.

Judging by the rest of Hebrews 11, the Futurists must also think all the Patriarchs were crazy lunatics desiring "a better, heavenly country" and had no clue to the real deal God was talking about - modern Tel Aviv.

117 posted on 10/15/2011 10:00:28 PM PDT by The Theophilus (Obama's Key to win 2012: Ban Haloperidol)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 64 | View Replies]

To: one Lord one faith one baptism
perfect example - 70 weeks = 490 days. if this passage is to be taken literally, we should be calculating a 490 day period. do you believe this passage is talking about 490 days or is the 70 weeks a type or shadow of a different time period?

Its actually more powerful than that. The context of the seventy weeks is where Daniel is pleading with God to be Merciful and not punish wicked and rebellious captive Israel by extending the seventy year captivity. Daniel was genuinely concerned that the Jews learned absolutely nothing while held hostage to Babylon. The whole book of Esther shows how close they all were to being slaughtered. Nonetheless, Daniel made petition to the Almighty because he had faith that God would be true to His Sovereign Will and Promise for the captivity to be no longer than seventy years.

It is in that context where the seventy years is perfectly fulfilled so that those who would live in the seventy weeks would know that when the LORD says seventy times, then it isn't sixty-nine times plus this "gap" of thousands of years before "restarting" the weeks clock to count the last and seventieth.

Futurists make a complete and total mockery of the "type" of seventy years captivity, and the Faithfulness of our LORD when they blatantly ignore the fulfillment of the relatively near/short prophecy to guarantee the longer.

IOW, if the type of seventy years captivity were to be reproduced according to how the Futurists handle the seventy weeks, then Daniel and all of the Jews would do sixty-nine years, then the year clock would "stop" for thousands of years and then "restart" to finish the last year before they could return to their homeland and rebuild the Temple.

Futurists hate OT types - it ruins their camp fire story.

118 posted on 10/15/2011 10:12:07 PM PDT by The Theophilus (Obama's Key to win 2012: Ban Haloperidol)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 73 | View Replies]

To: The Theophilus
The NT interprets the OT, not the OT unlocking the NT as you have

The NT is the prophesy of the OT revealed.

Without 1st understanding the OT, one gets a false interpretation of the NT because one interprets the OT according to what they think the NT concludes without any knowledge as to who the characters are or what their purpose is.

Your theory tells me to pick up a novel, start reading 2/3 the way through and then write a report about the entirety of the novel by using the last 1/3 to define the characters & explain the time-line of what had happened in the 1st 2/3. Sorry, but your theory & logic contains absolutely no common sense what so ever.

119 posted on 10/15/2011 10:56:21 PM PDT by patlin ("Knowledge is a powerful source that is 2nd to none but God" ConstitutionallySpeaking 2011)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 101 | View Replies]

To: GourmetDan
The only thing that dispensationalism has brought into Christianity is confusion...

And bad fiction.

120 posted on 10/16/2011 6:31:37 AM PDT by Lee N. Field (Come, behold the works of the LORD, how he has brought desolations on the earth.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 3 | View Replies]

To: Cicero
Christianity is the New Covenant.

The new covenant is the covenant with Abraham, come to full fruition.

The old covenant is Sinai. Law. Do this and live. "All this we will do" for the next 5 minutes.

121 posted on 10/16/2011 7:03:57 AM PDT by Lee N. Field ("And if you are Christ's, then you are Abraham's offspring, heirs according to promise" Gal 3:29)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 33 | View Replies]

To: one Lord one faith one baptism
we know from various passages only those in Christ will be saved. no salvation outside of the Body of Christ. hopefully we can all agree on that.

This is absurd...No one comes into the Body of Christ to get saved...Read what God says about it for a change...

AFTER one gets saved, he/she is automatically a member of the Body of Christ...And it ain't your religion...

The bible refers to us as the church...Your religion stole the name and modified it to (C)hurch trying to and obviously succeeding in duping you people...Buy a bible and read it...

122 posted on 10/16/2011 8:51:40 AM PDT by Iscool (You mess with me, you mess with the WHOLE trailerpark...)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 39 | View Replies]

To: Iscool

Praising God, and having favor with all the people. And the Lord added to the church daily such as were being saved.
umm, that’s Acts 2:47

we are saved by being “in Christ”, outside of Christ there is no salvation.

tell me, in your reading of the Scriptures, who will be saved outside of Christ?


123 posted on 10/16/2011 9:32:51 AM PDT by one Lord one faith one baptism
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 122 | View Replies]

To: marbren

Interesting thoughts but I don’t think the analogy works very well. If it did, Israel would never have quit performing the daily sacrifices and the Church would have left the Gospel. The analogy works better the other way around, but then the birth order is skewed. It’s good to question assumptions, but this was a dead end It appears.


124 posted on 10/16/2011 10:04:48 AM PDT by Avalon Hussar
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: one Lord one faith one baptism
who are the heirs to the promises made to Abraham, physical Jews or believers in Jesus Christ??

The answer I'd give would be simple.

The answer a dispensationalist would give, convoluted. And, for them there are many more possibilities. What happens to a physical descendant of Jacob, who converts to Christ? Raptured out in the nick of Tribulation, and still has a claim on the land? How cool is that? What about a Christian who decides to convert to Judaism, as a matter of devotion? This is not an idle question. What Would Paul Say?

Occam's Razor.

125 posted on 10/16/2011 10:56:36 AM PDT by Lee N. Field ("And if you are Christ's, then you are Abraham's offspring, heirs according to promise" Gal 3:29)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 54 | View Replies]

To: GourmetDan

Any specifics?


126 posted on 10/16/2011 2:36:52 PM PDT by GiovannaNicoletta ("....in the last days, mockers will come with their mocking...." (2 Peter 3:3))
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 3 | View Replies]

To: GourmetDan

How, exactly?


127 posted on 10/16/2011 2:38:59 PM PDT by GiovannaNicoletta ("....in the last days, mockers will come with their mocking...." (2 Peter 3:3))
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 13 | View Replies]

To: The Theophilus
"In this age or the age to come". The Lord only speaks of the PResent Age and the Age to come.

Does he now?

When they therefore were come together, they asked of him, saying Lord, wilt thou AT THIS TIME restore again the kingdom to Israel? And he said unto them, It is not for you to know the TIMES (plural) or the SEASONS (plural), which the Father hath put in his own power." Acts 1:6-7.

Read Eph. Chapter 2. There is a "Time Past", a "But Now" and an "Ages(PLURAL) to Come". That is at LEAST three times and seasons.

The word "dispensation" is used 4 times in the NT; (1 Cor. 9:17; Eph. 1:10;, 3:2; Col.1:25). The word "dispensation" means an administration, a stewardship, dispensation, or guardianship. But of course you know this. I find it amusing that a religious organization that DEMANDS the word "dispensation" be stated PLAINLY when it is meant, at the same time teaches and believes that the Immaculate Conception of Mary, the bodily assumption of Mary, the Eucharist, apostolic succession, Peter being the first pope, etc. are somehow biblical, even though they are NEVER MENTIONED in God's Word. But I digress...

When did "Time Past" end so that "But Now" could begin? And when will "But Now" end so that the next "Age" could begin? Remember the "Ages to Come" that Paul spoke of is plural, meaning more than one.

When Christ spoke of "this present time", when did that begin, and when did it end for the "age to come" that He was referring to?

Let's get this far, and then I will show you where Christ ACTUALLY knew of dispensations and times and seasons, and rightly divided the Scriptures to prove it.

128 posted on 10/16/2011 2:44:14 PM PDT by smvoice (The Cross was NOT God's Plan B.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 114 | View Replies]

To: marbren
If you post this sort of thing in "Dispensational Caucus", it eliminates non-Christians hijacking the thread with false doctrines.

Then those of us who take the Bible as God wrote it instead of our own allegorized version of the Bible can have a civilized, edifying discussion about the Bible.

Feel free to post Dispensational topics under the "Dispensational Caucus" designation. I'll send you the ping list if you want.

129 posted on 10/16/2011 2:44:40 PM PDT by GiovannaNicoletta ("....in the last days, mockers will come with their mocking...." (2 Peter 3:3))
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 44 | View Replies]

To: yldstrk
Here is an excellent summary of dispensational belief.
130 posted on 10/16/2011 2:47:01 PM PDT by GiovannaNicoletta ("....in the last days, mockers will come with their mocking...." (2 Peter 3:3))
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 47 | View Replies]

To: marbren
I really think that this is a parable of how Jesus will take us just as we are, even after we have walked away from Him.

I think it is about the forgiveness and redemption that Christ offers and died for.

131 posted on 10/16/2011 2:54:50 PM PDT by GiovannaNicoletta ("....in the last days, mockers will come with their mocking...." (2 Peter 3:3))
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 7 | View Replies]

To: GiovannaNicoletta; marbren

AMEN. Although I would miss the opportunity of showing some that Jesus Christ did INDEED know times and seasons and dispensations and rightly dividing God’s truth. Not that it will do any good, but..


132 posted on 10/16/2011 3:03:19 PM PDT by smvoice (The Cross was NOT God's Plan B.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 129 | View Replies]

To: smvoice
You have to personally know Christ as Savior to understand the things of God, especially Scripture. You also have to personally know Christ as Savior to be able to accept as absolute, inerrant, infallible truth every single word in Scripture, even the parts you may have not liked and may have disagreed with before you found wisdom and therefore understanding through a personal relationship with Christ.

Without salvation, it is not possible to know or accept Scripture. This explains the war the non-Christians who hijack these thread have declared on God and His word.

Even with the last-days prophecies that God gave us concerning His chosen people and the nation He established for them coming to pass right in front of our faces, the non-Christian will deny what God has said about His people, His plans for them, and the fact that He is in the process of carrying out those promises and plans until the day they die.

There is nothing we can do about their eternal condition, but the owner of this site has kindly given us the ability to be able to discuss Biblical truth without the hijackers, deniers, and Jew-haters surfacing on the thread to try anything to get the discussion off of Biblical truth and onto their false doctrines.

They have been given the free will by God to choose to deny Him and reject His Scripture, but they don't have any right to be heard and shouldn't be provided with a platform to spew their hatred to those who are sickened by it.

133 posted on 10/16/2011 3:13:55 PM PDT by GiovannaNicoletta ("....in the last days, mockers will come with their mocking...." (2 Peter 3:3))
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 132 | View Replies]

To: GiovannaNicoletta

I know you are right. But there is always the hope that one person is still searching for the truth, and will be saved. Although I do know that if it’s the same people crashing through with the same deceit, they are probably NOT that “one person”. {{sigh}}..


134 posted on 10/16/2011 3:19:26 PM PDT by smvoice (The Cross was NOT God's Plan B.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 133 | View Replies]

To: GiovannaNicoletta
I think it is about the forgiveness and redemption that Christ offers and died for.

I agree, Yesterday I had a new thought while I was reading it. Wow, the prodigal sounds like all born again Jewish or Gentile Christians in this present age of grace we are in. We all seem to go into the world of reckless living until we become broken in spirit and turn to Our Father in Heaven in repentance who loves us even before we can confess our sin in godly, not worldly sorrow. The older brother might be Israel who follows the rules and stays with the Father. Is there any dispensational sense to the story?

Some internet sources say the prodigal is Israel and the Church is the older brother.

135 posted on 10/16/2011 3:21:47 PM PDT by marbren (I do not know but, Thank God, God knows)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 131 | View Replies]

To: smvoice
Yeah, you're right, and there are many people who read and don't respond.

And the people who have been given the truth repeatedly and have repeatedly rejected it are not looking for truth and will not accept the truth as given by God, but are trying to deceive others as they have been deceived. And for that reason, I guess responses to the lies and false doctrines are necessary.

In the DC threads, those who are genuinely trying to learn the truth are welcome to come on and ask questions, but the tired, worn-out one-note-samba crowd that only wants to deny Scripture and turn as many people away from Christ as possible are not welcome and are booted from the thread.

The DC designation is there as an option for the times when we just want to have a discussion without having to deal with the nonsense and garbage.

136 posted on 10/16/2011 3:28:37 PM PDT by GiovannaNicoletta ("....in the last days, mockers will come with their mocking...." (2 Peter 3:3))
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 134 | View Replies]

To: GiovannaNicoletta
The DC designation is there as an option for the times when we just want to have a discussion without having to deal with the nonsense and garbage.

I love the DC threads. For this question I wanted many viewpoints. For instance I learned that Methodists might say Israel is the older brother which was new information for me.

137 posted on 10/16/2011 3:35:13 PM PDT by marbren (I do not know but, Thank God, God knows)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 136 | View Replies]

To: marbren
Is there any dispensational sense to the story?

In the sense that the story is symbolic of something literal, and not just a meaningless fairy tale, yes, it can be seen as dispensational in that we are currently in the Age of Grace, when Jesus Christ makes Himself available for salvation, redemption, and forgiveness. This parable, I believe, refers to that truth - that no matter how far away from Christ we have strayed, He will accept us where we are and will forgive us and will bring us back to Himself.

So in that sense, the parable reflects the truth of the current opportunity for salvation, and the fact that even if we walk away from Jesus for a time, He will forgive us, and, while not necessarily removing the consequences of our choice to place ourselves outside of His will for our lives, He is, like Scripture tells us, always faithful and just to forgive us of our sin.

138 posted on 10/16/2011 3:37:14 PM PDT by GiovannaNicoletta ("....in the last days, mockers will come with their mocking...." (2 Peter 3:3))
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 135 | View Replies]

To: marbren

OK. I just wanted you to know that the DC is available if you want to use it.


139 posted on 10/16/2011 3:38:29 PM PDT by GiovannaNicoletta ("....in the last days, mockers will come with their mocking...." (2 Peter 3:3))
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 137 | View Replies]

To: marbren
By the way, did you get to see this?

Amazing article!

140 posted on 10/16/2011 3:40:34 PM PDT by GiovannaNicoletta ("....in the last days, mockers will come with their mocking...." (2 Peter 3:3))
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 139 | View Replies]

To: GiovannaNicoletta

I started another open thread on who is Simon the magician. Based on internet sources that thread could get ugly. I would like to know the truth.


141 posted on 10/16/2011 3:44:35 PM PDT by marbren (I do not know but, Thank God, God knows)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 139 | View Replies]

To: GiovannaNicoletta

YES! It is amazing!


142 posted on 10/16/2011 3:48:16 PM PDT by marbren (I do not know but, Thank God, God knows)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 140 | View Replies]

To: GiovannaNicoletta; The Theophilus; one Lord one faith one baptism
If you post this sort of thing in "Dispensational Caucus", it eliminates non-Christians hijacking the thread with false doctrines.

Extra Scofieldism Nulla Salis? Outside of dispensationalism, there is no salvation -- is that what you mean to say? Disgusting, if true.

Note my comment here: "Inevitable? No. It is my no means true of all, but from what I've observed the center of their theology is often not where it should be, but rather in Israel according to the flesh and their quirky end times scenario. They become unbalanced, speculating about angels (nephelim) and endless genealogies, and something like the Trinity just doesn't matter much to some of them. Like I said, they have weird friends and fellow travellers."

Then those of us who take the Bible as God wrote it instead of our own allegorized version of the Bible can have a civilized, edifying discussion about the Bible.

It's been demonstrated that the dispensational scheme, at the very least, can't handle time texts in a coherent manner.

Feel free to post Dispensational topics under the "Dispensational Caucus" designation. I'll send you the ping list if you want.

As long as you-all refrain, hard as appears to be, from mentioning any other views, I'll not object.

It's a nice little place (very frequently resorted to I note) for you to say whatever you want, without having to answer any objections. Go ahead. An interesting amount of "Teh Crazy" often manifests.

143 posted on 10/16/2011 4:19:42 PM PDT by Lee N. Field ("And if you are Christ's, then you are Abraham's offspring, heirs according to promise" Gal 3:29)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 129 | View Replies]

To: marbren
I did a bit of research and found some who think the younger son is Israel and the older brother is the Church. What if it is the other way around? I do not know, Thank God, God knows.

I like your question and I think you are right though I don’t know for sure. Here is some evidence that I have come across over the years. As we see patterns in scripture, we can follow them to see where they lead
1 Cor 15:46 Howbeit that was not first which is spiritual, but that which is natural; and afterward that which is spiritual.
This is a rule in scripture confirmed with examples. Some of them are brothers. Cain and Able, Ishmael and Isaac, Esau and Jacob. In each case, the order is the same. The brother that represents the natural man is first and the brother that represents the spiritual man is second.

I have not included Shem or Abraham who were not first born, but in their cases, there were three brothers and the analogy is different. I don’t think there are any first-born sons in Christ’s genealogy

Following the same rule. You have the Old Testament, which gives us the history of the natural man, Adam and the New Testament, which give us the history of the spiritual man Christ.

It is also possible that some of the types can be first or second depending on context. Esau is to Jacob as Jacob is to Israel as Israel is to the Church.

Seven
144 posted on 10/16/2011 4:48:03 PM PDT by Seven_0 (You cannot fool all of the people, ever!)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: smvoice

you have been threatening to show us this but to date it’s all talk. zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz


145 posted on 10/16/2011 6:26:40 PM PDT by one Lord one faith one baptism
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 132 | View Replies]

To: smvoice; The Theophilus; Lee N. Field; GiovannaNicoletta

FYI - TT is not Catholic. This is not a Catholic/Protestant issue, the historical, orthodox, biblical postion is the Church is the Israel of God. to believe non-dispensationalists are not Christian would mean there were no Christians around for 1,800 years. ( btw - that’s the Mormon belief, nice company huh? )


146 posted on 10/16/2011 6:34:42 PM PDT by one Lord one faith one baptism
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 128 | View Replies]

Comment #147 Removed by Moderator

To: smvoice

your choice. it’s weird someone promises to hoist someone on their own petard and doesn’t follow up.
makes one think maybe they can’t do it, what do you think?


148 posted on 10/16/2011 6:39:12 PM PDT by one Lord one faith one baptism
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 147 | View Replies]

To: one Lord one faith one baptism

Believing that the Church is the Israel of God is your first problem. Of many.


149 posted on 10/16/2011 6:39:21 PM PDT by smvoice (The Cross was NOT God's Plan B.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 146 | View Replies]

To: one Lord one faith one baptism

It’s killing you, isn’t it?lol! It’s there and you cannot find it. Nor will you search for it. You just want someone to hand it over to you..


150 posted on 10/16/2011 6:42:31 PM PDT by smvoice (The Cross was NOT God's Plan B.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 148 | View Replies]


Navigation: use the links below to view more comments.
first previous 1-5051-100101-150151-200201-212 next last

Disclaimer: Opinions posted on Free Republic are those of the individual posters and do not necessarily represent the opinion of Free Republic or its management. All materials posted herein are protected by copyright law and the exemption for fair use of copyrighted works.

Free Republic
Browse · Search
Religion
Topics · Post Article

FreeRepublic, LLC, PO BOX 9771, FRESNO, CA 93794
FreeRepublic.com is powered by software copyright 2000-2008 John Robinson