Posted on 12/13/2011 8:11:29 AM PST by Colofornian
We know there’s a problem. Here’s how the bulk of us as Mormons see the problem:
SYMPTOMS: Americans have an anti-Mormon bias which manifests itself on the right with Evangelicals who call Mormonism “non-Christian” (and who cost Mitt Romney the Iowa Republican Caucus) and on the left with secularists and atheists decrying Mormonism’s foundational stories as an obvious “fraud.”
DIAGNOSIS: Mormons are “persecuted” by non-Mormons for their “weird” beliefs.
RECOMMENDED TREATMENT: De-emphasize (or eliminate) weird beliefs. Explain Mormonism using highly-nuanced language, which we (as Mormons) believe will satisfy non-Mormon ears (“milk before meat”).
We keep going back to the doctor because the symptoms persist. We keep refilling the prescription — and we now seem addicted to the medicine.
Unfortunately, that the diagnosis is wrong. Weird beliefs are not causing the symptoms. In the past generation, America generally has become increasingly tolerant of weird beliefs. America is more broadly pluralistic because of the influx of traditional religions that were previously unrepresented in the US (and therefore are filled with unfamiliar, weird beliefs), e.g., Hindus, Sikhs and Muslims, and also because the rise of indigenous weird beliefs: wicca, neo-paganism, American Buddhism and the various New Age ideas. (Is America ready for a neo-pagan president? No, because the masses of neo-pagans are college kids. Is America ready for a Sikh president? No, because most Sikhs are 1st generation immigrants. Is America ready for a Mormon president? Yes. Mo Udall would have beaten Gerald Ford, if he had bested Jimmy Carter in the 1976 Democratic primaries.) My point is that our society is prepared to be more broadly pluralistic than ever before. The primary component of pluralism is tolerance for our neighbor’s weird beliefs.
If it’s not so-called weird beliefs, what’s the real cause? I believe the cause of the problem is medicine we keep taking and that the underlying and resulting problem we face is credibility. It’s the milk before meat approach itself that undermines Mormon credibility. The examples of how this true problem manifests itself are so numerous — even in the past year alone — it’s hard to pick from among them. Let’s consider just one of 21 Questions Answered About Mormon Faith that the Fox News prepared in conjunction wiht the LDS church’s PR folks:
Q: Does the Mormon Church believe its followers can become “gods and goddesses” after death?
A: We believe that the apostle Peter’s biblical reference to partaking of the divine nature and the apostle Paul’s reference to being ‘joint heirs with Christ’ reflect the intent that children of God should strive to emulate their Heavenly Father in every way. Throughout the eternities, Mormons believe, they will reverence and worship God the Father and Jesus Christ. The goal is not to equal them or to achieve parity with them but to imitate and someday acquire their perfect goodness, love and other divine attributes.
Whachama-come again? This is a hefty dose of the medicine of de-emphasizing weird beliefs when speaking to non-Mormons. Can you argue that this bizarre answer is “not false”? Of course! And whenever anyone argues that any one of these medicinal answers is false, apologetic Mormons across the blogosphere will leap into heroic action in the answer’s defense.
And that is the problem! The problem is not whether the medicinal answers can be argued to be “not-false.” The problem is that these answers are not open and forthright, and that they thus lack credbility.
The real problem Mormons face is not that we have weirdness. It’s that we lack credibility.
A little weirdness wont lead anyone into Hell...
and the author is right about the lack of credibilty...
See how fair and objective I can be ???
BUT
Mormonism is not merely weird...
Its blasphemy and unBiblical...
Mormonism is not Christianity...
Not 'all' - this is the RELIGION area of FreeRepublic.
Most folks, who do not like to hear about or discuss religion, tend to stay away.
Oh, there'll be some who drop by to scold us for failing to tend to the more important things in life; but they usually don't stay around too long, and then we get back on the subject of ETERNAL matters.
See how fair and objective I can be ???
_______________________________________
Yes I must remember that I was at least once...
for those times I get bashed by the anti-Christians for not being etc...
Meanwhile
still
Mormonism is not Christianity...
Yup. Quite the inner turmoil.
If I were a Mormon, do I opt for...
...spin...dishonesty...euphemisms...stretches...exaggerations...prevarications...and play down the weirdness...
Or...honesty...forthrightness...credibility...intellectual integrity...all while embracing the overwhelming weird madness of it all within the Mormon belief maze???
Hey Danny:
Not nit picking just clarifying for others.
Mormons do not say “We are Christians Too”. That statement would be and inclusionary statement and agreement they are part of the larger body of Christ, which clearly they cannot be, otherwise being The Restored Church doctrine fails and they are not “The Perfect Religion”.
What they do say is “I am Christian, We are Christian”. Note the possessive nature of construct which objectifies the term and makes it exclusionary, meaning “They are something....You are not something or part of that something”.
No real problem with the statement but that they are attempting to gain credibility by co-opting a term they derided for most of their doctrinal existence.
"We may talk of men being redeemed by the efficacy of his [Christ's] blood; but the truth is that that blood has no efficacy to wash away our sins. That must depend upon our own action." [ LDS Apostle Amasa M. Lyman, Journal of Discourses, Vol. 7, p. 299, 1859]
You are imminently to explain this blasphemy and we look forward to your teaching, but here's why the Journal of Discourses source is so damning to LDS inc:
The following will clarify why the Journal of Discourses can be seen as a reflection of Mormonic beliefs:
“The Journal of Discourses deservedly ranks as one of the standard works of the Church, and every rightminded Saint will certainly welcome with joy every number (issue) as it comes forth.“ (President George Q. Cannon, Journal of Discourses, Preface, Volume 8.)“Each successive Volume of these Discourses is a rich mine of wealth, containing gems of great value, and the diligent seeker will find ample reward for his labor. After the fathers and mothers of this generation have made them the study of their lives their children’s children will find that they are still unexhausted, and rejoice that this Record has been handed down from their fathers to also aid them in following the way of life .” (Apostle Orson Pratt, Preface. Volume 3.)
“It is impossible to give monetary value to the past volumes of this publication, … Those who read the utterances of the servants of God, contained in this book, under the same influence by which the speakers were inspired, cannot fail to receive profit from the perusal.” (President Joseph F. Smith, Preface, Volume 18.)
“We take great pleasure in presenting to the Saints and the world the … the Journal of Discourses, which they will find contains rich treasures of information concerning the glorious principles of Eternal Life, as revealed through God’s anointed servants in these last days. All who read the discourses contained in this Volume are earnestly recommended to adapt them to their lives by practice, and we can confidently assure them that, in doing so, they are laying up a store of knowledge that will save and exalt them in the Celestial kingdom.” (Apostle Albert Carrington, Journal of Discourses, Preface, Volume 15.)
A good friend of mine was utterly crushed at not being able to attend the temple wedding Of her only daughter because she was not mormon. She was not even allowed to help her daughter get dressed, or enter the building. she had to stand outside in the garden.
It has caused a family rift of unbelievable proportions
“The real problem Mormons face is not that we have weirdness. It’s that we lack credibility.”
Actually the problem is both. Many of their beliefs are factually and historically incorrect and many are theologically abhorrent to orthodox Christianity, accordingly they are accurately described as “non-Christian”. They have no credibility because they attempt to conceal their beliefs behind a vale of deceit. It is sort of like President Obama portraying himself as fiscally responsible.
Joseph Smith did retranslated the entire bible, and the LDS sect, under the leadership of Brigham Young did declare the entire two year work of FLDS/LDS Prophet Joseph Smith fraudulent, and they do not use it to this day.
Everything I said is precisely true. Teh fact the the Romneyites NEVER respond is proof to us here that they cannot defend this LDS sect doctrine of competing "prophets"...
I know they hate it when I bring this up, but why, moderator did you remove these comments ?
placemarker
Mormonism is a cult straight out of the pit of Hell.
If you are not a born again Christian, please read the Book of John.
Mormonism is a cult straight out of the pit of Hell.
If you are not a born again Christian, please read the Book of John.
Many of the deceived members are very kind, trying people, but not only are they not Christians, the LDS Sect are not really Mormons either ! FLDS/LDS “prophet” Brigham Young claimed that Joseph Smith’s “retranslation” of the bible was a fraud, so the LDS sect abandoned Smith’s greatest work and does not use it to this day, unlike the true “Mormons” in the RLDS and FLDS communities.
Try to get your mind around this logic pretzel...the LDS sect will tell you that mormonism began when God(s) told Joseph Smith not to become a Christian or use the King James bible because it was corrupt and he needed to “translate” the Book of Mormon and “retranslate” the bible. Forward to today and they will tell you that they ARE Christians, that the “book of mormon” is the most correct of any book on earth, AND that the Joseph Smith Translation which Smith spent over two years working on is a fraud so they use the King James version instead.
Actually, many members don’t know the Joseph Smith translation even exists, to be fair....
They better hope and pray that FLDS/LDS “Prophet” Brigham Young was WRONG about Joe Smith judging EVERYONE BEFORE CHRIST DOES, because HE IS GOING TO BE TICKED !
Sorry about that. You are correct about the ALL. I’m just more into the politics on FR.
Actually the problem is both. Many of their beliefs are factually and historically incorrect and many are theologically abhorrent to orthodox Christianity, accordingly they are accurately described as “non-Christian”. They have no credibility because they attempt to conceal their beliefs behind a vale of deceit. It is sort of like President Obama portraying himself as fiscally responsible. [Busywhiskers]
Agreed.
Good summary, btw
A lie of omission isn't a lie lie is it? Isn't it just lying for the lord?
Well, that seemed entirely sincere, and in no conceivable way did it resemble shilling for the Mormons. Thanks for sharing!
I'm pretty sure I've had Mormon missionaries on my door step who announced themselves that way and/or something to the effect of "We're another Christian group that has an additional revelation."
But I see what you are saying. Mormon's don't consider Christians to be Christians, only themselves. But they try hard to make it sound like they are part of us, when they are really there to lure us away.
I've also heard a Mormon get up in arms saying "Nothing makes me madder than when people say Mormons aren't Christian."
It reminds me of the CLOSED world of communism that failed to sustain belief with the glaring light of ANY OTHER information. The Chinese have their military to keep the lid on but the Mormon Church can only wave "byebye" to the flood of refugees from an "ism" started by a prolifigate who was one of the greatest con artists and con men of the 19th century.
Wait until the masses of Hindus get access to the rest of the world...yes, beyond their gawd-awful movies, TV programs and ragnewspapersmagazines. Their 330 million gods won't save Hinduism from Christian evalization. It's impossible to resist the Way, the Truth and the Life.
God's plan is, without doubt, interesting.
As I said, my read.
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