Skip to comments.False Conversions 'Suicide' for Churches, Pastor Warns
Posted on 04/11/2012 12:36:50 PM PDT by marshmallow
LOUISVILLE, Ky. (ABP) Thousands, if not millions, of church members sitting in Americas pews arent really born-again Christians, a Washington, D.C., pastor said April 10 to a pastors conference in Louisville, Ky. Mark Dever
Mark Dever, senior pastor of Capitol Hill Baptist Church in the nations capital, warned on the opening day of the 2012 Together for the Gospel Conference that false conversions are the suicide of the local church.
Dever was one of four religious leaders with Albert Mohler, president of Southern Baptist Theological Seminary; C.J. Mahaney, president Sovereign Grace Ministries in Gaithersburg, Md.; and Ligon Duncan, senior minister at First Presbyterian Church in Jackson, Miss. to convene the first Together for the Gospel event in 2006 to combat what they viewed as false teaching in many churches today. A statement of unifying doctrines includes male headship in the church and home and the need for church discipline of wayward members in local congregations.
This years conference, the fourth, was expected to draw 8,000 pastors and ministers April 10-12 to The Kentucky International Convention Center and KFC Yum! Center, with messages uploaded daily on the website t4g.org.
Dever described members of the church who live worldly, carnal lives as a serious problem in American Christianity.
The problem I am pointing to is not just that of the occasional hypocrite lost in their own unrepentant sin, Dever said. Im talking about systems which seem to produce false converts so much that its not just one man but whole congregations that like Israel of old are typified and characterized not by holiness but by worldliness.
Dever said that is a problem for church members who are deceived about their own state before the Lord.
Its just not right for a congregation to leave men or women made...........
(Excerpt) Read more at abpnews.com ...
The heart of the augment.
Most churches are just club houses. Start asking people what they heard in the sermon that morning or what they read in their Bibles during the week. My experience is that most can’t wait to get away from me....................
This article was written on a Baptist pastor's message for a Baptist publication. My observation was based on individuals I have met over the years that hardly follow Christ's path and would even argue His message was for the Jews alone when presented with His teaching of the Commandments, etc.
I believe we come into conjunction with the Lord when we humbly read and reflect on His Word with goodwill in our hearts for the neighbor. I trust He will lead the conscience to repentance.
That's why I don't get upset with churches with a liberal agenda. Our faith has such a branch. I'm friends with many of their pastors on Facebook. I post the truth and they usually share homophobia cartoons. They are struggling and we are doing pretty well this year with some new online outreach ideas.
I think if a sinner can find a place where they can hear about the Lord, that's a good thing. Hate the sin but love the sinner.
I partake in Holy Supper at the local Episcopal church rather than drive 2 1/2 hrs each way to the liberal branch church of my own faith. Usually, I worship at home online via a UStream broadcast from our Cathedral back east.
Ok. Yeah been involved here since 2004 (Jr in HS)... just don’t post much. Read everyday though. FR tis my homepage.
Agreed 100%. I've seen it occur in every type of church. In the big Mega Churches with extravagant music and tech stuff to the smaller piano only church. I really believe that it is a members/pastor thing. Not one or the other. The pastor can only do so much. It's up to the members to utilize it and do it throughout the week. And to also hold eachother accountable.
But back on topic. False conversions are really a killer in a church. You can't expect new converts to turn the page 180 overnight, but you can still hold them accountable and encourage them through their transformation.
I think it's more a church by church basis. One bad Mega church does not make them all bad and one bad small church does not make them all bad.
Waiting for someone to come here and declare what a heretic Pastor Warns is.
I tend to be like the prophet Elijah? who thought he was the only one but God told him there were others.
Most everyone, including me, likes to eat from “the tree of knowledge of good and evil” where we decide what is right and wrong. Makes it hard for accountability when we don't know how to give correction or take correction. Nobody liked the Prophets and they didn't like Jesus much either. So, how well liked are you?
Doesn't work with a homosexual as they ARE the sin. So when you say that, you still hate them in their mind.
Biblically, I think God hates sin and there is going to be judgement and a time when there is no difference between sin and sinner. Willing to be corrected.
If by love you mean speaking the truth to them, we are on the same page. But no one is going to like you when you speak the truth..............
Honestly, probably not as disliked as I should be.
When I look to the Old Testament, I see a literal sense and a spiritual sense. The spiritual sense tells of the Lord's glorification and our regeneration, His church as it exists here and in heaven. The stories of an angry, vengeful and vindictive God are exteriors for the real spiritual meaning which is consistent from Genesis through Revelation. This is what is meant when Jesus opened the Scriptures to the disciples after His resurrection for them to understand.
Finally, I have enough to worry about with my own defects to judge someone else's.
The other thought is that by holding others accountable, we have to hold our selves to the same standard. It is part of working out our own defects, we don't do it in isolation. When I ask others in church what they read in the Bible this past week, I make sure I can answer that question.
Read Luke. He taught and healed all — never turning anyone away. God cannot hate if He loves all.
Define love. It is NOT the emotional and “you poor thing” our world teaches. If you love someone you will speak the hard truth to them and God speaks it to us.
He taught and healed all? He came to divide, not to bring peace. Truth was/is offered to all, most decline it. Never turning anyone away? If they didn’t want to hear the truth, he did not chase them, he was always testing and knowing hearts.
I do not mean to offend you, I may have taken things out of context, not knowing your heart. Yes God is graceful and loves us but he is also a just God, that has not gone away and we need to speak that truth as well.
My message is one of repentance and self examination. The Lord offers this to all while in this world. I moved to a Christian community after I retired and look up to my neighbors by and large. I've given Bibles out to those unfamiliar with it. I don't look to condemn as people condemn themselves.
My particular branch of my faith is very specific about sodomy, divorce and adultery. In a recent sermon published in New Church Life, they spoke to homosexuality head on with 'hard truth'. I agreed with everything it said. As for pastors in the liberal branch ministering to homosexuals, fine. They have a place and path to find the truth.