Posted on 05/15/2012 6:25:37 PM PDT by tedw
I don't get to judge you. I have my suspicions about your motivation, your level of alcoholic addiction, your true level of involvement in the program. But I don't get to judge you.
But what I want everyone to take note of is this:
On my side, I say, "Find God the way that works for you. Just FIND GOD. Find sobriety the way that works for you. Just FIND SOBRIETY."
On Ted's side, he says "God is only available my way. The other way sucks. Sobriety is only avaiable my way. The other way sucks."
I will leave it to the reader to decide which is the more spiritual approach.
Good day, sir.
Institutionalized? J, M and J
Interesting little series of exchanges. Will leave it to you guys to decide which makes sense. ;)
“On Ted’s side, he says “God is only available my way. The other way sucks. Sobriety is only avaiable my way. The other way sucks.”
That is your twisited to spin on the matter. I am just saying that what AA teaches about alcoholism is untrue.
My book is available over at Smashwords for .99 cents. Hardly a monetary motivation. If anyone wants it free email me at adamsonted@gmail and I will gladly seen you a free coupon code.
I was deeply involved in AA. I was an Intergroup Representative, Secretary of a Speaker meeting, and and H&I chair with Narcotics Anonymous. I have been a speaker at many meetings, both in NA and AA.
What I am saying conflicts with the brainwashing you have accepted, and it disturbs you.
I want people to be Born Again and be Children of God, not cripples dependent on going to meetings the rest of their life and believing lies.
AA in no way impedes a person becoming a Christian. In fact, it often LEADS to someone becoming a Christian. Further, I have seen people 'graduate' successfully from AA and go on to become an even more spiritual person. I have seen them give up AA and go on to church.
But I don't see them denegrating AA and saying the path that got them sober and on better footing with God is UNTRUE.
You may be, should someone be foolish enough to listen to your denegration, having a hand in someone's death. You may be having a hand in PREVENTING them from getting to know God.
What worked for you might kill me. What worked for me might kill you. That's why I do not denegrate your path, but recommend that people find the way that works for them.
So, if I am 'brainwashed' enough to be open to whatever works for a person to sober them up, and eventually get them to Christ, but you are 'brainwashed' enough to deny any other path but yours as correct, WHO IS TRULY BRAINWASHED?
Physician, heal thyself.
I walked into AA and one week later turned my life over to Jesus. The people that lead me were not allowed in many meeting across town because they were adament about salvation being spoken about in AA.
I quickly found out that was not allowed. Many sober folks would blow a fuse if you even thought about sharing Jesus.
So I can understand your point of view. Nonetheless AA helps many to not take a drink one day at a time and theres a place for that despite Jesus not being allowed.
In my case a wise Christian used AA to stay sober by working the 12th step outside the doors. He just had to keep his views “disguised” untill the meetings were over.
Ah well. Sometimes I suck, sometimes I pwn.
The most spiritual people I know are those who continued on their development, even while still going to AA and NA. Mostly, they were going there to remind themselves of a few of the basics, but more importantly, to reach out to someone who still suffers.
I myself go to AA and NA less, and have grown spiritually past the program. But I still go, and always will, to help others just coming in.
“But I don’t see them denegrating AA and saying the path that got them sober and on better footing with God is UNTRUE.”
I am telling the Truth about AA, not denigrating it. There are better programs than AA and a person would be well advised to seek them out. I will gladly recommend them to anyone interested.
Your too defensive. AA has lost it’s way. There acceptance of homosexuality is just one sign of it.
What “better” programs? AA is everywhere, its free, and it works for many people.
AA turned away from the salvation of Jesus Christ a long long time ago. Bill W and the Doctor talked about it. They said it did not work for everyone to be beat with the Bible. Most people had been preached to all their lives.
Christians operating in AA have to be subtle and wise like a fox. But it is a wonderful place to plant seeds and be the salt of the earth and be used by God to see miracles.
I will conclude with this: Ted says: "I am telling the Truth about AA, not denigrating it. There are better programs than AA and a person would be well advised to seek them out."
I say, instead: "There are many programs of recovery out there. None of them are 'better' than the other. Go find the one that seems to work best for *you*. Keep trying until you get sober and find God. Just keep trying until you find what works for you."
You are exclusionary. I am inclusionary. I need do something now, so I will stop responding to you. You may have the last word.
Lets say your a homosexual alcoholic and you go to AA. You are accepted for you sinful life and even told about Gay AA meetings where people will be completely accepting of your failing.
Is that as good a program as a Christian progam that tells you the truth that homosexuality is a sin and can be overcome? I think not.
God, by the way, is somewhat exclusionary:
New International Version (©1984)
Do you not know that the wicked will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived: Neither the sexually immoral nor idolaters nor adulterers nor male prostitutes nor homosexual offenders
1 Corinthians 6:9
But you probably dont believe that either. I rest my case.
Maybe it's in your book, but what is your definition of addiction? I have developed an interest in shape note singing and I try to participate in it as much as I can. An I addicted to singing?
Did it take you 30 years in AA to figure out how wrong it is?
“Did it take you 30 years in AA to figure out how wrong it is?”
No, I used to try and go to help people even though I knew that much of the “teaching” is false.
So you have decided it is your job to shed light on the subject?
You have *absolutely no evidence* to support your assertion about what I believe about the Bible or homosexuals.
You rest your case on vapid judgementalism, devoid of a shred of evidence.
If this reflects what sort of style is in your book, I'll pass.
In short, your evidence-free assumptions about my beliefs have angered me. Get lost, creep.
I said probably.
“In short, your evidence-free assumptions about my beliefs have angered me. Get lost, creep.”
Yes, your an angry person, and not spiritual at all. You are convicted by the words out of your own mouth.
Hear Hear! It was exactly postings like this on this board that gave me the courage to take my first steps toward recovery. And I had been in church all my life.
Heavy metal goes well with demon rum and coke.
Hey don-o! Tell 'im how angry I am! LOL
Dude, although I am largely a happy person, a jerk can piss me off -- temporarily. And you have been a jerk, and have pissed me off -- temporarily.
TTFL (Ta ta for life)
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