Amillennialism 101 -- Jesus Christ: The True Israel

The Riddleblog ^ | Kim Riddlebarger | Kim Riddlebarger

[Lee N. Field]

“Dispensational” refers to the Bible term/word “oikonomos”-economy (literally). It’s a VERY Biblical word.

It's a biblical word, but the use it's put to isn't necessarily biblical.

The fulcrum of dispensationalism is the distinction between Israel and the Church.

The radical distinction between the Church and Israel. From my observation, I have come to think that the whole system is designed to protect that distinction. The eschatological scheme is almost incidental.

Israel = the unfaithful, whoring, divorced wife of God the Father. She will be restored to full status in the future.

The church = the unmarried, betrothed, Bride of Christ. The marriage has yet to take place.

And I would say, this is a New Testament development of an Old Testament theme.

Otherwise, I'd say we've got some trinitarian issues, eh? God the Father has one spouse, God the Son has a completely different spouse? How's that work, really?

There's an interpretive issue at the base of all this, that needs to be looked at: does the Old Testament govern how we interpret the New Testament, or does the New Testament inform how we interpret the Old?

[Lee N. Field]

Those same descendants that stood at the base of Mt. Sinai and received the Ten Commandments as their marriage contract,then through history were scattered and became Gentiles (per Hosea), were made a way, through Jesus death and resurrection, to come back into Israel.

Is it on the basis of physical descent?

[Lee N. Field]

Those same descendants that stood at the base of Mt. Sinai and received the Ten Commandments as their marriage contract,

It's a suzerainty treaty.

[Gamecock]

ok, thanks. I’m staying out of this, but I hope that we freepers can debate on this instead of fight.

The church used to have debates between amils, historical premils and postmils. As stated above the premil dispys are a recent development.

[Cronos]

My religion is Christianity. Now go away. Probably a time for hajira right?

[Zionist Conspirator]

But with apostolic hindsight Peter speaks

But is this how the New Testament interprets these messianic prophecies regarding the servant of the Lord?

In order to answer this questions, we must see that the gospel writers interpret these prophecies from Isaiah as fulfilled in the messianic mission of Jesus.

In Hosea 11:1, Hosea predicted a time when “Israel was a child, I loved him, and out of Egypt I called my son.” But in Matthew 2:15, the evangelist tells us that Hosea’s prophecy was fulfilled when his parents took Jesus to Egypt to protect him from Herod’s “slaughter of the innocents”

The ramifications for this upon one’s millennial view should now be obvious. If Jesus is the true Israel of God, and if the New Testament writers apply to Jesus those Old Testament prophecies referring to Israel as God’s son or servant, then what remains of the dispensationalist’s case that these prophecies remain yet to be fulfilled in a future millennium? They vanish in Jesus Christ, who has fulfilled them!

The author in these quotes has exposed the logical fallacy at the heart of chr*stianity (any and all kinds of chr*stianity). Supposedly chr*stians believe in J*sus and the "new testament" because they "fulfill" the prophecies of the "old testament." Yet the only grounds for that belief (that J*sus fulfills the prophecies) is the assumed authority of the "new testament" and J*sus to authoritatively interpret those prophecies. But if the authority of J*sus and the NT is assumed, then one is not basing one's chr*stian belief in the prophecies to begin with. One is instead beginning with an assumed belief and then falsely claiming that belief is based on "old testament prophecies."

That is why all forms of chr*stianity--from the most ancient liturgical to the most snake-handling "fire baptized," from the most liberal to the most conservative, from the most anti-Semitic to the most Judaized "messianism," from the most mainstream to the most "out there"--is utter bunk.

Paul tells us that Abraham believed the very same gospel that he preached to the Gentile Galatians.

This is no different from the islamic claim that Abraham was a moslem. It is a later, invented religion retrojecting itself into the past in order to claim a legitimacy it does not possess.

[Boogieman]

Yes, but that is talking only about the northern nation of Israel, not the 12 tribes of Israel collectively, which you can see because the verse refers to the rest of the tribes as “her treacherous sister Judah”.

[AceMineral]

I was trying to give a very simple definition of what has become known as “Replacement Theology”. That phrase as I have encountered it is used by those who disagree with it.

Personally, I subscribe neither to “Replacement Theology” nor to “Dispensationalism”. However, I will say that if someone from today went back to 1812 or 1712 and started preaching a “dispensationalist” sermon he would have been thought part of some kook fringe or possible cryptojudaiser.

[Ezekiel]

The ten northern tribes (House of Israel) have been scattered into ALL THE NATIONS OF THE WORLD.

Judah, subsequently scattered (but without loss of tribal identity), reestablished a nation/state in 1948, even though many Jews (~ 50% ?) remain outside the Land.

What is sliding way under the radar (consistent with loss of identity) is that the same applies to the House of Israel. That is, right here in plain sight (elephant in the room) is a nation that represents the House of Joseph, even though the ten tribes were/are scattered all over.

This all goes a long way in explaining why we have an evil, POS Amalekite usurper working his craft in the White House. Something about the characteristics of Abraham, Isaac, Jacob, and Joseph that he doesn't like. Freedom-loving people are not only refusing the shackles, they understand on a visceral level that a bondage-loving ruler is not one of them and is brazenly claiming a birthright not his.

[HarleyD]

I thought you tried to do a fair job. This is a pet peeve of mine. There’s a subtle flaw in the “Replacement” argument (one that I had to catch myself on). There is nothing being replaced as is intimated in the question. The question, “Do you or do you not believe in Replacement Theology?” can’t be answered since nothing is being replaced. It’s like saying, “Do you like Obama or are you a racist?” The real question is “Do you or do you not believe that the exact same promises of God for the Jews extends to Gentile believers?” The answers are surprising.

[Biblical Calvinist]

If you go to Dr. Riddlebarger’s Blog, the Riddleblog - http://kimriddlebarger.squarespace.com/ then scroll halfway down the page, on the right side of the page, you’ll find Dr. Riddlebarger’s lecture series titled “AMILLENIALISM 101” in Mp3 format, which can be streamed or downloaded..FREE.

Dr. Riddlebarger was raised in an Evangelical, Dispensational church..he says that he was a committed Dispensationalist for most of his 20’s, until he began to discover deep inconsistencies in the Dispensational schema, compared to what the Bible actually taught.

Most Evangelicals tend to disparage Amillenialism and Post Millenialism without actually reading the primary Amil or Post Mill literature that has been written by Amillenial and Post Mill scholars, like Dr. Riddlebarger, or Dr. Anthony Hoekema, Dr. Greg Bahnsen, or Gary DeMar, and others.

I’ve spoken with more than a few Christians in the past who are strongly against the Amil or Post Mill viewpoint, but find that they have no real knowledge of the Scriptural arguments used by those who hold to these viewponts. They only know what they have been told by other well known Dispensationalists.

Since he was raised as a Dispensationalist, Dr. Riddlebarger is quite familar with the various arguments that are used by Dispensationalists, he presents these arguments in a balanced way, then deals with them in an irenic manner.

This is an INTERFAMILY argument. No one on the Reformed side says that Dispensationalists are not Christians, yet we do insist that classical Darby and Scofield Dispensationalism, and the Modified Dispensationalism of Walvoord and Ryrie is in error.

Dr. Riddlebarger’s book “A CASE FOR AMILLENIALISM” is a good place to start to understand the Scriptural arguments presented by both sides of the issue at hand. His AUDIO Mp3 lecture series is an excellent companion to the book.

Dr. Riddlebarger has a lecture included within this AUDIO series that REFUTES the idea that the Reformed hold to REPLACEMENT theology.

The TERM “Replacement” is a canard. The Reformed have NEVER used this term. The term was coined by, and used by Dispensationalists to describe something that they don’t really understand. Reformed theologians do NOT hold to so called “Replacement” theology at all.

Rather, the classical Reformed position is that since Believeing Christians are grafted onto the branch of Believeing Israel, Believeing Israel IS the Church and the Church IS Believing Israel, and has been since Creation.

God has one people, not two. Believeing Israel and the Believing Church are one and the same, and have always been so. There is no dichotomy between the Believeing Church and Believing Israel. We are all one in God’s Kingdom.

So, understanding that the Church IS Israel, Israel IS the Church, and always has been so, there cannot possibly be any REPLACEMENT of Israel here. Rather, the Believing Church is EXPANDING Israel when God draws people into His Kingdom through evangelism.

So, it’s best that we properly affirm that we hold to EXPANSION theology, rather than the canard of Replacement theology.

Dr. Riddlebarger’s book and audio series is highly recommended for those who wish to further investigate these things.~

[Gamecock]

So, it’s best that we properly affirm that we hold to EXPANSION theology, rather than the canard of Replacement theology.

Exactly.

Thanks for your well reasoned post.

[ladyL]

Oh Ezekiel, my hero...I think they were about to burn me at the stake. That’s traditionally how the church put a “heretic” out of his misery. Remember John Wycliff and the Inquisition. That’s what’s ahead of us my friend. Oh well, what’s new?

[ladyL]

There were three conditions a “foreigner” could meet to become an Israelite according to the Torah. 1. He must take part in the Passover 2. He must be circumcised 3. He must walk with the Israelites.

When you think about to become a Christian 1. our hearts are circumcised 2. Christ is our Passover lamb 3. we SHOULD walk as the Israelites...that's where the glitches come in.

[fishtank]

STEM Publishing: J. N. Darby: Evidence from Scripture of the passing away of the present dispensation.

"STEM Publishing: J. N. Darby: Evidence from Scripture of the passing away of the present dispensation. Evidence from Scripture of the passing away of the present dispensation.

J. N. Darby.

<02007E> 89

The testimony of Scripture is the only secure resting-place for man amid the darkness of this world. This, through the teaching of the Spirit, is the believer's light and security; from this his judgment flows; and, consequently, from this the rule and foundation of his conduct springs. Wrong thoughts as to God's dealings, and our own place before Him, must lead to wrong judgment as to the conduct claimed from us; and thus all our service will be folly, and, perhaps, our hopes presumption; our light will be darkness, and then what will become of those "who are led"?

Immediately connected with this inquiry (and thus involving the most practical results) is the question as to the dispensation in which we stand, and what are to be our hopes in it? Many most interesting inquiries are connected with this subject, as to the development of the purposes of God; but it is not my present purpose to enter into them. I intend to confine myself to the scriptural evidence on the two following most important questions, which, in the highest degree, affect the present interests and operations of the church of Christ.

(1) IS THIS DISPENSATION THE LAST, OR NOT?

(2) WHAT ARE THE CIRCUMSTANCES BY WHICH ANY OTHER IS TO BE INTRODUCED?

The answer to these questions appears to me to involve the whole ground of the judgment of a believer's mind, as to his present position in the world; and, consequently, as to his duty and his hopes. Without examining the detail of circumstances, I shall endeavour to seize on some of the broad facts and principles.

(1) Is this dispensation the last, or is it not?

First - Let us consider the evidence of Scripture as to the Christian body.

The 9th verse of the 1st of Ephesians affords a leading declaration of Scripture on this subject: "Having made known unto us the mystery of his will, according to his good pleasure which he hath purposed in himself: that in the dispensation of the fulness of times he might gather together in one all things in Christ, both which are in heaven, and which are on earth; even in him, in whom also we have obtained an inheritance" (v. 10). Now this is in no way applicable to the present dispensation. He is to gather together in one all things which are in heaven, and which are on earth. This the present dispensation does not assume to do: it is a dispensation in which Satan is the prince and god of this world - in which he sows tares among the wheat, and is in high places. In this, God visits the Gentiles to take out of them a people for His name. This is indeed a dispensation of another gathering (as we shall see presently), in which angels minister and devils oppose - anything but a gathering into one things in heaven and things on earth; for we must be absent from the body to be present with the Lord, and absent from the Lord to be at home in the body; and we "groan" waiting."

More at the link.

[fishtank]

“However, I will say that if someone from today went back to 1812 or 1712 and started preaching a “dispensationalist” sermon he would have been thought part of some kook fringe or possible cryptojudaiser.”

This is a completely fallacious argument. One could say the same about the preaching of salvation by grace through faith alone before 1500....

This “dating” argument reminds me so much of the RCC argumentation that appeals to the “Magisterium”, and the “church Fathers” and “Councils” and to “papal infallibility”.

The Reformation did NOT end with the Council of Dordt and the publication of the Westminster Catechism. I do declare, it seems as if Reformed theology is halfway stuck in the Vatican.

Having grown up in the RCC, I am trying to move as far away from it as I can, in so far where they differ from Scripture.

[one Lord one faith one baptism]

people identify themselves as heretics.......the mormons, jehovah winesses, seventh day adventist, those who claim the true Gospel has not been preched for 2,000 years out themselves.

Jesus said He would be with us ALWAYS, EVEN TO THE END OF TIME. HE SAID HE WOULD SEND THE HOLY SPIRIT TO US TO GUIDE US INTO ALL TRUTH. HE SAID THE GATES OF HELL WOULD NOT PREVAIL AGAINST THE CHURCH. READ ACTS 9:4 TO SEE HOW JESUS FEELS ABOUT HIS CHURCH.

i watched the you tube link you posted, i felt sorry for the guy, he is one lost puppy. what arrogance to feel the Church has been wrong and the Holy Spirit has been asleep for 2,000 years! to find out he is a Sabbath keeper is just one more confirmation that the man has no clue what the Scriptures teach. Christians rest in Jesus, He is our Sabbath.

[one Lord one faith one baptism]

if you can’t name at least 10 Christians in every century since Jesus ascended to heaven, you just might not be a Christian.

the reason no one belived through “faith alone”, is the Scriptures specifically say the opposite. and since the Church only chose those books for the NT canon that matched the Faith received orally from the Apostles, no one heard of “faith alone” before the 16th century.
grace alone, yes.
faith alone, no.

[ladyL]

I want to thank you and tell you that I really respect your theological position. You are one of the very few who will venture outside of their comfort zone to see the other side of the biblical perspective. Wish there were more Believers like you. I truly believe the Father will honor your desire to know Him better.

I would appreciate, if you have the time, any scriptures that support your position against the Restoration of Israel teaching. Thank you

[one Lord one faith one baptism]

there is no “restoration” needed. the key to understanding the Scriptures is the OT contains types and shadows pointing to the coming of the Lord Jesus Christ into the world as a man to live a sinless life and give His life as a sacrifice for the forgiveness of sins to reconcile His people ( Israel ) to the Father. the NT tells about the life of Jesus, the early Church and Epistles from Paul which explain certain Christian doctrines in more detail. The NT explains how the OT types and shadows relate to Christ and how they were done away with when Jesus arrived.
One of these types was national Israel. For the most part, the promises made to Abraham were confined to the physical descendants of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob. but Jesus Christ cut off national Israel from being the custodian of the Kingdom when He cursed the fig tree and said it would NEVER bear fruit again and when He told the Jews their house would be left desolate and the Kingdom would be given to another nation ( this nation was the Church,the Israel of God comprised of all believers whether they are Jew or Gentile )
The NT tells us the true Jew is one inwardly, not determined by DNA.
The NT tells us not all who are descended from Israel belong to Israel.
The NT tells us “all Israel is to be saved” the clearest statement in the Bible that the Church ( the Body of Christ ) is Israel since the only ones to be saved are “in Christ”
The NT tells us the kingdom has been established and the Lord Jesus Christ is reigning NOW from the heavenly Jerusalem. His subjects are all those In Him, those who He purchased with His own blood.
The NT tells us you can’t seperate Jesus from His Church and this Church will be on the earth CONTINUOUSLY from Pentecost until Jesus comes back at the end of the world.
Satan CAN NOT overcome the Church, because Jesus bound Satan at the cross and the Holy Spirit leads the Church to all truth and protects the Church. Without the Holy Spirit, man can not understand the things of God, they are folly to him. But Jesus gave AUTHORITY TO THE CHURCH in Matthew 28:16-20.
the NT also tells us there will be false prophets who arise and will lead many astray. history tells us this is true. but the TRUE CHURCH is the one that has been here since Pentecost 33ad.
the NT also tells us there must come a great “falling away” in the Church right before the end. What do we see happening to the Church today? A GREAT FALLING AWAY!
so when someone says the true Gospel has not been preached for more than 2,000 years, we can dismiss such a person because such a person does not understand the Church is the Body of Christ, it is not a man made institution but a Divine One, it is protected by the Holy Spirit and led into all truth by Him and it will fulfill it’s commission received from Jesus Himself to teach and baptize until He returns to earth at the end.
the true offspring of Abraham has always been on earth since the promise was given to Abraham, only those with the eyes of Faith know who this offspring are. ( no “restoration” is needed )
this Faith is a gift from God, and i believe if you sincerely pray to God for this gift, He will send a Philip into your life like He did the eunuch in Acts 8.
God bless you.