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But Iím a good Mormon wife: Sean and I had the perfect life. Then his faith started to crumble...
Salon ^ | June 1, 2012 | Maren Stephenson

Posted on 06/20/2012 12:17:00 PM PDT by Colofornian

...When Sean replaced his temple garments — the sacred underwear he’d promised to wear day and night — with boxers, I couldn’t take it anymore. It was too much betrayal. I called up a neighbor with a husband like mine and cried. But instead of empathy, she offered questions that stunned me into silence. Was Sean addicted to pornography? Watching R-rated movies? What sin had brought him to this terrible place?

...Her questions were so off-base...She was sincere, and trying to help, but she believed what the Church teaches — that a man would only leave because he’s disobeying the commandments. She couldn’t understand this was a rational inquiry. She saw everything as the result of sin.

...The Church was wrong about him. What else might they be wrong about?...

...I often found him hunched over his iPad reading everything he could find on Mormon origins...“I’m sorry, but I just have to tell you. Did you know that…” and then he’d tell me...About how Joseph Smith mistranslated some Egyptian hieroglyphics that are part of our canonized scripture. About how he translated the Book of Mormon while looking at a stone inside of a hat.

I listened half-heartedly...though I wasn’t about to go looking at them myself...until one night it was about polygamy, my archnemesis.

“Did you know that Joseph Smith married a 14-year-old girl against her will? Did you know that he’d send men on missions and marry their wives in secret when they were gone?” ...he kept talking, a horror growing in my gut. I knew that if Sean was right, then Joseph Smith was a fraud. I saw no difference between his acts and the modern-day acts of Warren Jeffs, whom I abhorred. And if Joseph Smith was a fraud — then what did that make the Church?

(Excerpt) Read more at salon.com ...


TOPICS: General Discusssion; Other non-Christian; Religion & Culture; Theology
KEYWORDS: exmormon; exodus; inman; lds; mormon
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To: Tennessee Nana
Jorge's connection to Old Kenosha Money was the same as Barry Goldwater's whose wife was the Borg-Warner heir.

The nomination was confirmed outside the convention long before the first primary was held.

More recently Mitt proved the Old Kenosha Money is still there and it served to PUT his lackey Priebus in place as RNC Chairman, which helped a lot.

101 posted on 06/20/2012 4:11:29 PM PDT by muawiyah
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To: BfloGuy

“hard-working, self-reliant folks who created thriving communities across the country. “

Facts are not Hate. You can post the history of the Methodist church all day long and it won’t bother me. You can even criticize it and I might agree.
So why is this anti-Mormonism such a bad thing? I criticize the ECUSA for ordaining gays. I criticize Islam for terrorism.


102 posted on 06/20/2012 4:17:47 PM PDT by AppyPappy (If you really want to annoy someone, point out something obvious that they are trying hard to ignore)
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To: jimt

Please provide examples of hate.
You keep making the charge, without evidence.
Its time for your canned corrosive bile to end.


103 posted on 06/20/2012 4:22:17 PM PDT by svcw (If one living cell on another planet is life, why isn't it life in the womb?)
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To: onedoug
Neither.

BHO's relationship is with allah.

Romney's relationship is with godS.

104 posted on 06/20/2012 4:28:47 PM PDT by svcw (If one living cell on another planet is life, why isn't it life in the womb?)
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To: BfloGuy

Please name on elected mormon on the national stage who is a conservative?
mormonism is not conservative.


105 posted on 06/20/2012 4:34:09 PM PDT by svcw (If one living cell on another planet is life, why isn't it life in the womb?)
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To: OrangeHoof
I'm not ignorant, YOU are merely a water carrier for the fearful crowd. You have no idea what will happen tomorrow, so much for your FACTS!!

Liberal Romneycare is the LEAST likely candidate who could beat his brother Obamacare. Yet, idiot voters caught in the LIES of the POS, didn't want conservative NEWT which would be a win for WeThePeople/America.

So let the games begin for the morons - on both sides - they choose evil over good - they WILL get it either way!

there is no point having a discussion - I agree, what is there to discuss with SELL OUTS where a godless cult leader who is a PRO HOMO marriage and PRO baby killing and appointment of liberal judges candidate and a KNOWN LIAR and hater of conservationism is OK for America to them - their mind is made up MONTHS ahead of time with 'their facts'!

106 posted on 06/20/2012 4:39:51 PM PDT by presently no screen name
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To: BfloGuy
I don't get the anti-Mormonism on this board -- against people who would otherwise be held up as examples of conservatism

Maybe you can find a clue at this link:

What has the Mormon Church historically taught about Christianity?

"While some current church leaders portray the LDS Church as Christian, the church actually has a long history of condemning Christianity. The church has also stated repeatedly that no one can be saved without the permission of Joseph Smith. The church has even suggested that Islam is better than Christianity."

Mormon Church Condemns Christians

"This is not just another Church. This is not just one of a family of Christian churches. This is the Church and kingdom of God, the only true Church upon the face of the earth..." - Prophet Ezra Taft Benson, Teachings of Ezra Taft Benson, p.164-165

107 posted on 06/20/2012 4:45:17 PM PDT by greyfoxx39 (Until the 52K LDS missionaries claiming Christian faith is bogus quit, I will post LDS truth.)
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To: BfloGuy

What you’re perceiving is that the opposition to the ISM has been successfully morphed into condemnation of the adherents because one of their number is running for the republican nomination. It or was subtle, but it is blossoming into something quite ugly, which will make the task of opposing the ISM that much more ‘difficult’ in order to get through to the adherents regarding their ISM.


108 posted on 06/20/2012 4:50:01 PM PDT by MHGinTN (Being deceived can be cured.)
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To: Colofornian

I think it’s sad that the evils of Mormonism caused these two to become atheists. I truly hope that they can somehow find a way to discover God and a Christian life.


109 posted on 06/20/2012 4:57:39 PM PDT by Tau Food (Tom Hoefling for President - 2012)
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To: BfloGuy

“I don’t get the anti-Mormonism on this board — against people who would otherwise be held up as examples of conservatism.”

Only under a very shallow definition of conservatism. If conservatism is strictly about being productive, law abiding citizens, then many groups qualify as conservative.

But the roots of our success as a nation go much deeper, being tapped into the fertile belief in a monotheistic Creator who endows us with unalienable rights, wholly unlike the Mormon registry of countless evolving deities swarming to get to the top. This is extremely important to the definition of conservatism, because our system of unalienable individual rights is the basis of our claim to freedom, and it is a direct byproduct of natural law, in which there is one universal, timeless moral code, which is enforced by only one eternal, all-powerful Arbitrator, a concept ultimately impossible in any polytheistic system.

This has been understood by political philosophers for millennia, and it is one of the central reasons even the deists among our founders sided with the traditional Christians in recognizing that our rights are indestructible because they come from our Creator. It is a belief essential to the whole notion of the rule of law, and therefore essential to the survival of our Republic, and it is held by neither Obama nor Romney.

To see how this works, take a look at Plato’s Euthyphro, in which Socrates utterly destroys the idea of universal moral principle IF there exists a multiplicity of ever higher ranked deities, all claiming to be moral authorities in their own sphere of influence, with no single Arbiter at the top of the pile.

That’s the problem with an “evolved” deity. As in Gnosticism, the progression is infinite. NO god ever fully arrives at the top, no matter how long the struggle. Therefore there is really is no way to be certain whether there might not be an even bigger fish lurking about to upset the whole moral order. Monotheism does not have that problem, and we can therefore believe in and function as a society in which the one and only eternal God has created each of us with those famously unalienable rights which define our freedom.

Now this is speculation on my part, but I believe this polytheistic instability in the moral order is directly reflected in the vacillating moral positions of Romney and other big ticket Mormons on, for example, abortion. Gods give life, and gods take away life. If you’re going to be a god someday on Kolob or wherever, with teeming throngs worshipping at your feet, you would be, theoretically, in a position to give or take life.

So if a person really believes that megalomaniacal nonsense about themselves, why would it not affect their attitude toward our puny mortal struggles? We are all so inferior to them, after all, not being on the fast track to deification and all that rot. But if necessary to gain power, a public position on any given subject can always be adjusted to current circumstances. Oh, did I just say Etch-a-Sketch? I think I did.


110 posted on 06/20/2012 5:22:24 PM PDT by Springfield Reformer (Winston Churchill: No Peace Till Victory!)
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To: freedomlover

>> is this an ad for Romney, or is it just an independent Mormon ad totally unrelated to the election?

You’re kidding, right?

Have you — has ANYONE — EVER — in their ENTIRE LIVES — ANYWHERE in the US — seen ads touting mormonism BEFORE this year, the year in which Myth was to be the annointed Republicandidate?

Honest question. If anyone on the forum has EVER seen such an ad, please enlighten me and provide a link, if one exists.


111 posted on 06/20/2012 5:24:36 PM PDT by Nervous Tick (Trust in God, but row away from the rocks!)
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To: Springfield Reformer

Wow. Superb post.


112 posted on 06/20/2012 5:32:20 PM PDT by Nervous Tick (Trust in God, but row away from the rocks!)
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To: Nervous Tick

I think this will answer your question.

http://www.usatoday.com/news/religion/story/2011-10-02/mormon-church-media-campaign/50637136/1


113 posted on 06/20/2012 6:43:37 PM PDT by svcw (If one living cell on another planet is life, why isn't it life in the womb?)
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To: Nervous Tick
Back in the seventies or eighties (about the same time the Methodist Church was running their 'fire of the Holy Spirit' campaign which yielded the cross with a red cloth of flame around it) there was a series of TV ads which parallel the current "and I'm a Mormon' campaign. The gist was that folks should ask 'what do these folks believe who call themselves Latter Day Saints?' At the end of the ad there was always an inviation to contact any LDS church or person of the Mormon faith and they would be sure to get someone by to see you, to 'share their story'.

The ISM is not Christianity and in fact is shown through their records of the previous leadership teaching to teach what amounts to clear blasphemy.

114 posted on 06/20/2012 6:47:31 PM PDT by MHGinTN (Being deceived can be cured.)
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To: LibLieSlayer
As long as the media tells the truth and does not lie... then anyone who believes in the truth should not fear it. If they lie, then it is open warfare on liars. The truth is the truth... there is only truth and lies.

Many of us have said for years that the media won't even have to lie to expose the cult of mormonism, there's ample material from mormon's own sources that they don't have to lie to expose this abominable "religion" and its false prophets.

If anyone here has seen a lie from the media about mormonism, I'd like for them to point it out, when they do, you and I and others will jump right on it.

115 posted on 06/20/2012 7:02:11 PM PDT by Graybeard58 (Come quickly Lord Jesus.)
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To: Graybeard58

Does Bill Maher lying count?


116 posted on 06/20/2012 7:27:31 PM PDT by MHGinTN (Being deceived can be cured.)
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To: BfloGuy

“I don’t get the anti-Mormonism on this board — against people who would otherwise be held up as examples of conservatism. “

You somehow morphed from “anti-Mormonism” to “people”

Mormonism is a cultic heresy that leads people to hell.
Mormons are (largely) nice people, who are caught in a cultic heresy.

I’ve not seen any criticism of the cultic heresy that also criticized the members who are caught in it.

There have been some mormonic-FReepers who were here flacking the cult and I did see their actions criticized.


117 posted on 06/20/2012 7:48:47 PM PDT by aMorePerfectUnion ("I'm comfortable with a Romney win." - Pres. Jimmy Carter)
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To: MHGinTN
Does Bill Maher lying count?

I've neither heard or read anything he has said, I skip articles about him and have never watched his show, so you'd have to quote me one of his lies about mormonism. From what I've read about him, I'd hardly say he was media. He's a liberal comedian isn't he?

118 posted on 06/20/2012 7:58:35 PM PDT by Graybeard58 (Come quickly Lord Jesus.)
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To: BfloGuy

But they also seem to be hard-working, self-reliant folks who created thriving communities across the country.

- - - - -
SEEM being the operative word. Reality is vastly different.

The LDS are no more conservative than any other religious group (although they claim such) and more liberal in practice than many. Don’t be decieved by PR.

The ‘anti-Mormonism’ on FR is because they claim to be Christians while insulting Christ and God. I used to be LDS which is why I am so outspoken about the truth of their cult now.

Doctrine matters, not perceived ‘results’.


119 posted on 06/20/2012 9:24:48 PM PDT by reaganaut (Ex-Mormon, now Christian "I once was lost, but now am found, was blind but now I see")
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To: greyfoxx39

Mormon Church Condemns Christians

- - - - =- -
But...but...but...they SEEM so nice and conservative!

/eyeroll


120 posted on 06/20/2012 9:27:58 PM PDT by reaganaut (Ex-Mormon, now Christian "I once was lost, but now am found, was blind but now I see")
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To: Tau Food; D-fendr
I think it’s sad that the evils of Mormonism caused these two to become atheists.

Well...I just recently came across a quote from an early church father who referenced a heretic as an atheist.

Did the heretic believe in a god? (Yes)

So why did this early church father reference the heretic as an atheist?

Because the heretic did not know the true God.

You see, this early church father wasn't satisfied with "theism" being defined as only an abstract acknowledgment that "Yes, a generic god exists out there somewhere." To this early church father, if the heretic didn't know -- didn't relate to the true God -- he was no different than an out-and-out atheist.

I outlined big distinctives between the God of the Bible and the Mormon god (see posts #89, #94, #96). Do Christians believe in that Mormon god described in those three posts? (No) Are Christians then, in effect, "atheists" if that "theism" is defined by Mormon beliefs? (Yes)

The reverse is also true: Do Mormons rule out a God-the-Father who "is spirit" (John 4:24) and is not a man-become-god? (Yes, they rule that out) Are they therefore "atheists" toward that defined theistic divinity? (Yes; in effect, they are!)

Mormonism, therefore, is already in effect "atheistic" toward the God of the Bible. It has redefined God that greatly!

121 posted on 06/20/2012 11:07:03 PM PDT by Colofornian
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mormonism is the same today as it was yesterday, only today they actually hide what it really is
place marker


122 posted on 06/20/2012 11:11:49 PM PDT by svcw (If one living cell on another planet is life, why isn't it life in the womb?)
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To: OrangeHoof

Tampa might put a hitch in your giddyup.

LLS


123 posted on 06/21/2012 4:22:25 AM PDT by LibLieSlayer (Don't Tread On Me)
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To: BfloGuy
All it takes is to study their religion, read the TRUE word of GOD and believe in JESUS and his teachings. One cannot be a member of that science fiction cult if one does these things.

Conservatives stand against evil... we do not embrace the lesser... savvy?

LLS

124 posted on 06/21/2012 4:29:18 AM PDT by LibLieSlayer (Don't Tread On Me)
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To: Colofornian
...she believed what the Church teaches...


125 posted on 06/21/2012 4:30:47 AM PDT by Elsie (Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going)
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To: Flintlock
Behold: the attack on Romney!

(THE TRUTH: It's the new hate speech..)


Now THIS is an interesting pairing you don't find every day!

126 posted on 06/21/2012 4:32:24 AM PDT by Elsie (Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going)
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To: Graybeard58

That was my point exactly.

LLS


127 posted on 06/21/2012 4:33:44 AM PDT by LibLieSlayer (Don't Tread On Me)
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To: OrangeHoof
And yet if Salon ran a piece like this about Christians, we’d all see it for the left-wing smear it is.

I see FACTS about MORMONism.

Where is the SMEAR part?

128 posted on 06/21/2012 4:35:38 AM PDT by Elsie (Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going)
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To: OrangeHoof
And yet if Salon ran a piece like this about Christians...

Bah!

Who needs Salon???



Questions put to Joseph Smith: "'Do you believe the Bible?' [Smith:]'If we do, we are the only people under heaven that does, for there are none of the religious sects of the day that do'. When asked 'Will everybody be damned, but Mormons'? [Smith replied] 'Yes, and a great portion of them, unless they repent, and work righteousness." (Teachings of the Prophet Joseph Smith, p. 119).
Joseph Smith: "for the teachers of religion of the different sects understood the same passages of scripture so differently as to destroy all confidence in settling the question by an appeal to the Bible" (from Pearl of Great Price 1:12). "What is it that inspires professors of Christianity generally with a hope of salvation? It is that smooth, sophisticated influence of the devil, by which he deceives the whole world" (Teachings of the Prophet Joseph Smith, p.270).
 
 
 
Brigham Young stated this repeatedly: "When the light came to me I saw that all the so-called Christian world was grovelling in darkness" (Journal of Discourses 5:73); "The Christian world, so-called, are heathens as to the knowledge of the salvation of God" (Journal of Discourses 8:171); "With a regard to true theology, a more ignorant people never lived than the present so-called Christian world" (Journal of Discourses 8:199); "And who is there that acknowledges [God's] hand? ...You may wander east, west, north, and south, and you cannot find it in any church or government on the earth, except the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints" (Journal of Discourses , vol. 6, p.24); "Should you ask why we differ from other Christians, as they are called, it is simply because they are not Christians as the New Testament defines Christianity" (Journal of Discourses 10:230).
 
 
 
Orson Pratt proclaimed: "Both Catholics and Protestants are nothing less than the 'whore of Babylon' whom the Lord denounces by the mouth of John the Revelator as having corrupted all the earth by their fornications and wickedness. Any person who shall be so corrupt as to receive a holy ordinance of the Gospel from the ministers of any of these apostate churches will be sent down to hell with them, unless they repent" (The Seer, p. 255).
 
 
 
Orson Pratt also said: "This great apostasy commenced about the close of the first century of the Christian era, and it has been waxing worse and worse from then until now" (Journal of Discourses
, vol.18, p.44) and: "But as there has been no Christian Church on the earth for a great many centuries past, until the present century, the people have lost sight of the pattern that God has given according to which the Christian Church should be established, and they have denominated a great variety of people Christian Churches, because they profess to be ...But there has been a long apostasy, during which the nations have been cursed with apostate churches in great abundance" (Journal of Discourses , 18:172).
 
 
President John Taylor stated: "Christianity...is a perfect pack of nonsense...the devil could not invent a better engine to spread his work than the Christianity of the nineteenth century." (Journal of Discourses , vol. 6, p.167); "Where shall we look for the true order or authority of God? It cannot be found in any nation of Christendom." (Journal of Discourses , 10:127).
 
 
 
James Talmage said: "A self-suggesting interpretation of history indicates that there has been a great departure from the way of salvation as laid down by the Savior, a universal apostasy from the Church of Christ". (A Study of the Articles of Faith, p.182).
 
 
 
President Joseph Fielding Smith said: "Doctrines were corrupted, authority lost, and a false order of religion took the place of the gospel of Jesus Christ, just as it had been the case in former dispensations, and the people were left in spiritual darkness." (Doctrines of Salvation, p.266). "For hundreds of years the world was wrapped in a veil of spiritual darkness, until there was not one fundamental truth belonging to the place of salvation ...Joseph Smith declared that in the year 1820 the Lord revealed to him that all the 'Christian' churches were in error, teaching for commandments the doctrines of men" (Doctrines of Salvation, vol. 3, p.282).
 
 
 
More recent statements by apostle Bruce McConkie are also very clear: "Apostasy was universal...And this darkness still prevails except among those who have come to a knowledge of the restored gospel" (Doctrines of Salvation, vol 3, p.265); "Thus the signs of the times include the prevailing apostate darkness in the sects of Christendom and in the religious world in general" (The Millennial Messiah, p.403); "a perverted Christianity holds sway among the so-called Christians of apostate Christendom" (Mormon Doctrine, p.132); "virtually all the millions of apostate Christendom have abased themselves before the mythical throne of a mythical Christ whom they vainly suppose to be a spirit essence who is incorporeal uncreated, immaterial and three-in-one with the Father and Holy Spirit" (Mormon Doctrine, p.269); "Gnosticism is one of the great pagan philosophies which antedated Christ and the Christian Era and which was later commingled with pure Christianity to form the apostate religion that has prevailed in the world since the early days of that era." (Mormon Doctrine, p.316).
 
 
 
President George Q. Cannon said: "After the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints was organized, there were only two churches upon the earth. They were known respectively as the Church of the Lamb of God and Babylon. The various organizations which are called churches throughout Christendom, though differing in their creeds and organizations, have one common origin. They all belong to Babylon" (Gospel Truth, p.324).
 
 
President Wilford Woodruff stated: "the Gospel of modern Christendom shuts up the Lord, and stops all communication with Him. I want nothing to do with such a Gospel, I would rather prefer the Gospel of the dark ages, so called" (Journal of Discourses , vol. 2, p.196).

129 posted on 06/21/2012 4:37:18 AM PDT by Elsie (Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going)
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To: OrangeHoof
I’m simply pointing out that the liberal media will find ways to attack Romney’s religion now that he’s the nominee.

No, Ma'am. We are NOT Liberals!

We are from your local LDS stake, and we'd like to tell you the truth about religion in America; whose Constitution is hanging by a thread.



130 posted on 06/21/2012 4:40:40 AM PDT by Elsie (Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going)
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To: Colofornian
It appears like you guys is PROPHETS!!!
131 posted on 06/21/2012 4:43:17 AM PDT by Elsie (Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going)
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To: Colofornian
Well, doubt there were many ... but once Joseph Smith had this as his founding "vision" -- a LATER generation of Mormons (in the 1870s) decided that "vision" was "scripture" on par with the Bible...put it in one of their sacred books, the Pearl of Great Price...even gave it Scripture "verses" -- verses 18-19 in Joseph Smith, History...

 
See some differences between GOD's Word and the Joseph Smith's 'translation'
 
 


Color coding explanation:
 
Added stuff... Changed stuff... Rearranged stuff... Removed stuff... 
 *(UNDERLINED stuff is the DISTRACTING reference on every tenth word or so that infuses LDS 'scripture' online.)

 
 
 
 

JOSEPH SMITH—MATTHEW
An extract from the translation of the Bible as revealed to Joseph Smith the Prophet in 1831: Matthew 23: 39 and chapter 24.
Jesus foretells the impending destruction of Jerusalem—He also discourses on the second coming of the Son of Man, and the destruction of the wicked.
1 aFor I say unto you, that ye shall not see me henceforth and know that I am he of whom it is written by the prophets, until ye shall say: Blessed is he who bcometh in the name of the Lord, in the clouds of heaven, and all the holy angels with him. Then understood his disciples that he should come again on the earth, after that he was glorified and ccrowned on the right hand of God.
2 And Jesus went out, and departed from the temple; and his disciples came to him, for to ahear him, saying: Master, show us concerning the buildings of the temple, as thou hast said—They shall be thrown down, and left unto you desolate.
3 And Jesus said unto them: See ye not all these things, and do ye not understand them? Verily I say unto you, there shall not be left here, upon this temple, one astone upon another that shall not be thrown down.
4 And Jesus left them, and went upon the Mount of Olives. And as he sat upon the Mount of Olives, the disciples came unto him privately, saying: Tell us when shall these things be which thou hast said concerning the destruction of the temple, and the Jews; and what is the asign of thy bcoming, and of the cend of the world, or the destruction of the dwicked, which is the end of the world?
5 And Jesus answered, and said unto them: Take heed that no man deceive you;
6 For many shall come in my name, saying—I am aChrist—and shall deceive many;
7 Then shall they deliver you up to be aafflicted, and shall kill you, and ye shall be bhated of all nations, for my name’s sake;
8 And then shall many be aoffended, and shall betray one another, and shall hate one another;
9 And many afalse prophets shall arise, and shall deceive many;
10 And because iniquity shall abound, the alove of many shall wax cold;
11 But he that remaineth asteadfast and is not overcome, the same shall be saved.
12 When you, therefore, shall see the aabomination of bdesolation, spoken of by Daniel the prophet, concerning the destruction of cJerusalem, then you shall stand in the dholy place; whoso readeth let him understand.
13 Then let them who are in Judea flee into the amountains;
14 Let him who is on the housetop flee, and not return to take anything out of his house;
15 Neither let him who is in the field return back to take his clothes;
16 And wo unto them that are with achild, and unto them that give suck in those days;
17 Therefore, pray ye the Lord that your flight be not in the winter, neither on the Sabbath day;
18 For then, in those days, shall be great atribulation on the bJews, and upon the inhabitants of cJerusalem, such as was not before sent upon Israel, of God, since the beginning of their kingdom until this time; no, nor ever shall be sent again upon Israel.
19 All things which have befallen them are only the beginning of the sorrows which shall come upon them.
20 And except those days should be shortened, there should none of their flesh be asaved; but for the elect’s sake, according to the bcovenant, those days shall be shortened.
21 Behold, these things I have spoken unto you concerning the Jews; and again, after the tribulation of those days which shall come upon Jerusalem, if any man shall say unto you, Lo, here is Christ, or there, believe him not;
22 For in those days there shall also arise false aChrists, and false prophets, and shall show great signs and wonders, insomuch, that, if possible, they shall deceive the very elect, who are the elect according to the covenant.
23 Behold, I speak these things unto you for the aelect’s sake; and you also shall hear of bwars, and rumors of wars; see that ye be not troubled, for all I have told you must come to pass; but the end is not yet.
24 Behold, I have told you before;
25 Wherefore, if they shall say unto you: Behold, he is in the desert; go not forth: Behold, he is in the secret chambers; believe it not;
26 For as the light of the morning cometh out of the aeast, and shineth even unto the west, and covereth the whole earth, so shall also the coming of the Son of Man be.
27 And now I show unto you a parable. Behold, wheresoever the acarcass is, there will the eagles be bgathered together; so likewise shall mine elect be gathered from the four quarters of the earth.
28 And they shall hear of wars, and rumors of wars.
29 Behold I speak for mine elect’s sake; for nation shall rise against nation, and kingdom against kingdom; there shall be afamines, and pestilences, and earthquakes, in divers places.
30 And again, because iniquity shall abound, the love of men shall wax acold; but he that shall not be overcome, the same shall be saved.
31 And again, this aGospel of the Kingdom shall be preached in all the world, for a witness unto all bnations, and then shall the end come, or the destruction of the wicked;
32 And again shall the aabomination of desolation, spoken of by Daniel the prophet, be fulfilled.
33 And immediately after the tribulation of those days, the asun shall be bdarkened, and the moon shall not give her light, and the cstars shall fall from heaven, and the powers of heaven shall be shaken.
34 Verily, I say unto you, this ageneration, in which these things shall be shown forth, shall not pass away until all I have told you shall be fulfilled.
35 Although, the days will come, that heaven and earth shall pass away; yet my awords shall not pass away, but all shall be fulfilled.
36 And, as I said before, after the atribulation of those days, and the powers of the heavens shall be shaken, then shall appear the sign of the Son of Man in heaven, and then shall all the tribes of the earth bmourn; and they shall see the cSon of Man dcoming in the clouds of heaven, with power and great glory;
37 And whoso atreasureth up my word, shall not be deceived, for the Son of Man shall bcome, and he shall send his cangels before him with the great sound of a trumpet, and they shall gather together the dremainder of his elect from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other.
38 Now learn a parable of the afig-tree—When its branches are yet tender, and it begins to put forth leaves, you know that summer is nigh at hand;
39 So likewise, mine elect, when they shall see all these things, they shall know that he is near, even at the doors;
40 But of that day, and hour, no one aknoweth; no, not the angels of God in heaven, but my Father only.
41 But as it was in the days of aNoah, so it shall be also at the coming of the Son of Man;
42 For it shall be with them, as it was in the days which were before the aflood; for until the day that Noah entered into the ark they were eating and drinking, marrying and giving in marriage;
43 And aknew not until the flood came, and took them all away; so shall also the coming of the Son of Man be.
44 Then shall be fulfilled that which is written, that in the alast days, two shall be in the field, the one shall be taken, and the other bleft;
45 Two shall be grinding at the mill, the one shall be taken, and the other left;
46 And what I say unto one, I say unto all men; awatch, therefore, for you know not at what hour your Lord doth come.
47 But know this, if the good man of the house had known in what watch the thief would come, he would have watched, and would not have suffered his house to have been broken up, but would have been ready.
48 Therefore be ye also aready, for in such an hour as ye think not, the Son of Man cometh.
49 Who, then, is a afaithful and wise servant, whom his lord hath made ruler over his household, to give them meat in due season?
50 Blessed is that aservant whom his lord, when he cometh, shall find so doing; and verily I say unto you, he shall make him ruler over all his goods.
51 But if that evil servant shall say in his heart: My lord adelayeth his coming,
52 And shall begin to smite his fellow-servants, and to eat and drink with the drunken,
53 The lord of that servant shall come in a day when he looketh not for him, and in an hour that he is not aware of,
54 And shall cut him asunder, and shall appoint him his portion with the hypocrites; there shall be weeping and agnashing of teeth.
55 And thus cometh the aend of the wicked, according to the prophecy of Moses, saying: They shall be cut off from among the people; but the end of the earth is not yet, but by and by.

KJV Matthew 23:38-39 24:1-51
39. For I say unto you, Ye shall not see me henceforth, till ye shall say, Blessed is he that cometh in the name of the Lord.

1. And Jesus went out, and departed from the temple: and his disciples came to him for to shew him the buildings of the temple.
2. And Jesus said unto them, See ye not all these things? verily I say unto you, There shall not be left here one stone upon another, that shall not be thrown down.
3. And as he sat upon the mount of Olives, the disciples came unto him privately, saying, Tell us, when shall these things be? and what shall be the sign of thy coming, and of the end of the world?
4. And Jesus answered and said unto them, Take heed that no man deceive you.
5. For many shall come in my name, saying, I am Christ; and shall deceive many.
6. And ye shall hear of wars and rumours of wars: see that ye be not troubled: for all these things must come to pass, but the end is not yet.
7. For nation shall rise against nation, and kingdom against kingdom: and there shall be famines, and pestilences, and earthquakes, in divers places.
8. All these are the beginning of sorrows.
9. Then shall they deliver you up to be afflicted, and shall kill you: and ye shall be hated of all nations for my name's sake.
10. And then shall many be offended, and shall betray one another, and shall hate one another.
11. And many false prophets shall rise, and shall deceive many.
12. And because iniquity shall abound, the love of many shall wax cold.
13. But he that shall endure unto the end, the same shall be saved.
14. And this gospel of the kingdom shall be preached in all the world for a witness unto all nations; and then shall the end come.
15. When ye therefore shall see the abomination of desolation, spoken of by Daniel the prophet, stand in the holy place, (whoso readeth, let him understand:)
16. Then let them which be in Judaea flee into the mountains:
17. Let him which is on the housetop not come down to take any thing out of his house:
18. Neither let him which is in the field return back to take his clothes.
19. And woe unto them that are with child, and to them that give suck in those days!
20. But pray ye that your flight be not in the winter, neither on the sabbath day:
21. For then shall be great tribulation, such as was not since the beginning of the world to this time, no, nor ever shall be.
22. And except those days should be shortened, there should no flesh be saved: but for the elect's sake those days shall be shortened.
23. Then if any man shall say unto you, Lo, here is Christ, or there; believe it not.
24. For there shall arise false Christs, and false prophets, and shall shew great signs and wonders; insomuch that, if it were possible, they shall deceive the very elect.
25. Behold, I have told you before.
26. Wherefore if they shall say unto you, Behold, he is in the desert; go not forth: behold, he is in the secret chambers; believe it not.
27. For as the lightning cometh out of the east, and shineth even unto the west; so shall also the coming of the Son of man be.
28. For wheresoever the carcase is, there will the eagles be gathered together.
29. Immediately after the tribulation of those days shall the sun be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light, and the stars shall fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens shall be shaken:
30. And then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven: and then shall all the tribes of the earth mourn, and they shall see the Son of man coming in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory.
31. And he shall send his angels with a great sound of a trumpet, and they shall gather together his elect from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other.
32. Now learn a parable of the fig tree; When his branch is yet tender, and putteth forth leaves, ye know that summer is nigh:
33. So likewise ye, when ye shall see all these things, know that it is near, even at the doors.
34. Verily I say unto you, This generation shall not pass, till all these things be fulfilled.
35. Heaven and earth shall pass away, but my words shall not pass away.
36. But of that day and hour knoweth no man, no, not the angels of heaven, but my Father only.
37. But as the days of Noe were, so shall also the coming of the Son of man be.
38. For as in the days that were before the flood they were eating and drinking, marrying and giving in marriage, until the day that Noe entered into the ark,

39. And knew not until the flood came, and took them all away; so shall also the coming of the Son of man be.
40. Then shall two be in the field; the one shall be taken, and the other left.
41. Two women shall be grinding at the mill; the one shall be taken, and the other left.
42. Watch therefore: for ye know not what hour your Lord doth come.
43. But know this, that if the goodman of the house had known in what watch the thief would come, he would have watched, and would not have suffered his house to be broken up.
44. Therefore be ye also ready: for in such an hour as ye think not the Son of man cometh.
45. Who then is a faithful and wise servant, whom his lord hath made ruler over his household, to give them meat in due season?
46. Blessed is that servant, whom his lord when he cometh shall find so doing.
47. Verily I say unto you, That he shall make him ruler over all his goods.
48. But and if that evil servant shall say in his heart, My lord delayeth his coming;
49. And shall begin to smite his fellowservants, and to eat and drink with the drunken;
50. The lord of that servant shall come in a day when he looketh not for him, and in an hour that he is not aware of,
51. And shall cut him asunder, and appoint him his portion with the hypocrites: there shall be weeping and gnashing of teeth.
King James Version of the Holy Bible
Public domain

132 posted on 06/21/2012 4:45:29 AM PDT by Elsie (Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going)
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To: Nervous Tick

I’ve seen ads for the LDS church for over a decade.


133 posted on 06/21/2012 4:47:07 AM PDT by AppyPappy (If you really want to annoy someone, point out something obvious that they are trying hard to ignore)
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To: BlueDragon; OrangeHoof
"...If Romney believed in magic jelly beans..."



THE FIRST BOOK OF NEPHI

HIS REIGN AND MINISTRY
CHAPTER 16
The wicked take the truth to be hard—Lehi’s sons marry the daughters of Ishmael—The Liahona guides their course in the wilderness—Messages from the Lord are written on the Liahona from time to time—Ishmael dies; his family murmur because of afflictions. Between 600 and 592 B.C.
1 And now it came to pass that after I, Nephi, had made an end of speaking to my brethren, behold they said unto me: Thou hast declared unto us hard things, more than we are able to bear.
2 And it came to pass that I said unto them that I knew that I had spoken ahard things against the wicked, according to the truth; and the righteous have I justified, and testified that they should be lifted up at the last day; wherefore, the bguilty taketh the ctruth to be hard, for it dcutteth them to the very center.
3 And now my brethren, if ye were righteous and were willing to hearken to the truth, and give heed unto it, that ye might awalk uprightly before God, then ye would not murmur because of the truth, and say: Thou speakest hard things against us.
4 And it came to pass that I, Nephi, did exhort my brethren, with all diligence, to keep the commandments of the Lord.
5 And it came to pass that they did ahumble themselves before the Lord; insomuch that I had joy and great hopes of them, that they would walk in the paths of righteousness.
6 Now, all these things were said and done as my father dwelt in a tent in the avalley which he called Lemuel.
7 And it came to pass that I, Nephi, took one of the adaughters of Ishmael to bwife; and also, my brethren took of the cdaughters of Ishmael to wife; and also dZoram took the eldest daughter of Ishmael to wife.
8 And thus my father had fulfilled all the acommandments of the Lord which had been given unto him. And also, I, Nephi, had been blessed of the Lord exceedingly.
9 And it came to passthat the voice of the Lord spake unto my father by night, and commanded him that on the morrow he should take his ajourney into the wilderness.
10 And it came to passthat as my father arose in the morning, and went forth to the tent door, to his great astonishment he beheld upon the ground a round aball of curious workmanship; and it was of fine brass. And within the ball were two spindles; and the one bpointed the way whither we should go into the wilderness.
11 And it came to passthat we did gather together whatsoever things we should carry into the wilderness, and all the remainder of our provisions which the Lord had given unto us; and we did take aseed of every kind that we might carry into the wilderness.
12 And it came to pass that we did take our tents and depart into the wilderness, across the river Laman.
13 And it came to pass that we traveled for the space of four days, nearly a south-southeast direction, and we did pitch our tents again; and we did call the name of the place aShazer.
14 And it came to pass that we did take our bows and our arrows, and go forth into the wilderness to slay food for our families; and after we had slain food for our families we did return again to our families in the wilderness, to the place of Shazer. And we did go forth again in the wilderness, following the same direction, keeping in the most fertile parts of the wilderness, which were in the borders near the aRed Sea.
15 And it came to pass that we did travel for the space of many days, aslaying food by the way, with our bows and our arrows and our stones and our slings.
16 And we did follow the adirections of the ball, which led us in the more fertile parts of the wilderness.
17 And after we had traveled for the space of many days, we did pitch our tents for the space of a time, that we might again rest ourselves and obtain food for our families.
18 And it came to pass that as I, Nephi, went forth to slay food, behold, I did break my bow, which was made of fine asteel; and after I did break my bow, behold, my brethren were angry with me because of the loss of my bow, for we did obtain no food.
19 And it came to pass that we did return without food to our families, and being much fatigued, because of their journeying, they did suffer much for the want of food.
20 And it came to pass that Laman and Lemuel and the sons of Ishmael did begin to murmur exceedingly, because of their sufferings and afflictions in the wilderness; and also my father began to murmur against the Lord his God; yea, and they were all exceedingly sorrowful, even that they did amurmur against the Lord.
21 And it came to pass that I, Nephi, having been afflicted with my brethren because of the loss of my bow, and their bows having lost their asprings, it began to be exceedingly difficult, yea, insomuch that we could obtain no food.
22 And it came to pass I, Nephi, did speak much unto my brethren, because they had hardened their hearts again, even unto acomplaining against the Lord their God.
23 And it came to pass I, Nephi, did amake out of wood a bow, and out of a straight stick, an arrow; wherefore, I did arm myself with a bow and an arrow, with a sling and with stones. And I said unto my bfather: Whither shall I go to obtain food?
24 And it came to pass that he did ainquire of the Lord, for they had bhumbled themselves because of my words; for I did say many things unto them in the energy of my soul.
25 And it came to pass that the voice of the Lord came unto my father; and he was truly achastened because of his murmuring against the Lord, insomuch that he was brought down into the depths of sorrow.
26 And it came to pass that the voice of the Lord said unto him: Look upon the ball, and behold the things which are written.
27 And it came to pass that when my father beheld the things which were awritten upon the ball, he did fear and tremble exceedingly, and also my brethren and the sons of Ishmael and our wives.
28 And it came to pass that I, Nephi, beheld the pointers which were in the ball, that they did work according to the afaith and diligence and heed which we did give unto them.
29 And there was also written upon them a new writing, which was plain to be read, which did give us aunderstanding concerning the ways of the Lord; and it was written and changed from time to time, according to the faith and diligence which we gave unto it. And thus we see that by bsmall means the Lord can bring about great things.
30 And it came to pass that I, Nephi, did go forth up into the top of the mountain, according to the adirections which were given upon the ball.
31 And it came to pass that I did slay wild abeasts, insomuch that I did obtain food for our families.
32 And it came to pass that I did return to our tents, bearing the beasts which I had slain; and now when they beheld that I had obtained afood, how great was their joy! And it came to pass that they did humble themselves before the Lord, and did give thanks unto him.
33 And it came to pass that we did again take our journey, traveling nearly the same course as in the beginning; and after we had traveled for the space of many days we did pitch our tents again, that we might tarry for the space of a time.
34 And it came to pass that aIshmael died, and was buried in the place which was called bNahom.
35 And it came to pass that the daughters of Ishmael did amourn exceedingly, because of the loss of their father, and because of their bafflictions in the wilderness; and they did cmurmur against my father, because he had brought them out of the land of Jerusalem, saying: Our father is dead; yea, and we have wandered much in the wilderness, and we have suffered much affliction, hunger, thirst, and fatigue; and after all these sufferings we must perish in the wilderness with hunger.
36 And thus they did murmur against my father, and also against me; and they were desirous to areturn again to Jerusalem.
37 And Laman said unto Lemuel and also unto the sons of Ishmael: Behold, let us aslay our father, and also our brother Nephi, who has taken it upon him to be our bruler and our teacher, who are his elder brethren.
38 Now, he says that the Lord has talked with him, and also that aangels have ministered unto him. But behold, we know that he lies unto us; and he tells us these things, and he worketh many things by his cunning arts, that he may deceive our eyes, thinking, perhaps, that he may lead us away into some strange wilderness; and after he has led us away, he has thought to make himself a king and a ruler over us, that he may do with us according to his will and pleasure. And after this manner did my brother Laman bstir up their hearts to canger.
39 And it came to pass that the Lord was with us, yea, even the voice of the Lord came and did speak many words unto them, and did achasten them exceedingly; and after they were chastened by the voice of the Lord they did turn away their anger, and did repent of their sins, insomuch that the Lord did bless us again with food, that we did not perish.
 

134 posted on 06/21/2012 4:47:16 AM PDT by Elsie (Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going)
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To: BlueDragon; OrangeHoof
 

If you have cable TV, there won’t be much on to watch.


 

 

 

 

If there isn’t much on to watch, you will answer your door whenever someone rings.


 

 

 

 

If you open your door, you will see mormons.


 

 

 

 

If you talk to mormons, they will trick you into “praying about whether something is true”.


 

 

 

 

If you rely on your feelings, you may become a mormon.


 

 

 

 

If you become a mormon, you will have to wear magic underwear!


 

 

 

 

If you wear magic underwear, people will immediately label you as a cultist.


DON’T be a cultist!
Get DirectTV.


135 posted on 06/21/2012 4:47:51 AM PDT by Elsie (Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going)
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To: reaganaut
The best way to get the LDS out, is to get them to read the Bible without the LDS footnotes and chapter headings.

Heck; can you even do that with a BoM???



(It's worse online: LDS.ORG)

136 posted on 06/21/2012 4:50:07 AM PDT by Elsie (Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going)
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To: 5thGenTexan
Take a deep, cleansing breath - I am one of the evil "won't pull the level for Romney crowd"...

Good!!

Now tell all you can!

137 posted on 06/21/2012 4:52:11 AM PDT by Elsie (Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going)
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To: jimt; Invincibly Ignorant
I see rhe only some of the usual suspects are here for today's THREE MINUTES' HATE.


We'll have you know know we spend MANY times more than a mere 3 minutes daily; spreading the TRUTH through out America and the World!

An average tour of duty is about a year: 6 days a week - 10 hours a day.

What flimsy '3 minutes' can stand THAT onslaught?



138 posted on 06/21/2012 4:58:05 AM PDT by Elsie (Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going)
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To: jimt; Invincibly Ignorant

 



 
Eerily familiar...
 
 

Party ownership of the print media
made it easy to manipulate public opinion,
and the film and radio carried the process further.


 



16. Ministry Of Truth

.......

The Ministry of Truth, Winston's place of work, contained, it was said, three thousand rooms above ground level, and corresponding ramifications below.

The Ministry of Truth concerned itself with Lies. Party ownership of the print media made it easy to manipulate public opinion, and the film and radio carried the process further.

The primary job of the Ministry of Truth was to supply the citizens of Oceania with newspapers, films, textbooks, telescreen programmes, plays, novels - with every conceivable kind of information, instruction, or entertainment, from a statue to a slogan, from a lyric poem to a biological treatise, and from a child's spelling-book to a Newspeak dictionary.

Winston worked in the RECORDS DEPARTMENT (a single branch of the Ministry of Truth) editing and writing for The Times. He dictated into a machine called a speakwrite. Winston would receive articles or news-items which for one reason or another it was thought necessary to alter, or, in Newspeak, rectify. If, for example, the Ministry of Plenty forecast a surplus, and in reality the result was grossly less, Winston's job was to change previous versions so the old version would agree with the new one. This process of continuous alteration was applied not only to newspapers, but to books, periodicals, pamphlets, posters, leaflets, films, sound-tracks, cartoons, photographs - to every kind of literature or documentation which might conceivably hold any political or ideological significance.

When his day's work started, Winston pulled the speakwrite towards him, blew the dust from its mouthpiece, and put on his spectacles. He dialed 'back numbers' on the telescreen and called for the appropriate issues of The Times, which slid out of the pneumatic tube after only a few minutes' delay. The messages he had received referred to articles or news-items which for one reason or another it was thought necessary to rectify.

In the walls of the cubicle there were three orifices. To the right of the speakwrite, a small pneumatic tube for written messages; to the left, a larger one for newspapers; and on the side wall, within easy reach of Winston's arm, a large oblong slit protected by a wire grating. This last was for the disposal of waste paper. Similar slits existed in thousands or tens of thousands throughout the building, not only in every room but at short intervals in every corridor. For some reason they were nicknamed memory holes. When one knew that any document was due for destruction, or even when one saw a scrap of waste paper lying about, it was an automatic action to lift the flap of the nearest memory hole and drop it in, whereupon it would be whirled away on a current of warm air to the enormous furnaces which were hidden somewhere in the recesses of the building.

As soon as Winston had dealt with each of the messages, he clipped his speakwritten corrections to the appropriate copy of The Times and pushed them into the pneumatic tube. Then, with a movement which was as nearly as possible unconscious, he crumpled up the original message and any notes that he himself had made, and dropped them into the memory hole to be devoured by the flames.

What happened in the unseen labyrinth to which the tubes led, he did not know in detail, but he did know in general terms. As soon as all the corrections which happened to be necessary in any particular number of The Times had been assembled and collated, that number would be reprinted, the original copy destroyed, and the corrected copy placed on the files in its stead.

In the cubicle next to him the little woman with sandy hair toiled day in day out, simply at tracking down and deleting from the Press the names of people who had been vaporized and were therefore considered never to have existed. And this hall, with its fifty workers or thereabouts, was only one-sub-section, a single cell, as it were, in the huge complexity of the Records Department. Beyond, above, below, were other swarms of workers engaged in an unimaginable multitude of jobs.

There were huge printing-shops and their sub editors, their typography experts, and their elaborately equipped studios for the faking of photographs. There was the tele-programmes section with its engineers, its producers and its teams of actors specially chosen for their skill in imitating voices; clerks whose job was simply to draw up lists of books and periodicals which were due for recall; vast repositories where the corrected documents were stored; and the hidden furnaces where the original copies were destroyed.

And somewhere or other, quite anonymous, there were the directing brains who co-ordinated the whole effort and laid down the lines of policy which made it necessary that this fragment of the past should be preserved, that one falsified, and the other rubbed out of existence.

 
 


139 posted on 06/21/2012 4:58:58 AM PDT by Elsie (Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going)
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To: jimt
It's missing the usual corrosive bile and canned, pre-written posts.

Son; ya gotta give us TIME; for there are ONLY around a 100 or so of us - give or take - depending on who's counting...


Mr. Millet:
 
I don't think we can ever transcend Joseph Smith or consider him to be a valued personality, but now we'll move on.
I don't think you'll see that among believers in the faith, because there are too many other things that came from him
that are the reasons why we do what we do and we are what we are. That there are unanswered questions, to be sure.
That there are things that I'm as anxious as the next guy to learn more detail on, I really want to know. But in the interim,
 it really doesn't, doesn't trouble me.
We're in the religion-making business, as you intimated earlier, only for a short time, I mean, compared to the
Christian church, which has been at this for a couple of millennia. We're about halfway to Nicaea.
And so, and so in that sense — I remember a very tender moment. I was speaking with — I've been invited
to the Salt Lake Theological Seminary, basically an Evangelical seminary, to discuss a book I had done on Jesus.
And they had read it, and they wanted me to come and just respond to questions.
And it was, it was a very enjoyable couple of hours.
 
The very last question that was asked by one of my friends there was this one.
 
He said, 'Bob, what can we do for you?'
 
And I, I wasn't ready for that question. I said, 'What do you mean?'
 
He said, 'What can we, as Evangelicals, do for our Mormon friends?'
 
And I, I guess my mind could have gone a hundred different ways, but what I came back with was this.
 
I said, 'Boy, I appreciate you asking that. I don't think I've ever been asked that.'
 
But, but I said, 'Try this. Cut us a little slack, will you? Give us a little time.
We're in the religion-making business, and this takes time. It takes centuries.
 
And, and trying to explain the faith and articulate the faith, that doesn't come over night.
We've really only been about that for 20 or 30 years.'
 
 
http://being.publicradio.org/programs/insidemormonfaith/transcript.shtml

140 posted on 06/21/2012 5:00:55 AM PDT by Elsie (Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going)
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To: seenenuf
Religion in politics is so 13th Century.

And 14th and 15th and 16th and 17th and 18th and 19th and 20th and 21st and...

141 posted on 06/21/2012 5:03:26 AM PDT by Elsie (Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going)
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To: AppyPappy; MHGinTN

>> I’ve seen ads for the LDS church for over a decade

OK. Thanks for the insight.

Guess they didn’t play in my area... or I wasn’t paying attention.


142 posted on 06/21/2012 5:04:00 AM PDT by Nervous Tick (Trust in God, but row away from the rocks!)
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To: seenenuf
I pray that those who declare an inability to vote for a Mormon soon realize that they may be speeding up Sharia law.

I pray that those who choose to vote for a Mormon soon realize that they may be speeding up polygamy again in America.

143 posted on 06/21/2012 5:04:36 AM PDT by Elsie (Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going)
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To: seenenuf
Did SOMEone say 'Sharia' and 'MORMON' in the SAME post???


“I Will Be a Second Mohammed”

In the heat of the Missouri “Mormon War” of 1838, Joseph Smith made the following claim, “I will be to this generation a second Mohammed, whose motto in treating for peace was ‘the Alcoran [Koran] or the Sword.’ So shall it eventually be with us—‘Joseph Smith or the Sword!’ ”[1]

It is most interesting that a self-proclaimed Christian prophet would liken himself to Mohammed, the founder of Islam. His own comparison invites us to take a closer look as well. And when we do, we find some striking—and troubling—parallels. Consider the following.

  • Mohammed and Joseph Smith both had humble beginnings. Neither had formal religious connections or upbringing, and both were relatively uneducated. Both founded new religions by creating their own scriptures. In fact, followers of both prophets claim these scriptures are miracles since their authors were the most simple and uneducated of men.[2]

  • Both prophets claim of having angel visitations, and of receiving divine revelation to restore pure religion to the earth again. Mohammed was told that both Jews and Christians had long since corrupted their scriptures and religion. In like manner, Joseph Smith was told that all of Christianity had become corrupt, and that consequently the Bible itself was no longer reliable. In both cases, this corruption required a complete restoration of both scripture and religion. Nothing which preceded either prophet could be relied upon any longer. Both prophets claim they were used of God to restore eternal truths which once existed on earth, but had been lost due to human corruption.

  • Both prophets created new scripture which borrowed heavily from the Bible, but with a substantially new “spin.” In his Koran, Mohammed appropriates a number of Biblical themes and characters—but he changes the complete sense of many passages, claiming to “correct” the Bible. In so doing he changes many doctrines, introducing his own in their place. In like manner, Joseph Smith created the Book of Mormon, much of which is plagiarized directly from the King James Bible. Interestingly, the Book of Mormon claims that this same Bible has been substantially corrupted and is therefore unreliable. In addition, Joseph Smith went so far as to actually create his own version of the Bible itself, the “Inspired Version,” in which he both adds and deletes significant portions of text, claiming he is “correcting” it. In so doing he also changes many doctrines, introducing his own in their place.

  • As a part of their new scriptural “spin,” both prophets saw themselves as prophesied in scripture, and both saw themselves as a continuation of a long line of Biblical prophets. Mohammed saw himself as a continuation of the ministry of Moses and Jesus. Joseph Smith saw himself as a successor to Enoch, Melchizedek, Joseph and Moses. Joseph Smith actually wrote himself into his own version of the Bible—by name.

  • Both prophets held up their own scripture as superior to the Bible. Mohammed claimed that the Koran was a perfect copy of the original which was in heaven. The Koran is therefore held to be absolutely perfect, far superior to the Bible and superceding it. In like manner, Joseph Smith also made the following claim. “I told the Brethren that the Book of Mormon was the most correct of any book on earth, and the keystone of our religion, and a man would get nearer to God by abiding its precepts, than by any other book.”[3]

  • Despite their claim that the Bible was corrupt, both prophets admonished their followers to adhere to its teachings. An obvious contradiction, this led to selective acceptance of some portions and wholesale rejection of others. As a result, the Bible is accepted by both groups of followers only to the extent that it agrees with their prophet’s own superior revelation.

  • Both Mohammed and Joseph Smith taught that true salvation was to be found only in their respective religions. Those who would not accept their message were considered “infidels,” pagans or Gentiles. In so doing, both prophets became the enemy of genuine Christianity, and have led many people away from the Christ of the Bible.

  • Both prophets encountered fierce opposition to their new religions and had to flee from town to town because of threats on their lives. Both retaliated to this opposition by forming their own militias. Both ultimately set up their own towns as model societies.

  • Both Mohammed and Joseph Smith left unclear instructions about their successors. The majority of Mohammed’s followers, Sunni Muslims, believe they were to elect their new leader, whereas the minority, Shiite Muslims, look to Alī ibn Abī Ṭālib, whom they consider Divinely appointed, as the rightful successor to Muhammad, and the first imam. (Ali was the cousin and son-in-law of the Islamic prophet Muhammad). Similarly, the majority of Joseph Smith's followers, Mormons, believed their next prophet should have been the existing leader of their quorum of twelve apostles, whereas the minority, RLDS, believed Joseph Smith's own son should have been their next prophet. Differences on this issue, and many others, have created substantial tension between these rival groups of each prophet.

  • Mohammed taught that Jesus was just another of a long line of human prophets, of which he was the last. He taught that he was superior to Christ and superceded Him. In comparison, Joseph Smith also made the following claim.

“I have more to boast of than ever any man had. I am the only man that has ever been able to keep a whole church together since the days of Adam. A large majority of the whole have stood by me. Neither Paul, John, Peter, nor Jesus ever did it. I boast that no man ever did such a work as I. The followers of Jesus ran away from Him, but the Latter-day Saints never ran away from me yet.”[4] In light of these parallels, perhaps Joseph Smith's claim to be a second Mohammed unwittingly became his most genuine prophecy of all.


[1] Joseph Smith made this statement at the conclusion of a speech in the public square at Far West, Missouri on October 14, 1838. This particular quote is documented in Fawn M. Brodie, No Man Knows My History, second edition, (New York: Alfred A. Knopf, 1971), p. 230–231. Fawn Brodie’s footnote regarding this speech contains valuable information, and follows. “Except where noted, all the details of this chapter [16] are taken from the History of the [Mormon] Church. This speech, however, was not recorded there, and the report given here is based upon the accounts of seven men. See the affidavits of T.B. Marsh, Orson Hyde, George M. Hinkle, John Corrill, W.W. Phelps, Samson Avard, and Reed Peck in Correspondence, Orders, etc., pp. 57–9, 97–129. The Marsh and Hyde account, which was made on October 24, is particularly important. Part of it was reproduced in History of the [Mormon] Church, Vol. III, p. 167. See also the Peck manuscript, p. 80. Joseph himself barely mentioned the speech in his history; see Vol. III, p. 162.”

[2] John Ankerberg & John Weldon, The Facts on Islam, (Eugene, OR: Harvest House Publishers, 1998), pp.8–9. Eric Johnson, Joseph Smith & Muhammed, (El Cajon, CA: Mormonism Research Ministry, 1998), pp. 6–7.

[3] Documentary History of the [Mormon] Church, vol.4, pp.461.

[4] Documentary History of the [Mormon] Church, vol.6, pp.408–409.




144 posted on 06/21/2012 5:06:01 AM PDT by Elsie (Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going)
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To: SaraJohnson
How many Mormons ran for President before Romney...NONE.

Sorry; you must have been absent the day this was discussed in American History class.

Try ONE.




...the presidential campaign of Mormon Church founder Joseph Smith in 1844: “Challenging Democrat James Polk and Whig Henry Clay, Smith prophesied that if the U.S. Congress did not accede to his demands that ‘they shall be broken up as a government and God shall damn them.’

Smith viewed capturing the presidency as part of the mission of the church.

145 posted on 06/21/2012 5:08:35 AM PDT by Elsie (Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going)
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To: SaraJohnson
How many Mormons ran for President before Romney...NONE.

HUNTSMAN ran at the same time as Romney.

146 posted on 06/21/2012 5:09:42 AM PDT by Elsie (Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going)
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To: old school
But, how does that alter the fact Mitt Romney will be the next POTUS?

We appear to have anOTHER prophet amoung us!

Quick!! Got any stock tips?

147 posted on 06/21/2012 5:11:51 AM PDT by Elsie (Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going)
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To: muawiyah
Hypocrisy is an issue for the Moslems and the leftwingtards. The Prophet said "kill the hypocrites".

It seems to have no boundaries...


THE
DOCTRINE AND COVENANTS
OF THE CHURCH OF JESUS CHRIST OF LATTER-DAY SAINTS
SECTION 132
51–57, Emma Smith is counseled (commanded) to be faithful and true; 58–66, Laws governing the plurality of wives are set forth.
51 Verily, I say unto you: A commandment I give unto mine handmaid, Emma Smith, your wife, whom I have given unto you, that she stay herself and partake not of that which I commanded you to offer unto her; for I did it, saith the Lord, to aprove you all, as I did Abraham, and that I might require an offering at your hand, by covenant and sacrifice.
52 And let mine handmaid, Emma Smith, areceive all those that have been given unto my servant Joseph, and who are virtuous and pure before me; and those who are not pure, and have said they were pure, shall be destroyed, saith the Lord God.
53 For I am the Lord thy God, and ye shall obey my voice; and I give unto my servant Joseph that he shall be made ruler over many things; for he hath been afaithful over a few things, and from henceforth I will strengthen him.
54 And I command mine handmaid, Emma Smith, to abide and acleave unto my servant Joseph, and to none else. But if she will not abide this commandment she shall be bdestroyed, saith the Lord; for I am the Lord thy God, and will destroy her if she abide not in my law.
55 But if she will not abide this commandment, then shall my servant Joseph do all things for her, even as he hath said; and I will bless him and multiply him and give unto him an ahundredfold in this world, of fathers and mothers, brothers and sisters, houses and lands, wives and children, and crowns of beternal lives in the eternal worlds.
56 And again, verily I say, let mine handmaid aforgive my servant Joseph his trespasses; and then shall she be forgiven her trespasses, wherein she has trespassed against me; and I, the Lord thy God, will bless her, and multiply her, and make her heart to brejoice.
 
 

Whatever HAPPENED to Emma???
 
Eliza was a devout Mormon.
 
At age 38, she became Joseph Smith's 14th plural wife (in addition to Smith's lawful wife, Emma).
 
In 1842, after learning Eliza was pregnant, Emma Smith beat Eliza with a broomstick and
knocked her down a flight of stairs, causing Eliza to miscarry Smith's baby.
Wow!!
 
I guess ol' Emma got VAPORIZED by GOD!!!
 
We know that multiply him thing sure didn't work out!          
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Children_of_Joseph_Smith,_Jr.

148 posted on 06/21/2012 5:13:29 AM PDT by Elsie (Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going)
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To: svcw
You keep making the charge, without evidence.


Office of First President & Living Prophet®:

April 1st, 2012

URGENT!

Fellow MORMON Freeper Christians!!
 
Due to the charges being leveled at our pesky opponents of "Out Of Context" comments; we have been challenged repeatedly to then post the TRUTH IN context! How dumb do they think we ARE??
 
We do not have to spend time refuting the facts against MORMONism; we get LOTS more mileage out of claiming the Christians are in error, then backing away and watch them sputter.
 
So, bottom line, stay aWAY from defending our faith, as it is a vain effort.
Stick to CONSERVATISM (you can even rag on Mitt, if you want - it makes your message seem more authentic that way.)
 
As always, Tommy M.

 

149 posted on 06/21/2012 5:19:41 AM PDT by Elsie (Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going)
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To: Elsie

Ooops!

Due to the charges being leveled at our pesky opponents of “Out Of Context” comments; we have been challenged repeatedly to then post the TRUTH IN context! How dumb do they think we ARE??

We do not have to spend time refuting the facts against MORMONism; we get LOTS more mileage out of claiming the Christians are in error, then backing away and watch them sputter.

So, bottom line, stay aWAY from defending our faith, as it is a vain effort.

Stick to CONSERVATISM (you can even rag on Mitt, if you want - it makes your message seem more authentic that way.)


150 posted on 06/21/2012 5:27:16 AM PDT by Elsie (Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going)
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