Skip to comments.James Carville: Romney’s Mormon religion still a problem [Mitt silent on bishop, gov roles]
Posted on 07/08/2012 8:01:01 AM PDT by Colofornian
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I don’t blame you. I am ashamed of what my country and countrymen have become. But you of all people must know what happens when people abandon their beliefs to have the govt. act like Santa.
We have no choice. We have this one remaining hill. We can defend it or abandon it by voting for our own destruction.
From the comments I have seen from RYam lately, he is anything but a ‘true conservative’.
True conservatives do not support those who are pro abortion, pro gay marriage and pro mandate.
The GOP has proven they don’t care about this country by throwing up Mitt in an election that we should have been able to win easily.
I am Conservative enough to understand that there will be no magic moment at the convention when Newt waddles in and the crowd goes wild and babies get thrown in the air. Sadily I did not support Ronmey and do not agree with his moderate ideas. However I don’t live in California where it realy doesn’t matter if you decide to not select Mitt. Kalifornia will go Obama by such a large margin you have the freedom to stick with your principles. Simply Mitt is a better option than Obama. However while Texas has a strong republican party, Holder is blocking our efforts to stop illegals from voting, thus I vote against Obama while praying that Rand Paul announces the day after the election that he is running in 2016. Four more years of Obama is too much for this nation to take. There is no other logical choice. Mitt is bad, Obama is a disaster. A Pox on the whole damn thing. I fear 2008 will come back to haunt us again.
“Where do I go now?....... Im so damn angry.”
There will be medical health centers at places like the Caiman Islands. Seriously.
Things will change back here though. Dynamically, I think. With or without the involvement, relvance or continuity of the Washington government, which may well go the way of the Politburo before this is done.
The truth is Romney is a liberal in republican clothing. I'm faced with the reality of voting for a man that is nothing more than a lighter version of Obama.
Honestly, I'm just beside myself. I'm so livid at Roberts... I was ready to pack my bags that night.
I don't know what to do. I want to fight but at who or at what? My faith was shaken, in this country and at God.
I think I need to go away and think about it for a while.
The only thing we ‘can’ do is what we believe is right. Not what screaming people on the internet think, but what WE think. Follow what you know to be right and you’ll never go wrong.
I feel every bit as helpless as you do. Believe me. But I refuse to let the GOP or Obama or anyone else strip me of my integrity. I will not help them destroy me, my country and the people I care about. If they do it, they will do it without my help.
That’s all anyone of us can do.
RY: There are many FReepers who continue to embrace reason and truth-seeking.
DB: The truth is Romney is a liberal in republican clothing. I’m faced with the reality of voting for a man that is nothing more than a lighter version of Obama.
I’ve really had to soul search lately. There is much to detest about Romney’s record, which is in fact to the left of Bill Clinton’s. Set against this is the disaster on stilts which is Obama. The deal killer boils down to the fact that Romney is nonchalantly culture of death, every bit as much as the equally alienated and fringe Obama.
“We will hold Mitt’s feet to the fire.”
Really? When? After he has won? When he needs you less than ever?
No, do it now.
I want to hear him say abortion is unequivocally wrong, and that he was wrong when he was quoting ‘mom’s’ authority to support it. I want to hear him say that coercive mandates to purchase anything are wrong, and that he will seek the utter and absolute abolition of “Affordable Health Care”. If he did these things, I would actually vote for this bloody handed and wrong headed liberal opportunist.
If he cannot even say these things when it matters most to him, I cannot believe he will DO these things when he has already cashed in his votes.
Unlike many here, I do think he will win. Sadly, he will perpetuate the increased totalitarian reach of the Washington government, and the decline of American liberties and sovereignty.
At the end of the day, I think this was a rare moment of utter candor from Willard Mitt Romney:
Apathy works two ways with regard to this empty man.
Originally I said I would vote for a banana slug over obama, and meant it.
I my wildest nightmares, did I beleive the Republican Party would chose a liberal like Romney (even more liberal and anti-Conservative than McCain) to be the potential nominee.
I gagged when I cast my vote for Palin because McCain made me ill.
I will not ever do that again, not ever.
We are here because conservatives voted people like McCain into office just hoping the next guy would be a real conservative, all that has happened is each candidate will become even more liberal.
I guess that THIS mattereth not to you also!
“My faith was shaken, in this country and at God.”
God already has a chosen nation, and it is not the United States. See Psalm 2 for perspective on the fate of ALL corrupted nations.
You breath, you feel passion, you think because of the faithfulness of God. Don’t blame Him for some pygmy grunts from a blasphemously titled “Chief Justice” of a “Supreme Court”. The hubris in those titles underscores the corruption at the root.
I would rephrase part of this. Romney won't win because of skill. He will win because Zero seems to have a wish to lose. Time will tell how much his cultic background turns off voters.
RINOmney is campaigning exactly like Dewey - playing it safe, trying not to say anything wrong or raise anything controversial. Loser mentality. Loser candidate. No big ideas. No vision. No differences with Zero.
In his favor is Zero, who is no Harry Truman. Whose campaign seems to be about special favors, special groups and government handouts. It may be enough. Time will tell.
All that said, RINOmney will compete with no help from me, financially or otherwise. He doesn't represent any of my conservative convictions and violates my conscience. Others will make a different choice and justify it in their own hearts. I'm fine with that. Nor do I care what anyone else thinks I should do or not do. My vote isn't their's to cast.
After this election, I will change my registration to independent. With Reagan, "I'll say, I didn't leave my party, they left me."
You are probably thinking of the Goldwater and the America of the 1980s and 1990s. Goldwater didn't "give away" the social conservative vote in 1964. In fact there really wasn't a "social conservative vote" to win or lose then -- before abortion and homosexuality and drugs and busing became issues.
As it was Goldwater campaigned on the social issues of his day -- crime and school prayer. Like it or not, civil rights was considered a "social issue" back then and a lot of people voted for Goldwater because of his stand -- which lost him far more votes than it gained him. Nobody voted against Barry Goldwater because his wife believed in birth control. It wasn't an issue.
If any Republican nominee was outside or against the party establishment (which really existed back then) it was Goldwater -- more so even than Reagan -- and Goldwater lost big. Anybody who knows anything about that campaign knows about the bitterness of the Goldwater-Rockefeller animosity.
Nixon is almost a special case since he later on won two times, but in his first race he was the GOP-e (liberal lite) candidate against the more Conservative Democrat JFK.
There weren't many real issues in 1960. Kennedy campaigned on a non-existent "missile gap" to get to the right of Nixon, but anybody who knew politics knew Nixon was not more liberal than Kennedy. Galbraith and Schlesinger and the other Harvard professors knew that. Nowadays, people make out that Kennedy's tax cuts made him conservative, but cutting taxes without cutting spending wasn't considered a conservative practice at the time.
Dole and McCain failed to come to grips with the demographic realities of today's Republican party and gave too much head to the GOP-e.
What about the economic realities in the country at the time? Nobody was going to beat Clinton with Perot in the race, and no Republican was going to succeed Bush -- not after the economy tanked. If there had been a strong conservative candidate maybe that candidate would have beaten Dole or McCain for the nomination, but that candidate didn't exist.
When I say "a strong conservative candidate" I mean someone who had wide, crossover appeal, somebody who didn't only appeal to true believers. There wasn't such a candidate and there was no guarantee that such a candidate could have won, given the state of the economy in 1996 or 2008.
When the tired old guy wins the nomination, it's a good sign that nobody sees a more electable alternative out there. A tired, but more conservative candidate wouldn't have been able to pull it off in either election.
In fact, McCain hired on all of Romney's backstabbers and that pretty much nullified any social Conservative leverage he'd gained with Sarah Palin on the ticket.
Like McCain didn't have plenty of staffers of his own? Like McCain needed Romneyites to make himself liberal? Like -- in the widely circulated myth -- McCain needed Romney staffers to badmouth Palin? Like his own loyalists didn't have it in for her? Like Axelrod and Plouffe needed Romneyites to make attacks on Palin for them? Got any more myths?
Palin won McCain some votes and lost him some votes. Possibly on balance she won him more votes than she lost him, but no way was she going to win him enough votes to take the election.
Roosevelt was a sick man and his campaign ran through Willkie like (p..p) through a goose!
Roosevelt wasn't that sick in 1940, but let that go. Blame the Germans and the French. After Hitler crushed France, Americans didn't want to pick a new guy who'd have to go through on the job training.
A NOTE: I've noticed almost none of the Mittbots are unwilling to discuss Willkie.
My point is that all politicians disappoint. All ideologies have their problems. Pretending that there's some ideal candidate with some ideal ideology who could win, when such a candidate doesn't appear is living in a fantasy world. We have elections between candidates who actually exist and manage to prevail in the primary process. Candidates who don't exist or don't win in the primaries aren't going to come out on top in the general election.
“We are here because conservatives voted people like McCain into office just hoping the next guy would be a real conservative, all that has happened is each candidate will become even more liberal.”
You, I and others have come to the realization that ‘next time’ will never happen. Because ‘this time’ is next time’ from 4 years ago. And that time was ‘next time’ 4 years prior to that. and so on back to Reagan. And before him as well for a number of elections. He was a fluke in GOP politics.
Since this is a historical, documented fact, a conservative voter has no reason to expect or believe that ‘next time’ will ever come.
Choose The Prophet!!!
1. The prophet is the only man who speaks for the Lord in everything.
2. The living prophet is more vital to us than the standard works.
3. The living prophet is more important to us than a dead prophet.
4. The prophet will never lead the church astray.
5. The prophet is not required to have any particular earthly training or credentials to speak on any subject or act on any matter at any time.
6. The prophet does not have to say Thus Saith the Lord, to give us scripture.
7. The prophet tells us what we need to know, not always what we want to know.
8. The prophet is not limited by mens reasoning.
9. The prophet can receive revelation on any matter, temporal or spiritual.
10. The prophet may advise on civic matters.
11. The two groups who have the greatest difficulty in following the prophet are the proud who are learned and the proud who are rich.
12. The prophet will not necessarily be popular with the world or the worldly.
13. The prophet and his counselors make up the First Presidencythe highest quorum in the Church.
14. The prophet and the presidencythe living prophet and the First Presidencyfollow them and be blessedreject them and suffer.
I testify that these fourteen fundamentals in following the living prophet are true. If we want to know how well we stand with the Lord then let us ask ourselves how well we stand with His mortal captainhow close do our lives harmonize with the Lords anointedthe living ProphetPresident of the Church, and with the Quorum of the First Presidency.
Ezra Taft Benson
(Address given Tuesday, February 26, 1980 at Brigham Young University) http://www.lds.org/liahona/1981/06/fourteen-fundamentals-in-following-the-prophet?lang=eng
Add one more into the Religious Bigot Club.
No one is embracing leftists talking points, conservatives have been attacking the liberal Massachusetts Governor for decades, from the right, not from the left.
"America's premier conservative web forum" has been fighting the failed liberal Governor for many years, I don't see the left taking up our attacks on his pro-abortion politics, his anti-gun politics, his anti-military, pro-homosexual agenda and so on.
It don't take a rocket surgeon to figger it out!
Exactly. And, that was my point in post 88.
People need to understand that when Californians like rogue yam state that they're going to vote for Romney, you have to assume that they're voting for Romney and not merely voting against Obama because they know that their votes for Romney will not and cannot harm Obama's electoral chances. These folks are voting their principles; their votes for Romney are fully consistent with their philosophical views. Voting for Romney presents no conflict for them. They seem immune to any appeal to conscience by conservatives because they are in fact immune to any such appeal.
We must accept that there are many Republicans who look to Mitt Romney for leadership and they are fully prepared to enthusiastically follow him.
Modern MORMONism snuggles up to ISLAM just slightly differently...
Interesting to see the actual ANTI-christian supporters in this thread. The DEMONIC deception dimwits are in full blinder mode.
When Goldwater ran, abortion, homosexuality (even welfare was not) where non issues, so what is it you mean by social issues?
Why would anyone discuss Willkie, I am really confident he is not running.
Sit back down.
He's either a
DECIEVED Mormon, or a
I believe MORMON lies!
No, Jimmy. Mitt’s biggest problem is not that he’s a Mormon. Mitt’s biggest problem is that he’s a lame candidate. Now, whether Mormon teaching is a primary contributor to his lameness is a proposition we can argue. Personally, I think Mitt would be a lame candidate whatever religion he was in. He’s just a lame kind of guy. And let all the church say “Amen!” and “Amen!”
I've slept thru two MORE conventions!!
After this election, I will change my registration to independent. With Reagan, “I’ll say, I didn’t leave my party, they left me.”
I will wait for the convention results. If things shape up as they appear to be headed, I too will change my registration, after more than 30 years of solid Republican support.
I hear directly from them every day.
IF my people; who are called by my name...
IF my people; who are called by my name...
As usual, our last resort when it should have been our first.
“I will wait for the convention results. If things shape up as they appear to be headed, I too will change my registration, after more than 30 years of solid Republican support.”
I’ve done it all since Ford’s race. Grunt work, giving, yard signs, recruiting others, etc. Done with RINOs for good. I will continue to vote for conservatives - the only standard from now on.
Ford - RINO
Bush I - nice guy, RINO
Dole - RINO
McCain - RINO
RINOmney - Liberal, pro-gay, pro-abortion, pro-mandate, RINO Cultist. Now, it’s not enough for the GOPE to oppose my political and moral views, they are pushing a guy who opposes my God and Savior. No more.
Isn't that what anyone who brings up the religion of a politician is engaging in?
I didn't bring it up.
SIN is a reproach to ANY Nation...
Are you still killing your unborn?
I hear you. So down right now, but it is truth.
Religion is part of who a candidate is, so why not talk about it.
54,000,000 by recent estimate. That is Stalin and Mao territory.
There are more than a few who call themselves conservative, who silently agree with Margaret Sanger. Nevertheless, tophets then, or clinics now, the remnant will not go to or remain in such abattoirs.
No, it's not that. I've seen so many good people either die or suffer terribly while others who are just rotten to the core prosper and do well. I see evil triumph while the good suffer. I just gets to be too much after a while.
What has Romney ever done which would give you the impression that he is to be trusted?
Personally I would prefer to elect congressmen and senators with the guts to repeal Obama (i.e., impeach the tyrant).
Romney has a track record of being just as much of a tyrant as Obama (only on a limited scale).
“Religion is part of who a candidate is, so why not talk about it.”
Do you mean core beliefs might be important in a person’s makeup?
How revolutionary a concept in the post-Rove era!
Until your posts this thread was a purely attack Romney thread, and attack anyone who would admit they’re voting for him to remove Barry Dunham. Your posts, coming 120 posts on, are the FIRST hint of any discussion of Romney’s religion, yet this thread was posted as a ‘religion forum’ thread. I suspect even you might find that strange. BTW, how is the JB Weld holding out on that leaking gas tank?
Elsie said I was a religious bigot. I was responding to her. Try to keep up.
It is hard, but it is a given, and must be endured.
But yes my friend, it is damned hard and bitter to watch.
Elsie said I was a religious bigot. I was responding to her. Try to keep up.
Heh. I’ll just give you a skip henceforth.