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Pope Francis: The List (What Pope Francis Has Done)
Praytellblog ^ | March 30, 2013

Posted on 03/30/2013 2:42:00 PM PDT by NYer

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To: RegulatorCountry
Well, since he's shaking things up and the Swiss Guard takes their job very seriously, I suggest ditching the striped pantaloons.

Why? They make excellent theatre. They draw attention away from the other Swiss Guards ... the ones in black business suits, with wires in their ears and MP-5s tucked away unseen but convenient.

51 posted on 03/30/2013 10:29:18 PM PDT by ArrogantBustard (Western Civilization is Aborting, Buggering, and Contracepting itself out of existence.)
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To: NYer

amen, may the 1000 year schism be ended.


52 posted on 03/31/2013 12:44:33 AM PDT by Cronos (Latin presbuteros->Late Latin presbyter->Old English pruos->Middle Engl prest->priest)
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To: RegulatorCountry

well, the uniform is for decorative/historical purposes — just like the beefeaters at the tower or the bearskin caps at Buck house. The Swiss guard who protect the pope directly wear clothes like the secret service


53 posted on 03/31/2013 12:46:31 AM PDT by Cronos (Latin presbuteros->Late Latin presbyter->Old English pruos->Middle Engl prest->priest)
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To: RegulatorCountry
I have some Swiss ancestry too. Not Catholic, though. Moravian, from Canton Basel

well, their ancestors were Catholic...

54 posted on 03/31/2013 12:48:02 AM PDT by Cronos (Latin presbuteros->Late Latin presbyter->Old English pruos->Middle Engl prest->priest)
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To: ArrogantBustard

Don’t encourage her! She needs the rank (and the salary) to support her car and her dog!


55 posted on 03/31/2013 3:32:12 AM PDT by Tax-chick (Stand in the corner and scream with me!)
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To: Hieronymus

Thanks for the link Peter’s site. He offers a good defense. FWIU, the foot washing rite is optional. More than 25 years ago, the priest at my parish included women when washing feet. It’s much ado about nothing.


56 posted on 03/31/2013 4:16:16 AM PDT by NYer (Beware the man of a single book - St. Thomas Aquinas)
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To: Cronos

Their ancestors were Eastern Orthodox.


57 posted on 03/31/2013 6:39:46 AM PDT by RegulatorCountry
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To: RegulatorCountry

you wrote:

“I’ll refer you back to the initial link I provided, amply sourced, with the key excerpt being as follows:”

It is not “amply” sourced. It is, in fact, not sourced at all. The two footnotes are about Hus not any Eastern Orthodox connection. That’s exactly why the superscript numbers only come at the end of the sentence and NOT after the comment about supposed Eastern Orthodox origins. Also, please not that both titles referenced in footnotes 2 and 3 lack page numbers which shows us that no specific point is being made except a general reference to the Protestant nature of the sect in question - as is amply demonstrated in the titles and description of the two books referenced.

In other words, you got nothing!

Now, again, I ask you to provide me with a source, preferably an official source from the Moravians, which gives evidence, actual evidence rather than a claim of evidence, that the Moravian Church, a 15th century heretical sect which broke away from the Catholic Church was actually Eastern Orthodox in origins. Can you do it or not?


58 posted on 03/31/2013 8:22:59 AM PDT by vladimir998
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To: RegulatorCountry; Cronos

“Their ancestors were Eastern Orthodox.”

No, they were not. Even in the days of Sts. Cyril and Methodius they were Catholic because Cyril and Methodius were Catholic. They received approval from the pope to have the liturgy in the native language, for instance. Cyril died in Rome as a monk.


59 posted on 03/31/2013 8:29:01 AM PDT by vladimir998
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To: vladimir998

I’ve got family obligations Vlad no time to spar at present. The Inquisition will have to wait, lol.


60 posted on 03/31/2013 8:41:47 AM PDT by RegulatorCountry
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To: RegulatorCountry

Okay, we’ll put away the rack for NOW! Enjoy your Easter with your family. He is risen!


61 posted on 03/31/2013 8:43:23 AM PDT by vladimir998
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To: vladimir998

The Lord Is Risen Indeed.


62 posted on 03/31/2013 8:48:43 AM PDT by RegulatorCountry
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To: livius
Personally, I think the TLM folks have lost a lot of friends with this, and I even noticed a couple of comments on Fr. Z’s blog from people who said they had been sort of interested in the TLM but after the display of hatred against Pope Francis ... Forget it, they were going back to the Novus Ordo and just trying to improve it.

I have read these kinds of reports (I was going to be a traditionalist, but now I'm not!, etc, etc.) on various sites for weeks now, and I can tell you I just don't buy a word of it. It sounds like those people who love to say "I was going to be a conservative, but then I heard Rush Limbaugh and the NRA and now I am going to be a raging liberal Democrat . . ." As Keanu would wisely say, "Bogus!" This is just a typical comment people make when they want to add force to their criticism of somebody personally or something they said. It is the kind of tactic people like Bill Maher love to revel in.

Being a conservative of any kind, and this includes traditionalism, is about holding a particular value system. You adopt such views over time by learning something, and after you find the truth in such a system you don't just abandon it because you were offended by somebody who is also associated with those values. And, in addition to this, traditional Catholicism is about religious conviction and belief. You don't just decide to believe something, and then decide not to because that guy over there said something ridiculous. If that were true then the TLM crowd would be giant right now because all these people would have abandoned their commitment to the modern Mass since there are thousands and thousands of ignorant people who support that Mass on TV and online everyday saying outrageously stupid things, often about the pope! But, strangely, they don't abandon what they believe because of them. Imagine that.

People who say they were going to believe something to be true, and then just decided not to now, are only saying this because they think it makes their argument against the people they are trying to blame seem stronger.

63 posted on 03/31/2013 11:13:25 AM PDT by cothrige
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To: livius
I don’t think Pope Francis is going to “drive people” to the EF (old rite) but just the reverse, mostly because of the display of uncharitability and pride that has boiled out of that group. Not to mention hysteria...

I've never been impressed by the "more Catholic than the Pope" crowd, and some of their comments about Pope Francis have been more ridiculous than usual.

There is no Catholic doctrine or dogma about which shoes the Pope should wear, or which vestments, at what time. This is all such superfluous nonsense about which to get one's knickers in a twist.

64 posted on 03/31/2013 11:47:13 AM PDT by SuziQ
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To: RegulatorCountry
Marching about looking like a Ronald McDonald convention is distinctly unserious, and all that frippery has got to have a negative effect on response speed and mobility.

The guys in the Michelangelo designed uniforms are there for show. It's the guys in the suits with the coiling earpieces about whom bad guys need to be worried. They are the Pope's Secret Service, and they are around him constantly.

65 posted on 03/31/2013 11:51:40 AM PDT by SuziQ
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To: RegulatorCountry
Not really. Moravians were not converted by Cyril and Methodius. the first Christian Church was built by Bishop Adalram of Salzburg in Pribina. This was in 828, so pre-dating the schism

Cyril and Methodius were part of a united Church so when they came, they were not converting from the bishop of Salzburg as both the Bish of Salzburg and Cyril and Methodius were of the same Church

The Moravians then were brought into the German Holy Roman Empire -- in reality the Western half voluntarily joined the HRE while the eastern (Slovakia) was under the initially pagan Magyar

So, in short your Moravian ancestors were originally pagan, then converted by the joint Church (pre-Schism) and then were in the Catholic Przymyslid or Germanic realms or under the Magyar. The "Moravian Church" was mostly formed from the western moravians (i.e. under the Germans) from whence some of your ancestors come

They were initially Catholic in that sense, never Eastern Orthodox.

66 posted on 03/31/2013 1:22:38 PM PDT by Cronos (Latin presbuteros->Late Latin presbyter->Old English pruos->Middle Engl prest->priest)
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To: RegulatorCountry
Sorry, but that article is wrong and let me point out why:

1. it says what were the practices in these territories when it had been Eastern Orthodox: liturgy in the language of the people (i.e. Czech) -- the liturgy of the Orthodox among the Slavs was Church Slavonic, not Czech. Czech is a Western Slavic language, while Church Slavonic, having originated from the missionary teachings of Saints C&M in Bułgaria was/is a South Slavic language - and, as a person who is learning a West Slavic language, let me tell you that there is a substantial difference between West and South Slavic languages, they are not easily comprehensible -- more like if an English person tried to speak Dutch or Flemish

married priests, -- ok, this is hilarious. There was nothing about married priests in Jan Hus' revolt. He was unmarried btw. The article ismixing up the actions of the re-created Hussite Church, re-created centuries later.

indulgences -- the person who wrote this doesn't realise that the Orthodox had a practice of absolution certificates (συγχωροχάρτια – synchorochartia). Greek Orthodox Patriarch of Jerusalem Dositheos Notaras (1641–1707) wrote: "It is an established custom and ancient tradition, known to all, that the Most Holy Patriarchs give the absolution certificate (συγχωροχάρτιον – synchorochartion) to the faithful people … they have granted them from the beginning and still do."

purgatory -- again another example that the link you provided has people who have no idea what they are talking about -- the Orthodox hold that Prayer for the dead is necessary.The Eastern Orthodox Church holds that it is necessary to believe in an intermediate after-death state in which believers are perfected and brought to full divinization, a process of growth rather than of punishment, which some Orthodox have called purgatory

67 posted on 03/31/2013 1:33:40 PM PDT by Cronos (Latin presbuteros->Late Latin presbyter->Old English pruos->Middle Engl prest->priest)
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