Be very, very quiet..
You might hear the sound of LOGIC kicking in!!
Flushing away useless ritual and excessive 'veneration'.
Posted on 09/30/2013 11:30:08 AM PDT by NYer
Thanks for the advice, mod, but if they are screaming like little babies here, can you imagine what they’d do if I mailed them?
I shudder to think!
Yada, yada, yada...rules, rules, rules.
Hit me with your best shot, narses.
With THIS reply??
But if they'd go to their priest, then HE would let them read all they wanted; right?
Again, do you dispute that the individual could not have read any of the NT for himself?
Well; since you've moved the goalposts back to the BEGINNING; what can I say about that?
I guess I was wrong.
Not as pointy as I had ASSumed...
didn’t you get the memo? Rules are up to everyone’s personal interpretation
Definitely!
Especially from a follower of Pope Urban VI...
The rules of this site forbid “mindreading” on this forum.
I wish there was a 'rule' forbidding illogical statements.
Mindreading only works on INDIVIDUALs; not an ill-defined group like 'Catholics'.
"By Jove; I think he's GOT it!"
I am sure you agree, but while the varying views (to varying degrees) of pius but post-apostolic so-called church “fathers” (who are not the fathers of the NT church in Scripture) have a place such as showing that Luther’s rejection of apocryphal books was not novel as RCs allege, yet they are not to be treated as if their understanding is determinative for doctrine, and even Rome judges them more than they judge here. But for NT Christians (not Rome) Scripture was the transcendent supreme standard for truth and obedience, and it was upon Scriptural substantiation that the Lord established His claims in dissent from those who were the stewards of the Scriptures.
And thus in my opinion, that endless thread debating what CFs said has gone way beyond what is warranted. Scripture teaches historical accounts as literal, which RC scholarship denies in her own official Bible, and often uses eating as metaphorical, as in Jn. 6, and never is physically eating the means by which souls have life in themselves.
Nor was that the means by which the Son “lived” by the Father, which serves as the examples of how believers live by Christ, (Jn. 6:57) but He said His food was to do the will of His Father, (Jn. 4:34) for He lived by every word of God, and instructed that we are to as well, after His example. (Mt. 4:4)
placemarker
Evidently the Roman mind control will not even let you read thru material from RC sources which disturb your cherished fantasy of history, and require you read what you want into it. For rather than RCs being only prohibited from reading incorrect or heretical translations, they were at times, in places or universally prohibited from freely reading Scripture, part or whole, even if only in the language they could read, and not simply a bad translation of it.
You only mention the Council of Toulouse (1229) and Terragona, (1234), SHOUTING that this was only for that location (even if in two different countries), but you evidently failed to see that i myself said these were local councils. You also protest this was only for that translation (even if in two locations), but which is not what it says:
Canon 14. We prohibit also that the laity should be permitted to have the books of the Old or New Testament; unless anyone from motive of devotion should wish to have the Psalter or the Breviary for divine offices or the hours of the blessed Virgin [a small portion]; but we most strictly forbid their having any translation of these books . --S. R. Maitland, Facts and Documents, Rivington, 1832, pp. 192-194.; cited in Heresy and Authority in Medieval Europe, Edward Peters, Ed. © 1980 by Edward Peters, pp. 194-195
The Roman Catholic Council of Tarragona also ruled that: "No one may possess the books of the Old and New Testaments in the Romance language, and if anyone possesses them he must turn them over to the local bishop within eight days after the promulgation of this decree, so that they may be burned." D. Lortsch, Histoire de la Bible en France, 1910, p. 14.
As the Catholic encyclopedia states,
What these decrees (e.g. of the synods of Toulouse in 1229, Tarragona in 1234, Oxford in 1408) aimed at was the restriction of Bible-reading in the vernacular. http://oce.catholic.com/index.php?title=Censorship_of_Books
"Any translation of these books" means any, as these were written in the common tongue, and another Catholic sources affirms that in Spain did a decree of the Spanish Inquisition totally forbid Bible-reading in the vernacular; this decree was withdrawn in 1782 unconditionally forbidden (except in Spain - -John Gilmary Shea, Ed., The Catholic Educator: A Library of Catholic Instruction and Devotion, "Vernacular Bibles," (C) 1902 by Thomas Kelly, p. 544 has Imprimitur ) And while it is claimed that apart from that a general prohibition of Bible reading was never unconditionally forbidden, yet not only was reading forbidden without special permission, if even granted, but since the laity usually could not read Latin, what the decrees such as the synods of Toulouse and Tarragona amount to is a prohibition on reading Scripture, even if local and a small portion was allowed.
Moreover, if you had cared or dared to read on, you could have seen that by way of its restrictive permissions (so that only the most spellbound devotees of Rome read them) on reading Scriptures in the common tongue, which Trent states will result in more harm than good (including such harm as Rome's error being discovered), Rome effectively prohibited reading of the Scriptures by the multitudes.
And knowing you could be dragged before the Inquisitor for reading Scripture is certainly a deterrent.
Furthermore, both the he Bull Unigenitus and the Douay-Rheims preface condemn that the reading of Sacred Scripture is for all.
O...
K...
Or the WAY it was said.
I can’t judge - for it was gone before I got here this morning.
AMEN!
It was a HECK of a lot more fun in the Angels Dancing on the Head of a Pin thread!
2 Thess 2:9 For at the coming of the Lord there will be great activity on the part of Satan, in the form of all kinds of deceptive miracles, signs, and marvels, ...
And no one's heard of Pharoah's sorcerers?
I await the usual, "If a miracle advances the Kingdom; it CAN'T be anything but from GOD!"
Be very, very quiet..
You might hear the sound of LOGIC kicking in!!
Flushing away useless ritual and excessive 'veneration'.
'SAY' indeed!
The Word was made flesh: not the Wafer was made flesh.
The RCC's little wafers are about as effective as two day old manna.
You a wonderful observer of the human condition.
Why address these folks?
Isn't there some Catholic 'saint' that's in charge of Unfair Rules Toward Catholics??
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