Skip to comments.Meet "Kosher Frank" (Pope says Church cannot engage in proselytism)
Posted on 10/07/2013 5:36:12 PM PDT by Greetings_Puny_Humans
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So much for "Go and teach all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, Son and Holy Spirit'!
More horrors at the link
Proselytism is different from evangelization. Proselytism is what Jehovah’s Witnesses do on your doorstep before you slam the door.
Evangelization, announcing the Gospel, is entirely different, and the Pope tells us we have to do that every day.
Are you saying that all Christians should hate Jews? Or just doing a little more Catholic bashing? What on earth is your point?
Evangelism (good) / proselytism (bad). These words have different meanings in Catholicism than elsewhere. Much like a cult is good in Catholic circles but bad elsewhere. Are you not aware of these facts that I present to you?
Consider Tolkien and Lewis. What Lewis did was Evangelize Tolkien. Neither of them proselytised each other, and they remained friends of different religious sects.
” I spoke to him about EVANGELIZATION, and he stated emphatically that the Catholic Church cannot engage in PROSELYTISM
Evangelization = Proselytism
“Are you saying that all Christians should hate Jews?”
So you’re okay with Jews going to hell since they do not believe in Jesus Christ? Who hates who here?
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>>Evangelization = Proselytism<<
I gotta go with this definition.
Where we go from there is an entirely different kettle of wombats...
So youre okay with Jews going to hell since they do not believe in Jesus Christ?
Your statement is drawing a distinction between words that does not exist everywhere yet. For most people, Evangelization and Proselytism are the exact same things. Saying that they are different is a modern attempt to change the meaning of an old word by putting a slightly new nuance on the word--A nuance which that word did not originally have. It's the same tactic that progressives use to alter the original meaning of the plain text of the constitution. (I don't mean that you are progressive yourself, but the progressives do love this logical tactic which is a form of equivocation.)
By the way the Merriam Webster dicitionary defines these words to mean essentially the exact same thing, that is to attempt to convert someone to one's religion:
pros·e·lyt·ize [pros-uh-li-tahyz] Show IPA verb (used with object), verb (used without object), pros·e·lyt·ized, pros·e·lyt·iz·ing. to convert or attempt to convert as a proselyte; recruit.
e·van·ge·lize [ih-van-juh-lahyz] Show IPA verb, e·van·ge·lized, e·van·ge·liz·ing. verb (used with object) 1. to preach the gospel to. 2. to convert to Christianity.
According to your definition, apparently Jesus hates Jews. Which doesn't sound right, does it?
“According to your definition, apparently Jesus hates Jews. Which doesn’t sound right, does it?”
And where, exactly, did you find THAT definition?
If you consult the Bible, you will find that God tells the Jews that His covenant with them is “forever.” And St. Paul repeats that in one of his epistles.
Yes, Jesus established a New Covenant. But God continues to keep the Old Covenant with the Jews. The Jews were offered the New Covenant, and many or most of them accepted it. But the Old Covenant will remain with those faithful Jews who have chosen to remain where they are.
Christianity fulfilled the promises made to Israel. It did not supersede them. Judaism still remains a religion to which God is faithful—so long as they are faithful to Him.
They are always welcome to come over to the New Covenant. But they are not damned for not doing so, so long as they are faithful to the Old Covenant. God repeatedly made that assurance in the Old Testament. “Forever” is forever. And St. Paul repeated that. Obviously Paul approved of conversion—he was converted himself. But he did not say that the Jews would all be damned if they remained faithful to the old Covenant.
I am watching this Pope’s actions very carefully.
He is either very right or very wrong. I am currently leaning towards the very right side of perspective, but the jury is still out.
By his fruits, we shall know him.
If saying that people who don’t believe in Christ as our Savior will go to Hell—including Jews—is “hate,” then Jesus Himself must hate Jews since He’s the One who laid out the rule of Salvation.
” But the Old Covenant will remain with those faithful Jews who have chosen to remain where they are.”
Not only is this horrific heresy, offensive and hateful to the Jews who will die in their sins because you move not a single finger for them, but it is offensive to the sight of God. The law was fulfilled on the cross by Christ, the only one who was able to fulfill it. Under the law, outside of Jesus Christ, there is no salvation.
Joh_5:23 That all men should honour the Son, even as they honour the Father. He that honoureth not the Son honoureth not the Father which hath sent him.
Joh_3:36 He that believeth on the Son hath everlasting life: and he that believeth not the Son shall not see life; but the wrath of God abideth on him.
“Then came the Jews round about him, and said unto him, How long dost thou make us to doubt? If thou be the Christ, tell us plainly. Jesus answered them, I told you, and ye believed not: the works that I do in my Father’s name, they bear witness of me. But ye believe not, because ye are not of my sheep, as I said unto you. My sheep hear my voice, and I know them, and they follow me: And I give unto them eternal life; and they shall never perish, neither shall any man pluck them out of my hand. My Father, which gave them me, is greater than all; and no man is able to pluck them out of my Father’s hand.”
“Then said Jesus to those Jews which believed on him, If ye continue in my word, then are ye my disciples indeed; And ye shall know the truth, and the truth shall make you free.”
Rom_3:20 Therefore by the deeds of the law there shall no flesh be justified in his sight: for by the law is the knowledge of sin.
I speak definitively for all Jews when I say that we don’t care where others think we’re going for belief or non-belief in their religion(s.) We are nudniks. We don’t care. Go G-d!