Posted on 12/04/2013 2:17:07 PM PST by markomalley
Today is the 50th anniversary of Sacrosanctum Concilium.
What great fruits the liturgical reforms have produced! Jammed churches, long confession lines, full schools, lots of weddings and baptisms, convents bursting, seminaries churning out priests as fast as they can be ordained….
Back in 1967 when the reformers were creating the Novus Ordo, an experimental “Missa Normativa” was celebrated for a groups of cardinals and bishops. After this Mass, Card. Heenan of Westminster remarked to the Synod of Bishops in Rome:
At home, it is not only women and children but also fathers of families and young men who come regularly to Mass. If we were to offer them the kind of ceremony we saw yesterday we would soon be left with a congregation of women and children.
There is a good post at Cream City Catholic, which originates in Milwaukee, WI. He tackles the question of why fewer men go to Mass than women.
This article, appearing in The Milwaukee Journal-Sentinel, discusses various efforts being made by Milwaukee-area churches (Catholic and non-Catholic) to attract men back to the pews. [Reason #12 for SUMMORUM PONTIFICUM!!] The concern is that men are, for some mysterious reason, [Not mysterious to me.] checking out from liturgy or other Christian services.
[...]
According to a statistic presented in the article, the male/female discrepancy is especially felt in the Catholic Church, where 64% of parish life is comprised of women.
So why are the guys MIA?
This is another one of those instances within our local Church where you have a lot of people who subscribe to the conventional wisdom scratching their heads and asking “Why? Why? Why?” when the answer is not particularly elusive. This really isn’t a surprise to me, or to many others. I recall attending Mass in Rome at a local parish and, unbeknownst to me when I entered, it was a “Children’s Mass”. Start to finish, the liturgy was replete with childish, Sesame Street-styled songs and embarrassing hand motions. As I scanned the pews, only two groups of people were participating: the small children, and the women, especially the older women. The men, from young to old, were standing there, stone-faced, arms crossed, totally disengaged. It was painful. The music and everything else was thoroughly emasculating. No self-respecting man would participate in that. And they didn’t. If this is what is meant by “active participation” on the part of the laity, I and lots of guys, want nothing to do with it. Run for the hills.
This phenomenon has been replicated ad nauseam in the United States as well.
Authentic masculinity has been knee-capped in our Church. [OORAH!] This trend is conspicuously apparent in our liturgical life, as any manifestation of authentic masculinity is attacked as boorish male chauvinism, old manifestations of discrimination and oppression from a Church that is “unfairly” dominated by an all-male hierarchy. (The article cites an example of a parish in the Diocese of Madison where the pastor insisted on only boys serving as acolytes. Predictably, he received tons of criticism as a result. Fortunately, Bishop Morlino backed up his priest.) [Do I hear an "Amen!"?] What’s more, many of the “liturgical planning committees” have been taken over by women. The embellishments of many church buildings often look like a Jo-Ann Fabric was detonated inside. Pastel ribbons, crafts, baskets, streamers, quilts…BOOM!
What I’ve often referred to as the “Oprahfication” of our Church has had a direct effect on the number of men who opt out of liturgy. Much of our Church culture has imbibed a pandering, touchy-feely, soft sofa approach to dealing with real challenges, and guys don’t dig that. Coupled with a de-emphasis on the Sacramental life, the Eucharist in particular, many men simply see no point in attending Mass if all they’re “getting” is meaningless psychobabble and Stuart Smalley motivational talks.
[...]
Dead on.
Vast swathes of the Church have been wussified. Part of this is internal to the Church. Part of this comes from the decades long war on boys and men.
I think a huge part of this comes from the fact that our sacred liturgical worship is massively screwed up.
I’m not talking about “no pastors”. I’m talking about accountability for those who are. Upgrade not eradication. Right now you’ve got a bunch of Willy Wonkas leading the masses through Happy Jesus Bullcrap Land.
Should try attending Messianic Jewish services. No lack of guys there .....
That was both funny and painfully sad!
I mentally left in the mid-60s when the young priest who taught CCD class on Saturday mornings (yeah, that really appeals to teen boys) started preaching liberation theology with regard to the Mexicans and South Americans and went batshit crazy over U.S. involvement beginning in VN. I drove him nuts with a lot of counter-arguments and he eventually encouraged me to skip class. That was a no-brainer. I physically left when I entered the Marine Corps and could no longer stand the anti-war views of the church and their political stances. Other denominations had little more to offer than they did and I now consider myself a believer, but adenominational. Every denomination has their own “truth” and too many will tell me that I will go to hell for not believing that they do; regardless of how good a life I live.
Well, my priest is a communist and certainly has issues with white people (this is New Mexico).
The youth leaders may or may not be gay, but the guy who greets us at the door is either gay or flaming wimp, such that he might as well be gay.
All the activities, outside of mass itself, at the church are social do-goodery for projects I don’t agree with and, IMHO, harm society or do nothing.
Great question!
I have a simple and profound explanation.
I chose to stop attending church when, at my nephew’s baptism in the Episcopal church, the (married, female) pastor was quoting Desmond Tutu during the baptism; hitting on me at the reception; and in the activity room, -which I grew up in beginning with Sunday school, I observed the decor to consist of a bunch of b&w pictures of ~rocks~ displayed on the walls.
Feminism, promiscuity and Gaia was waaaaay too much for me at, of all things, my nephew’s baptism!
OUTTA THERE!!
-but that was probably the intent.....
I remember when a church in Phoenix was permitted to offer the Latin mass. The service was SRO, the front rows were full of invalids, some who had been taken out of hospitals and nursing homes by their families so they could one again experience the Latin mass. Some were Catholics who had not gone to church since Vatican II.
They had to bring large fans in because of the oppressive heat. Many of the elderly were in tears at seeing and hearing their faith once again.
Noticeable by their absence were those proponents of trendy modernism, who were trying very hard to ignore what was happening. Afterwards they acted like it had never happened and that it would be “better” if the church again turned to guitars, pastels, and everyone giving each other hugs, while listening to politically correct inanities.
The reason; because Sunday morning follows Saturday night.
“Church” is primarily for born again believers. The worlds conception of what a man is remains highly distorted. Brutes after the flesh impress fleshy women, not the Lord. He chose the weak things of the world to shame the strong.
Etc.
Us Episcopalians are glad to continue to use the music that the Catholics abandoned. I’m in the choir in my parish and I’ve sung Bach, Beethoven, Tallis, Mozart, Bird, Palestrina, etc., etc.
>> Why don’t as many men go to church as women?
Not sure about the history of this issue in YOUR congregation — but if I find out that **EVEN ONE** man is going to MY church as a woman... I’m finding a new church. Pronto.
;-)
Exactly.
LOL.
You'll know to run for the hills if your church changes the "Men" and "Women" signs on the bathrooms to "Whatever".
I hear you on numbers one and two but the rest sound like leftist divide and conquer talking points.
The challenges that life offers has no real bearing on the road traveled. The human experience is the human experience. There should be no reason that a well educated experienced man can’t help or offer perspective to anyone.
Of course if vapidity and shallowness extend to the intellect there’s no hope for it.
It is not just the Catholic church, or Protestant churches, it is the culture as a whole. Things have become so overtly feminine orenated, that men have been pushed to the side.
After a long week at the mines and keeping the spousal unit placated Monday through Saturday, sometimes Sundays are the only days I can have any downtime.
Clicked on the link for the book...speaking of unintended consequences, how about expecting the Germans to pay for St. Peter’s Basilica (via indulgences) and not bitch about it? Anybody see that one coming? That was a pretty big misread.
Come to think of it, Europe is right back where it was 500 years ago...the Krauts got the money and the Italians want it. Except today the establishment hierarchy is composed of bureaucrats and academics, not clergy (who appear content sticking their hands down boys pants). Turns out the same way. Krauts do the heavy lifting and destroy the Establishment assumptions, and God only knows what fills the vacuum (What is the secular equivalent of Joel Osteen?)
are you going to take advice about being a dad from a guy who never has been one? But he speaks with total authority and thinks he just knows better than you do?
if you already don’t have much respect for him because the sermons are shallow and not substantial? Don’t think he really knows too well what he’s talking about?
If you think he’s gay? Or you know he leads a life that’s insulated from the lives married people lead?
first hand experience is important in CREDIBILITY of the person offering the advice. It lets the person getting the advice know the person offering the advice really may have dealt with similar things and aren’t just talking out of their hiney.
There is the doctrine of The Priesthood of All Believers...
It is the foundation of the Via de Cristo and Walk to Emmaus movements.
Stipulates that all believers are called to act as “priests”. Not in the giving communion and absolution sense, but in bringing others to Christ and ministering to them as Christ and the Apostles ministered to people.
It imparts a great sense of responsibility upon one, that Christ is counting on you to be his representative on Earth.
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