Posted on 12/14/2014 11:57:21 AM PST by ealgeone
The reason for this article is to determine if the worship/veneration given to Mary by the catholic church is justified from a Biblical perspective. This will be evaluated using the Biblical standard and not man’s standard.
No, that is not seen in the scripture. That is what Prtestant charlatans teach, but scripture it is not.
Because others might read what I write. In fact, you seem to read me as well. It is a good thing.
you admitted that you need a priest to interpret scripture
Well, I don't remember that. Most likely I did not want to address every detail of your post. Catholics in general, priests and laity, do not interpret the Holy Scripture: they instead teach it as it is and explain difficult parts. That is the Church produced the Holy Scripture in the first place under the dictation of the Holy Ghost; just like you would not say that Mark Twain "interprets" Tome Sawyers's Adventures, so you cannot say that the Church "interprets" passages of the scripture that came from her bosom.
It is not even my post. Oh, you mean I did not make a larger quote? That is the nature of quoting.
My position is that the Holy Scripture does not teach he Protestant Sola Fide nonsense. What speculation you have about that fact is of no interest to me.
Well, like every journey, it has to have a beginning. And the beginning of starts with God seeking you out, as He did Abram, and Nathanael, and inviting you to go on a long, long trip, with Him as the tour director, and no going back. And the ticket is paid for. You only have to meet the requirement of believing in Him, based on His history with others, leaving everything you have behind, as Peter and his fellow fishermen did, including their homes and Moms and Dads.
Now, when the trip labeled Salvation, or in the pre-Christ times Redemption (which is about the same thing), you need to count the cost, for when God saves, it is for ever, and it happens once, at the beginning, for good, with lasting effects.
Before The Law:
"Therefore thus saith the LORD, who redeemed Abraham, concerning the house of Jacob, Jacob shall not now be ashamed, neither shall his face now wax pale" (Isa. 29:22 AV).
Jehovah ordered, Abram believed, and The Lord redeemed. (Gen. 12:1, Heb. 11:9).
"Redeemed" above is in the perfect tense, a action performed, once for all time, with ongoing consequences.
"The Angel which redeemed me from all evil, bless the lads; . . ." (Gen 48:16 AV).
Isaac spoke of The LORD to Jacob, and Jacob hd a dream at Luz, which he naned Bethel. There Jacob belived in Christ, and God saved/redeemed him (Gen. 28:20-22). "Redeemed" here is in the perfect tense. Once completed, with ongoing effects.
Under The Law:
"And David answered Rechab and Baanah his brother, the sons of Rimmon the Beerothite, and said unto them, As the LORD liveth, who hath redeemed my soul out of all adversity," (2 Sam 4:9 AV).
The Lord sent Samuel to anoint David, David responded and was anointed, and the Holy Spirit was upon him thereafter. David was redeemed, and the tense of the verb is the perfect tense. An action, once completed and irrevocable, with lasting results.
"And he said to the woman, Thy faith hath saved thee; go in peace" (Lk. 7:50 AV).
Mary Magdalene showed her faith in the Lord Jesus, and was saved, not by her works, but by her faith.
"Saved" here is in the perfect tense, Jesus saved her ar once, forever, with lasting consequences.
"And Jesus said unto him, Receive thy sight: thy faith hath saved thee" (Lk. 18:42 AV).
A blind beggar, in faith, cried out to Jesus passing by, and had faith to trust Jesus to give him site. Jesus saved him on the basis of his faith unaccompanied by any works, and gave him sight.
"Saved" here is in the perfect tense: an action once for all time completed, with eternal consequences.
Under Grace:
"But God, who is rich in mercy, for his great love wherewith he loved us, "Even when we were dead in sins, hath quickened us together with Christ, (by grace ye are saved;)" (Eph 2:4-5 AV).
Those who were saved, were dead in sins and absolutely unable to perform any acceptable works toward The God, but he saved them, each individual at once for all time, with everlasting consequences of new birth, new life, and new Lord.
"Saved" here is in the perfect tense.
"For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God: Not of works, lest any man should boast" (Eph 2:8-9 AV).
Referring to the same souls, they are saved by grace and faith apart from any human beneficial (or detrimental) works, penance duties, acts of contrition, etc. because people who are unsaved, who are dead in spirit to The God and His Christ, cannot do anything pleasing for Him. He saaves in spite of what you are, who you are, or what you do., based on crying out in sensible longing faith, "Please save me!"
"Saved" here is in the perfect tense--somthing done once at a point in time, never needing to be repeated, with ongoing and increasing effects.
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Are you getting the point?? "Wherefore, my beloved, as ye have always obeyed, not as in my presence only, but now much more in my absence, work out your own salvation with fear and trembling. For it is God which worketh in you both to will and to do of his good pleasure" (Php 2:12-13 AV).
You can't work out a salvation which is not already yours, permanently, and for all time. Yes God is more often interested in the process, perhaps more than the product. But you can't have a process, which in this case is sanctification, that doesn't start with an initial event, which is the act God performs gratuitously--salvation--the result being having Him as the new and permanent owner and proprietor of this piece of dead meat.
So, lets not hear anything more about penance having anything to do with this redemption, this act of salvation, this change in ownership. The Savior is not interested or impressed with penance, a self-imposed inversely prideful suffering. There's enough unwanted suffering without it, and He's already done more of it for you already than you can comprehend.
You are correct sir. People ARE reading what we write. I know that positively. See you at the pearly gates.
You are correct sir. People ARE reading what we write. I know that positively. See you at the pearly gates.
I only asked a question which you did not answer. I didn’t concede anything. A baby hasn’t got to the point where he/she can make any kind of rational decision. That must have been you for several of the first years you appeared in this world.
So Catholicism sets up its own set of *works* which the believer has to do to earn his salvation.
Interesting. Because if the law handed down by God couldn't save, and Paul tells us that if there had been a law that could have saved, righteousness would have come by the law.
What makes the RCC have the chutzpah to declare its own set of works that people must keep to become righteous and earn salvation.
If GOD couldn't come up with something, then man certainly can't and anyone who tells you so is lying to you.
Possibly; but it might arouse he who sleeps...
Which is...?
Mod: can we do free plugs on FR?
My advice: drop Rome and believe what JESUS said. Salvation is NOT a journey.
Luke 7:50
"Your faith HAS saved you. Go in peace."
I see the blender speed was set on Medium.
"Your faith HAS saved you."
Silly goose!
You Catholics added John's Revelation into your 'scriptures' for a REASON!!!
Keep reading...
Catholicism in a NUT shell!
Any of this sticking to the wall?
Your selective avoidance is well noticed.
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