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Straight Answers: Who Were the Magi?
Catholic Herald ^ | Fr. William Saunders

Posted on 12/15/2014 1:25:07 PM PST by SeekAndFind

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1 posted on 12/15/2014 1:25:07 PM PST by SeekAndFind
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To: SeekAndFind

Mary: Oh....a burial spice. How......inappropriate.
Curley: You’re welcome, toots. Nyuk, nyuk, nyuk.


2 posted on 12/15/2014 1:28:46 PM PST by AppyPappy (If you are not part of the solution, there is good money to be made prolonging the problem.)
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To: AppyPappy

Don’t tell me that was in an old three stooges clip....


3 posted on 12/15/2014 1:29:51 PM PST by SeekAndFind (If at first you don't succeed, put it out for beta test.)
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To: SeekAndFind

I always knew that 3 wise men was just a guess.


4 posted on 12/15/2014 1:32:10 PM PST by Blood of Tyrants (Good Muslims, like good Nazis or good liberals, are terrible human beings.)
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To: SeekAndFind

Is that not the plural of major, as in one major, two or more maji?

Badda bing, badda boom, couldn’t resist.

No insult whatsoever intended on the biblical reference.


5 posted on 12/15/2014 1:35:34 PM PST by Da Coyote
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To: SeekAndFind

Is that not the plural of major, as in one major, two or more maji?

Badda bing, badda boom, couldn’t resist.

No insult whatsoever intended on the biblical reference.


6 posted on 12/15/2014 1:35:34 PM PST by Da Coyote
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To: SeekAndFind

That was the actual conversation. 3 Stooges never did the Nativity.


7 posted on 12/15/2014 1:37:03 PM PST by AppyPappy (If you are not part of the solution, there is good money to be made prolonging the problem.)
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To: SeekAndFind

But why would they have cared about anything happening in Judea, which was 500 miles across the desert and in enemy territory anyway (since the magi came from the Parthian Empire)? The only plausible answer to me is that they were descendants of the Judeans who were carried off to Babylon 500 years earlier, who were considered the best and the brightest, like Daniel and his companions. Most of the Jews in Persia did not return to Judah with Nehemiah, but they would still have kept up with the prophecies and such, and would have been looking for signs of the Messiah, just as the Judeans would, or should, have been looking.


8 posted on 12/15/2014 1:49:52 PM PST by chajin ("There is no other name under heaven given among people by which we must be saved." Acts 4:12)
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To: Blood of Tyrants

I clearly remember getting kicked out of Sunday School for calling them the Three Wise Guys.


9 posted on 12/15/2014 1:52:04 PM PST by bigbob (The best way to get a bad law repealed is to enforce it strictly. Abraham Lincoln)
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To: chajin

In other words, what you are saying is that these Magi’s were not really Gentiles, but Israelites (like Daniel?)


10 posted on 12/15/2014 1:55:03 PM PST by SeekAndFind (If at first you don't succeed, put it out for beta test.)
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To: Blood of Tyrants

RE: I always knew that 3 wise men was just a guess.

So, how did the Wise Men morph into “Kings” ( as in the Christmas Carol )?


11 posted on 12/15/2014 1:55:57 PM PST by SeekAndFind (If at first you don't succeed, put it out for beta test.)
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To: SeekAndFind
After hearing the king, they went their way; and the star, which they had seen in the east, went on before them until it came and stood over the place where the Child was. 10 When they saw the star, they rejoiced exceedingly with great joy. 11 After coming into the house they saw the Child with Mary His mother; and they [e]fell to the ground and worshiped Him. Then, opening their treasures, they presented to Him gifts of gold, frankincense, and myrrh. matthew 2:9-11

Wise men still seek Him and wise men still worship Him.

12 posted on 12/15/2014 2:01:09 PM PST by ealgeone
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To: SeekAndFind; bigbob

My dad, a retired Lutheran pastor, says that there were 15-18 wise men. Many people assume that there were three wise men, since Matthew said that they gave three gifts. My dad also says that Jesus was about two, when the wise men found him. The star appeared when Jesus was born, and the wise men came from present-day India.


13 posted on 12/15/2014 2:04:38 PM PST by PhilCollins
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To: chajin

Daniel was a Magi in both the Babylonian, and later, the Persian courts. He could have shared Jewish writings with the rest of the Persian Magi who then kept an eye out for the coming of the Messiah.


14 posted on 12/15/2014 2:08:10 PM PST by the_Watchman
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To: SeekAndFind

It has always puzzled me a little, but by anyof those definitions of the Magi, they were practitioners of occult arts.

The OT is pretty clear about its position on occultism of any sort. Just as clear as it is about idolatry, murder, adultery, and homosexual acts.

So how is it that these magicians were among the first to worship Christ? Did they thereafter repent of their practices and give them up.

I don’t expect an answer, really, but if someone has an opinion, I’d like to hear it, and the reasoning behind it.


15 posted on 12/15/2014 2:09:17 PM PST by chesley (Obama -- Muslim or dhimmi? And does it matter?)
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To: SeekAndFind
In other words, what you are saying is that these Magi’s were not really Gentiles, but Israelites (like Daniel?)

More accurately they would be Jews but not Israelites, in the same way that Jews in the US are Jews, but not Israelis until they make aliyah and return to their ancestral home. For a concurrent opinion, check here.

16 posted on 12/15/2014 2:11:41 PM PST by chajin ("There is no other name under heaven given among people by which we must be saved." Acts 4:12)
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To: chesley

“but by anyof those definitions of the Magi, they were practitioners of occult arts”

Magi is a Greek word, a translation of the original Hebrew word for “wise man” “sage”, etc. It is not the original term, but at the time of writing (the first century), its meanings were close enough to “wise sage” to suit. (It later came to have additional meanings added on.)

There are some who believe the wise men actually came from China—based on the two-year period necessary for them to arrive (the same time as taking the silk road to Judea would take).

You can leave out astrology as playing a part in their understanding of the star, because that same astrological “knowledge” was not confined to Persia (and points east), but was also known in the Roman world. Ergo, had the star had an astrological meaning, everyone—not just people in the east-would have seen and interpreted the “sign”.

But the bible says that when they arrived and mentioned they had seen the star, all Jerusalem was stirred. Why would this be so if everyone had seen the “sign” and interpreted it the same way?

The wise men came to Jerusalem, to Herod, to find the newborn king. Had they been Jewish sages, they would have headed to Bethlehem (as Herod’s own sages told him was the place the messiah was to be born). Hence, we might—might—deduce they were not Jewish.

(all just thoughts for discussion)


17 posted on 12/15/2014 2:16:40 PM PST by CondorFlight (I)
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To: SeekAndFind

Interesting thread. Bookmarking.


18 posted on 12/15/2014 2:22:05 PM PST by Faith65 (Isaiah 40:31)
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To: PhilCollins

RE: My dad also says that Jesus was about two, when the wise men found him.

I tend to think this would be correct.

1) It says this in the Bible: ( Matthew 2:11 ):

(capital emphasis mine ):

And when they had come into the HOUSE, they saw the young Child with Mary His mother, and fell down and worshiped Him. And when they had opened their treasures, they presented gifts to Him: gold, frankincense, and myrrh.

So, the wise men arrived at the HOUSE where Mary and Joseph lived and not in the stable next tot he inn where the manger was.

2) Herod ordered the massacre of infants two years old and younger.


19 posted on 12/15/2014 2:26:15 PM PST by SeekAndFind (If at first you don't succeed, put it out for beta test.)
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To: SeekAndFind
< The third, black-skinned and heavily bearded, named Balthasar. .. by his gift of myrrh testified to the Son of Man who was to die."

Token black. The idea has been around for a long time, apparently.

20 posted on 12/15/2014 2:27:03 PM PST by sportutegrl
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