Posted on 06/09/2015 3:51:50 PM PDT by stockpirate
amen, yes, the last day is when it all happens.
the angels, and those who meet him in the air.
how do you reconcile “the dead in Christ rise first” when Christ returns if not for the fact that they’re still in the ground?
If they are not in Heaven, the dead Christians, then whom is it that God will bring with Him when He comes to take away His Bride?
1 Corinthians 15
20 But now is Christ risen from the dead, and become the firstfruits of them that slept.
21 For since by man came death, by man came also the resurrection of the dead.
22 For as in Adam all die, even so in Christ shall all be made alive.
23 But every man in his own order: Christ the firstfruits; afterward they that are Christ’s at his coming.
Romans 8
29 For whom he did foreknow, he also did predestinate to be conformed to the image of his Son, that he might be the firstborn among many brethren.
30 Moreover whom he did predestinate, them he also called: and whom he called, them he also justified: and whom he justified, them he also glorified.
This was all past tense, meaning it had already happened at the time of Paul`s writing.
Hosea 6
After two days will he revive us: in the third day he will raise us up, and we shall live in his sight.
They were old testament Jews and they were conformed to the image of Christ.
1 Cot 15:23
The ones who slept were no longer sleeping as they followed Jesus in the resurrection.
I’m a Christian. If you read the Bible thoroughly, you must deduce that God does not secretly remove believers from earth for several years and THEN returns.
Catholics seem unable to discern when they are duplicitous. I know from reading the sources that the notions of pre-trib or mid-trib or post-trib arose in the sources I cited. That means your characterization of the notions regarding pre-trib Rapture is false, a fabrication from the source of ecclesiastical fabrications. I have not stated that these sources approved of any of the various scenarios, just that discussion was occurring since the first century, in contradiction to your false assertion.
No, the treaty in question will specify Jerusalem in the text. As you say, there are numerous treaties possible, but the one pointed to by Prophecies is the one which names Jerusalem and thus the temple reconstruction project, etc. The breaking of that treaty will be hallmarked by the son of perdition, the man of sin violating the Temple.
There is no rapture. It is a false belief.
If we believe that God calls things into existence then it is not even a stretch to comprehend that He can re-unite the alive and awake souls of those whose bodies have fallen with a new energized body which He then transforms in a moment in the twinkling of an eye.
There is nothing secret about this event. It is so well witnessed that the son of perdition fabricates a lie to explain it away, a lie which could only be believed because God gives the left-behinds strong delusion such that they believe THE Lie. No doubt the Vatican can be of great assistance in promoting this lie, eh? I mean there are more than a billion Catholics who take every word from the Vatican as god speaking to them through the church.
If you are worried about Christians tempted to take the Mark, relax, we be gone, baby!
1 Thessalonians 4
17 Then WE which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord.
We also know that it was not Paul who wrote 1 Thessalonians because he is said to have been killed in Rome.
Sorry, Historians tell us the Galatian letter was first, then the two Thessalonian letters were written next. But you will believe whatever fits your paradigm, which appears to want to disregard what you don’t like. Jefferson was like that so you’re in famous company. He even went so far as to cut pages of text out which he didn’t want to accept.
BTW, the notion of imminence was present even in Paul’s lifetime, so he would not have been given any indication of when the Rapture occurs to end the Church Age, thus he would naturally write ‘then WE who are alive and remain’.
Jew anybody who really understands the scripture.
No, you asserted my statement was false, after evidently misunderstanding it, produced what you purported were patristic sources supporting your view. I pointed out the actual content of those sources debunked your claim. The only obfuscation I detect in the exchange is on your part, since you are pretending my critique of the “pre-tribulation rapture” was denying what is plainly said in Scripture, when obviously the plainness of it is in dispute even among protestants who like the word “rapture”. If you want to claim I made a false statement, give a quote from a Church Father (ideally one of the Greek Fathers, since that’s who I cited) that moves the events described in First Thessalonians before the reign of Antichrist. An actual quote, not a list of Church Fathers you purport did this, since the lot you pointed to came up short as I noted in my reply.
I am not in communion with the Pope of Rome, but if you’d like to claim I’m in the One Holy Catholic and Apostolic Church, I and my fellow Orthodox Christians will happily accept your acknowledgment of our catholicity.
The mark is in the mind. The hand is symbolic of labor
Revelation 20
and who had not adored the beast nor his image, nor received his character on their foreheads, or in their hands; and they lived and reigned with Christ a thousand years.
There does seem to be more than one way to worship the beast but I have no doubt that if our society can do it they will put a computer chip in our right hands or in our foreheads, in the time of the eighth beast.
thus he would naturally write ‘then WE who are alive and remain’.
Thank you, both.
Sorry, Historians tell us the Galatian letter was first, then the two Thessalonian letters were written next. But you will believe whatever fits your paradigm, which appears to want to disregard what you don’t like. Jefferson was like that so you’re in famous company. He even went so far as to cut pages of text out which he didn’t want to accept.
I was just making a remark that if the writer of Thessalonians was going to be raptured it could not have been Paul who wrote it as we know or at least assume Paul was killed, he was not raptured up alive.
Meaning who can say which word is to be taken literally and which can not, I take WE literally.
I was not literally saying Paul did not write Thessalonians, just trying to make a point.
But did he really?
Interesting, thanks.
Sorry, I misunderstood.
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