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How Not to Interpret Scripture
Crisis Magazine ^ | March 21, 2016 | MICHAEL HAYES

Posted on 03/21/2016 3:43:44 PM PDT by NYer

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To: MamaB
Chapter 1

Chapter 2

Chapter 3

Chapter 4

Chapter 5

121 posted on 03/22/2016 4:37:33 AM PDT by Cronos (Obama's dislike of Assad is not based on his brutality but that he isn't a jihadi Moslem)
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To: MamaB
More readings for you posted by Catholic posters for your reference (since you asked):
Sing to the LORD, praise the LORD, For he has rescued the life of the poor from the power of the wicked!

“Now is the Son of Man glorified, and God is glorified in him. If God is glorified in him, God will also glorify him in himself,

122 posted on 03/22/2016 5:04:04 AM PDT by Cronos (Obama's dislike of Assad is not based on his brutality but that he isn't a jihadi Moslem)
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To: Zionist Conspirator

You posted: “we do know when the universe was created. It is Halakhah that the universe was created ex nihilo going on 5776 years ago. The first day of creation was ‘Elul 25 and the sixth day was 1 Tishrei—Ro’sh HaShanah.”

That means that the world was created in 3760 BC by my calculation (2016 AD - 5,776 years), thus the world is younger than what Bishop Ussher calculated.

However, you missed the underlying point of my post: The sarcasm over this arguing about the exact date of the creation of everything by God. Although you did put in a bit of sarcasm yourself, which I appreciated.


123 posted on 03/22/2016 5:50:10 AM PDT by GreyFriar (Spearhead - 3rd Armored Division 75-78 & 83-87)
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To: imardmd1

my post was sarcastic over the long squabble about spelling Phil(l)ip and whether or not that showed biblical knowledge.


124 posted on 03/22/2016 5:51:15 AM PDT by GreyFriar (Spearhead - 3rd Armored Division 75-78 & 83-87)
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To: GreyFriar
You posted: “we do know when the universe was created. It is Halakhah that the universe was created ex nihilo going on 5776 years ago. The first day of creation was ‘Elul 25 and the sixth day was 1 Tishrei—Ro’sh HaShanah.”

Yes.

That means that the world was created in 3760 BC by my calculation (2016 AD - 5,776 years), thus the world is younger than what Bishop Ussher calculated.

Yes. As a matter of fact, according to the Kutim (the "Samaritans") the world is even younger than that.

Having heard so often that "no one had ever interpreted Genesis literally until the stupid rednecks came along" I took advantage of an opportunity to send an e-mail to an online Samaritan publication (which gave the years from creation on its home page). The answer I received was that the Samaritans really do believe that all those things actually did happen. So much for "stupid rednecks" inventing Biblical literalism out of whole cloth.

However, you missed the underlying point of my post:

I must have.

The sarcasm over this arguing about the exact date of the creation of everything by God.

I didn't see any sarcasm. I saw yet another post by a (Catholic/Orthodox?) FReeper laughing at retarded "white trash" for believing there are no mistakes whatsoever on any subject in the Written Word of G-d.

Although you did put in a bit of sarcasm yourself, which I appreciated.

I wasn't being sarcastic. I'm sorry you're so dismissive of the Bible's veracity as to interpret it that way. But that is your problem.

125 posted on 03/22/2016 6:05:14 AM PDT by Zionist Conspirator (The "end of history" will be worldwide Judaic Theocracy.)
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To: GreyFriar

I guess I missed your POV. It’s becoming clearer.


126 posted on 03/22/2016 6:13:01 AM PDT by imardmd1 (Fiat Lux)
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To: ealgeone

This is a good question.

I personally believe the account of the Flood is an accurate historical account. I personally believe it retells the flooding of the Black Sea, approximately 7000 years ago (c 5600 BC). See here https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Black_Sea_deluge_hypothesis

This fits nicely not only with the fact the Flood is recorded in the Bible but also in the Epic of Gilgamesh. Both regions and peoples could have easily heard of and recorded such a flood, knowledge of which was passed on to both peoples from ages long past.

This doesn’t mean it wasn’t done by God nor that there aren’t some important Judeo-Christian truths to be had from the Biblical account. Both are quite true, I firmly believe.

I just don’t believe the entire globe of the Earth was ever covered in water in any point in human history.


127 posted on 03/22/2016 6:39:12 AM PDT by FourtySeven (47)
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To: Zionist Conspirator

You said yourself that you were being sarcastic with this statement:

“Why, they’ll fry in hell for doing that![/sarcasm]”


128 posted on 03/22/2016 6:52:39 AM PDT by GreyFriar (Spearhead - 3rd Armored Division 75-78 & 83-87)
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To: FourtySeven
If you compare how the use of the Hebrew word for flood and the Greek word for flood are used it points to a worldwide flood. In Luke the Greek verbs really break down the impact of the Flood.

Also examine the passages concerning the covenant God made after the Flood.

If the flood were local and if anyone has died in a flood in the Mesopotamian area since God made this covenant then God has lied.

I'm currently writing a paper for a seminary class to offer evidence for a worldwide flood.

129 posted on 03/22/2016 6:56:09 AM PDT by ealgeone
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To: ealgeone

Good luck in your paper. I’d like to read it when you’re done if possible.

About your point about the verbs used to describe the flooding pointing to a “worldwide” flood. As far as I remember, when I investigated this issue before (about 10 years ago but not exhaustively admittedly), yes the intent of the “original authors” of the account was that the Flood encompassed the “whole world”, however that useage must be examined critically. After all, as we all know firstly, the ancients didn’t conceive of the Earth as a globe. They viewed the “world” as flat, only extending to the horizons they could see. So it’s quite possible what they meant as a “world-wide” flood was really a regional flood like the Black Sea flood.

As far as anyone dying in a Mesopotamian flood since the Great Flood making God a liar, this can’t be true since we still have people dying in floods today, and that certainly doesn’t make God a liar.

Make no mistake the Black Sea flooding, if as catastrophic and sudden as some believe, was in every sense of the word, “Biblical” in its scope and severity. We have never seen anything like it since. I don’t see a problem with accepting that as the origin of the Great Flood account, since it not only proves from history that Scripture is right again but it also allows for a literal interpretation of Scripture. All things that should make everyone, on this thread at least, happy.


130 posted on 03/22/2016 7:08:11 AM PDT by FourtySeven (47)
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To: ealgeone
When a religion which wants to look like Christianity sets out to identify itself 'the superior way' that 'way' invariably sows seeds of doubt as to the accuracy of The Bible. We see it perhaps most blatantly in Mormonism, since that religion seeks to establish credulity for the fictional book of Mormon.

Stick with 'the Bible is all true, we just don't yet know how it is all true.'

131 posted on 03/22/2016 7:10:44 AM PDT by MHGinTN (Democrats bait then switch; their fishy voters buy it every time.)
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To: FourtySeven
As far as anyone dying in a Mesopotamian flood since the Great Flood making God a liar, this can’t be true since we still have people dying in floods today, and that certainly doesn’t make God a liar.

God said all flesh would not die due to a flood again.

Now one has to qualify how big or small the world was to justify God not lying.

The plain reading of the text, in conjunction with the passages in Isaiah and the New Testament indicate it's worldwide.

I'll be glad to get you a copy of the paper. Would be interested in your evaluation of the thought process.

Freepmail me on how we can do this.

132 posted on 03/22/2016 7:21:23 AM PDT by ealgeone
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To: NYer

This was a thread that needed to happen, and yet somehow went to hell in a handbasket.

Education, particularly in America, has become a debased shadow of what it ought to be.

A thorough grounding in what this writer calls “western civ” is necessary or you aren’t really educated at all. We can argue about specific authors and specific works, whether or not they should be in the “canon” but kids who graduate having never read and understood any of this, are not educated and are easily misled by demagogues, not to mention that they must then spend decades de-educating and re-educating themselves.

Christians of every stripe need to look at what passes for education and decide if this is really what they want for their kids. Churches should consider establishing classic college level studies and turning their backs on the crap that is being peddled by the establishment. It makes no sense to bankrupt yourself to have your kids indoctrinated in the flavor-of-the-month and at the end of it, they are not really educated at all. Most people you meet, if they are educated for real, have had to educate themselves. There is room for someone to do something about this if they just will.

But first you have to recognize that there is a problem, and that’s what a thread like this ought to be about. Maybe you can try again and hope for better results.


133 posted on 03/22/2016 10:42:59 AM PDT by marron
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To: ealgeone

Ok FReepmail sent.


134 posted on 03/22/2016 11:59:27 AM PDT by FourtySeven (47)
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To: ealgeone
Was the Flood recorded in Genesis a myth, a good story, local or worldwide?

probably...

135 posted on 03/22/2016 6:16:33 PM PDT by terycarl (COMMON SENSE PREVAILS OVER ALL)
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To: MeganC
Funny the difference between Catholic postings on FR and Protestant postings. Catholics post about how wrong the Protestants are and Protestants post about the love of God and the salvation that we find in Jesus. Is that what it means to be Catholic? To always be aware of how morally and religiously superior you are to everyone else? No, thanks.

I disagree with your conclusions....Catholics preach the 2,000 year old truth of the Christian religion, Protestants, by their very description, are trying, fruitlessly, to change, eliminate, rewrite, misinterpret, what existed for one thousand six hundred years before they even existed.

136 posted on 03/22/2016 6:36:40 PM PDT by terycarl (COMMON SENSE PREVAILS OVER ALL)
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To: terycarl

Wow...way to take a stand on the issue.


137 posted on 03/22/2016 6:38:09 PM PDT by ealgeone
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To: MamaB
Thank you for saying what I have thought. It seems that they post pro-Catholic instead of pro-Bible. Tis a shame. It is like they hate the Bible. I wonder why.

Pro-Catholic IS pro Bible....Catholics get a little upset when folks eliminate entire books, reinterpret what has been taught for 2,000 years, deny apparent truths like Transubstantiation, deny the seven Sacrament instituted by Christ...little things like that.

138 posted on 03/22/2016 6:41:32 PM PDT by terycarl (COMMON SENSE PREVAILS OVER ALL)
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To: MamaB

Catholics do NOY hate the Bible. Where did you get that idea?


139 posted on 03/22/2016 6:44:40 PM PDT by Salvation ("With God all things are possible." Matthew 19:26)
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To: MeganC
All too often you folks open your dialogue with something to the effect of “You silly stupid Protestants have it all wrong...HARDY-HAR-HAR!! (SNORT!!) (SNEER!!)” Like I said, I’ve never actually met anyone Catholic in person. Not so sure I want to based on what I see here.

You have that EXACTLY in reverse....remember that the Catholics were there for 1,600 years before the Protestant revolution took place. It was the Protestants that ridiculed the Catholics for their beliefs and traditions..

The Catholics said...Jesus took bread, broke it and said "TAKE AND EAT OF THIS, THIS IS MY BODY" and the protestants decided that He rally didn't mean that and chastised Catholics for their belief.

140 posted on 03/22/2016 6:49:07 PM PDT by terycarl (COMMON SENSE PREVAILS OVER ALL)
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