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John Paul II´s Apostolic Letter "Rosarium Virginis Mariae"
Zenit News Agency ^ | October 16, 2002 | Pope John Paul II

Posted on 10/16/2002 6:55:59 AM PDT by ELS

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To: F16Fighter
The Bible commands, nay Christ Himself commands that we ask anything IN HIS NAME we shall receive. Nothing scriptural about being commanded to clutch and count a bunch of magic beads in conjunction with prayers to Mary.

And I'm sure that at your church, no one has ever requested anyone to say prayers for anyone else.

61 posted on 10/16/2002 9:17:17 PM PDT by Loyalist
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To: ELS
I just finished reading this Apostolic Letter a little while ago and it is absolutely beautiful! I emailed it to my brother,hoping that he'll read it.
62 posted on 10/16/2002 9:24:44 PM PDT by Lady In Blue
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To: TotusTuus
This flyboy is apparently entrusted by us to fly multi-million dollar Falcons for our protection. I now think I'm beginning to understand why so many F-16's have been crashing in the desert out of Luke AFB here in AZ.

Ooo. Not good. My little brother flies the 53-whatever the latest letter is. It's a big Marine cargo chopper. They've been really busy lately....
63 posted on 10/16/2002 9:32:04 PM PDT by Desdemona
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To: Loyalist
"And I'm sure that at your church, no one has ever requested anyone to say prayers for anyone else."

"For" or "to"??

I don't anyone at church calling upon any of the dearly departed to intercede for the flock.

64 posted on 10/16/2002 9:34:54 PM PDT by F16Fighter
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To: Siobhan
Siobhan,about what time will you be saying the Mysteries of Light tomorrow at your dad's grave site,if you don't mind my asking? I'd like to unite myself with you all in saying it at the same time.I'm in the Pacific time zone. Hope you see this post before I go to bed. Thanks.
65 posted on 10/16/2002 9:35:30 PM PDT by Lady In Blue
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To: TotusTuus
"You forgot to mention the snide remarks about "tradition" and "it has NO scriptural basis at all" comment."

Would you prefer to abide by man's "tradition", or the "Word of God"?

If you don't like the choice, take it up with the Big Guy Upstairs, not me.

66 posted on 10/16/2002 9:38:03 PM PDT by F16Fighter
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To: Siobhan
Thank you for posting this beautiful picture of the Blessed Mother.It's lovely!
67 posted on 10/16/2002 9:38:46 PM PDT by Lady In Blue
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To: F16Fighter
You miss the point.

I often say the Rosary while jammed into a rush hour train. Naturally, I can't be holding a set of Rosary beads under those circumstances, so I just count off as best I can.

The purpose of the beads is just to make it easy not to lose your place, that's all.
68 posted on 10/16/2002 9:46:01 PM PDT by dsc
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To: ELS
Thank you. I have bookmarked this to download and read and study carefully.

God Bless the Holy Father, and may Mary protect him always!
69 posted on 10/16/2002 10:00:34 PM PDT by Palladin
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To: F16Fighter
Is the 'Rosary' not an inanimate object? But through this object or "Rosary" beads, God's power or Mary's "power" is supposedly obtained.

Oh brother,,, dude, you really need to read the articles posted first before responding.

I'm beginning to see the problem here. You seem to be caught up on the Rosary chaplet that people use to pray this prayer - which need not be used for the prayer itself at all. No biggie. Think of them as a clock keeping time while you pray. Yes we Catholics, at least, will bless them and care for them like we do all other inanimate objects (as well as animate!) used in service and worship of God, which is a Biblical principle - e.g. we bless Churches. But they aren't the prayer itself, nor do we see anything "magical" about them in any way. Those seem to be your prejudices (Read: pre - judge). Or maybe it's just confusion over language - usually in everyday life a chaplet will be referred to as a 'rosary', e.g. "Do you have a rosary"? This article is clearly talking about the Rosary in the full sense of the term, meaning prayer.

The Rosary itself is a meditative prayer - meditation on the Gospels themselves. Prayer occurs between us - living beings - and God. Any "power" (Grace) comes from God through the act of prayer (yea, yea, yea, I know, ultimately through Grace through the Spirit of Christ indwelling in us as a result of the Passion and Ressurection of Christ) not "beads".

There are different levels, or types, of prayer. Such as begging forgiveness for our sins, or petitions - asking for things, or thanking God just to thank Him, or praising and adoring God because He is God. There is communal prayer and interior mental prayer. The Rosary is a private devotion of (hopefully) the meditative or contemplative type, even when prayed communally in public. Think of it as praying the Scriptures, which is what it is. All these different forms of praying is Biblical. Ultimately, prayer is nothing other than talking to God. All prayer should come from the heart; any not, including the Rosary, is an empty shell offered to God. The command itself to pray is littered throughout the Holy Scriptures. And yes, Jews did have prayer tassles that they used recorded in Scripture, meaning Christ Himself had them. That should answer your other objections in your Post.

Lastly, while the Rosary, when prayed devoutly is a wonderful prayer, or way of praying, it is not the only form of prayer used by Catholics (incidently, no small amount of Protestants pray the Rosary as well). All prayer is good. Catholics believe a person can have an excellent prayer life without even knowing about the Rosary. While I recommend it, nobody dictated that it must be prayed for eternal salvation. Talking about prayer life and actually having one are two different things altogether. Many people have dry spells or a difficult time praying, especially meditative prayer. The Rosary developed over time as a disciplined and helpful way to lead to a deeper prayer life for individuals.

Why do you have problems with all this?

70 posted on 10/16/2002 10:19:47 PM PDT by TotusTuus
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To: Desdemona
My little brother flies the 53-whatever the latest letter is.

Ask Smedley, he might know.

Desde, this guy apparently can't even read through a coherent article or post to effectively respond to it in an intelligent manner. Spec manual? I knew and know guys like this in the military. They didn't fly F-16's. (heehee) Of course he's just a pilot, your brother is an aviator!

71 posted on 10/16/2002 10:46:37 PM PDT by TotusTuus
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To: ELS
Thanks for posting this letter. It is an extremely thorough dissertation on the rosary and it's Christocentic essence. JPII would make a good Catholic Freeper.
72 posted on 10/16/2002 11:36:30 PM PDT by St.Chuck
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To: F16Fighter
Nobody ever said anything about amulets or charms. Is a bible a charm? No. If someone was carrying it around, would you say it was one?
73 posted on 10/17/2002 2:00:48 AM PDT by nickcarraway
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To: F16Fighter
Can you imagine Jesus consorting with prostitutes and tax collectors? Oops never mind. Jesus did a lot of things people didn't understand and might have thought a little ``off.'' When you read the Bible do you realize that the Pharisees aren't ``the good guys?''
74 posted on 10/17/2002 2:03:09 AM PDT by nickcarraway
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To: TotusTuus
That was one of the most concise explainations of the Rosary I've ever read. Thank you for that. =)
75 posted on 10/17/2002 6:52:19 AM PDT by Aggie Mama
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To: TotusTuus
Two comments.

Wouldn't actually reading from scripture about the actual events that are the "Mysteries" bring them into focus more then the Rosary? No offence intended here just wondering why this is not advised as much as the rosary.

And why are they called "Mysteries?"

Becky

76 posted on 10/17/2002 7:01:50 AM PDT by PayNoAttentionManBehindCurtain
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Comment #77 Removed by Moderator

To: ELS
Magnificent!
78 posted on 10/17/2002 7:13:24 AM PDT by Aquinasfan
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To: sandyeggo
You know what's funny, after I wrote that, I thought, Des, you ditz, you should have said, "Mine are chanting to me, Desdemona. Come count us."

Who cares how you hold it. And if you're saying it in bed, with the Rosary in your hand, inevitably in the morning the thing ends up on the floor.

These people need to get a grip.
79 posted on 10/17/2002 7:15:47 AM PDT by Desdemona
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Comment #80 Removed by Moderator


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