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Imprisoned in the Gulag by Stalin, A Russian-Jewish Doctor Becomes a Christian
Jews for Jesus ^

Posted on 01/07/2003 12:03:54 PM PST by xzins

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A Russian Doctor


This article originally appeared in ISSUES 4:7

No reporters have visited the prison camps of Soviet Russia, unless they have gone as prisoners. So to this day we have little information about the millions who have lived, suffered, and died there, especially during Stalin's reign of terror. Most will remain nameless for all time, remembered only in the hearts of those who knew and loved them. But from time to time, scraps of information have filtered out about a few. One of those few was Boris Nicholayevich Kornfeld.

Kornfeld was a medical doctor. From this we can guess a little about his background, for in post-revolutionary Russia such education never went to families tied in any way to czarist Russia. Probably his parents were socialists who had fastened their hopes on the Revolution. They were also Jews, but almost certainly not Jews still hoping for the Messiah, for the name Boris and the patronymic Nicholayevich indicate they had taken Russian names in some past generation. Probably Kornfeld's forebears were Haskalah so-called "enlightened Jews," who accepted the philosophy of rationalism, cultivated a knowledge of the natural sciences, and devoted themselves to the arts. In language, dress, and social habits they tried to make themselves as much like their Russian neighbors as possible.

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It was natural for such Jews to support Lenin's revolution, for the czars' vicious anti-Semitism had made life almost unendurable for the prior two hundred years. Socialism promised something much better for them than "Christian" Russia. "Christian" Russia had slaughtered Jews; perhaps atheistic Russia would save them.

Obviously Kornfeld had followed in his parents' footsteps, believing in Communism as the path of historical necessity, for political prisoners at that time were not citizens opposed to Communism or wanting the Czar's return. Such people were simply shot. Political prisoners were believers in the Revolution, socialists or communists who had, nevertheless, not kept their allegiance to Stalin's leadership pure.

We do not know what crime Dr. Kornfeld committed, only that it was a political crime. Perhaps he dared one day to suggest to a friend that their leader, Stalin, was fallible; or maybe he was simply accused of harboring such thoughts. It took no more than that to become a prisoner in the Russia of the early 1950s; many died for less. At any rate, Kornfeld was imprisoned in a concentration camp for political subversives at Ekibastuz.

Ironically, a few years behind barbed wire was a good cure for Communism. The senseless brutality, the waste of lives, the trivialities called criminal charges made men like Kornfeld doubt the glories of the system. Stripped of all past associations, of all that had kept them busy and secure, behind the wire prisoners had time to think. In such a place, thoughtful men like Boris Kornfeld found themselves re-evaluating beliefs they had held since childhood.

So it was that this Russian doctor abandoned all his socialistic ideals. In fact, he went further than that. He did something that would have horrified his forebears.

Boris Kornfeld became a Christian.

While few Jews anywhere in the world find it easy to accept Jesus Christ as the true Messiah, a Russian Jew would find it even more difficult. For two centuries these Jews had known implacable hatred from the people who, they were told, were the most Christian of all. Each move the Jews made to reconcile themselves or accommodate themselves to the Russians was met by new inventions of hatred and persecution, as when the head of the governing body of the Russian Orthodox Church said he hoped that, as a result of the Russian pogroms, "one-third of the Jews will convert one-third will die, and one-third will flee the country."

Yet following the Revolution a strange alignment occurred. Joseph Stalin demanded undivided, unquestioning loyalty to his government; but both Jews and Christians knew their ultimate loyalty was to God. Consequently people of both faiths suffered for their beliefs and frequently in the same camps.

Thus it was that Boris Kornfeld came in contact with a devout Christian, a well-educated and kind fellow prisoner who spoke of a Jewish Messiah who had come to keep the promises the Lord had made to Israel. This Christian--whose name we do not know--pointed out that Jesus had spoken almost solely to Jewish people and proclaimed that He came to the Jews first. That was consistent with God's special concern for the Jew, the chosen ones; and, he explained, the Bible promised that a new kingdom of peace would come. This man often recited aloud the Lord's Prayer, and Kornfeld heard in those simple words a strange ring of truth.

The camp had stripped Kornfeld of everything, including his belief in salvation through socialism. Now this man offered him hope--but in what a form!

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To accept Jesus Christ--to become one of those who had always persecuted his people--seemed a betrayal of his family, of all who had been before him Kornfeld knew the Jews had suffered innocently. Jews were innocent in the days of the Cossacks! Innocent in the days of the czars! And he himself was innocent of betraying Stalin; he had been imprisoned unjustly.

But Kornfeld pondered what the Christian prisoner had told him. In one commodity, time, the doctor was rich.

Unexpectedly, he began to see the powerful parallels between the Jews and this Jesus. It had always been a scandal that God should entrust Himself in a unique way to one people, the Jews. Despite centuries of persecution, their very existence in the midst of those who sought to destroy them was a sign of a Power greater than that of their oppressors. It was the same with Jesus--that God would present Himself in the form of a man had always confounded the wisdom of the world. To the proud and powerful, Jesus stood as a Sign, exposing their own limitations and sin. So they had to kill Him, just as those in power had to kill the Jews, in order to maintain their delusions of omnipotence. Thus, Stalin, the new god-head of the brave new world of the Revolution, had to persecute both Jew and Christian. Each stood as living proof of his blasphemous pretensions to power.

Only in the gulag could Boris Kornfeld begin to see such a truth. And the more he reflected upon it, the more it began to change him within.

Boris Kornfeld

Though a prisoner, Kornfeld lived in better conditions than most behind the wire. Other prisoners were expendable, but doctors were scarce in the remote, isolated camps. The authorities could not afford to lose a physician, for guards as well as prisoners needed medical attention. And no prison officer wanted to end up in the hands of a doctor he had cruelly abused.

Kornfeld's resistance to the Christian message might have begun to weaken while he was in surgery, perhaps while working on one of those guards he had learned to loathe. The man had been knifed and an artery cut. While suturing the blood vessel, the doctor thought of tying the thread in such a way that it would reopen shortly after surgery. The guard would die quickly and no one would be the wiser.

The process of taking this particular form of vengeance gave rein to the burning hatred Kornfeld had for the guard and all like him. How he despised his persecutors! He could gladly slaughter them all!

And at that point, Boris Kornfeld became appalled by the hatred and violence he saw in his own heart. Yes, he was a victim of hatred as his ancestors had been. But that hatred had spawned an insatiable hatred of his own. What a deadly predicament! He was trapped by the very evil he despised. What freedom could he ever know with his soul imprisoned by this murderous hate? It made the whole world a concentration camp.

As Kornfeld began to retie the sutures properly, he found himself, almost unconsciously, repeating the words he had heard from his fellow prisoner. "Forgive us our trespasses, as we forgive those who trespass against us." Strange words in the mouth of a Jew. Yet he could not help praying them. Having seen his own evil heart, he had to pray for cleansing. And he had to pray to a God who had suffered, as he had: Jesus.

Boris with patient

For some time, Boris Kornfeld simply continued praying the Lord's Prayer while he carried out his backbreaking, hopeless tasks as a camp doctor. Backbreaking because there were always far too many patients. Hopeless because the camp was designed to kill men. He stood ineffectively against the tide of death gaining on each prisoner: disease, cold, overwork, beatings, malnutrition.

Doctors in the camp's medical section were also asked to sign decrees for imprisonment in the punishment block. Any prisoner whom the authorities did not like or wanted out of the way was sent to this block--solitary confinement in a tiny, dark, cold, torture chamber of a cell. A doctor's signature on the forms certified that a prisoner was strong and healthy enough to withstand the punishment. This was, of course, a lie. Few emerged alive.

Like all the other doctors, Kornfeld had signed his share of forms. What was the difference? The authorities did not need the signatures anyway; they had many other ways of "legalizing" punishment. And a doctor who did not cooperate would not last long, even though doctors were scarce. But shortly after he began to pray for forgiveness, Dr. Kornfeld stopped authorizing the punishment; he refused to sign the forms. Though he had signed hundreds of them, now he couldn't. Whatever had happened inside him would not permit him to do it.

This rebellion was bad enough, but Kornfeld did not stop there. He turned in an orderly.

The orderlies were drawn from a group of prisoners who cooperated with the authorities. As a reward for their cooperation, they were given jobs within the camp which were less than a death sentence. They became the cooks, bakers, clerks, and hospital orderlies. The other prisoners hated them almost more than they hated the guards, for these prisoners were traitors; they could never be trusted. They stole food from the other prisoners and would gladly kill anyone who tried to report them or give them trouble. Besides, the guards turned a blind eye to their abuses of power. People died in the camps every day; the authorities needed these quislings to keep the system running smoothly.

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While making his rounds one day, Kornfeld came to one of his many patients suffering from pellagra, an all-too-common disease in the camps. Malnutrition induced pellagra which, perversely, made digestion nearly impossible. Victims literally starved to death.

This man's body showed the ravages of the disease. His face had become dark, one deep bruise. The skin was peeling off his hands; they had to be bandaged to staunch the incessant bleeding. Kornfeld had been giving the patient chalk, good white bread, and herring to stop the diarrhea and get nutrients into his blood, but the man was too far gone. When the doctor asked the dying patient his name, the man could not even remember it.

Just after leaving this patient, Kornfeld came upon a hulking orderly bent over the remains of a loaf of white bread meant for the pellagra patients. The man looked up shamelessly, his cheeks stuffed with food. Kornfeld had known about the stealing, had known it was one reason his patients did not recover, but his vivid memory of the dying man pierced him now. He could not shrug his shoulders and go on.

Of course he could not blame the deaths simply on the theft of food. There were countless other reasons why his patients did not recover. The hospital sttank of excrement and lacked proper facilities and supplies. He had to perform surgery under conditions so primitive that often operations were little more than mercy killings. It was preposterous to stand on principle in the situation, particularly when he knew what the orderly might do to him in return. But the doctor had to be obedient to what he now believed. Once again the change in his life was making a difference.

When Kornfeld reported the orderly to the commandant, the officer found his complaint very curious. There had been a recent rash of murders in the camp; each victim had been a "stoolie." It was foolish--dangerously so at this time--to complain about anyone. But the commandant put the orderly in the punishment block for three days, taking the complaint with a perverse satisfaction. Kornfeld's refusal to sign the punishment forms was becoming a nuisance; this would save the commandant some trouble. The doctor had arranged his own execution.

Boris Kornfeld was not an especially brave man. He knew his life would be in danger as soon as the orderly was released from the cell block. Sleeping in the barracks, controlled at night by the camp-chosen prisoners, would mean certain death. So the doctor began staying in the hospital, catching sleep when and where he could, living in a strange twilight world where any moment might be his last.

But, paradoxically, along with this anxiety came tremendous freedom. Having accepted the possibility of death, Boris Kornfeld was now free to live. He signed no more papers or documents sending men to their deaths. He no longer turned his eyes from cruelty or shrugged his shoulders when he saw injustice. He said what he wanted and did what he could. And soon he realized that the anger and hatred and violence in his own soul had vanished. He wondered whether there lived another man in Russia who knew such freedom!

Now Boris Kornfeld wanted to tell someone about his discovery, about this new life of obedience and freedom. The Christian who had talked to him about Jesus had been transferred to another camp, so the doctor waited for the right person and the right moment.

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One gray afternoon he examined a patient who had just been operated on for cancer of the intestines. This young man with a melon-shaped head and a hurt, little-boy expression touched the soul of the doctor. The man's eyes were sorrowful and suspicious and his face deeply etched by the years he had already spent in the camps, reflecting a depth of spiritual misery and emptiness Kornfeld had rarely seen.

So the doctor began to talk to the patient, describing what had happened to him. Once the tale began to spill out, Kornfeld could not stop.

The patient missed the first part of the story, for he was drifting in and out of the anesthesia's influence, but the doctor's ardor caught his concentration and held it, though he was shaking with fever. All through the afternoon and late into the night, the doctor talked, describing his conversion to Christ and his new-found freedom.

Very late, with the perimeter lights in the camp glazing the windowpanes, Kornfeld confessed to the patient: "On the whole, you know, I have become convinced that there is no punishment that comes to us in this life on earth which is undeserved. Superficially, it can have nothing to do with what we are guilty of in actual fact, but if you go over your life with a fine-tooth comb and ponder it deeply, you will always be able to hunt down that transgression of yours for which you have now received this blow."

Imagine! The persecuted Jew who once believed himself totally innocent now saying that every man deserved his suffering, whatever it was.

The patient knew he was listening to an incredible confession. Though the pain from his operation was severe, his stomach a heavy, expansive agony of molten lead, he hung on the doctor's words until he fell asleep.

The young patient awoke early the next morning to the sound of running feet and a commotion in the area of the operating room. His first thought was of the doctor, but his new friend did not come. Then the whispers of a fellow patient told him of Kornfeld's fate.

During the night, while the doctor slept, someone had crept up beside him and dealt him eight blows on the head with a plasterer's mallet. And though his fellow doctors worked valiantly to save him, in the morning the orderlies carried him out, a still, broken form.

But Kornfeld's testimony did not die.

The patient pondered the doctor's last, impassioned words. As a result, he, too, became a Christian. He survived that prison camp and went on to tell the world what he had learned there.

The patient's name was Alexander Solzhenitsyn.



TOPICS: General Discusssion
KEYWORDS: christianity; salvation; sovereignty
Navigation: use the links below to view more comments.
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1 posted on 01/07/2003 12:04:00 PM PST by xzins
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To: fortheDeclaration; ShadowAce; P-Marlowe; Revelation 911; The Grammarian; SpookBrat; ...
ping to an awesome story

I originally read this in Chuck Colson's "Loving God."
2 posted on 01/07/2003 12:05:39 PM PST by xzins
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To: All
Very late, with the perimeter lights in the camp glazing the windowpanes, Kornfeld confessed to the patient: "On the whole, you know, I have become convinced that there is no punishment that comes to us in this life on earth which is undeserved. Superficially, it can have nothing to do with what we are guilty of in actual fact, but if you go over your life with a fine-tooth comb and ponder it deeply, you will always be able to hunt down that transgression of yours for which you have now received this blow."

Imagine! The persecuted Jew who once believed himself totally innocent now saying that every man deserved his suffering, whatever it was.

3 posted on 01/07/2003 12:06:52 PM PST by xzins
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To: xzins
Bump for a "looking forward" to a later read. Thanks Bro!
4 posted on 01/07/2003 12:12:57 PM PST by w_over_w
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To: xzins
Amen! A great story on how God works!
5 posted on 01/07/2003 12:42:39 PM PST by fortheDeclaration
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To: Alamo-Girl
Ping..........................MERRY CHRISTMAS RUSSIA..............BTTT
6 posted on 01/07/2003 12:51:20 PM PST by maestro
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To: maestro
Merry Christmas!
7 posted on 01/07/2003 1:00:28 PM PST by Alamo-Girl
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To: xzins
Beautiful and thank you. But could you, or someone else expound on this?

Very late, with the perimeter lights in the camp glazing the windowpanes, Kornfeld confessed to the patient: "On the whole, you know, I have become convinced that there is no punishment that comes to us in this life on earth which is undeserved. Superficially, it can have nothing to do with what we are guilty of in actual fact, but if you go over your life with a fine-tooth comb and ponder it deeply, you will always be able to hunt down that transgression of yours for which you have now received this blow."

8 posted on 01/07/2003 3:45:10 PM PST by xJones
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To: xzins; FormerLib
Very nice and thank you. Of course we in the Orthodox church are very aware of Alexander Solzhentizyn and I have read most of his books. I had not heard this story before though. Thank you so much.

Possibly worth an EO ping, FL?

9 posted on 01/07/2003 4:53:22 PM PST by MarMema
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To: crazykatz; don-o; JosephW; lambo; MarMema; MoJoWork_n; newberger; Petronski; The_Reader_David; ...
A requested Orthodox ping.
10 posted on 01/07/2003 6:46:51 PM PST by FormerLib
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To: xJones
I think there is a good chance that this physician became Orthodox ( Russian) as this was the prevailing Christianity in the gulags. So I may be able to offer some insight on this...

You may or may not know that Russia as a country accepted (Orthodox) Christianity in 988 via a prince who traveled to Constantinople and attended our Byzantine liturgy there in the Hagia Sophia.

Up until just before the Bolsheviks took over, Russia was a profoundly Christian country. Empire perhaps.

Just before the revolution when it became the USSR, there was a movement in Russia against Christianity. It became known as the Russian Intelligentsia.

more here
EXCERPT - "The development of this situation helped explain why public life in nineteenth-century Russia was dominated, first by members of the gentry, and then by the intelligentsia that sprang from it. (Pares) The aristocratic and clerical origins of the intelligentsia left a decisive imprint upon its ideas --- and it was these ideas, rather than any precise occupational function, that served to distinguish the intelligentsia from other social groups. (Kemp) It comprised those who, having received a modern education, felt alienated from the existing political and social order. They might earn their living as professional men, zemstvo employees, or even civil servants and landowners; indeed, the figure of the "repentant nobleman" stands at the cradle of Russian intellectual history. (Pares) The ideologies propounded by the Russian intelligentsia tended to be socially radical, democratic, and cosmopolitan, although they might have a concealed elitist, authoritarian, or nationalist streak. (Presniakov) These theories, derived from the advanced thought of contemporary Europe, often bore little relevance to the immediate problems confronting Russian society, but this seldom detracted from their appeal. Intellectuals were acknowledged to be their mentors by nearly all educated Russians, that is, by everyone not closely identified with the autocratic regime. (Pares) Their leadership was in normal times implicit, but in periods of crisis (1877-81, 1902-7), it became overt and decisive. (Pares) Russian socialism was therefore a product of the intelligentsia.."

Many Russian theolgians and philosophers, of the Orthodox church, spoke out at the time, protesting the turning away of Russia from Christianity.

The results of this turning away from Christianity became evident shortly afterward, when Russia became the USSR.

Solzhenitzyn, and many other writers of that time period and later, have espoused the idea that Russia deserved the suffering under communism which came to it, because they as a country had turned away from God.

"(Solzhenitzyn) thought that millions of ordinary people in Russia, through deep and on-going suffering, had achieved a "spiritual development of such intensity that the Western system in its present state of spiritual exhaustion does not look attractive... After the suffering of decades of violence and oppression, the human soul longs for things higher, warmer and purer than those offered by today's mass living habits."Is Solzhenitzyn a prophet for our Times?

Solzhenitzyn believed and stated, and I cannot find the quote just now, that a country had a sense of itself, that a nation could be Godly or not. That each nation needed to develop itself as devoted to God as a population.

Because of this belief in countries as Godlike or not so, he could then propose that a country could be allowed to suffer as a country for turning away from God.
There are a few links about this which I will post shortly which you may find interesting, as it seems to be quite appropriate for us, now, here in the US, to consider. In my opinion, that is.

11 posted on 01/07/2003 7:13:04 PM PST by MarMema
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To: xJones; xzins
I Highly recommend these two links for more reading.

From Under the Rubble

"Thus Christianity does not teach individualism or nationalism as a source of personality, but it elevates the innate individuality of the person and the national awareness of a culture as divine facets to reflect the glory of God's kingdom."

The self-willed descent into the Abyss

"What is remarkable about Landmarks, is not only the prescience of its authors, and the accuracy of their forecasts, but the fact that literally thousands of scholars poring over the pre-revolutionary literature of Russia managed to overlook its accuracy, and to ignore its remarkable foresight."

"As Berdyayev put it in his contribution, Russia had now been seized by evil spirits like those in Gogol’s nightmarish tales, or by the “possessed” of Dostoyevski’s prophetic imagination. “It was not simply a change of regime, but a spiritual disaster, a self-willed descent into the abyss."

12 posted on 01/07/2003 7:22:28 PM PST by MarMema
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To: George W. Bush
In case you are interested in any of my above postings.
With love.
13 posted on 01/07/2003 7:30:59 PM PST by MarMema
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To: MarMema
Good post, Mar. I, too, have long admired Solzhenitzyn and have read (a long time ago, now) a good deal of his material. I continually carry a newspaper clipping in my bible from the Jun 27, 1978 Cincinnati Enquirer. It is written by William Rusher and is entitled: "Solzhenitsyn: I have seen the future and it does not Work."

It's an awesome short piece based on an address at Harvard University when Solzhenitzyn was a 'celebrity.' Solz. wore out his welcome in that one visit to Harvard. It's getting ragged now, but its words still jump off the pages at me.

The West can survive only by reversing the process: "It is imperative to review the table of widespread human values. Its present incorrectness is astounding....Is it true that man is above everything? Is there no Superior Spirit above him? The world is approaching a major turn in history, equal to the turn from the Middle Ages to the Renaissance. It will exact from us a spiritual upsurge...to a new level of life where our physical nature will not be cursed as in the Middle Ages but, even more important, our spiritual being will not be trampled upon as in the Modern Era."

14 posted on 01/07/2003 7:42:44 PM PST by xzins
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To: xzins
I am a fan of his as well, and have both books, Landmarks and From Under the Rubble. Astonishing reading material from a long ago time but one from which we can learn today.

I recently discovered the writings of Alexander Schmemann, mentioned in one link above. And I do enjoy Dostoevsky a great deal.

Your posts are among my favorites here on FR.
Let us, together, "swim against the tide".

15 posted on 01/07/2003 8:00:22 PM PST by MarMema
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To: xJones
LOL. I finally found that quote...in one of my own posted links.

"As Alexander Solzhenitsyn has said: "Nations are the wealth of mankind, its collective personalities. The very least of them wears its own special colors and bears within itself a special facet of divine intention."

16 posted on 01/07/2003 8:02:11 PM PST by MarMema
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To: xzins
Oh, I forgot to mention, I have read that address at Harvard many times. It must have taken tremendous courage and faith for him to say those things at Harvard.

+Memory Eternal, Alexander.

17 posted on 01/07/2003 8:06:43 PM PST by MarMema
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To: xJones
you will always be able to hunt down that transgression of yours for which you have now received this blow."

Something like this was suggested to me once, when I was a boy and resisting an unjust punishment. I do not believe that it can be true. More than that; I believe that this claim is positively evil, diabolical in the original and literal sense.

It is no more true to argue that men are sinless or that through suffering they're able to win their redemption than to turn these same arguements inside out in suggesting that all evils are deserved and therefore no man-dealt torment, howsoever malevolent, an injustice. The path to truth never passes through a lie.

If all evil is deserved, then every evildoer is an agent of justice. More than this, the very concept of innocence becomes impossible. Though it's likely that life in the gulags was sufficiently hellish to plant this notion in Kornfeld, only in hell is this possible, and only a diabolical mind would seek to propagate such a belief among the living.

In fact, the Church's teaching on suffering relies on its being frequently unjust: it is this suffering that, if accepted as a personal Calvary, causes us crucified in Christ. As Paul says (Coloss 1:24 ): Now I rejoice in my sufferings for your sake, and in my flesh I complete what is lacking in Christ's afflictions for the sake of his body, that is, the church.

Human suffering is an invitation to participate in the suffering of the innocent Victim, not a Christian karma by which accounts are settled and books balanced.

18 posted on 01/07/2003 8:34:29 PM PST by Romulus
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To: xzins
Thanks for the ping.
19 posted on 01/07/2003 8:55:19 PM PST by CARepubGal
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To: MarMema
Merry EO Christmas!
20 posted on 01/07/2003 8:55:49 PM PST by CARepubGal
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To: xzins
read later
21 posted on 01/07/2003 10:26:42 PM PST by LiteKeeper
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To: Romulus; xzins; RnMomof7; MarMema
I believe this claim is positively evil.

While we disagree on a lot, not here.

The last person I heard insist individuals were "responsible" for all evils that befall them was Shirley Maclaine.

God is the creator of every moment in our lives; and the suffering therein is, as you say, an opportunity to be closer to the suffering of Christ.

C.S. Lewis in "The Problem of Pain" spoke to this also.

Hopefully, God's gift of conversion to Dr. Kornfeld advanced him beyond this gnostic idea of karma and into a fuller understanding of God's sovereignty in all things.

22 posted on 01/08/2003 12:35:18 PM PST by Dr. Eckleburg
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To: Dr. Eckleburg
positively evil

My guess is that it ties into his NOT having any Bible or other Christian literature available.

He's a new Christian; the only scripture he knows is the Lord's Prayer, and he derives his theology from "lead us not into temptation but deliver us from evil."

I think we need to be sympathetic of his circumstances.

23 posted on 01/08/2003 1:22:24 PM PST by xzins
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To: xzins
Of course you're right about that.

A harrowing, uplifting, life-affirming story, also, I should have added.

(I just really dislike Shirley Maclaine.)

24 posted on 01/08/2003 4:09:57 PM PST by Dr. Eckleburg
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To: Romulus; Dr. Eckleburg; xzins; RnMomof7; George W. Bush
You're taking it out of context and adding a great deal to it that is of your mind, and not from the post.
No one said that God brought the suffering, nor that it was karma.
The statement itself, standing alone, is consistent with ascetic thinking in Russia.

"Suffering cleanses the soul infected with the filth of sensual pleasure and detaches it completely from material things by showing it the penalty incurred as a result of its affection for them. This is why God in His justice allows the devil to afflict men with torments." -
St. Maximos the Confessor (+ 662)

"If you are not willing to repent through freely choosing to suffer, unsought sufferings will providentially be imposed on you." -
St. Thalassios (7th c.)

Here is a quote from the Orthodox Church of America website

"Jesus Christ shows us that human suffering has redeeming and sanctifying significance. It can be the means of finding God in the fallen world, the means of purification from carnal passions, the means of enlightenment and communion with God for everlasting life."

"The apostle Paul tells us that "the sufferings of the present time are not worth comparing with the glory that is to be revealed to us" (Romans 8:18). He says that our earthly sufferings are but the "slight momentary affliction" which "is preparing us for an eternal weight of glory beyond all comparision" (2 Corinthians 4:17)."
Those who suffer through sickness and disease with every virtue of Christ will receive "sufficient grace" from God to be strong in the Lord in their bodily weakness, and so direct their sufferings "not unto death" but to the "glory of God." (cf 2 Corinthians 12:7-10, John 11:4)

Suffering helps us to remember that this world is transient and unimportant. For whatever reason, it is clear that God allows a tremendous amount of suffering to take place around the world every day. Even if suffering is of demonic origin, to believe that God is almighty and all-powerful is to accept that God allows it. It is arrogant to question it, therefore, and the very essence of ascetic humility to place blame for your suffering upon yourself.

Pinging some friends to the discussion.

25 posted on 01/08/2003 4:41:51 PM PST by MarMema
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To: RnMomof7; George W. Bush
You know, in the Orthodox church there is actually no greater suffering than sin, which separates us from God. Physical suffering pales by comparison.

The parable of the Good Samaritan is interpreted by us in this way. The Samaritan is Christ, who arrives to relieve us of our suffering of sin. When the Samaritan tells the innkeeper to spend whatever is needed to bring the wounded man back to health, and promises to pay for it, we consider that to be a parallel to Christ giving whatever is needed for our sins, so that we may be brought to "health".

Your comments?

26 posted on 01/08/2003 5:03:46 PM PST by MarMema
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To: All
"Why do men learn through pain and suffering, and not through pleasure and happiness? Very simply, because pleasure and happiness accustom one to satisfaction with the things given in this world, wheras pain and suffering drive one to seek a more profound happiness beyond the limitations of this world. I am at this time in some pain, and I call on the name of Jesus - not necessarily to relieve the pain, but that Jesus, in Whom alone we may transcend this world, may be with me during it, and His will be in me. But in pleasure I do not call on Him; I am content then with what I have, and I think I need no more. And why is a philosophy of pleasure untenable? ... because pleasure is impermanent and unreliable, and pain is inevitable. In pain and suffering Christ speaks to us, and thus God is kind to give them to us; yes, and evil too - for in all of these we glimpse something of what must lie beyond." - excerpt from NOT OF THIS WORLD, Fr Seraphim Rose, A Russian Orthodox theologian


27 posted on 01/08/2003 5:14:04 PM PST by MarMema
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To: MarMema
Because of this belief in countries as Godlike or not so, he could then propose that a country could be allowed to suffer as a country for turning away from God.

I think we can make a case that God sometimes considers nations as a whole in judgement. But that is more typical of nations in the Old Testament. I tend to believe, and it is merely my own opinion, that under the New Covenant, God deals more with individuals and that there are essentially only two nations remaining in the world: the true Christian church (wherever its members may be) and all the rest of mankind. Of course, one could make the case that rich and free and powerful nations who choose evil may experience God's punishment or that He might withhold His protection from them. Many American Christians, for instance, have wondered if the 9/11 attack was a result of having tolerated abortion and riotous living for so many years. I'm still not convinced that God was punishing us in that way. I just don't feel that if God was punishing us for such grave sins that it would have been limited to a few thousand lives. I think that if God were punishing us, it would be much worse. Perhaps you can make a stronger case for Russia in turning to an antichristian system but the vast majority of the Russian people did not really make that choice. Much like in Nazi Germany, the horror was upon them before they knew it.

This story was rich and wonderful in its way. The doctor, whose parents were "cosmopolitan" Jews, a class of people who had been persecuted and were outside the 'pale' in Czarist Russia, looked at Christianity as their enemy. And so it was. When church and state march hand in hand, as did the Russian church and the czars, evil always happens. The same happened with the Roman church and empire, with the established church of England and with many other examples of state religions. The establishment of a state church has a very poor history, regardless of which religion is the state religion.

The Jews of Russia wrongly saw Christianity as their enemy. It was in fact those who represented the church and lead it who were most unchristian toward the Jews and they used the power of the state to persecute them. It is not rational to expect people to know the love of Christ because you are persecuting or punishing them. It never works.

One has to recall that Stalin even had a secular Jew, Molotov, as his foreign minister for a number of years. Russian Jews felt that there was a cause for hope. But this doctor and many other Jews found out that the new communist system was even worse than the old czarist system. And in the midst of the wreckage of his own life, the doctor saw the simple message of Christ, saw Christ as his only hope, found the freedom in Christ and the courage in Christ to lead a moral life in an utterly immoral situation. And as a result of his stand for the Christian faith, something he himself would never have expected, his story is known to us today in the person of Solzhenitzyn, the heir of his Christian belief. The doctor's work in saving Solzhenitzyn's life was no more important than the influence he had in his Christian testimony to the young Solzhenitzyn. In some sense, the doctor, in Christ, had a victory over Stalin. But the good doctor would already know this because he is likely, inasmuch as we know his spiritual state from Solzhenitzyn, to be in heaven and Stalin is almost certainly in hell. And Russia is free, more or less, of czars and commissars and state religions. There are many indications that Christian churches may prosper there.

It is, all in all, a very sweet story and well worth remembering.
28 posted on 01/08/2003 5:20:50 PM PST by George W. Bush
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To: MarMema
That is an interesting rerading of the good Samaritan...I have never considered it that way, But there is surely a parallel  ..I need to think on that a bit. Off hand I like it alot..just wonder about giving His life..but he does say whatever it costs

thanks for the study idea

29 posted on 01/08/2003 5:29:59 PM PST by RnMomof7 (Jhn 8:36 If the Son therefore shall make you free, ye shall be free indeed.)
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To: MarMema
The parable of the Good Samaritan is interpreted by us in this way. The Samaritan is Christ, who arrives to relieve us of our suffering of sin. When the Samaritan tells the innkeeper to spend whatever is needed to bring the wounded man back to health, and promises to pay for it, we consider that to be a parallel to Christ giving whatever is needed for our sins, so that we may be brought to "health".

This is a nice teaching. I think it may have limits though.

"Suffering cleanses the soul infected with the filth of sensual pleasure and detaches it completely from material things by showing it the penalty incurred as a result of its affection for them. This is why God in His justice allows the devil to afflict men with torments." - St. Maximos the Confessor (+ 662)

I think Western Christians would not agree much with this teaching.

"If you are not willing to repent through freely choosing to suffer, unsought sufferings will providentially be imposed on you." - St. Thalassios (7th c.)

I believe that Western Christians would vehemently object to this teaching. Seeking suffering is not a virtue. The wicked are not always punished (in this life). Perhaps the most disturbing portion of this to American Christians is the idea that Christians should "repent through freely choosing to suffer". Unless Thalassios was simply speaking of renouncing our sins (a mild suffering and we would not use that term), few of us could agree with this statement. If he was referring to anything that resembled the ascetic orders of monks of the Roman church, we would most certainly not agree. Suffering, of itself, is not holy. Renouncing sin and embracing freedom in Christ, as the doctor in our story did, is the end of suffering and the beginning of eternal life in Christ.

Perhaps there is a broader cultural context within which some of these Orthodox statements should be understood. I've often recognized that each church denomination has a distinctive culture and history and that outsiders never truly grasp the meanings that members take for granted. There is, within scriptural limits, always room for charity between Christians of differing language and backgrounds. When we look at our missionaries' work around the world, we know this to be true.
30 posted on 01/08/2003 5:36:53 PM PST by George W. Bush
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To: George W. Bush
I believe that Western Christians would vehemently object to this teaching.

Yes and I am not surprised. My point was not to sell the idea, but to show that the statement in the story is consistent with Russian Orthodox ascetic beliefs. Self-chastisement, for instance, is considered a virtue.

31 posted on 01/08/2003 5:45:13 PM PST by MarMema
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To: MarMema
In pain and suffering Christ speaks to us, and thus God is kind to give them to us; yes, and evil too - for in all of these we glimpse something of what must lie beyond.

This statement does not resemble my experience of God. God is sweetly generous to me, who deserves nothing from Him. Suffering is what I impose on myself when I sin or forget Him and His rightful place in my life. But that is my fault, not God's. If there are hard lessons I must learn, He is always there, always faithful. But He is not the author of sin as the Bible tells us. And in my experience, He is not to be considered the author of suffering. Nor am I certain that He finds any special merit in it. Christ calls us to new life and to freedom in Him, not to suffering. He has paid the price for us if we belong to Him.

It's not a perfect statement to answer any and all historical objections that might be brought against it but I thought I'd share with you a more common perspective from Western churches. At least, from any Protestant or Baptist or evangelical church I have heard of.

Nevertheless, there are some stories of people's lives in our traditions where they affirm that God taught them a great thing through a trial or suffering, something that was previously unknown to them and that they could have only learned through a trial of personal suffering. So, we are not solely some sort of spiritual hedonists as compared to the Eastern Orthodox. But a focus on asceticism or suffering is not central to a life of faith in the churches I'm aware of.
32 posted on 01/08/2003 5:49:42 PM PST by George W. Bush
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To: George W. Bush
Actually here is a fairly good overview if you are interested in our "take" on these things.
God does not manifest Himself to an impure heart.
33 posted on 01/08/2003 5:58:42 PM PST by MarMema
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To: MarMema
Yes and I am not surprised. My point was not to sell the idea, but to show that the statement in the story is consistent with Russian Orthodox ascetic beliefs. Self-chastisement, for instance, is considered a virtue.

I think an explanation offered earlier on the thread by another poster explains it better. The doctor simply had not had an opportunity to fully study and grasp all that scripture had to teach. And yet, his ignorance was no obstacle to God's purpose in his life nor did it cause him to fail in his personal Christian integrity as a camp doctor or in his witness to the young Solzhenitzyn. We might still wish that the doctor had had more time to learn scripture and to have a happier ending in his earthly life.

I wrote a bit about your mention of "self-chastisement" but erased it because I thought I should ask exactly what you meant by that phrase. There are certain practices known as "mortification of the flesh" which are held by the Roman church (more weakly in modern times) but which are rejected by non-Roman churches in the West.
34 posted on 01/08/2003 7:23:39 PM PST by George W. Bush
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To: MarMema
Actually here is a fairly good overview if you are interested in our "take" on these things. God does not manifest Himself to an impure heart.

But this describes only the monastic life, it seems. It does not describe your priests or patriarchs or ordinary believers, the vast bulk of your church. Surely these standards do not apply to ordinary clergy or believers. Nor would they actually seem directly applicable to the doctor in our story.

You should understand that for most of us here, the monastic life is largely incomprehensible. In many non-Roman churches in the West, it is emphasized that we are a priesthood of believers and that we are to be in the world but not of this world. I'm not sure that we practice that though, at least in the same sense as the great apostles did.
35 posted on 01/08/2003 8:23:59 PM PST by George W. Bush
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To: George W. Bush
Our patriarchs come from the monastic life. It is considered a countermeasure against power-lust. If you spend ten or more years living in a monastery, you are less likely to emerge as worldly and political in nature. Therefore more trustworthy to oversee within the church, you see.

All Orthodox Christians are called to the ascetic lifestyle, not just the monastics. We are to advance as our spiritual leaders believe us ready and as we gain spiritual maturity. The quality you defined as quaint earlier is one "sign" of this spiritual training.

If suffering and redemption are not closely linked, why did Christ suffer so severely in order to redeem us?

36 posted on 01/08/2003 11:13:32 PM PST by MarMema
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To: George W. Bush
great lent

This might be helpful in explaining our view.

37 posted on 01/08/2003 11:19:03 PM PST by MarMema
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To: Dr. Eckleburg
I agree. Shirley Maclain makes my skin crawl...

Wasn't she with "the partridge family" or something? The 'kids' of that family were all screwed up in real life. She probably gets some of the credit.
38 posted on 01/09/2003 5:19:27 AM PST by xzins
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To: MarMema
What practices are included in "mortification of the flesh" in the Orthodox tradition? You are perhaps aware of some of the excessive practices within the church of Rome historically.
39 posted on 01/09/2003 5:19:32 AM PST by George W. Bush
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To: xzins
That was Shirley Jones, I think.

Shirley Maclain is much stranger. Actually everyone would have forgotten her entirely except for her New Age religious practices. After that television special, she was so widely ridiculed as a gullible idiot that she pretty much disappeared. Fortunately, the Hollywood crowd tends to completely implode when they turn toward some (false) religious practice.
40 posted on 01/09/2003 5:23:34 AM PST by George W. Bush
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To: George W. Bush
I'll bet you're gonna quibble over a last name....LOL!!! :?)

SHIRLEY did it --- isn't that enough!
41 posted on 01/09/2003 5:27:44 AM PST by xzins
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To: xzins
You're right. I humbly apologize for being such a petty stickler over last names.

DEATH TO SHIRLEY, THE SOURCE OF ALL EVIL!
42 posted on 01/09/2003 7:02:03 AM PST by George W. Bush
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To: George W. Bush
DEATH TO SHIRLEY, THE SOURCE OF ALL EVIL!

ROTFLOL!!!!

43 posted on 01/09/2003 7:09:56 AM PST by xzins
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To: xzins; MarMema; George W. Bush; RnMomof7; Romulus
Shirley Jones was the Partridge family mom; married and now separated from Marty Ingles; previously widow of Jack Cassidy, actor.

Shirley Maclaine, Warren Beatty's sister and Rat Pack girlfriend, wrote two books on reincarnation, etc. She wrote that any child who dies "deserves" its fate because of its "bad karma from previous lives."

Although she was great in the "The Apartment," she does the devil's bidding, IMO.

All glory to God.

As an aside, the problem with self-flagellation as a means to spiritual growth is that once again it places our good standing with God in our hands and not in God's hands (salvation through works).

So while life's trials and tribulations do make us stronger for the effort we expend to surmount them in God's name, we can't say that enormous injustices are of our own making, i.e. the Jews in Nazi Germany or the blacks in the ghetto, or the starving Somalis.

Our lot in life was given to us by God, and His plan is all that matters. We will do with our lives as He sees fit.

That should give us (and Dr. Kornfeld) the strength to vanquish foes and praise His name.

44 posted on 01/09/2003 9:37:51 AM PST by Dr. Eckleburg
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To: Dr. Eckleburg
See 40, 41, 42, 43

:>)
45 posted on 01/09/2003 9:40:45 AM PST by xzins
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To: George W. Bush; xzins
Yes, but when one retires, there's three more to take their place, since Hollywood is a ripe field for sowing lies.

i.e. Uma Thurman is the daughter of Robert Thurman, major Buddhist wacko who makes Richard Gere look like an acolyte.

46 posted on 01/09/2003 9:46:57 AM PST by Dr. Eckleburg
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To: xzins
Late to the party, as always.

Pardonez moi. 8~)

47 posted on 01/09/2003 9:48:58 AM PST by Dr. Eckleburg
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To: Dr. Eckleburg
pardonez moi

SHIRLEY'S are evil. (surely, they are.)

48 posted on 01/09/2003 9:52:29 AM PST by xzins
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To: Dr. Eckleburg
As an aside, the problem with self-flagellation as a means to spiritual growth

I think the largest objection the Orthodox would have to it is that it defiles the body, which was created in the image of God to become the likeness of God.

49 posted on 01/09/2003 10:36:49 AM PST by MarMema
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To: George W. Bush
What practices are included in "mortification of the flesh" in the Orthodox tradition?

An extremely simple lifestyle, with much fasting and prayer, secluded from the worldly and secular life the rest of us have to battle today.

50 posted on 01/09/2003 10:40:57 AM PST by MarMema
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