The Institutes Book 1, Chapter 3

The Institutes of the Christian Religion ^ | 1500's | John Calvin

[anniegetyourgun]

Darkness existed (in the beginning/creation) until He brought the Light. Light rejected = back to just plain old darkness.

I have done lengthy studies in Romans and find this whole set of verses you replayed here to be so fascinating. Have you noticed the progression of 1)disregard to 2) speculation to 3) lies to 4) living in sin. Interesting stuff. Disregard = rejecting the light. Speculation = the state of returning to darkness and feeling the need to fill it with something. Lies = what it is filled with. And living in sin = Eyes adjusting to the darkness, perhaps?

Throwing out more food for thought.

[RnMomof7]

Good thoughts..I have been reading genesis ..It reveals alot about the Character and Holiness of God..as well as His justice and mercy

[anniegetyourgun]

I love Genesis! In fact....I just love the Word of God. What's your favorite book of them all, Mom?

[ksen]

My favorite passage is Ge 1:1-Re 22:21 ;^)

[anniegetyourgun]

Not fair! You have to tell us which ONE is your fav!

[ksen]

Ok, ok, Isaiah barely edges out Jeremiah with me.

[anniegetyourgun]

Hhhmmm, seems like we ought to allow for a NT choice too....now that you mention it...

What a grand book you've chosen as favorite.

[RnMomof7]

OT? History Genesis ..Prophetic..Isaiah...Wisdom Psalms (Job fits in there too)

[RnMomof7]

My favorite Chapters are Eze 47 and companion Rev22..to me they are a picture of the grace of God..

[RnMomof7]

#29

[Calvinist_Dark_Lord]

I have done lengthy studies in Romans and find this whole set of verses you replayed here to be so fascinating. Have you noticed the progression of 1)disregard to 2) speculation to 3) lies to 4) living in sin. Interesting stuff. Disregard = rejecting the light. Speculation = the state of returning to darkness and feeling the need to fill it with something. Lies = what it is filled with. And living in sin = Eyes adjusting to the darkness, perhaps?

You seem to have started your "progression" too late in the chain. Notice verse 18: For the wrath of God is revealed from heaven against all ungodliness and unrighteousness of men, who hold the truth in unrighteousness.

Some translations have the word "hold" as suppressed, or repressed. The verse teaches that truth is known, (although not a total or even salvific knowlege), and men suppress it because of their unrighteousness...i.e., they know their lives do not match up with the knowlege of God that they have, and out of what the "psychobabble" schools call 'cognitive dissonance', deny knowlege of that truth.

The more it changes, the more it stays the same.

[Penny1]

Hey ksen, fun to find you here!

I've just been reading through some of the discussion and enjoying it, glad you started this thread/study.

...and adding my 2 cents.... ;)

Just because man has some inherent knowledge of God and need for God, that does not mean that man will worship Him as the one true God, as the almighty Creator. Romans 1 gives us the picture of that dichotomy. Man knows God, so he is without excuse, yet he suppresses that truth--he suppresses that knowledge of God, in order to avoid worshipping and glorifying Him as God. But...the need for God is still there, so man then substitutes anything and everything he can to try to fulfill that need for God. This results in worshiping of the creature rather than the creator, or in the case of many of the religions in the world, the worshiping of a god that simply doesn't exist.

I think that in many ways, in these first chapters, Calvin is laying the groundwork for the point that man knows God, that God has revealed Himself to man, so that man is without excuse. The punchline of what man does with this knowledge and need, in terms of salvation, is still to come.

[Dr. Eckleburg]

This is great -- reading the Institutes step by step.

"I readily acknowledge that designing men have introduced a vast number of fictions into religion, with the view of inspiring the populace with reverence or striking them with terror, and thereby rendering them more obsequious..."

An early conspiracy theorist...and so true.

[RnMomof7]

I think it is a great idea too..if you read then alone you skim,here you think

[anniegetyourgun]

Good catch....and that certainly fits with all that I know about the sinful mind. After all, isn't that what repentence is all about - agreeing with God (and thereby the knowledge He has already revealed) about what constitutes sin?

[Calvinist_Dark_Lord]

i am still curious over whether or not Calvin endoursed the idea of immediate imputation, that is to say 'implanted' knowlege of God without virtue of a media, such as creation in Romans 1 and Psalm 19.

[Corin Stormhands]

This is great -- reading the Institutes step by step.

You may want to sit down before you read this, but I appreciate this too. I've got so many things on my reading list(s) that I'd probably never get around to reading these on my own.

Doing it this way, with the commentary is very helpful.

Thanks, ksen.

[the_doc]

Ask OP if he has anything definitive on this. I am not sure when the question of immediate versus mediate imputation surfaced.

The real problem arose in the New School Theology among Edwards' supposed spiritual descendants. They MISUNDERSTOOD Edwards. Alas, so did Charles Hodge, as Warfied proved.

[Calvinist_Dark_Lord]

Ask OP if he has anything definitive on this. I am not sure when the question of immediate versus mediate imputation surfaced.

Thanks for the reply. As far as i know, this particular issue has been around for quite a while. The Roman Catholic Church rejected immediate imputation according to Sproul. What has made me curious about the issue recently is that i have been considering the case of John the Baptist leaping for joy in his mother's womb at the sound of Mary's salutation. Thanks again

[Dr. Eckleburg]

You may want to sit down before you read this, but I appreciate this too.

Thanks for the warning, CS. Those dead faints can be unsightly. 8~)