The Institutes Book 1, Chapter 6

The Institutes of the Christian Religion ^ | 1500's | John Calvin

[Calvinist_Dark_Lord]

That's not what I'm addressing. What I am addressing is that Calvin said that God intended for the Creation to act as a clear revelation of Himself. Man's nature, according to Calvin, overrode what God intended. Everything I've ever heard from my FRCalvinist friends is that whatever God intends, happens. Except in this case.

i'm still convinced that such an idea is absurd on it's face, but putting that aside for a second, let's take a look at what you are saying above.

...the Creation to act as a clear revealtion of Himself... And so the creation does act. Just because man supresses the revelation of God through Creation it does not follow that the nature of man thwarted the purpose of God! Man must recieve the revelation in order to suppress it! The result being that God's purpose is accomplished. This is nothing more than an exposition of Romans 1:18

[ksen]

Kevin it is HIS plan not ours..You are assuming His purpose was to bring all men to him as opposed to give all men a knowlege of Him..that is two different things..

Well, actually I am assuming that God gives everyone a fair opportunity to come to Him by faith; not that everyone will come to Him.

Do you agree that having a general knowlege differs from a personal knowlege?

Yes.

Kevin why do you believe God made man?

For His own good pleasure.

[ksen]

Alright, I'm willing to admit that I am reading Calvin with a jaundiced eye.

So you are saying that Creation does act as a clear revelation of God (as God intended), but our nature takes that clear revelation and perverts it (did God also intend this?)?

Ok, I guess I can go along with that.

[RnMomof7]

Well, actually I am assuming that God gives everyone a fair opportunity to come to Him by faith; not that everyone will come to Him.

Well I guess that is something we will be looking at:>) So I do not want to run ahead with what I consider a natural follow up question *grin*

I will ask who determines what is "fair" God or men?

For His own good pleasure.

Yep..we are made for His glory..so it makes sense to this womans mind He would desire to show himself in nature..

Long before I was a calvinist I heard someone say in a Sunday School class that God made men because he loves us and wanted company....that was pathetic theology

[Corin Stormhands]

Long before I was a calvinist I heard someone say in a Sunday School class that God made men because he loves us and wanted company....that was pathetic theology...

What if it's His good pleasure to have company? ;-)

[RnMomof7]

He does have company..Himself..He was complete for all eternity (we can not wrap our minds around that can we:>)

[Corin Stormhands]

He does have company...

Never implied He needed company Rn, just that He wanted it.

[RnMomof7]

So if he did not NEED company why did He want it?

[Corin Stormhands]

You need everything you want?

You're making a mountain out of a molehill over a casual comment.