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The FReeper Foxhole Remembers "Black Thursday" Schweinfurt, 1943 - Jan. 17th, 2003
http://www.af.mil/news/Oct1999/n19991015_991907.html ^ | Tech. Sgt. Gary W. Boyd

Posted on 01/17/2003 5:34:18 AM PST by SAMWolf

U.S. Military History, Current Events and Veterans Issues

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Black Thursday
Schweinfurt Oct. 14, 1943

Imagine if a squadron-sized unit simply failed to return to duty after taking part in a contingency.



That's precisely what confronted in the 305th Bombardment Group 59 years ago, following what is perhaps the greatest air battle in history.

Rightly called "Black Thursday" by veterans, the Oct. 14, 1943 mission to Schweinfurt, Germany, was the most arduous of the war. Incredibly, of the 15 group aircraft able to participate in the mission, the Luftwaffe claimed 13, and 130 crewmembers.

Of the downed airmen, 40 died and 20 were wounded, while another 79 became prisoners of war. Four airmen evaded capture and eventually returned to duty, while the remaining crewmen spent the war interned in Switzerland.



It took many months for the "Can Do" group to recover from the raid, and the wounds of that day are still felt by the group's veterans. The 305th BG had raided Schweinfurt before, on Aug. 17, 1943. The experience had been chilling, with much aerial opposition and flak, but the group held together and lost no aircraft.

The "Black Thursday" Schweinfurt raid was completely different. Mistakes up and down the chain of command -- from security lapses to poor weather briefings -- led to unmitigated disaster for the Eighth Air Force and nearly halted the combined bombing offensive.

Departing from the disciplined model of Col. Curtis LeMay, the group struggled with one problem after another in the bad weather that blanketed England. The group missed its assigned rendezvous with its element leader and every other subsequent navigational waypoint over England. Eventually, the 305th formed up on the wrong combat wing -- the 1st Combat Wing rather than the 40th -- becoming the "low group" in a very unconventional four-group alignment.

Unlike England, the weather over occupied Europe was generally excellent for the defending fighters, only adding more misery to the 305th's longest day, as flak, fighters and coast watchers had no trouble plotting their course.



Rocket-firing German Messerschmitt-110s and Messerschmitt-210s destroyed most of the 305th BG before they even reached the Rhein River -- some 115 miles short of the target. Only three of the group's B-17s made it to the target area -- one of those crews released its bomb load while the aircraft burned.

Only two 305th BG B-17s left Schweinfurt that day, and their crews managed to survive the long trip back to England by tucking into the 92nd Bomb Group's protective formation. Many tales of bravery transpired that day, such that unbelievable courage was the rule rather than the exception.

Unfortunately, there weren't enough survivors to write many decoration packages.

Since only two moderately damaged "Flying Fortresses" had taxied to the maintenance area, Lt. Col. Thomas McGehee, commander of the 305th, asked a returning crewman where the rest of the group's B-17s were. He received the most chilling reply in 305 AMW history.



"Sir, there are no more ships," the crewman said. "We are the only ones left." The ground crews of the missing 13 aircraft refused to give up hope and desperately milled about the hardstands for hours until ordered to stand down.

Leadership sometimes requires that higher headquarters be disappointed. Given the abysmal weather over England, the lack of coordination in the air, and the known, strong aerial opposition ahead, the Schweinfurt mission should have been scrubbed.

Despite the odds, the Eighth Air Force had not turned back, had hit its intended target, and suffered the loss of more than 600 crewmen that day. As a result, the face of the bomber offensive changed almost immediately. Never again would the Eighth Air Force commit so many lives to deep penetrations of occupied Europe without adequate fighter protection. No group ever again suffered the horrendous 87-percent attrition rate the "Can Do" group did that October day.

When the 42nd "Rainbow" Infantry Division liberated Schweinfurt in 1945, they sent the Nazi flag flying over the town hall to the men of the 305th Bombardment Group. Now housed at the Air Force Museum in Dayton, Ohio, the flag is inscribed with the simple words, "The Rainbow has avenged your losses at Schweinfurt."





TOPICS: VetsCoR
KEYWORDS: 8thairforce; b17; daylightbombing; freeperfoxnole; schweinfurt; wwii
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To: AntiJen
"Schweinefurt"
41 posted on 01/17/2003 11:51:10 AM PST by patton (Spelling in Englisch gives me a headache)
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To: All
Show your support, Have your e-mail or snail mail letter of support and appreciation HAND DELIVERED to a Service member.
42 posted on 01/17/2003 11:59:14 AM PST by SAMWolf (To look into the eyes of the wolf is to see your soul)
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To: ThomasJefferson
I'm sorry to hear about your uncle, I consider him a hero along with all the others who flew daylight raids over Europe.
43 posted on 01/17/2003 12:01:21 PM PST by SAMWolf (To look into the eyes of the wolf is to see your soul)
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To: facedown
Thanks for another excellent link facedown.
44 posted on 01/17/2003 12:02:16 PM PST by SAMWolf (To look into the eyes of the wolf is to see your soul)
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To: JackelopeBreeder
Thank your uncle for his service from me next time you talk to him.
45 posted on 01/17/2003 12:03:05 PM PST by SAMWolf (To look into the eyes of the wolf is to see your soul)
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To: ex-snook
I again thank you for your service, we can never thank you and the others enough for what you accomplished during the War.
46 posted on 01/17/2003 12:04:24 PM PST by SAMWolf (To look into the eyes of the wolf is to see your soul)
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To: Lee'sGhost
We're planning a Ploesti Thread. Was your dad on that mission?
47 posted on 01/17/2003 12:05:29 PM PST by SAMWolf (To look into the eyes of the wolf is to see your soul)
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To: AntiJen
Present!
48 posted on 01/17/2003 12:08:41 PM PST by manna
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To: AntiJen
Status:
Dropped in, currently dangling from ceiling fixture.
Awaiting SAR....
49 posted on 01/17/2003 12:10:11 PM PST by Darksheare (This Tagline has been deleted by the Americans for Socialist Septicemia, All hail Brak!)
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To: SAMWolf
It's one of the few things he ever talked about re the war, but for the life of me I'm not sure he was actually in it. I'll have to find out somehow. Any idea how I might check military records?
50 posted on 01/17/2003 12:12:31 PM PST by Lee'sGhost (Edwards sucks (excuse my French))
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To: Lee'sGhost
Not really. But if you know his bombers name or his unit there may be a way to see if it was on the mission.
51 posted on 01/17/2003 12:17:25 PM PST by SAMWolf (To look into the eyes of the wolf is to see your soul)
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To: SAMWolf
Good idea. Thanks.
52 posted on 01/17/2003 12:37:36 PM PST by Lee'sGhost (Edwards sucks (excuse my French))
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To: HiJinx
Martin Caidin and Ed Beach were prominent in my library very early on. Black Friday was one of the most chilling books I ever read, and that includes Stephen King's works.

I guess you mean "Black Thursday". It is an awesome book, in my opinion. I read it first when I was about 12 years old. B-17's rule!

Walt

53 posted on 01/17/2003 12:54:01 PM PST by WhiskeyPapa (To sin by silence when they should protest makes cowards of men)
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To: SAMWolf
"Despite all the terrible destruction of German cities, despite all the hardship and death it brought to the civilian population and industrial workers--whose ordeal was now often worse than the soldiers at the front--it was not,as we have seen, area bombing by night that struck the vital blow at German survival. This mission was accomplished to a far greater extent by the selective and precision bombing of the American Eighth Air Force in daylight. By careful choice of target, this first blocked the bottle-necks of armaments production, and finally brought the whole German war machine to a standstill."

Luftwaffe War Diaries, p.340 by Cajus Bekker

54 posted on 01/17/2003 1:03:21 PM PST by WhiskeyPapa (To sin by silence when they should protest makes cowards of men)
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To: SAMWolf
"In the course of the year 1943 the accent of the Reich defense shifted more and more toward action against daylight raiders. Even though numerically the British were still stronger than the Americans and were undoubtedly a great trial for for the civilian population, the American precision raids were of greater consequence to the war industry. They received priority attention over the British raids on our towns."

"The First and the Last" p. 178, Adolf Galland

Boy it really torques the Brits off when you point out little factoids like this.

Walt

55 posted on 01/17/2003 1:06:19 PM PST by WhiskeyPapa (To sin by silence when they should protest makes cowards of men)
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To: WhiskeyPapa
Precision bombing was the way to go but until a long range escort was availble the cost was very high.
56 posted on 01/17/2003 1:17:12 PM PST by SAMWolf (To look into the eyes of the wolf is to see your soul)
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To: SAMWolf
Precision bombing was the way to go but until a long range escort was availble the cost was very high.

A very unhappy "what didn't" was that an effective long range escort was not developed sooner. And what is most tragic is that that escort WAS IN ENGLAND in the summer of 1942. That was the P38.

There was a P38 group sent to England; shortly it was detailed to North Africa.

The P-38 would and could have been MUCH more effective as an escort than it was, and earlier than it was.

As many may not know, the P-38 was plagued by mechanical problems that limited its effectiveness. I don't recall the exact problems, but they caused the lead to separate out of the gasoline, causing detonation, and engine failure. A re-designed carburator --later-- fixed the problem. As it was, even a few dozen P-38's made a big difference in breaking up the German fighter attacks on the bomber boxes. But the technical problems were not given top priority, and no large P-38 force was built up in '42-'43. Some DID go to Guadalcanal. Great thinking.

The big wigs in England just kept bulling ahead, thinking they were killing the German day fighter force, when that just wasn't happening. They seemed to think the bomber boxes were these flying buzz saws that would wreck the German fighter force. Black Thursday was the final wake up call. The 8th had lost 45 Forts on a raid to Munster the week previous to 14 October, '43.

It was finally an assistant secretary of War that came out to England in the Summer of '43 that got the ball rolling faster on the redesigned Mustang.

But the Germans had defeated the day bomber as of 10/14/43.

Walt

57 posted on 01/17/2003 1:44:22 PM PST by WhiskeyPapa (To sin by silence when they should protest makes cowards of men)
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To: WhiskeyPapa
It was just the old "The bomber will always get through" thinking that all sides had. The Germans made the same mistake in the Battle of Britain.

Then there was the "stay close to the bombers" vs the the "free roaming" escort arguments.

Unfortuantely, while the higher ups were debating all this the air crews were paying the price in high losses.
58 posted on 01/17/2003 2:04:31 PM PST by SAMWolf (To look into the eyes of the wolf is to see your soul)
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To: SAMWolf
Being the kind of SAC crew dog who actually read books in college, I had this terrible recurring dream that one day I'd go into crew briefing on Guam and they'd say: "Gentlemen, your target for today is..." and put a slide of Schweinfurt up on the screen.

So I was 'kind-of' ready when on 19 Dec. '72 they put up a slide of... not Schweinfurt....

I have heard more than 600 J57s running at the same time. Have you any idea what that sounds like?

59 posted on 01/17/2003 2:25:37 PM PST by Grut
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To: Grut
Not even a clue, I've read about the 1,000 bomber raids and it's just mind boogling to think about them.
60 posted on 01/17/2003 2:29:05 PM PST by SAMWolf (To look into the eyes of the wolf is to see your soul)
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