Rense.com
Her View Maitreya Is
The Antichrist
From Rick Visneau <ricvis@knology.net>
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I couldn't decide whether to post this or not, but I listened to the interview of Ms. Keating on the Art Bell show several months back, and she strikes me as an honest person. She worked with the late Fr. Malachai Martin, and has researched the subject very well. The reason I posted it is because there have been several other threads discussing this in the past on FR, and it seemed to be something that alot of freepers were interested in.
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To: poisedwoman
fyi
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To: Space Wrangler
Just to make sure no one from the tin-foil brigade gets this confused, Kathleen Keating should not be mistaken for Cathy Keating, first lady of Oklahoma and the wife of the future vice-president.
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To: ObfusGate
Did not realize that was the Gov. of OK's wife's name. Kathleen Keating was a research assistant for the late Father Malachai Martin, who dedicated his life to research on the AC, as well as the Fatima prophecies. No relation to the Governer of OK.
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To: Space Wrangler
Just who is Maitreya, and where does he live? What does he do for a living, and when is he supposed to make his move?
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To: Space Wrangler
Maitreya Is The Antichrist
OK, that's ONE question answered.
Next question
Who / what is Maitreya?
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To: Space Wrangler
Stay out of the sun.
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To: Space Wrangler
Who is Maitreya?
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To: Space Wrangler
You might find this useful:
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To: Space Wrangler
The real question is, is he a Democrook, which he should be well qualified for.
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To: Space Wrangler
Maitreya is the Antichrist
No, dammit, I'm the antichrist, I'm the antichrist!
Will you people finally get it right for once?
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To: Space Wrangler
Maitreya's spokesperson was on Art Bells show last week or the week before. I heard alot of it. I think he is the anti-christ and alot of the callers did too.
I had been wondering who Kathleen Keating thought was the anti-christ for a long time, because she declined to say so on the art bell show earlier this year.
Now that she says thats who she thinks it is, I am more convinced.
Maitreya's info website is http://www.shareintl.org/
Sorry I cant make it link.
Phil
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To: Space Wrangler
Well if you want to know there are a lot of antichrists on the earth right now.
"It is the man who denies that Jesus is the Christ. Such a man is the antichrist - he denies the Father and the Son." I John 2:22
"But every spirit that does not acknowledge Jesus is not from God. This is the spirit of the antichrist, which you have heard is coming and even now is already in the world." I John 4:3
Do you know how many people throughout the ages have claimed that "The" antichrist is on earth now?
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To: Space Wrangler
Sorry. My number is 668, which means I am Nieghbor of the Beast, and it turns out that the AntiChrist is little old 72 year old Elsie Maven, arthritic grandmother of 4. She makes a mean chocolate chip cookie.
A very mean chocolate chip cookie.
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To: bigsur
I thought it was my turn to be the anti-Christ today . I'm sure it's my turn.
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To: Lurking Libertarian
Gang,
Check out: here for more info.
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To: Izzy Dunne, Yellow Rose of Texas
Take a look Here to find out. Judge for yourself.
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Is Bono the Anti-Christ?
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Reply |
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To: mit
Hey, I agree with you for once. It is your turn to be the antichrist today! :-)
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To: bigsur
No, dammit, I'm the antichrist, I'm the antichrist!
Elsie Maven is the antichrist.
The antichrist wears support hose and needs a hearing aid.
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To: twinmag
lmao
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To: Space Wrangler
But you have an annointing from the Holy One, and all of you know the truth. I do not write to you because you do not know the truth, but because you do know it and because no lie comes from the truth. Who is the liar? It is the man who denies Jesus is the Christ. Such a man is the antichrist--he denies the Father and the Son. No one who denies Son has the Father; whoever acknowledges the Son has the Father also.
See that you what you have heard from the beginning remains in you. If it does, you will also remain in the Son and in the Father. And this is what He has promised us--even eternal life.
Your best weapon against this person is familiarity with God's word. If you know God, you will know the AntiChrist as well.
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To: Lazamataz
Wasn't she in The Matrix?
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To: Space Wrangler
The real test is... does he liken himself to Elvis?
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To: twinmag
The world teacher as he calls himself, lord maitreya. Lord maitreya claims to be the one expected of by all major religions. He claims to be the Messiah that the Jews are waiting for. He claims to the Krishna who the Hindus expect to arrive. He claims to be maitreya Buddha whom the Buddhists expect. He claims to be Imam Mahdi or the Messiah that the Muslims are looking for. But even more shocking he claims to the be Christ whom Christians are waiting for.
Maitreya means Lord of Love. He claims to have fulfilled 2 Thes. 4:17 as the Christ came in the clouds when he flew in an airplane from the Himalayas. All others that claim to be Christ are the false christs and he even holds claim to Matthew 24:4,5. "According to esoteric teachings, Maitreya manifested himself 2,000 years ago in Palestine by overshadowing his disciple Jesus, now the Master Jesus. This time Maitreya has come himself." as quoted right from his web site.
"Jesus of Nazareth and the Christ are not one and the same person." Maitreya claims that Jesus was nothing more than a master of wisdom such as Buddha, Krishna, Mohammed had each become a master of wisdom. According to Maitreya, Jesus was nothing more than a man that allowed Maitreya to use his body. Maitreya is the so called energy, the Christ-principle, that Jesus was allowed to manifest. According Maitreya, "It was, therefore, the consciousness of the Christ, Maitreya, which was seen and experienced by those around Jesus. The answer is that Jesus was a man who, as a result of the process of evolution, became a Son of God -- as does everyone eventually."
"Jesus' death was the fulfillment of the task for that life, and it was Maitreya who resurrected the body from the tomb. This presentation of ancient occult knowledge in symbolic form is one of the methods which the Spiritual Hierarchy uses to teach humanity, and to convey knowledge to those who have ears to hear and eyes to see.
"The Master Jesus has been living in Rome for over four years, and He will take over the throne of St Peter. The Christian world is to be awakened... to recognize their place within a worldwide divine revelation and see the Christ as representing all the faiths and taking His rightful place as World Teacher. He is the World Teacher and not a Christian teacher. He Himself told us that He had other folds and to them He has meant as much as He has meant to the orthodox Christian. They may not call Him Christ, but they have their own name for Him and follow Him as truly and faithfully as their Western brethren."
According to Maitreya there is a day approaching called the Day of Declaration. This day where the entire world will hear or see Maitreya. He supposedly will be broadcast to the world, on every radio and television station. Maitreya even claims those that do not have a television or a radio on will hear him in their own language and dialect in their minds. He claims on this day that there will be millions of healings where the world will know that the "Christ" has come."
"All eyes will see Him will be fulfilled, in the only way in which it can be fulfilled. We will see His face, but He will not speak. His thoughts, His ideas, His call to humanity for justice, sharing, right relationships and peace, will take place silently, telepathically. Each of us will hear Him inwardly in our own language. In this way, He will re-enact on a world-wide scale the true happenings of Pentecost 2,000 years ago."
(POSTER'S NOTE: Frankly, this sounds like horse hockey to me.)
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To: Dog Gone
I KNEW that you would agree with me!!!! That means I MUST be the anti-Christ today.
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To: Lurking Libertarian
"Who is Maitreya?"
He is the head master. Christ served under him. That would make him an antichrist wanna be at least.
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To: Lurking Libertarian
From reading a little the tripe from his website, I'd say he is has to be a frontrunner in the vice-prez sweepstakes for Algore.
His Top Two Priorities (inspire mankind to...)
[1] Share the world's resources
[2] Restore the earth's ecological balance
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To: Hootowl
Yeah-- It does seem almost a little too obvious doesn't it? I just posted here for discussion purposes, as I find this a most interesting subject. It's all just a little to neat, with Matriyea wearing the turbin and all. Who knows? I sure don't claim to, just wanted to see some discussion on the matter.
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To: Joee
From the website linked above:
His Top Two Priorities (inspire mankind to...)
[1] Share the world's resources
[2] Restore the earth's ecological balance
Yup...sure sounds like a Democrap to me...LOL!
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To: Space Wrangler
I've read a lot of different speculations on how and when the beast will come, but, this one does make a lot of sense, considering the technology we have now. Having an ET come and bring peace to the world and advance our technology would sure win a lot of support.
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To: Lazamataz
These things are so painful to hand out on threads like this... but what choice is there?!
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To: mit
"That means I MUST be the anti-Christ today."
If you answer this question correctly, you might qualify.
Would you send Christ back to Castro too?
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To: Space Wrangler, et. al.
The anitchrist, reguardless of the title he uses, will be the one who establishes a short period of peace in the middle east, when the Israelies will feel secure in a land of unwalled villages, which is definitely not the case now. By this reason, moreso than any other, he will be hailed as the savior (the Israelies will call him the messiah and honor him as such), of the world, having come up with an equitable solution to that eternal struggle.
The period of peace will end when he declares himself to be God.
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To: Hootowl
Sounds like quite a resume. You sure this isn't Al Gore were talking about?
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To: Space Wrangler
Antichrist, panty-christ. I'm going to Valhalla. You Xtians can battle it out.
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To: bigsur
...and upon his tinfoil helmet were the numbers six hundred three score and six...
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To: Space Wrangler
After looking at his picture I am quite disappointed. He doesn't look very evil. I figured he would look more like Rasputin with the hypnotic eyes. Oh no I made a big mistake! I forgot your not suppoused to look at the antichrists eyes.
I read Kathleen Keatings book "the Final Warning". There was nothing really new in it that I haven't seen elsewhere. I was a little ticked off that right in the middle of the book she starts trying to sell products(although the prices listed are slightly cheaper purchased through the book than at the local religious store). I had flashbacks to Y2K. I try to read those types of books as good science fiction never putting too much faith in them.
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To: goliath
or check here
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To: teresat
Reading through this thread it seems some have skipped right over skepticism and gone straight to ridicule.
A few years ago I came across a few verses in Second Peter which seem appropriate to the discussion.
"He is especially hard on those who follow their own evil, lustful thoughts, and those who are proud and willful, daring even to scoff at the Glorius Ones without so much as trembling. Although the Angels in heaven who stand in the very presence of the Lord, and are far greater in power and strength than these false teachers, never speak out disrespectfully of these evil Mighty Ones.
But false teachers are fools- no better than animals. They do what ever they feel like; born only to be caught and killed, they laugh at the terrifying powers of the underworld which they know so little about; and they will be destroyed along with all the demons and powers of hell."
One time my Daughter asked me where the expression "fools rush in where Angels fear to tread" came from. I gave her the best answer I could but wish I had been familiar with these verses at the time.
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To: Space Wrangler
Trying to guess who the Anti-christ is is pointless and even counterproductive.
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To: Thinkin' Gal
The real test is... does he liken himself to Elvis?
Could there possibly be an anti-Elvis?
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To: teresat
After looking at his picture I am quite disappointed.
He does look like an extra in Lawrence of Arabia.
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To: Space Wrangler; cc: logos, Phaedrus, cornelis, angelo, annalex, Askel5, Physicist, untenured
Religious believers who do not succumb to the deception will be quickly discounted as lunatics, eventually persecuted to death for standing in the way of the advancement of 'the new golden age' this deceiver would usher in (Maitreya's Benjamin Crème and many others in the new age theosophist movement have openly said that Christians and Jews and others who would not accept the new "lord" would have to be 'dealt with' and in some places have said 'removed' from the way). He will come with all the answers, and settling debts and disputes.... how? What sort of power could do this? That could make this prophetic statement vital: "Who is like the beast, and who can make war with him?"
Hello Space Wrangler! What a wild post! Really wild for me, because I know Benjamin Creme personally. I haven't seen him in fifteen years, and have completely lost contact with him and the "crowd" around him; for all I know, he's gone on to his Reward by now....
Back in ’85 I had the great fun of knocking back a few Dewars with “Ben,” just the two of us. He’s an enormously engaging, charismatic personality and a great conversationalist -- a pink-cheeked cherub of a man, with mischievous blue eyes and a shock of wispy white hair. A British subject, he is a man of working class origins and distinctly socialist leanings. We had a nice chat about philosophy and politics. Turns out, he doesn’t much care for the United States. Thinks our culture of greed is setting a bad example for the rest of the world, or something like that. Plus we don’t deserve to be so rich while there are so many poor starving people in the world. We also discussed his work and his books, a couple of which I had read.
“Ben” has a devoted following of would-be disciples and “initiates” in the United States, and visits often for the “laying on of the hands,” to teach group mediation techniques, and to raise the mystical consciousness of his cult following. I won’t go into his work and his sources here; I doubt there are even a few FReepers who’d be interested in “Arcane School” esotericism, a strange amalgam of Christianity and Buddhism with a strong, scientistic bent. Suffice it to say it has been thriving for about a 100 years now, in breathless anticipation of the “Externalization of the Masters of the Hierarchy,” the “Lord Maitreya, the Christ” being the leading figure of that bunch.
But I just have to give you a sample of “Ben” before signing off here. Here’s an excerpt from his Introduction to Messages from Maitreya the Christ (London and Los Angeles: The Tara Press, 1980).
“On July 19th, 1977, the Christ, Maitreya, the World Teacher, Head of our Spiritual Hierarchy, emerged from His ancient retreat and is now in the modern world. With His Disciples, the Masters of Wisdom, He will inaugurate the new age of synthesis and brotherhood.
“Early in September 1977 I was asked if I would take, publicly, communications from Him which, since 1974, I have received in the privacy of the group with which I work. I said I would try, do my best. On September 6th, 1977, the first public Message was given at Friend’s House, Euston Road, London, experimentally, to find out how I stood up to this kind of mental overshadowing and spiritual telepathy in public….
“No trance or mediumship is involved, and the voice is mine, strengthened and altered in pitch by the overshadowing energy of Maitreya. [The messages] are transmitted simultaneously on all the astral and mental planes, while I supply the basic etheric-physical vibration for this to take place. From these subtle levels, the Messages impress the minds and hearts of countless people who are gradually made aware of the thoughts and the Presence of Christ. A great thought-form is being built, on the inner planes, embodying the fact of the Christ’s Presence. This thought-form is then tuned into by the sensitives, clairvoyants and mediums of the world who from now on will increasingly bring in (in more or less distorted form) the information of the Christ’s return. He releases in this way fragments of His Teaching, to prepare the climate of hope and expectancy which will ensure His being accepted and followed, quickly and gladly….
“[I]f people can rid their minds of the idea of the Christ as some sort of spirit, sitting in ‘heaven’ at God’s right hand; if they can begin to see Him as indeed He is, as a real and living man (albeit a Divine man) who has never left the world; who descended not from ‘heaven’ but from His ancient retreat in the Himalayas, to begin the task He began in Palestine; as a great Master, an Adept and Yogi; as the chief actor in a Gospel Story which is essentially true, but much simpler than hitherto presented…. [Then??? “Ben” never completes the sentence….]
"Through these communications Maitreya, the Christ suggests the lines that social change must take. He gives hints on how to recognize Him and urges His listeners to make known the fact of His Presence. He evokes also the desire to share and to serve humanity and Him.”
(Anyone smell the rat here?)
SW, as for the lady who said she saw Maitreya the Christ cavorting about her backyard (or wherever), and can positively identify him as the Antichrist, well what can I say? On the one hand, strictly speaking, that is probably a fantasy. But on the other, IMHO she might be on to something.
In closing, “Who is like the beast, and who can make war with him?” That is a most excellent puzzler! Ideas, anyone?
Thank you, SW, for posting this. It’s nutty as all get-out, but it made me laugh – and remember some things I haven’t thought about for a long time. BTW, your timing is perfect: By “Ben’s” reckoning, today, July 19th, is the twenty-third anniversary of the Lord Maitreya’s “emergence” from his “ancient retreat”…. best wishes, bb.
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To: betty boop
I doubt there are even a few FReepers who’d be interested in “Arcane School” esotericism, a strange amalgam of Christianity and Buddhism with a strong, scientistic bent.
As long as there were no particular duties, instructions or prohibitions, I don't see why not. =)
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To: Smithp67
Share International, Maitreya's outfit, is registered as an official United Nations non-governmental organization (NGO).
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To: betty boop
(Personally ... I think the anti-Christ will be a wealthy, well-mannered, handsome man whose Vision for a more prosperous, peaceful and progressive world will only be enhanced by his fluency in many languages and erudite mastery of ancient texts as well as cutting edge modern thought. A true peacemaker reknown for his immeasureable personal charm and unassailable personal virtue. No whipping the moneychangers out of the temple for this guy. Rather, he'll make certain churches can afford to preserve the antiquities of an era that birthed our brave new world.)
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To: Everyone
See this link: U.N. plans to bring together 1,000 world religious leaders
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To: Hatteras
Nein! It's der Felon himself!
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To: Space Wrangler
Years ago I saw a video with Benjamin Creme, where he said (if I remember correctly), that the Pope was the antichrist, and that he (the Pope) would wave his hand in a strange pattern. This wave would signal the beginning of the endtimes, and he would then emerge as antichrist.
Creme demonstrated the "wave," and I tell ya, this guy may or may not be crazy, but he is definitely under demonic influence. Yuk!
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To: Space Wrangler
"You are the Antichrist!!!" - Pig Vomit addressing Howard Stern
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To: twinmag
You might find this useful:
I see you keep a good supply around for yourself.
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To: Everyone
Also check out: See in particular the article 'The Rise of the Green Religion'
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To: Space Wrangler
So it's not Hillary?
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To: Dataman
Looks like Dennis Miller in a rug to me...guess I won't be watching Monday Night Football
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To: PrairieDawg
OK I checked out your link, thanks. If that guy shows up at my door & tells me he is Christ, I won't have any trouble slamming the door in his face. (I would't have hesitated even BEFORE I checked him out.)
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To: Hootowl
If your description is accurate one can only answer the man's claim by the phrase- Oh! Yes, well...hmmm! The aforementioned stated while one's eyes dart nervously about searching for the nearest exit.
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To: Dataman
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To: Space Wrangler
Caesar Nero was the antichrist. Let's work for the long haul in restoring the US to a Constitutional Republic built upon the Christian religion and ethical monotheism instead of waiting for a secret rapture, looking for antichrists, beasts, etc. Love in Christ to all the brethren & sistren.
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To: PresbyRev
Pardon my eschatology, but if Nero was the Anti-Christ, isn't the Last Judgement imminent?
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To: Lurking Libertarian
Who is Maitreya?
More than likely, someone from the Indian subcontinent who speaks English. That is the only requisite for selling false-religions in the Western markets.
By the way, Hinduism is NOT a false-religion.
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To: Space Wrangler
And all this time I thought it was George Soros.
Oh well.
--Boris
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To: PresbyRev
A certain good sense to your post Rev.
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To: Dataman
And the woman was arrayed in purple and
scarlet colour,
and decked with gold and precious stones and pearls...
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To: Lazamataz
Sorry. My number is 668, which means I am Nieghbor of the Beast, and it turns out that the AntiChrist is little old 72 year old Elsie Maven, arthritic grandmother of 4. She makes a mean chocolate chip cookie.
Well, if you go to cleaning weaponry at home,
1) make sure they're unloaded
2) even so, don't point 'em in the direction of her house
Hate to see her with a head wound or anything...
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To: Space Wrangler, PrairieDawg
If I click on your links will I spend an eternity in damnation?
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To: Kerensky
"Caesar Nero was the antichrist."
You'll have to forgive the good Rev, Kerensky, but that's the kind of eschatology one ends up when secular humanism and political correctness is substituted for the Word of God.
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To: Lazamataz
Sorry. My number is 668, which means I am Neighbor of the Beast, and it turns out that the AntiChrist is little old 72 year old Elsie Maven, arthritic grandmother of 4. She makes a mean chocolate chip cookie.
Who lives at number 999, the upside down Anti-Christ?
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To: Solson
what, someone already got maitreya.com?
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To: Thinkin' Gal
Is believing in a false antichrist better or worse than believing in a false prophet?
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To: Thinkin' Gal
TG!!! No, no, no!!!
That woman is supposed to be beautiful. Mady is NOT beautiful.
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To: betty boop
I doubt there are even a few FReepers who’d be interested in “Arcane School” esotericism,
I think you are right, but you might find more than a few FReepers interested in "Arcane School" erotocism.
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To: Lazamataz
660 Approximate Number of the Beast
DCLXVI Roman Numeral of the Beast
665 Number of the Beast's Older Brother
667 Number of the Beast's Younger Sister
668 Number of the Beast's Neighbor
999 Number of the Australian Beast
333 Number of the Semi-Beast
66 Number of the Downsized Beast
666.0000 Number of the High Precision Beast
665.9997856 Number of the Beast on a Pentium
0.666 Number of the Millibeast
1/666 Reciprocal of the Beast
-666 Opposite of the Beast
666[-/(-1)] Imaginary Number of the Beast
6.66 x 102 Scientific Notation of the Beast
00666 Zip Code of the Beast
Form 10666 Special IRS Tax Forms for the Beast
6.66% 6-Year CD Rate at First Beast Bank of Hell,
$666 minimum deposit, $666 early withdrawal fee
$666/hr Billing Rate of the Beast's Lawyer
$665.95 Retail Price of the Beast
$699.25 Price of the Beast plus 5% State Sales Tax
$769.95 Price of the Beast with accessories and replacement soul
$656.66 Wal-Mart Price of the Beast
$646.66 Next week's Wal-Mart Price of the Beast
Phillips 666 Gasoline of the Beast
666i BMW of the Beast
Formula 666 All Purpose Cleaner of the Beast
WD-666 Spray Lubricant of the Beast
As for Maitreya, I've long suspected he's just Benjamin Creme's marvelous mythical meal ticket, a figure spun up out of thin air to sell books and get Creme some paying venues.
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To: monkeyshine
I think Space Wrangler went back to where ever he came from. He hasn't answered any questions since posting.
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To: Askel5
As long as there were no particular duties, instructions or prohibitions, I don't see why not.
Hello Askel5! There are no "particular duties, instructions or prohibitions!" But how would I even get started? With the ABC's of esoteric theosophy??? Yikes! What a work-out that would be!!! (Maybe just ask me a simple question, any question on this subject at all, just to "prime the pump"?) Thanks so much for writing, Askel5. best wishes, bb.
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To: patriot x
WHAT! READ THE BIBLE? IT's too hard and I've been told not to interpret it ... .
Furthermore, I've also got too many things to do. For example, how's the stock market doing, after all it affects my retirement and what about some relaxation after a long day at work? Seinfeld, even though they are reruns help settle me down. Besides, the "church" tells me what to believe. They've done my homework for me.
Of course, you know I'm being facetious, however what I stated is true for far tooooooo many.
I am partial to the pretrib theory and don't expect to have to deal with this monster. Still I wouldn't speculate on who it could be. It would be an exercise in futility. I'd rather see more people saved so they don't have to be concerned with him either.
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To: BansheeBill
...you might find more than a few FReepers interested in "Arcane School" erotocism.
Well, who could blame them for that??? LOL! Thanks for writing, BansheeBill. best wishes, bb.
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To: Thinkin' Gal
Hillary's loves to sport her illuminati broach at these events.
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To: Washington_minuteman
I am afraid you are quite wrong, dear washington_minuteman. Orthodox Protestant and Catholic theologians and laypersons have held to and do hold to Preterism. You are obviously ignorant of what Scripture teaches about eschatology & even more unaware of what humanists and liberals teach about the Bible. Preterism affirms Scripture as the only rule of faith and practice, as inspired, infallible and inerrant. Rather than bandying about terms you do not understand about Scripture, doctrine & history ---- you ought to read your Bible & check out the aforementioned sites: they will reveal themselves as anything but 'humanist' or liberal. Dispie. Love in Christ. (Also, thank you for asking others to 'forgive' me for my views on the fulfillment of Biblical prophecy. You'll be delighted to know I forgive you for slandering me as a secular humanist.)
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To: Washington_minuteman
I agree with much of what you said but there will be a universal type religion and the a/c will share power with this group for a short time. Like any demented egotist, he will turn on the false religion and declare himself god.
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To: Cultural Jihad
Maitreya, or whatever title he ends up having hung around his neck, A.K.A. the antichrist, will be a Jew, for only a Jew would be recognized as Messiah by Israel, which he will be, after he signs the peace treaty which enables Israel to live in peace and security as in a land of unwalled villages for 3 and 1/2 years. That's the calm before the storm; that storm being known as the Time of Jacob's Trouble, or the Great Tribulation.
About Hinduism, as an aside; after seeing what Hinduism has done to India, I have to disagree with you. Who in their right mind would willingly take upon themselves the yoke of the wheel of Sanshara(sp?) (reincarnation), considered a curse to Indian Hindus (which is what Yoga is all about - escaping the wheel of Sanshara), but a wonderful blessing in the West? Besides, Judeo-Christianity is the only faith that can demonstrate fulfilled prophecy which lends it more veracity that others.
It's all in what you want to believe.
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To: nmh
I am partial to the pretrib theory and don't expect to have to deal with this monster.
But of course you have all you need if it comes down to that. Bump.
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To: Alas Babylon!
That woman is supposed to be beautiful. Mady is NOT beautiful.
Obviously you've never seen a drunken whore!
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To: Kerensky
Check out www.preteristarchive.com & www.bibleprophecy.com. Many evangelicals and conservatives burned out on the repeated false prophecies and 'end-times' speculations of premillenialists, dispensationalist and adventists are turning in increasing numbers to the historic, though minority position, of preterism --- some full prets, some partial prets. Full preterists would say the judgment has already occurred, partial prets (like myself) still look for the final general resurrection and general judgment as described in the final few chapters of Revelation. Even many good, sound premills are looking with increased awareness on the emphasis of preterism in pointing out the many time indicators that Jesus spoke about in the Olivet Discourse and that occur throughout the NT prophecies and warnings of the parousia (coming/presence) of Christ and His coming in judgment upon babylon (Jerusalem) -- the city that murdered the prophets. Preterism is loyal to what Scripture says. Liberals seize upon Jesus and the Apostle's statements that the 'end' was soon, the Parousia was at hand, soon to take place, in that generation, some living would see it. Preterists say, Jesus was not mistaken, the Apostle's were not wrong --- there was no delay in what was predicted --- the judgment that would fall upon Jerusalem, the land (Israel) and the Jewish religious establishment & Temple did take place in AD 70. Don't take my word for it ---- look at the Scriptures, look at the first hand testimony of Josephus, read the Church Fathers, etc. You can find this info. at www.preteristarchive.com and www.bibleprophecy.com. For at critique of preterism, look at www.historicist.com. God bless.
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To: Askel5
No whipping the moneychangers out of the temple for this guy.
Very interesting thought, Askel5. I've often thought myself that the good ol' AC is carrying the portfolio for "the moneychangers." At least in the short run -- until he doesn't "need them" anymore. Meanwhile, the public is snoring through it all. (But then maybe I'm simply demented to say such things.) Thanks for writing. best wishes, bb.
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To: PresbyRev
"Preterism affirms Scripture as the only rule of faith and practice, as
inspired, infallible and inerrant. "
Thank goodness, another one like me!
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To: PresbyRev
Caesar Nero was the antichrist.
Unlikely, given that Revelation was written after he was long dead. It is likely that 1 John was as well, but the date for that epistle is less certain than that for Revelation, which Irenaeus clearly wrote was given to them at the end of the reign of Domitian. Since everything written after 4:1 is clearly future to the time of John's writing, that eliminates Nero as a candidate for the Beast, unless he's the one who will rise from the Abyss (17:8).
I stand with you in the desire to see the USA returned to a Biblically-based Constitutional republic, but that doesn't mean that we have to (or should) ignore God's prophetic Word in the process, especially with so many prophecies coming to a head in our time.
Yours in Truth,
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To: Jeremiah Jr
Daniel 8:23
KJV And in the latter time of
their kingdom,when the transgressors are come to the full,
a king of fierce countenance, and understanding dark
sentences, shall stand up.
YLT And in the latter end of
their kingdom, about the perfecting of the
transgressors, stand up doth a king, fierce of face, and
understanding hidden things;
Darby And at the latter time
of their kingdom, when the transgressors shall have come to the
full,
a king of bold countenance, and understanding riddles,
shall stand up.
NIV In the latter part of
their reign, when rebels have become completely wicked,
a stern-faced
king, a master of intrigue, will arise.
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To: Lazamataz
Hi Laz! IMHO, and for whatever it's worth, it may be the "antichrist" is the Spirit of our age, made fully manifest in human reality. Theosophy alleges a methodology by which such a thing is possible. best wishes, bb.
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To: Space Wrangler
Nah. I think Bible Thumpers are the anti-Christ in concert hiding behind the bible. (I'm in bad mood tonight, so I hope this pisses you off.) Better get the heavy duty tin foil, the stuff you're wearing is too thin.
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To: Hootowl
Excellent summary, Hootowl. Thank you so much for posting it! best wishes, bb.
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To: Space Wrangler
It surprises me that so many people think the anti-Christ will be a person. The anti-Christ could be a nation, a government or even possibly a religion. I do not want to offend anyone, but remember the "mark of the beast?" "666" according to the Bible. In Latin, the word "Latin" is, if I remember correctly, "Lateinos." Using the Latin numerical system and adding up the number value of all the letters in "Lateinos," the total is "666!" Latin, of course, was the official language of the Catholic church for centuries, and is still used in many ways by the Catholic priests to this day! Hmmmmmm.....
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To: PresbyRev
By the way, here's part of a response I wrote to TomSmedley on this very subject when he posted on this thread:
Chiliaism is the truncating of our Lord's eternal reign at His Father's right hand to shoehorn it into a brief historical moment.
Here is my response, edited slightly as some of my comments were for TomSmedley specifically:
That's a common misperception, fueled by the imprecise wording many pre-millennialists (or chiliasts, if you insist on confusing people by using a term that has hardly seen the light of day for eighteen centuries). Simply put, pre-millennialism is the belief that just as the prophecies of Christ's First Coming were all fulfilled literally, the prophecies of His Second Coming will be fulfilled in like manner. Pre-millennialism goes on to posit that the thousand years of rule by Christ and the saints in Rev. 20 is likewise a literal period of time that has not occurred yet.Some of the ways in which "this generation" can be interpreted are as follows (from the same thread):During the Millennium, Satan will be bound in the Abyss, completely sealed away from mankind. This has not occurred yet (see 2 Cor. 4:4, Eph. 2:2, and 1 Peter 5:8). During that same period of time, Christ will literally rule from David's throne in Jerusalem over the whole physical world (Luke 1:32). The Millennium is not to be confused with the eternal age that follows the final defeat of Satan, because while during the Millennium mortal lifespans will be greatly increased (see Isa. 65:20) there will still be death, while during the Eternal Age there will be no more death (Rev. 21:4). During the Millennium, the nations that attack Israel during the Great Tribulation will be compelled to go to Jerusalem every year to celebrate the Feast of Tabernacles. Some will rebel and be punished with drought (Zech. 14:16-19). During the Eternal Age, there will be no more tears or pain, which implies that there will be no more punishment, short- or long-term, for sin.
The confusion sets in because many pre-millennialists speak of the "thousand-year reign of Christ" in such a way that I can see how a person on the outside might think we think Christ's reign will be limited to that period of time. Not so, which is why I encourage people to instead refer to the "first thousand years of Christ's physical or earthly reign" instead.
Within the camp of the pre-millennialists are several divisions. For example, there are those who take a historicist view of Scripture, like the Seventh-Day Adventists, who try to read the prophecies in such a way that they fit (for the most part) the past historical events of the last 2000 years. Frankly, I feel this has as many pitfalls as preterism. Then there are the futurists, who understand that many of the prophecies of the Bible, especially certain parts of Daniel, the Olivet Discourse, and Revelation, have not yet taken place. Within that group are several more groups, mostly defined by when they believe the Rapture (1 Thess. 4:16-17) will occur in relation to Daniel's Seventieth Week. However, we all agree that there will be a seven-year period following a certain man confirming a treaty with Israel, that that man will be the Man of Sin spoken of by Paul in 2 Thess. 2, and that somewhere during or just before that period Christ will return for His Church.
Now, let's take a moment to look at Matt. 24 (and by extension, Mark 13—Luke 21 is a separate issue, as I can demonstrate if you feel the need). Preterists of all stripes get hung up on v. 34: "I tell you the truth, this generation will certainly not pass away until all these things have happened." Now, as I have already demonstrated, there are multiple ways of interpreting this passage that do not strain the Greek or allegorize it. So let's look at the rest of Matt. 24 and see if it came to pass in the destruction of Jerusalem in 70 AD.
Let's start by looking at "the Abomination of Desolation spoken of through Daniel the prophet" that Christ said would occur again. The original Abomination of Desolation involved Antiochus Epiphanies setting up an idol to Zeus in the Holy of Holies. In 2 Thess. 2:4, Paul tells us that the next Abomination of Desolation would involve the Man of Sin setting up himself in the Temple and proclaiming himself to be God. Did that occur in the destruction of Jerusalem?
No. Just because Josephus called a group of Zealots taking over the Temple an abomination does not make it the Abomination of Desolation, as none of them claimed to be God. Nor could that be a reference to Titus. First of all, the timing is wrong; Titus entered the Temple after the siege of Jerusalem was in its final stages, when it was impossible to flee to the mountains (not to mention pointless). Secondly, while he did enter the Holy of Holies, he did so only briefly before being forced to flee the flames, and had no time to set up himself as God there. Furthermore, when the destruction was complete, Titus set up ensigns to his father (not himself) at the east gate, which was part of the Court of the Gentiles and was not considered the Holy Place (see Acts 21:28—the Jews would not have cared if they had only thought Paul had brought the Greeks to the Court of the Gentiles; that's what it was there for).
Next, we have to ask if the tribulation of the destruction of Jerusalem was really the Great Tribulation spoken of by Jesus in Matt. 24:21. As I have already pointed out, Hitler's holocaust was arguably worse than the siege of Jerusalem (with triple the body count, etc.). Furthermore, v. 22 states that "if those days had not been cut short, no flesh would survive . . ." At no time in AD 70 was all "flesh," or even all Jewish flesh, at risk of extinction. Certainly, the Church was in no danger of extinction at that time, yet the Bible tells us that "for the sake of the elect (which in the NT always refers to the Church) those days will be shortened."
Lastly, let's look at vv. 29-31. As I've already pointed out, no one saw the Son of Man coming on the clouds at the siege of Jerusalem, either literally or metaphorically. Josephus and Tacitus certainly didn't see fit to mention it, yet Rev. 1:7 says that when He comes on the clouds, "every eye will see Him, even those who pierced Him." Even accepting an allegorical interpretation, that means that Josephus should have plainly seen the crucifixion of Christ as the cause of the destruction of Jerusalem, but he didn't. Rather, he blamed it on the wrong political party getting control of the Temple.
The same problems arise when attempting to shoehorn Revelation into a preterist viewpoint. It is the Beast (connected to Rome), not the 144,000 Jews, who is captured and thrown alive into the Lake of Fire (19:20). It is on the Beast's armies, not the armies of Jerusalem, that the birds feast on (v. 18). Nor was there a false prophet in service to Rome who caused fire to fall from the sky, or a Mark of the Beast, or demonic locusts come from the Abyss, or a host of other things that preterism would claim occurred at the fall of Jerusalem. That's even if you can prove that Revelation was written before AD 70, which is very problematic, considering that Irenaeus says pretty clearly that it was delivered to them during the reign of Domitian.
Your assertion that pre-millennialism was a heresy promoted primarily or solely by Cerinthus is also false. Papias of Hierapolis, Justin Martyr, Irenaeus, Tertullian, Commodian, Lactantius, Victorinus, Apollinaris, and Methodius were all prominent believers in Chiliasm, or pre-millenialism. In fact, Irenaeus clearly spoke of a personal, non-allegorized Antichrist who had not yet been revealed in his day.
I also take umbrage at your claim that all pre-millennialists are heretics. A heresy, using its common, present-day definition, is a false teaching that gets in the way of salvation—for example, claiming that Jesus Christ was not God, as the JWs do. To call the belief that Christ will come again in such a way that the whole world will see it (Rev. 1:7 again) and set up His physical throne in Jerusalem as promised by the prophets heresy is blatant ignorance or deceit, take your pick. On the contrary, 1 John 3:2-3, which was probably written in the late 80s (ten to twenty years after Jerusalem's destruction) says, "Dear friends, now we are the children of God, and what we will be has not yet been made known. But we know that when He appears, we shall be like Him, for we shall see Him as He is. Everyone who has this hope in him purifies himself, just as he is pure. . . ."
. . . Therefore, before you make the weighty charge of heresy, it is up to you to prove that each and every prophecy in Daniel, the Olivet Discourse, Revelation, and the rest of the Scripture that deal with the Second Coming occurred exactly as written in 70 AD. Scripture must interpret every symbol, not the non-canonical writings of a Pharisee. Among other things, you must prove that everyone saw Christ in that event.
1) Genea can mean "race" or "kind." Therefore, Jesus could have been saying that "this people" (i.e. the Jews) would not pass away (and they haven't) until His Second Coming.TomSmedley hasn't yet written a response (which is not to say that he isn't working on one, as the thread is only a few days old).2) In context, "this generation" could refer to the generation that saw all of the signs Jesus gave of His Coming, and then end of the age. This presents some problems when one does a careful study of Luke 21, however (Luke 21 being an entirely diffrent speech with a diffrent, but related, subject).
3) "This generation" may be referring to the generation which would see sign of the fig tree, which in Biblical symbolism is almost always representative of Israel. This has caused many to speculate that the return of Israel to her land means that this present generation will not pass away until the Second Coming. Due to the specific reference to the fig tree's leaves, I actually think this passage also refers to the return of Temple worship and Levitical sacrifice in Israel, which we're likely to see in the next few years.
4) And finally, have you ever noticed that every single other time Jesus uses the phrase "this generation," He is referring to "an evil and adulterous generation," that is, an evil and adulterous kind. Hence, He may have been saying that the evil, hypocritical, and unbelieving kind of person will not pass away until His Second Coming.
I tend to lean towards option #1, but it doesn't really matter if I'm off-base on that. The point is that there are numerous ways of interpreting "this generation" that don't monkey with the original Greek and don't require Jesus to have been speaking of AD 70.
Yours in Truth,
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To: PresbyRev
I try to keep spirituality simple and true. Do what the man said and follow God's Commandments. Pray. Take the rest with a grain of salt. This stuff gets too complex. Jesus wasn't into complex: "enter the kingdom of God as a little child" and all that.
Sooo
I have long given up trying to "figure out" whom is the AC as I figure that Jesus will make his return really obvious (see "simple"). Of more concern to me is the political import of what other people may find useful about this other clown, Maitreya, especially the Gobble Grubbamint Communists at the UN and in Hollywood. I have therefore posted Share International links and references to the movements of Benjamin Creme on FR for quite some time. (He is appearing at the Masonic Auditorium in San Francisco fairly soon.)
As it is, NBCCBSABCCNN can put any contrived "miracle" they want on TV and half the planet would take it seriously.
Thus, like it or not, so should we.
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To: patriot x
I am partial to the pretrib theory and don't expect to have to deal with this monster.
Get ready for a NASTY surprise...
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To: Jefferson Adams
By the way, if you folks what like to read wanna get your hands on an EXCELLENT novel (a trilogy, actually) get "The Christ Clone Trilogy." It's VERY well done. And I wouldn't be sprized if the real Beast acts a lot like the one in this fictional account of the last days.
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To: PresbyRev
"(Also, thank you for asking others to 'forgive' me for my views on the fulfillment of Biblical prophecy. You'll be delighted to know I forgive you for slandering me as a secular humanist.)"
I didn't slander you Rev. I said "that's the kind of eschatology [and I am referring to the allegorizing of Scripture when the context clearly indicates a literal interpretation] one ends up when secular humanism and political correctness is substituted for the Word of God."
For instance, Presbyterians ordain women, against the dictates of Scripture (1 Tim 2:12). They accept into their congregations and ordain, and some even marry practicing homosexuals, again, against the dictates of Scripture (Rom. 1:18-32). This is political correctness, humanism, and New Ageism in the church, which is a fulfillment of end-times prophecy (1 Tim 4:1, 2 Tim 4:3-4).
The news is full of this sort of stuff on an almost daily basis. As for my knowledge of Scripture, have you ever heard of J. Dwight Pentecost or John F. Walvoord, or Dallas Theological Seminary? Neither these excellent scholars or that excellent institution believe that your position is biblically sound.
Seeing as how the question has been argued out already, thousands of times, there's no point in stirring it up here again. You're simply going to have to accept that your method of interpreting Scripture is not universally accepted; that there are those of us, just as much born again as you, who believe that there's only one correct way to perform that task (which always leads to the same conclusion), just as I have to accept the fact that not everyone agrees with me. Arguing is as pointless as attempts at summing all of eschatology in a single phrase like "Caesar Nero was the antichrist."
So, as you have forgiven me of what you percieve as my slander, likewise, I forgive you your remark concerning, as you percieve, my lack of knowledge concerning the Scriptures and sound doctrine as well as my ignorance of the terms used in the study of God's Word.
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To: Space Wrangler
I knew a Maitreya once. Billy Maitreya. Used to deliver newspapers. They were always there at six AM sharp, rain of shine. Funny thing, was, they were on everybody's doorstep at 6 AM sharp. And nobody ever saw him except when he came to collect. Spooky, no?
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To: josiban
Hmmm, I think I knew the guy, too ...
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To: betty boop
"Back in ’85 I had the great fun of knocking back a few Dewars with “Ben,” just the two of us. ...
But I just have to give you a sample of “Ben" ...
“No trance or mediumship is involved, and the voice is mine, strengthened and altered in pitch by the overshadowing energy of Maitreya. [The messages] are transmitted simultaneously on all the astral and mental planes, while I supply the basic etheric-physical vibration for this to take place."
Betty, if Ben scored with you based on lines that lame, well... well... well, at least he was buying you Dewars (he was buying, right).
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To: betty boop
It would require an extraterrestrial, or perhaps a hybrid between the human race and the so-called alien race,
Algore is the antichrist???
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To: Junior
"Could there possibly be an anti-Elvis?"
Yes, Junior, there is an anti-Elvis. And many believe it's Slim Whitman.
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To: all
It's really very simple:
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To: betty boop
“No trance or mediumship is involved, and the voice is mine, strengthened and altered in pitch by the overshadowing energy of Maitreya. [The messages] are transmitted simultaneously on all the astral and mental planes, while I supply the basic etheric-physical vibration for this to take place.
Sounds like the makings of a bad Vaudeville skit.
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To: Jefferson Adams
Not my post; however, as I have said the means for identifying this one have been given. I'm not one to sit by the window waiting for him; I'll know when the time comes.
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To: Jefferson Adams
Jesus of Nazareth and the Christ are not one and the same person. This is one of the most difficult claims for many Christians to accept in connection with Maitreya, the World Teacher, and it therefore needs some further explanation.
From the Web Site. I don't need any further explanation. In addition to all of the other pronouncements, he is a liar. Not saying that this person is the AC, but rest assured he is not the Christ.
No complex calculations, just the Word.
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To: Darth Sidious
Now why didn't Yevette Mimeux ever start a cult ..... I might have waited in line to join. If she wanted to be the new Buddha .... fine by me.
Regards
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To: betty boop
Not to worry ... just being funny. Folks these days like a religion or philosophy that provides decent input but demands nothing. You know the score.
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To: hope
Re the Hil photo: remember the song, "She's Got Bette Davis Eyes"? This one s/b "She's Got Charlton Heston's EyeBROWS"
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To: josiban
"I knew a Maitreya once. Billy Maitreya. Used to deliver newspapers."
I knew Maitreya, and this guy, sir, is no Maitreya.
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To: betty boop
I've often thought myself that the good ol' AC is carrying the portfolio for "the moneychangers." At least in the short run -- until he doesn't "need them" anymore.
This sort of comment always reminds me of this classic post -- Missy Kelly Strips E.J. Dionne Naked (Repost of Roger Schultz post). I do and I don't wish to live to see the day the moneychangers get their for two-stepping with the totalitarians. Love of money runs a poor second to bona fide faith in Man.
But you misunderstand me a bit. I'm not saying the AntiChrist would pretend some piety. I'm saying George W. Bush is an aperitif of sorts:
- His "Christ is my favorite philosopher" probably lit up faces and focus groups but mostly just made points with those who smiled at the idea this "God" could be a philosopher ... the ultimate narcissist;
- I got in trouble for not knowing the hooking up of faith-based charities government was BUSH's idea not Gore's. But why would I suspect the GOP was behind a scheme to tie our last private safety net to a government that won't let children pray in schools and probably would just as soon relegate the elderly, terminally ill, unconscious, grossly deformed and orphaned to the same status of "Non-Person" they bestowed on unborn, unwanted human life;
- And, given these two examples ... the RNC and Bush target the Catholic Church -- primary source of Christianity and the only institution on the planet standing firm to the same truths our founders felt were universally "self-evident" and not subject to personal interpretation.
They don't target the Church for demonizing ... they are schmoozing the Church. Making a mountain out of the Bob Jones molehill in order to craft a letter to the Cardinal, accessorizing their appeal to Hispanics (they lure with leftovers from the table of Western Materialism) with a bit of piety, and "sending a message" that they are indeed open to "compromise" on the pro-life/choice question by cocking an ear to the traditionally pro-life Catholics.
A special task force for Catholics? Saul Alinsky (whose IAF has reaped millions under the guise of the Catholic Campaign for Human Development since the early 70's) is laughing uncontrollably, I'm sure. He probably never dreamed the RNC would take a page from him.
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To: Kevin Curry
LOL! heeheehee! "Spray lubricant of the beast!"
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To: Betty Boop
Well ... reading the post ... it does sound odd to say he's not pretending some piety -- he is. But each time he does so, he diminishes it quite neatly.
Much like the Washington Post -- of all papers -- featuring last July a Sunday front-page, above the fold, 1/4 pix of George W. as a "Saul on the Road to Damascus" story.
You see what I mean? Where does the Post get off pushing this slant? Turned my stomach when I saw it in the airport.
In any case ... of course it's about money and power and population control (although perhaps you've seen me post the quotes wherein W.'s Daddy would prefer we use words like "healthcare" instead of "population control" ... it takes the sensationalism out of it, you see. Sort of like calling God a philosopher, only different.)
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To: Space Wrangler
I have studied the New Age Movement for years, and your assesment of it is very accurate.
They are predicting a coming savior, and a tranformation of all mankind, except those who have a negative outlook. And, since they believe in reincarnation, those who disagree will have to be sent back through the system so that they will come back more positive, i.e. they will be killed.
I just wonder how much longer before these things come to pass? We seem to be on the edge, but that could just be my point of view. It seems that in the next few years, the earth will unite under three flags: one asian, one American, and a european flag. The new world leader will bring all of those together under one flag.
The Anti-christ will be a Jew since he will sit in the new temple and proclaim himself to be God. Jews would allow this only if he were of Jewish ancestry.
The future will be an incredible ride! Just make sure that you do not take the mark of the beast on your hand or forehead, and never ever walk another day on this planet without a personal relationship with God through Jesus Christ.
Tracey
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To: betty boop
Since you flagged me, I must say that this whole thread (and your old friend in particular) recalls the old adage, "one man's religion is another man's good belly laugh".
Sorry. All I see is lunatics warning us about lunatics (on the Art Bell Show, no less).
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To: Thinkin' Gal
#64: That was good.
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To: Southack
Hi southhack! He didn't score with me in any sense of the term. People around us thought we were arguing, but we were just having a grand ol' time disputing with each other. I don't know whose bottle of Dewars that was. It was just lying around the kitchen, so "Ben" confiscated it (true socialist at heart you see).
This thread and the reaction to it is quite absurd. Thanks for writing, bb.
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To: Kevin Curry
Sounds like the makings of a bad Vaudeville skit.
Yes it does, doesn't it? Yet there are people out there who simply lap this stuff up. I know of one woman who abandoned a husband and two small boys so she could go live in an ashram and "take up this work." You see, "this work" was more mportant to her than raising her boys in an intact family. I guess we can just say "different strokes for different folks." Still, old-fashioned person that I am, I think there is something just terribly out of whack there. Thanks for writing, Kevin Curry. best wishes, bb.
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To: Physicist
"...one man's religion is another man's good belly laugh".
Hi Physicist! Yep. But it seems to me the point is this esoteric theosophy business isn't a religion. I'd classify it as an anti-religion. Not that the distinction would matter much to you, presumably. Thanks for joining in. best wishes, bb.
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To: Carol-HuTex, betty boop, gg188, Prodigal Daughter
I have studied the New Age Movement for years, and your assesment of it is very accurate. They are predicting a coming savior, and a tranformation of all mankind, except those who have a negative outlook.
Interesting thread. I too have looked at New Age "movement" for years from inside and outside. At first, in the '60s and '70s, it was interesting. Met sincere seekers, learned about other religions. But now, the new age movement has been taken over by power hungry, manipulative, often unintelligent, greedy idiots. If you even question their wild assertions, they scream that you are "negative." Only positive people allowed. And by positive they mean those who do not challenge.
I just completed a business project with a new age woman who was so stupid, so vicious, that she cured me forever of even speaking to someone like that again. Whenever I pointed out certain pitfalls in the project from my perspective of 20 years in the business, she shrieked that my "negativity" would ruin everything. In her case, her "positivity" was a cover for stupidity. And you know what else? At the risk of sounding newagey myself, I sensed something dark in her soul and had nightmares for the several months I worked with her.
I've been to meetings where new projects were discussed: magazines, "centers," etc. Virtually all of the new-ager entrepreneurs at these meetings were Jewish. They referred to their potential clients as "marks." I don't think they meant 666, the mark of the beast. They meant "gullible," the mark of the sheeple. If there was ever anything of value in the new age movement, it has long since disappeared. (I do not mean to imply that all Jews behave this way. My screechy client was not Jewish.)
Like some other posters, I do not include legitimate religions in this rant. Buddhists, Hindus, etc. belong to religions that I may not agree with, but at least they have a long tradition, a religious culture, a body of good works, etc. It's the NEW agers and their for-profit non-profit imaginary religions who are total frauds and dangerous to boot.
BTW, the new agers I ran with in San Francisco were also instrumental in getting Feinstein elected and were very quick to try to snatch up incredibly valuable land when the US closed the Presidio army base there. It's a package deal. They'll probably send around a petition to get Maiyetrea on the ballot next. I truly believe that lulling the sheeple into sonambulance with "feel good" religions and politically correct, nonjudgmental "positive thinking" is a sneaky and very smart political strategy employed by the Left.
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To: Kerensky
It has called for a world conference in 1998 to present the treaties and other documents necessary to bring about complete global governance by the year 2000. There is going to be the largest UN meeting ever held in September, I think the 8th and 9th. Could this be the commencing of the gobal plantation?
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To: patriot x
You bet! We're, you and I atleast, are covered regardless!
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To: nmh
It's so easy. Man comes and says "God lying". I say goodbye.
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To: Thinkin' Gal
This is my Aunti Maddalin & Uncle Bubaric
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To: Askel5
His "Christ is my favorite philosopher" probably lit up faces and focus groups but mostly just made points with those who smiled at the idea this "God" could be a philosopher ... the ultimate narcissist;
That's not how he said it. He was asked which philosopher had had the greatest impact on his political stances, and he answered with the name of our Lord. He wasn't reducing Christ to a mere philosopher, he was giving Christ the credit for the impact He had on Bush's life.
Yours in Truth,
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To: Buggman
It was a win:win, Buggman.
(1) Sidestepped the fact that Bush is not terribly well read and -- being a "summaries only" sort of guy as he admits -- is never going to be terribly well read.(2) Rang the chimes of those anxious to get some decency and Christian virtues back along with the "decorum of the office" Bush's Daddy and Bob Dole sought to preserve by speaking publicly AGAINST the impeachment of one Bill Clinton.
And it was indeed nonsensical. He was asked for his favorite lover of wisdom and he replied with Wisdom Itself. He got away with it because folks heard what they wanted to hear and paid no attention to the fact that Christ is being reduced to a philosophy.
Probably not a bad idea, actually. This way they can feature Jesus (along with Mohammed, Buddha, Krishna, Joseph Smith, Rev. Moon, Martin Luther and anyone else whose "faith-based" philosophies have instilled good values in folks over the years) in Bush's decidedly "non-partisan" sort of Character Education in the public schools.
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To: PoisedWoman
It might not even be that the New Age movement has changed since you started with it, it could be that it starts out with 95% truth, 5% distortion or deceipt and gets more and more transparent the longer you are exposed to it, those who don't have any discernment just get brainwashed into it and it seems right to them. (What a horrible thought!) The Holy Spirit gave you the discernment to sense the darkness in the woman's soul.
My experience with the New Age was about the same, at first just some liberal Christianity with some quirky ideas and books and scientific studies of ESP, etc., and you reject what you think is the fringe, but pretty soon more and more is unacceptable fringe, thank God. I noticed lots of selfish New Agers, it's a very useful philosophy for justifying personality faults and never changing them. I've also noticed a lot of New Agers' first priority is the quest for "knowledge" and "helping mankind" (or manipulating mankind) and their children or parents or spouse come last.
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To: John D
I went on vacation shortly after posting this and haven't had a computer. Besides that I haven't really seen any questions worth answering.
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To: Space Wrangler
How's it goin.
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To: Zero Tolerance
Good find.
No telling what'll turn up in one's attic.
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To: PrairieDawg
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To: ravingnutter
Well if there is an anti-christ you can damn well bet that they will be a demoncrat
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To: Buggman
bump for later
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To: Space Wrangler
No way is he the anti christ. No way. When the anti christ appears, many, many will follow him. He is supposed to have great charisma just to mention one of the attributes . Can you see most people following this character ? Can you see any charisma in the guy ? C'mon.
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To: Lazamataz
LOL! Laz, you crack me up!....
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To: Thinkin' Gal
The real test is... does he liken himself to Elvis?
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To: MileHi
Maitreya: When you care enough to send the very Beast®
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To: B-Chan
ROTFLMAO!....
Ahhhmmmmm... Ahhhmmmmm, um, I really gotta pee...
sorry...
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To: Thinkin' Gal
The woman is an idiom. She represents wealth and outwardly attractive to many people. That is what the jewels and precious stones stand for.
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To: DreamWeaver
bttt
Any other opinions ?
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To: Space Wrangler
She worked with the late Fr. Malachai Martin, and has researched the subject very well.
No, she merely consulted with him. What she is doing is irresponsible.
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To: Space Wrangler
[to music playing in background, "Theme from Twilght Zone"]
Massive amounts of tin foil are unfurling.
It is amazing how trends and fads come and go and how soon we forget. That is how these modern day "prophets" are able to turn a profit.
Almost 20 years ago, author Constance Cumby, in her expose of the New Age movement, "The Hidden Dangers of the Rainbow", named
the "Lord Maitreya" as the emerging, probable Antichrist.
Who the heck even remembers that? Who cares? And who is this aging Lord Maitreya who is 20 years older today than he was then?
But woooooooooooo, some new prophetess says its a secret that she could not reveal until now because "things are moving faster now
and I feel it is time." Well Dearie (as Ann Landers would say) the secret was out 20 years ago.
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To: Thinkin' Gal
Madeline Albright as the woman "arrayed in purple."
LOL!
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To: Kevin Curry
Heh, heh, heh....
It's about time that someone started dealing with this Anti-Christ numerology stuff appropriately. I'm of the opinion that such speculation is a distraction. Even if the Beast is properly identified, what's it to us?
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To: ppaul
You should have seen the photo! It was an exact match to the caption, lol.
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To: Jefferson Adams
I just ordered the first Christ Clone Trilogy. I am looking forward to reading it. Is it as good as I've heard?
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To: angelo
Clicked on your link and checked out the website. Pretty good job. Looks like it is operated by some
artistically creative imbeciles who have poor spelling skills. They probably attended government schools.
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To: all
When are y'all going to realize that the antichrist is just people who are anti-Christ? Why does everybody seem to think it's just one person?
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To: Solson
I checked out the link you posted as well. What a crock! "The Greatest Sign" is a friggin' swastika inside a lotus blossom.
No thanks. I'll pass. The only sign worth talking even considering is "the sign of Jonah."
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To: Jeremiah Jr.
Where are you when we need you?
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To: Space Wrangler
Well...there you have it...the anti-christ revealed on the Art Bell Show....works for me.................ROFLMMFAO
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To: Space Wrangler
"Maitreya is the Antichrist"
No, Satan is the Antichrist. Maitreya is just a guy who sells books to foolish Christians.
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To: Thinkin' Gal
So, what cult do you belong to?
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To: Space Wrangler
ANTI-CHRIST = GEORGE SOROS
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To: twinmag
Hoe do u do that?
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To: PrairieDawg
The anti-christ looks like Jusef Islam (Cat Stevens). Who would follow this ass?
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To: HYPOCRACY
LOL!
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To: Space Wrangler
Maitreya
Maitreya, in Buddhism, the future Buddha, a Buddha who will be reborn in a period of decline to renew the doctrine of the founder of Buddhism, the Buddha. Maitreya is believed to be a bodhisattva, one who refuses entry into nirvana, a transcendent state free from suffering, out of a compassionate desire to help others. At present, he is believed to reside in Tushita Heaven, where he awaits his rebirth (see Transmigration). Although various calculations exist, this rebirth is expected to occur in 30,000 years. At the moment of his rebirth, Buddhist law will have completely degenerated, requiring a new revelation. After his rebirth, by some accounts, Maitreya will lead all beings still trapped in the cycle of rebirths to nirvana. Others maintain that he will preach for 60,000 years, after which he will enter nirvana and his doctrine will endure for another 10,000 years. His cult first appeared in India around the 3rd century then spread throughout China, Korea, and Japan.
The traditions surrounding Maitreya describe him taking on a variety of forms, such as a slothful student, a companion of the Buddha, or a kind tutor. In China, he is revered as a folk deity who wanders the country with a third eye in his back. In addition, Chinese emperors and empresses have claimed to be the incarnation of Maitreya in order to achieve political security. Sometime in the 4th or 5th century, Buddhist monks brought the cult of Maitreya to Korea, where followers established him as a god of fertility who grants infants to barren women and answers the prayers of children. In Japan, celebrated teacher Kukai claimed he was Maitreya when he founded the Shingon (Pure Word) sect of Buddhism in the early 9th century. Maitreya remains one of the few bodhisattvas revered in both Theravada Buddhism and Mahayana Buddhism.
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To: Space Wrangler
I, the real anti-christ, will now identify myself to you ...
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To: reagan_fanatic
The last straw!
ROTFLMAO
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To: Lazamataz
All this ""the auntychrist is coming" stuff is getting a tad tiring
Just reading Buddha died at age 84 feasting on Pork..kewl
Lets try this Buddhism stuff reaching for...
ham and pineapple pizza,
taking a bite
yummmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm...needs beer,sip
yummmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm
AH NOW THATS A BETTER REALITY.
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To: Space Wrangler
Ricky Schroder is the Antichrist!
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To: Dan from Michigan
I hear ya!
Have you ever noticed what the word SOROS backwards says?
Spooky, no?
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To: sonsofliberty2000
....So the probability of Maitreya wearing a tea towell on his head as per photo supplied is not very likely and Buddhists dont believe in human incarnation of deities therefore:
1.supplied Maitreya is bogus
2.an antichrist Budda is an oxymoron
3.the buddhists wouldn't have him hes not due yet according to their prophecies.
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To: Kevin Curry
ROFL, Kevin! What's the Pentium Chip NOTB? (Remember their math coprocessor problems?)
BTW, I checked out the most recent newsletter on that .org site. They are looking for "uniforms" for the "Divines" can wear during their teaching missions that will easily identify them to the rest of the world. I wonder if it includes armbands (or ribbons, perhaps?)
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To: Space Wrangler
Lifetimes have been expended on questions of spiritually complicated musings. It's seems pretty much a waste of time really.
Rather simple:
"My eyes are continually toward the Lord, for He will pluck my feet out of the net." Pslam 25:15
With that as a priority, who cares much about the many self-claimed "anti-Christs" that pop up. Believers in Christ have better things to do.
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To: GotDangGenius
I thought the AntiChrist was Alec Baldwin!
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To: A CA Guy
To this this thread in general: any good counter-espionage spook could offer some help here. Deconstruct the incident - identify the likely scenarios and the motives, establish alibi of any suspects, has anything prior to this occurred on a similar scale, etc. Evil has obvious and distinctive traits that betrays whatever cover it has, and ditto for Good. Good ol' processes of elimination should narrow the usual suspects down to a point where only sheer personal 'hunches' are left in play. At this point, at the end of deduction (logical reduction), only personal preference and beliefs separates my pick for anti-christ from yours. To each his own. But if anyone's interested, I do could go thru the exercise for Freepdom and kill off some of the characters posted so far (leaving aside the nonsense posts and the non-christian believer posts).
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To: ohms
War is organized theft (Ascent Of Man, J. Bronowski). Armageddon is a large battle in a larger war. It reads as though the sides are desperate for the Israeli real estate. Said real estate has discovered fossil-fuel energy reserves BTW in last few years. (Motives discussed further down). Obviously, the combatants would not be there if they knew the scriptures and recognized the signs. So count the current Russian forces and Western forces (like NATO) out. (Note- in the West or in Russia, if the Word was successfully suppressed and the Church killed off right now, then fifty years from now you could not count the Russians and the West out - but I am addressing short-term events).
Okay, so which large forces are currently ignorant or largely ignorant enough re Armmageddon signs? Well, PRC and Islamic nations. I considered India, but they have a long exposure to The Word and millions of Christian citizens - and former Christians.
I look at Armmageddon and I see front lines, supply lines, logistics, millions of combatants - it is a huge organic thing with a 'Satanic' leader. I see total war of course where civilian cities -far from front- are targetted to stop war production etc. (Possible leaders discussed further down). And soldiers are the basis of successful aggression. Obedience is all with something involving the Holy Land and ethnic issues -traditional hatreds- will be the ingredient that makes this war so desperate and bloodthirsty. Nazi's were over-the-top indoctrinated and loyal. Nips were too. The armies of Armageddon are driven on religious hatred. Deep hatred that -although it may have been papered over for a few years - is stirred up and mainlined by the 'Satanic' leader: fanatical soldiers, no matter how many die (even if most of them die), will always achieve the aim of the leadership. When large scale armies and alliances arise that hinge on this characteristic of fanaticism, war breaks out soon after, albeit begrudgingly.
Literature provides some hints re fanaticism.
J. Conrad's Heart of Darkness inspired the epic film Apocalypse Now (Omni Zoetrope 1978). The dialogue below is the main character's plee for understanding, his 'message from the front' to explain the war is lost. Collaborative writers F.F. Coppola, M. Brando, J. Milius.
Colonel Kurtz:It's impossible for words to describe what is necessary to those who do not know what horror means. Horror. Horror has a face, and you must make a friend of horror. Horror and moral terror must be your friends. If they are not, then they are enemies to be feared. They are truly enemies.
I remember when I was with [US] Special Forces... we went into a [Vietnamese] camp to innoculate some children. We left the camp after we had innoculated the children for polio... and this old man came running after us. He was crying. He couldn't say... We went back there. And [the VC] had come and hacked off every innoculated arm. There they were in a pile; a pile of little arms.
And I remember - I cried - I wept like some grandmother. I wanted to tear my teeth out. I didn't know what I wanted to do. And I want to remember it. I never want to forget it. I never want to forget, and then I realised -like I was shot, like I was shot with a diamond, a diamond bullet right through my forehead- and I thought "My God. The genius of that!" The genius, the will to do that. Perfect, genuine, complete, crystalline, pure.
Then I realised they were stronger than we; because they could stand it. These were not monsters. These were men; trained cadres. These men who fought with their hearts; who have families, who have children, who are filled with love. But they have the strength, the strength to do that.
If I had ten divisions of those men then our troubles would be over very quickly. You have to have men who are moral, and at the same time who are able to utilise their primordial instinct to kill; without feeling, without passion, without judgement. Without judgement. Because its judgement that defeats us.
Okay, so WW3 is a Holy War, after a phony war of diplomats and treaties and promises to leave Israel alone, even though it flies in the face of the rest of the UN's doctines or whatever. The leader points his might at Jerusalem and proceeds to break the peace and seek his vengeance for a religious insult, personal slight, or diplomatic betrayal (or some other pretext). He is not going there to get iron ore, oil, gold, wheat, beef, terms of trade acceptance (see Nips WW2) or territorial redress (I don't see Israel having peace and a traty for 3.5 years whilst holding, invading or occupying large chunks foreign real estate). He is going there in the same state of mind that drove the Pogroms, The Final Solution, The Pharoah, and the bad viceroy in Esther. He is going to enslave Israel or wipe 'em out. And He will fight with God on his side as per usual. The West will -most probably- defend Israel too. The UN will crumble as nations picks sides.
So in all the above, what does the leaders name matter? Did people take notice of the Nazi's first or their leader, Hitler? Who noticed his real power and took note of his real motivations? Only those with hindsight.
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To: Zero Tolerance, ALL
How's it going?
Pretty good. I was surprised to see this thread renewed after nearly 8 mos. I posted this for the same reason I post any article, and that is for the discussion and debate that it brings. I noticed a few people decided to ridicule me, and that's fine. All I wanted was some discussion on the subject. In the time since I posted this, I have read the entire Left Behind series, and found it rather entertaining reading. I don't dwell on this subject, or really harbor any particularly strong beliefs about it, other than what's in the bible. The reason I posted it was because I listened to the interview that Kathleen Keating did on the Art Bell show, and I found it very intriguing. Whatever your thoughts on the subject, you have to admit that it is interesting, and if you don't think so, then there are thousands of other articles here on FR to read. Peace.
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To: Space Wrangler
The real anti-christ resides in Happy Camp, CA. His name is Eddy. He killed Bob Crane.
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To: ohms
Wow!
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To: mit
I don't want a turn could someone take note and write that down..thanks
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To: 12B
Joe Lieberman is the antichrist. Israel would accept him blindly as they did in the election.
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To: linn37
Take note of this at least: civil defense - the end of this world is by fire, not flood. And it comes when it is going off, rancid. Christianity is the salt of the earth, the preservative. When Christianity goes, when the mission is over, or so oppressed (worldwide absolutely non-existent) then it goes off. Since Christianity springs from the Word, this involves the absolute loss, substitution or destruction of the Word. The Word and God are One.
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To: ohms
Of course the end of the world is by fire...everyone knows that. Personally, I picture God up there laughing his butt off because we are destroying ourselves with technology, he won't have to lift a finger this time!
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To: Space Wrangler
By the by, what's all this "All your base are belong to us" stuff? Care to tackle that one?
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To: Zero Tolerance
Click HERE for great justice!
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