Disclaimer: Opinions posted on Free Republic are those of the individual posters and do not necessarily represent the opinion of Free Republic or its management. All materials posted herein are protected by copyright law and the exemption for fair use of copyrighted works.
The Washington Times
The sisterhood, 27 years later
January 24, 2000
Barbara Curtis
Twenty-seven years ago, nine black-robed men handed feminists a triumph that would try our souls, and - I have come to believe - find them wanting.
On Jan. 22, 1973, when the "Sisterhood is Powerful" crowd rejoiced at the outcome of Roe vs. Wade, I was with them - a Washington radical feminist scholar/abortion rights advocate, much in demand as a spokeswoman by virtue of my motherhood. After all, who better to illustrate the righteous need for abortion than a young woman with a future, already encumbered by a 3-year-old in day care?
Five years later in San Francisco, that same little girl clutched my hand as we struggled against the chilly Van Ness Avenue wind on our way to some euphemistically styled "women's health clinic."
"Samantha," I explained, ever the politically vigilant parent, "Mommy is pregnant. But since Jasmine's only 2 and I'm not married anymore, this just isn't a good time to have a baby. We're lucky women have a choice."
I was proud of the legacy we would leave my daughter's generation. Thanks to the second wave of feminism, abortion was now available, accessible and not much worse than a trip to the dentist. Paid for by the state of California, to boot. And on the morning of my own abortion, I was feeling a little extra righteous. After years of posturing and sloganeering, I finally had an opportunity to demonstrate my core beliefs - like a rite of passage.
Or a sacrament.
And in the 27 years since Roe vs. Wade, isn't that what it's now become? Consider the sacred ground around abortion temples, free speech suspended so as not to hinder partaking of the ritual within and abortion providers occupying pedestals for their noble efforts. Heretics dare not blaspheme by calling a fetus a baby or what happens to it murder. And as though in the grip of a state religion, the media use only sanctioned terms: pro-choice, reproductive rights, products of conception.
Consider: While every other political group is permitted to baptize itself and demonstrate publicly, those who call themselves pro-life are branded by the media anti-abortion extremists and charged with racketeering.
But who's extreme? For all the left's vaunted respect for multiculturalism, pro-abortion evangels - like missionaries of old - spend vast amounts of time, energy and taxpayer money crusading into the Third World to bring the "good news" of "family planning" to primitives whose backward belief systems stand in the way of their salvation. Like religious zealots arriving on your doorstep when what you really need is an ambulance, they rush to ravaged lands such as Kosovo with abortion kits aplenty for those in dire need of more life-sustaining commodities such as medicine, food and water.
And what about here at home? In the United States, according to the very pro-abortion Alan Guttmacher Institute, 34 million abortions took place from 1973 to 1996. That's a million and a half per year. Who knows what genius men and women were whooshed away from our midst and with them what art, what music, what inventions, what cures.
How about it, sisters? Especially those of you who rode the crest of the second wave with me: Did you ever dream that this was where we were headed? Did you ever dream we would call a politician a friend to women - no matter how flagrantly he exploited them - as long as he continued to back abortion on demand? Did you ever dream we would enter the realms of denial required to condone a procedure in which a perfectly viable infant is pulled feet first through the birth canal until all but herhead is exposed, then stabbed in the skull to suck out her brains, delivered dead and sold to the highest bidder for body parts?
That's "a certain type of late-term procedure," according to modern feminists, who have twisted themselves like pretzels to pretend the dream did not turn into a nightmare.
Perhaps it's time to wake up and slap some cold water on our faces. Time to stop the hypocrisy, to sever the ideals of feminism - dignity for women, equal status, equal opportunity, equal pay - from what has become a religious devotion to death.
We should have listened to our mothers - the feminist ones, that is.
Susan B. Anthony, now featured on our currency, wasn't thinking of political correctness when she referred to abortion as "child murder." Nor when she wrote: "No matter what the motive, love of ease, or a desire to save from suffering the unborn innocent, the woman is awfully guilty who commits the deed. It will burden her conscience in life, it will burden her soul in death; but oh, thrice guilty is he who drove her to the desperation which impelled her to the crime!"
Elizabeth Cady Stanton, with her anti-slavery perspective, wrote, "When we consider that women are treated as property, it is degrading to women that we should treat our children as property to be disposed of as we see fit."
Mattie Brinkerhoff said: "When a man steals to satisfy hunger, we may safely conclude that there is something wrong in society - so when a woman destroys the life of her unborn child, it is an evidence that either by education or circumstances she has been greatly wronged."
Think that one over next time you're standing in line at the grocery store - as I was recently - and overhear a teen-age girl nonchalantly discussing with a friend the abortion she's having tomorrow.
Some legacy.
Barbara Curtis is an author, freelance writer and mother of many, including two through adoption.
All content © 2000-, by News World Communications, Inc.; 3600 New York Avenue, NE; Washington, DC 20002 and may not be republished without permission.
Heartfelt thanks for printing this!!!-----Are we beginning to see the truth behind their lies?!!
Our nation has literally 'sacrificed' its own lifeblood.... our children ....to this hideous idea called.... Choice.
We as a species have alot of explaining to do.
Well worth reading again.
Can't help thinking about that 8-year-old, clutching her mother's hand as she made her way into the abortuary.
What a life lesson she learned that day. What an example.
Did she thank God that her mother became pregnant with her when it was "convenient" instead of this time when her baby brother or sister had to be sacrificed?
How many failed relationships and abortions will that girl have in her lifetime, because of the example her mother set for her?
Elizabeth Cady Stanton, with her anti-slavery perspective, wrote, "When we consider that women are treated as property, it is degrading to women that we should treat our children as property to be disposed of as we see fit."
Thank you for bringing this to us. As they say, "The road to Hell is paved with good intentions". Many may have thought of abortion as a solution to womens' very difficult problems, but they have to admit today, that it has become nothing more than back-up birth control. Women have sacrificed their children on the altar of 'self-determination', and I can think of nothing more disgusting! A pregnancy only disrupts a woman's life for 9 months, but an abortion ends a child's life, and that's FOREVER!
STUNNING!!!
Bump
EXCELLENT!!!
Twenty-seven years ago, nine black-robed men handed feminists a triumph that would try our souls, and - I have come to believe - find them wanting.
If we can't get together on this thread for an AMEN! to this, then I don't know what!!!
I just finished watching a tape series by Ray Vander Lan and Focus on the Family called "That The World May Know." One of the 27 lessons is specifically on the Israelites buying into the Phillistine culture and religion of Bael and Asterah worship. Of course, key to this religion was child sacrifice as a way of inducing the god Bael to bring crops (economic prosperity) each year. The precursor was the public glorification and act of of sexual intercourse outside of marriage, followed each succeeding spring by child sacrifice on a heated, bronze alter. They burned their children alive, on hilltops, in public ceremonies.
We're not quite that brazen yet, but when we are, God will punish this culture (including the Christians) with a swift judgement. He has always demanded national destruction for the shedding of innocent blood.
And the people refused/continue to refuse to choose between Bael and Yaweh.
Yeah, it's all about choice.
The institutionalizng of abortion in the world of medicine has to also be held accountable for this legacy. Money talks and clinics all over this country are complicit in the actions of our so-called sisters. How many women were told to abort their babies because a test came back that indicated something may be wrong with the child. They were told an abortion was in order, because they couldn't guarantee that the child would be "normal" at birth.
Money talks
Thart's a very good point. How many abortionists who are so smug about the "woman's right to choose" would give away their "services" for free? How many "pro-choice" organizations buy abortions for those who cannot afford them? It's all about the money.
Re: #10, I admire your optimism. :^)
The claws are in deep, and it will take an act of Congress to extract them! As long as it's legal, the cycle will continue.
No one figured on the cost.
What inane, hysterical drivel. Your position of Roe vs. Wade holding the arts and our culture hostage is a stretch to say the least.
Instead of clouding the issue with gut-wrenching sob stories wouldn’t your talents be far better utilized educating the 15-year-old daughters of suburbia on the do’s and don’ts of intercourse? Abstinence and education are far better decisions to an unwanted pregnancy than abortion.
Your piece fails to even mention a solution just more hysteria inflaming of the right-wing-nutz and the terminally silly.
"Samantha," I explained, ever the politically vigilant parent, "Mommy is pregnant. But since Jasmine's only 2 and I'm not married anymore, this just isn't a good time to have a baby. We're lucky women have a choice."
Samantha and I are just about the same age, early thirties. My parents had an "afterthought" pregnancy when I was six, resulting in my youngest sister. Samantha's aborted sibling would be very close in age to my young sister.
I'll be perfectly honest with you, my little sister makes me nuts most of the time. She always has. I was the baby in the family until she came along and I suppose, subconsciously, I still miss my "baby" status.However...
When I try to imagine what it would be like if my little sister hadn't been allowed to live, I don't think about my missing "baby" status. I think about how much fun it was to have a real, live doll to play with when I was six years old. I think about how much fun it was teaching her to ride a bike. I think about how much fun we had hanging out at the municipal park, going fishing in the river, canoeing. I think about how much fun we had sneaking out of the house on "Devil's Night," armed with a 24-pack of Charmin. I think about how very, very weird (good-weird) it was when I caught her necking with her boyfriend when she was sixteen. I gave 'em both the sex talk to end all sex talks that night. I think of the day I got married, with my little sister standing beside me as maid-of-honor. I think about the day my oldest son was christened, making my little sister a first-time Godmother. I think about how much I miss her now that we live across the state from another.
Right now I am thinking, poor Samantha. I hope she is not overly troubled by her mother's selfishness. I hope she does not dwell too often on what she has lost--the joy of a sibling.
Samantha is another casualty of RvW.
"We as a species have alot of explaining to do."
To whom?
Evil is mundane, this woman telling her child, say goodbye to your brother or sister, too bad he or she is an inconvenience at this time. How twisted.
God is judging us now, look at how we are being destroyed, there is a price to pay, and we will drink every drop from that cup.
Instead of clouding the issue with gut-wrenching sob stories wouldn’t your talents be far better utilized educating the 15-year-old daughters of suburbia on the do’s and don’ts of intercourse?
I don't see that gut-wrenching sob stories cloud the issue at all. Gut-wrenching sob stories are the usual aftermath of abortion. Maybe if more women shared their gut-wrenching sob stories, how abortion really affected their lives, more women facing unplanned pregnancies would choose life. I volunteered for two years in a women's crisis shelter. I probably met around 200 women during that time, many of whom had had abortions. Not once did a woman say "Yes, I had an abortion. What a great idea."
BTW, Skooz posted the article but did not author the article.
Freepers ought to look up Mother Teresa's talk on abortion at the prayer breakfast some years ago. Maybe a more computer-literate freeper than me can post a link to one of the many sites that contain it. She calls abortion the greatest evil in the world at this time.
As to how to fix the problem, we need to elect a President and Congress who will appoint Constitutional judges or an amendment. Bush, being a liberal, is not going to do anything about this problem as the comments of both he a his wife have shown. Perhaps a law that would hang any judge who was pro-abortion would be a good start. And also hang any health-care provider who provided an abortion for any reason other than the life of the mother, rape, or incest - and even then only under certain circumstances.
Hey, Reagan Cowboy, where can I get a copy of that videotape?
Regards
Sounds like your appointment will be interesting.
Earlier this weeks FREE REPUBLIC had a thread on who should replace Patricia Ireland as president of the National Organization of Women.
I think the mother who killed her five kids in Houston would make an excellent choice. She was only carrying the rationalization for abortion, admittely at a somewhat later stage. The baby killing crowd at NOW would love her.
The 34,000,000 murders in our country in the last 27 years is an indelible stain on this country. At least the Germans or Russians or Cambodians, could always say that the holocausts their countries carried out happened under a "dictatorship", but our holocaust occured under a "democracy".
I tremble for this country when I reflect God is just.
Instead of clouding the issue with gut-wrenching sob stories wouldn’t your talents be far better utilized educating the 15-year-old daughters of suburbia on the do’s and don’ts of intercourse? Abstinence and education are far better decisions to an unwanted pregnancy than abortion.
I don't think discussing the gut-wrenching sob stories of abortion are out of place when educating our daughters about sex. It's just one piece of the sex education puzzle, for both sons and daughters.
Like Samantha in the story there are many who have grown up with those perverted ideas about abortion. And they'll be interacting with my children, so I want my kids to know all sides, and what I expect of them.
I think it's more important to educate boys at this point, that once they engage in intercourse with a girl, and God forbid she get pregnant, he has NO rights as to what is "done" with that baby. And if she decides not to abort he is now stuck with 18 years of child support, not to mention being responsible for another life. My son didn't like either one of those options and he might not have known that it comes down to that if I hadn't explained all the sides, including the gut-wrenching parts.
Did you ever dream we would enter the realms of denial required to condone a procedure in which a perfectly viable infant is pulled feet first through the birth canal until all but her head is exposed, then stabbed in the skull to suck out her brains, delivered dead and sold to the highest bidder for body parts?
From the nit-picker corner: This reminds me of the bumper stickers I see regularly which say "She's a child, not a choice", or "It's a child, not a choice". I totally support the Pro-life position, and would immediately outlaw partial birth abortion given that choice, but I would also like to see, one time at least "He's a child, not a choice". I suppose it is done the way is is for PR reasons, but it still rankles.
Amen!
Did you and I disagree on something? ;^)
P.S.: I thought many times during the debate over whether to televise the McVeigh execution, that I would agree to it if it could be coupled with an agreement to televise a partial birth abortion. I think that would change a lot of minds very quickly.
Check out Lifeway Christian Bookstores. The ISBN for the tape series is 0-310-67865-X. I misspelled the teachers' name earlier, it's Ray Vander Laan, and the series was originally known as "So The World May Know" but it is now sold as "Faith Lessons."
The lesson I referred to is on Volume Two, Video One, Lesson One: Innocent Blood. On the same tape also view Lesson Three: The Wages of Sin.
Of course you may be able to find this tape at your church or pastor's office, or (hopefully) at a public library. I doubt it would be at Blockbuster...
To own the entire four volume, eight tape, 27 lesson series you can expect to pay about $100. Highly worth it -- great material!
Absolutely, I am all for televising an abortion on prime time nationwide network television. The abortion industry would be shut down by an enraged populace the next day.
Thanks for the info. Regards
I wish Mother Teresa had given a speech before the congress about how that we, who have held ourselves out to the world as the most Christian nation on earth, have stirred the wrath of God and have filled our own cup to the brim with judgment.
If we don't want our own children, we will be sent the children of strangers. If we don't want to instruct our children in His ways, then we will be sent the children of strangers with strange gods. If we don't want our own children, to instruct in our ways and our Constitution, we will be sent the children of strangers who hate us and our ways.
All a Christian can do at this point is pray for God to send the spirit of repentence upon this nation, and hope he answers that prayer.
"Freepers ought to look up Mother Teresa's talk on abortion at the prayer breakfast some years ago. Maybe a more computer-literate freeper than me can post a link to one of the many sites that contain it. She calls abortion the greatest evil in the world at this time."
An excerpt:
Thanks for asking. It's a joy to read again.
....I would also like to see, one time at least "He's a child, not a choice". I suppose it is done the way is is for PR reasons, but it still rankles.
A friend of mine has one on her car, so they are available somewhere.
I've often thought "It's a son or daughter, not a choice" would be more effective.
"If we don't want our own children, we will be sent the children of strangers. If we don't want to instruct our children in His ways, then we will be sent the children of strangers with strange gods. If we don't want our own children, to instruct in our ways and our Constitution, we will be sent the children of strangers who hate us and our ways."
HUH? What the heck is this about?
It's about judgement for sins, for those that think God is not working in the world today.
"If we don't want our own children, we will be sent the children of strangers. If we don't want to instruct our children in His ways, then we will be sent the children of strangers with strange gods. If we don't want our own children, to instruct in our ways and our Constitution, we will be sent the children of strangers who hate us and our ways."
I assume you're talking about international adoption. Adoption has a long tradition in the Bible, and I'd suggest to you that if it's good enough for God, then it should be good enough for you.
Your comments are extremely offensive and not Christian by any stretch of the imagination.
I am not talking about international adoption, wrong assumption.
"I am not talking about international adoption, wrong assumption."
Then tell me what "children of strangers"...."children of strangers with strange gods"....and, "children of strangers who hate us and our ways"....you are talking about.
Here's the list, our open borders, paying for the college education of illegal aliens, Muslim children allowed to pray in school, but not Christian children, seperate graduation classes that would have brought out National Guard tanks if a gentile had suggested it, the embrace of socialism by most minorities and an open disdain for our flag and our constitution, more?
OK, divers license, medical payments, and eventually the right to vote by illegal aliens, the refusal by some city mayors to allow anyone that doesn't speak spanish or chinese like a native to hold a city job, the forcing of both Americans and Christians to accept that other cultures and their religions are not only equal to but better than our own. Not only a rewriting but silence about our history and culture, the removal of Christ from Christmas and the referal to it as Holiday Season, the ripping of nativity scenes and the ten commandments from public display. More?
The growing problem of radical illegal rebel forces burning our flag and demanding the return of the entire South West to Mexico, the socialist element imported from Europe that are very politically active, those are the strangers I'm refering to.
The problem is that that our language lacks a gender-neutral pro-noun.
Uggh...I never thought I would ever use the term "gender-neutral" in a sentence.
"Samantha," I explained, ever the politically vigilant parent, "Mommy is pregnant. But since Jasmine's only 2 and I'm not married anymore, this just isn't a good time to have a baby. We're lucky women have a choice."
I was proud of the legacy we would leave my daughter's generation. Thanks to the second wave of feminism, abortion was now available, accessible and not much worse than a trip to the dentist. Paid for by the state of California, to boot. And on the morning of my own abortion, I was feeling a little extra righteous.
The fact that this woman took her daughter to the clinic with her while she murdered her unborn babe not only horrified me, but made me downright nauseous. "Legacy," indeed. Does little Samantha remember this watershed moment in her relationship with her mother?? Does it chill her to realize that, but for the grace of God, it could have been her -- an inconvenient, expendable parasite? Now that she is (presumably) an adult, does it give her nightmares??
It should.
I wonder how righteous Barbara Curtis will feel before the Throne.
I know the answer. I was just seeing if IncPen did. And in truth, all of our appointments will be interesting. :)
This shows what happens when we THINK we're doing the right thing... This mother felt GOOD about killing her unborn, unwanted child. She felt GOOD that this was the opportunity to teach her daughter a lesson.
Life is full of opportunities, I am sure Bill Clinton and Hillary Clinton have taken Chelsea in hand many a times... to teach her lessons...lessons in evil.
Even Cannibals show their children how to make a stew.
"Here's the list, our open borders, paying for the college education of illegal aliens, Muslim children allowed to pray in school, but not Christian children, seperate graduation classes that would have brought out National Guard tanks if a gentile had suggested it, the embrace of socialism by most minorities and an open disdain for our flag and our constitution, more?
OK, divers license, medical payments, and eventually the right to vote by illegal aliens, the refusal by some city mayors to allow anyone that doesn't speak spanish or chinese like a native to hold a city job, the forcing of both Americans and Christians to accept that other cultures and their religions are not only equal to but better than our own. Not only a rewriting but silence about our history and culture, the removal of Christ from Christmas and the referal to it as Holiday Season, the ripping of nativity scenes and the ten commandments from public display. More?
The growing problem of radical illegal rebel forces burning our flag and demanding the return of the entire South West to Mexico, the socialist element imported from Europe that are very politically active, those are the strangers I'm refering to."
I don't understand why anyone would think that the major threat to the American way of life comes from recent immigrants or (as you first focused on) their children. On the contrary, most people who come here desperately want the American dream....not the socialist or communist nightmare they've just fled. And most of the socialist types I've encountered in my life have come from families that have been here for hundreds of years....even some that have American revolutionary patriots as ancestors.
The point is, your ethnicity or your "member since" date proves absolutely nothing. And folks like you who assume that it does are gravely mistaken.
Also, you can't force "Americans and Christians to accept that other cultures and their religions are not only equal to but better than our own." You can't force anyone to think a certain way, any more that you can force them not to pray.
Absolutely an heart-smashing article.
How big that new sisterhood must be by now -- nature and God make it so!
What great unheralded quotations she uses!
Thanks so much for the ping and for finding this jewel to bookmark!
"AMEN!"
AMEN!!
A repeat of a post from another thread that deserves repeating:
"A famous physician died and went to meet God's judgement.
He said, 'God, I have healed thousands of people with Your help, but why didn't You ever send someone to help me cure cancer, heart disease, MS, AIDS and all the other dreaded diseases about which I could do nothing.
God said, "I did, you aborted them."'
I thought Barbara Curtis' piece was excellent. However, much as I like the idea behind the exchange directly above, I frankly wish this line of argument would be dropped altogether because it introduces a value judgement on the worthiness of life. Think of how easily the reverse can be argued -- i.e., the crime rates are down now thanks to the aborting of so many murderers and other lowlifes. This same argument could be furthered to include handicapped babies and other "burdens on society." The bottom life is, shouldn't all human life be considered worthy in and of itself?
From the nit-picker corner: This reminds me of the bumper stickers I see regularly which say "She's a child, not a choice", or "It's a child, not a choice". I totally support the Pro-life position, and would immediately outlaw partial birth abortion given that choice, but I would also like to see, one time at least "He's a child, not a choice". I suppose it is done the way is is for PR reasons, but it still rankles.
I think it's done to show the NOW crowd that they are killing their prospective NOW members. At least that is how I always took it...
We began with the great idea of every man being equal, and every man having his share of the American dream. A vision of every man's life being lifted to it's unique and valuable state.
Instead of asking God to bless this endeavor we asked him to wait in the back room so as not to offend our new brothers under the skin. So in my opinion while we have had some limited success in blending people's, we have not had the success we would have had we not embraced abortion, allowed the word Christian to become a dirty word, and the name of Jesus to become almost unspeakable in this nation.
If this course isn't changed we will go down like the Titanic in short order. You can turn a blind eye to the voting record of these new imigrants and the problems we are facing in holding onto the Constitution in this nation if you want to. I prefer the data that tells the story, you know facts.
No, an apathetic populace would turn off the television and move on to something else so they didn't have to think about it. People are not ignorant about what an abortion is. Just not enough of them care.
"shouldn't all human life be considered worthy in and of itself? "
Of course.
The consideration of a major contribution to society should never be the criteria for saving a human life.
The poster of this reply to another thread had in mind, however, the possible alleviation of human suffering by saving the life of one aborted baby.
Thanks for this post.
And for all who did make the horrible mistake of taking our child's life, thank God his mercies are new every morning.
But little did we consider at the time, how we would suffer with the memory of the murders we committed.
Women considering this "choice" today need to hear from those of us who once made it-- of the pain and burden we will carry in our hearts forever.
Yes, I understand. And don't get me wrong, I'm as prolife as they come. It's just that I'm leery of that particular line of argument b/c it can so easily be turned around the other way. Thank you for your thoughtful response. We prolifers have to be supportive of each other, and I appreciate your posts.
I am all for televising an abortion on prime time nationwide network television. The abortion industry would be shut down by an enraged populace the next day.
31 Posted on 06/23/2001 09:19:38 PDT by Skooz
Sadly, skooz, I believe you are mistaken. Human nature is such that when confronted with gut-wrenching culpability (and this entire nation is culpable, not just the damn LIEberal pukes like Boxer, clinton, Harkin, Kennedy, etc.), a rationalization takes over to avoid confronting the harsh realities. I can hear it already (and we've heard these things), "I didn't kill the unborn." ... "This nation is in financial decline already, so just think of how bad it would be with 41 million more mouths to feed." ... I wouldn't do that horrible thing, but I don't think we have the right to impose our will, to enslave a woman's body." ... "Ending the life while in the womb, is merciful, when you consider that most abortions are for women who wouldn't care for their children anyway." ... "Better to protect society prior to bringing them into the world to be a burden." Yeah, I can hear the belching demonic crap already!
Logical arguments don't get through to emotionally fogged minds. And emotional appeals anger the unconscious self-serving like GeneH. Evil doesn't usually strut so openly as it does with aborticution of the conscious unborn ... sadly, evil gets away with such a parade in my nation. It makes me sick, and it makes me angry, and I'm so frustrated by the evil swamping my nation because I don't know what can turn it around! I've wanted to prodcue a three-D ultrasound video and distribute it free across the land, showing the prenatals responding to outside the womb stimuli ... for they do, you know! I've sought just one lawyer who would seek an injuction, a restraining order on an abortuary that harvests fetal remains, on the grounds that NOT ONE MOVE is made to confirm death in the womb (they know there is life instead, and they fully intend to kill so they can harvest) prior to beginning the harvesting process, contrary to all that is practiced in medicine where comatose and semi-comatose patients are concerned.
No, this nation, my nation, is beyond redemption now. Sadly, even televising a partial birth murder of a 32 week prenatal wouldn't turn the tide when so much has been condoned, when so many are complicit in the evil.
My husband's "birth mother" was single and already had a child when she got pregnant by a married man. He firmly believes that if abortion had been legal back then, he and his twin sister would not be here. As it turned out, he and his sister were adopted by a loving family who already had 4 other children, 3 of whom are also adopted.
Had he been conceived just a few years later, he would most likely not be here, we would not have our 2 wonderful children and this world would certainly be a much different place.
"We prolifers have to be supportive of each other,..."
Agreed.
To say it another way, we anti-murderers have to be supportive of each other.
AMEN!
My husband's "birth mother" was single and already had a child when she got pregnant by a married man. He firmly believes that if abortion had been legal back then, he and his twin sister would not be here. As it turned out, he and his sister were adopted by a loving family who already had 4 other children, 3 of whom are also adopted. Had he been conceived just a few years later, he would most likely not be here, we would not have our 2 wonderful children and this world would certainly be a much different place.
A more eloquent illustration of the long term consequences of abortion is hardly possible. Thanks for your thoughtful post.
"We began with the great idea of every man being equal, and every man having his share of the American dream. A vision of every man's life being lifted to it's unique and valuable state."
Yeah. It's a good plan, so why have you abandoned it?
"Instead of asking God to bless this endeavor we asked him to wait in the back room so as not to offend our new brothers under the skin. So in my opinion while we have had some limited success in blending people's, we have not had the success we would have had we not embraced abortion, allowed the word Christian to become a dirty word, and the name of Jesus to become almost unspeakable in this nation."
You know, I'm typically a "glass half full" type of gal, but next to you I feel like Pollyanna. The name of Jesus is spoken freely here. It's even on billboards everywhere. If you want to see some actual oppression, I suggest you visit some of the home countries of some of the recent American immigrants you dislike so.
"If this course isn't changed we will go down like the Titanic in short order. You can turn a blind eye to the voting record of these new imigrants and the problems we are facing in holding onto the Constitution in this nation if you want to. I prefer the data that tells the story, you know facts."
As I've already mentioned, there are a whole lot more people with bloodlines that reach far back into American history voting that way. Why don't you take a break from your immigrant bashing and pick on them for awhile? A change of pace is always nice.
I see the power of immigrants to control the course of American politics to strictly socialist/communism/totalitarianism, as a judgement on this nation. One we deserve if we do not repent of our betrayals and sins, dump abortion and pray earnestly for their waking up to the fact that their votes are being imported in order to promote an agenda of oppression for everyone.
If we don't pray for them to drop their own racism we are in for future problems when they are in the majority in 20 to 25 years. If being clear sighted is bashing to you, well aint that too bad.
Fantastic ! Cobby, I lov e that quote it says it all.
Thanks for the ping Cobby.
AMEN , you said it perfectly !
You said this......"If we don't want our own children, we will be sent the children of strangers. If we don't want to instruct our children in His ways, then we will be sent the children of strangers with strange gods. If we don't want our own children, to instruct in our ways and our Constitution, we will be sent the children of strangers who hate us and our ways."....
What exactly are you attempting to say here???? I read it twice and I just do not get it. Are you against adoption or something??????????
Abortion is murder and their is NO way to flower it up. But I have no clue what this paragraph you wrote here means.
Please explain. Thank you so much.
...34 million abortions took place from 1973 to 1996.
Who knows what genius men and women were whooshed away from our midst and with them what art, what music, what inventions, what cures.
I've always put it this way: Since children tend largely to adopt the political views of their parents, and since those who participate in this "right of choice" tend to be liberals, there are 34 million liberals who will not vote in our elections -- several million of whom would already be old enough to vote.
No, an apathetic populace would turn off the television and move on to something else so they didn't have to think about it. People are not ignorant about what an abortion is. Just not enough of them care.
Unfortunately, I agree. I used to think if people knew all the facts
on abortion and on the abortion industry hearts would change. But after
eight years of Clinton and how people continued to support him my view
of the American public has been
more than somewhat jaded. Sadly, we will continue to be more concerned
with what government can do for us, than in protecting innocent life.
...kiling their prospective NOW members..
That's correct. Many pro-abortion people, and many women who have their babies killed, are hostile toward men. Often, buying an abortion is an act of hostility toward the father. The idea of killing a male baby would bother them not at all, may in fact offer grim satisfaction.
Feminism sure has done a lot to elevate society.
Maybe if you follow the rest of my posts on this thread you will understand. I'm not talking about adoption. It's more about immigration and in particular illegal immigration.
Because we have killed our own children, and because we have not taught the ones that we have allowed to live, of their God or their freedoms, we have instead strangers, some of which do not mean us well, many of whom are racist, that have no desire to blend in, but to recreate their own country in this land.
Instead of our having prayed for the success of our immigration program, we have asked God to wait in the back room so as not to offend. Therefore instead of the spirit of the majority of immigrants being moved to embrace a new way, they are moved to racism and segregation. This is a judgement against us for aborting 40 million human beings as far as I am concerned.
Thanks for the heads up!
"I see the power of immigrants to control the course of American politics to strictly socialist/communism/totalitarianism, as a judgement on this nation. One we deserve if we do not repent of our betrayals and sins, dump abortion and pray earnestly for their waking up to the fact that their votes are being imported in order to promote an agenda of oppression for everyone.
If we don't pray for them to drop their own racism we are in for future problems when they are in the majority in 20 to 25 years. If being clear sighted is bashing to you, well aint that too bad."
We wouldn't be having this conversation if I shared your opinion that you are "clear sighted." For instance, if you want to continue to ignore the fact that most of the people who vote to advance "socialist/communism/totalitarianism" are white folks with families that have been here for generations, you can. It's silly, but it's a free country and you can be as narrowly focused as you want to be.
Words like yours just send "minorities" and others that abhor racism running into the arms of the rats.
In a nutshell, you're not helping.
I think your problem is with the word balance, there is about a 50/50 split in this country between socialist and conservatives, the influx of others that adhere to the socialist agenda, and their voting record is proof of the pudding, then the country tilts left, permanently.
I feel that is something to pray about, if you don't feel the same way fine, don't pray.
"I think your problem is with the word balance...."
No, my problem is with you infering that the "children of strangers" are some sort of curse on America.
It's awful.
Let me relate a little personal history for you. I had managed a business for a man for five years in the same shopping center. We had a big influx of Asian immigrants, and the government funded them millions of dollars to establish their own business's. Between government subsidies, illegal drugs and prostitution, an Asian man bought our strip center, and opened his own grocery store at the end of the strip.
He informed us that our lease would not be renewed as he only leases to asians, while my boss, being a conservative mulled over a discrimination law suit, a jewlery store in another near by asian shopping strip was bombed. The jewlery store owner's wife was killed.
One night at 4am I was wakened by a call from the police department asking me to come down to our place of business and give the fire dept entry because all sprinkler control equipment originated in the back of our store. I have been in many a sureal situation in my life, but I was not prepared for what I was about to see.
A rival gang, btw we count 7,000 gang members in our community now, not to mention a city wide rat infestation originating in our new asain community, had set off a bomb in the grocery store, glass, can goods, shelving, shopping carts, were blown out the front of the building for 80 to 100 feet. It was like driving into a Viet Nam war scene movie set.
Apparently our new landlord was in a gang war with a rival shopping strip owner. In the months following, during the repair of the grocery store, armed men with rifles and shotguns stood posted outside the grocery store. Now non asians are not at all welcome in this area of the city.
I don't mind correction or admonition when it is deserved from people who have experienced the same as I. But if I choose to see this as a judgement on this nation and choose to pray for the spirit effecting this gang war to be changed there is little you can say to dissuade me that I am in the wrong here, and I invite other's to pray with me that the spirit directing our nation is turned towards God the moment a new citizen's feet hit our shores.
I recently was "discussing" abortion with a married member of the now crowd. She was holding her 9 month old daughter on her hip while shaking her finger in my face and asking me why I didn't believe all humans had a right to chose what happened to their bodies. In the calmest voice I could muster I asked her if she realized what a wonder her young daughter was to be talking at such a young age. With a confused look on her face, and a bit of obvious caution she quietly asked me what I meant, since "my daughter can't talk, she is only 9 months old." She knew the trap was sprung when I asked her how she new her daughter had communicated her "choice" for pierced ears and ear-rings if she could not talk.
EEEwwww...pointing out fact is not fair when discussing abortion with pro-abortion types. Good show!
"But if I choose to see this as a judgement on this nation and choose to pray for the spirit effecting this gang war to be changed there is little you can say to dissuade me that I am in the wrong here, and I invite other's to pray with me that the spirit directing our nation is turned towards God the moment a new citizen's feet hit our shores."
That's a far cry from #33:
"If we don't want our own children, we will be sent the children of strangers. If we don't want to instruct our children in His ways, then we will be sent the children of strangers with strange gods. If we don't want our own children, to instruct in our ways and our Constitution, we will be sent the children of strangers who hate us and our ways."
Talking about little kids as if they are evil and spell doom for America, is far different from praying that their parents will end up being the kind of Americans you want them to be.
As for your story, there are violent criminals of all sorts here. They are quite obviously not all just recent immigrants or "minorities." The recent immigrants that I know are all professional people....doctors, engineers, and Christian seminary students among them. It is unfortunate that you have a tendency to paint "strangers" with such a wide brush.
"I don't mind correction or admonition when it is deserved from people who have experienced the same as I."
Your correction and admoniton is coming from someone who has been to communist countries and seen the lines of desperate people at our Embassies....(praying that they escape their brutal governments) and from the mother of two little girls that did escape. BTW, their ethnicity is Chinese....and it breaks my heart that some people will probably dislike them for that alone.
I absolutely hate that. It's not what America is all about. And it's not Christian either.
Are you a Christian? I am curious as to how you seem to know so much about what one is, and yet you have no understanding of the term "children" as used in the Old Testament, the "children" of Israel refers to adults, or how about Isaiah 2:6 therefore you have forsaken thy people, the house of Jacob, because they be replenished from the east, and are soothsayers like the Philistines, and please themselves in the children of strangers. The term children is used many times to designate people born of another nation or way.
It's nice that you are able to travel in the rarified company of doctors and engineers, and professional people. However people in my income level are left with the stolen bicycles, the car windows shot out with pellet guns, the cars that are keyed, the gangs, the gun shots from the park across the street so you don't dare spend time in your front yard after dark, the declining neighborhoods, the fights that erupt right in your own front yard, and the neighborhood watches where we try to protect each other through constant vigilance.
I dare to say that there are far more examples of the element that inhabits my neighborhood in this country than the very welcome Doctors, and Engineers that inhabits the more elite one that you evidently enjoy.
As far as the communist countries you have visted, it's too bad that you spent that kind of money traveling when you could have visited the third world country that many of our neighborhoods are turning into right here in "America". I'm glad you have such a handle on what America is about as I am no longer sure myself.
So I will just continue to pray for the people that move here for economic reasons only, to realize the cost of freedom to the point that they are not willing to sell their votes to the highest bidder. I will continue to pray that they come to understand what great possibilities real freedom offers them and pray that God give them a vision of what can be accomplished when racism is overcome and laws obeyed. In other words a change of spirit.
I wonder if this prayer will be answered if we continue to hang onto abortion as a national disgrace. It could be that if we continue to hold onto abortion, that we will be sent more children of strangers (translated people of other nations) that display such a disdain for the inhabitants of this country that they quickly build a replica of their own, in already established cities, and then dare anyone of another race to enter their newly acquired territory.
"Are you a Christian? I am curious as to how you seem to know so much about what one is, and yet you have no understanding of the term "children" as used in the Old Testament, the "children" of Israel refers to adults, or how about Isaiah 2:6 therefore you have forsaken thy people, the house of Jacob, because they be replenished from the east, and are soothsayers like the Philistines, and please themselves in the children of strangers. The term children is used many times to designate people born of another nation or way."
Oh, cmon. What a twisted explanation. "Children" aren't really children.....And I should know that because I'm a Christian. That's absolutely ridiculous. After all, you kept using the phrase "children of strangers." I guess that (in MissAmericanPie-speak) means "adults of strangers." (HUH?) You remind me of Bill Clinton and his verbal gymnastics over what the word "is" is.
If you wanted to do the honorable thing and apologize for giving the wrong impression to me and others on this thread, that'd be one thing. But your condescending (not to mention tardy and inept) explanation of what "children" really means, along with your snide and ignorant comments about my economic status are abysmal. You've cashed in any credibility you had.
I'm done here.
So now after your "innuendo's" regarding my Christianity, and displaying your own lack of knowledge of biblical language, after advising me on how I should "take a break" and filling me in on your elitist attitude of, "it's no sweat off my nose if you and the nation are having problems with immigrants, I'm due for cocktails with my high dollar immigrant friends that don't bomb stores, so I refuse to pray with you". You want to let yourself off the hook with an "I am done"? After I have patiently responded to all your posts, answering all your questions, the first time I toss the ball to you, your done?
And it's my credibility that has crashed? I have no idea what is wrong with you. But fine, go in peace.
BUMP-a-Rama
Disclaimer: Opinions posted on Free Republic are those of the individual posters and do not necessarily represent the opinion of Free Republic or its management. All materials posted herein are protected by copyright law and the exemption for fair use of copyrighted works.
[
Top
|
Latest Posts
|
Latest Articles
|
Self Search
|
Add Bookmark
|
Post
|
Abuse
|
Help!
]
FreeRepublic , LLC, PO BOX 9771, FRESNO, CA 93794 Forum Version 2.0a Copyright © 1999 Free Republic, LLC |