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They're here, they're mad, get used to it
Lured by dreams of hobnobbing with their Florida recount heroes, Free Republic faithful have to make do with one another.
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By Kerry Lauerman
June 24, 2001 | SEABROOK, S.C. -- I make it to the Free Republic conference Saturday just in time for the "Round Table Discussion on Media Bias," held in a conference room that, despite its panoramic view of the Atlantic Ocean, is a little dark and dank, the air stale from a good number of cigarettes.
When I'm introduced to the group of about 25 members sitting at the tables, organized in a square, I'm mostly met with glares, some steely, others surprised. It's not just that Freepers hate Salon. (But, boy, do they hate Salon.) They also hate, with the exception of Fox News, the rest of the media. "Feminized men and airhead women," clucks Janice Matchett, a retired widow from Florida. The room suddenly seems a little darker. I'm instructed by someone to turn to Page 15 in a handy, pocket-size version of the Declaration of Independence (provided by the libertarian Cato Institute) to peruse the list of signatories.
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"See, even a Clymer signed it," she says, and the group breaks into laughter. The signer was a George Clymer; the reference, of course, was to venerable New York Times reporter Adam Clymer, slurred by George W. Bush last summer as a "major league asshole." Now Clymer has become shorthand on the Free Republic site (which has rules against profanity) for "asshole" and "journalist," since to Freepers they're synonymous.
A very large man sitting next to me launches into a tangent on how the media is generally biased because reporters are generally dumb. Journalism schools, he points out, are where all the kids who couldn't make it in business school go. "They're just not very smart," he says angrily.
I didn't expect to be the only media person at this, the second annual Southeastern Rally, thrown by the South Carolina chapter of the Free Republic Network, the nascent organizing group that has spun off from no-holds-barred conservative Web site FreeRepublic.com. Expectations were high. Last year was a high-profile success, thanks to Linda Tripp's first post-impeachment hearing appearance, but this weekend's gathering seemed ready to top it: Florida Secretary of State Katherine Harris and Circuit Judge Sanders Sauls, who stopped the Florida recount requested by Vice President Al Gore before it was temporarily jump-started again by the Florida Supreme Court, planned to attend the convention banquet to receive awards.
Or so they thought. Harris waffled last week, then blamed "scheduling conflicts" before pulling out. Sauls pulled out at the last moment, after getting a shellacking from Florida newspapers for considering appearing at such a partisan event. The cancellations were due to "outside influence," Julie Nicholson, the event organizer and South Carolina chapter head, said gloomily.
Both may have decided that Freepers were a little hot even for their firebrand images. Freepers are angry -- boy are they mad -- and they don't just like to argue online, they like to get in people's faces. This is the only annual gathering for the Freeps (as they call themselves) and, aside from the hundreds of protests they throw every year, the only chance to meet one another.
The people who traveled and paid about $220 a night to attend this conference at the plush, gated island of Seabrook, south of Charleston, S.C., are true believers. Many of them regularly attend the protests organized in the site's chat rooms. Jo-Ann Melhuish, a friendly older woman from New Jersey, says she frequently drove down to D.C. last year to pull shifts with other Freepers in front of the White House in a daily protest the group kept alive throughout the Clinton years. Melhuish mentions, with clear pride, having once met Juanita Broaddrick at a Freeper event in Arkansas.
It's a group of conservatives who have largely self-organized online, fulfilling one of the great promises of the Internet, and there's a comfort level among them, though some are meeting for the first time, purely because they identify one another as political comrades. Journalists constantly use their forums as quasi-focus groups, and often look to them for outrageous postings; a UPI story last month found one poster who sympathized with Timothy McVeigh, and another who called him a "modern-day Paul Revere."
The group has also expressed a level of vitriol toward Democrats, particularly the Clintons (including occasional death threats), that has normally reasonable voices on the left wishing they could shut the group up. Legal scholar Cass Sunstein uses the Free Republic as an example of what his new book, "Republic.com," describes as "group polarization," where people segregate themselves so effectively online with other like-minded thinkers that they create an echo chamber where the group's worst and most malevolent opinions get reinforced and strengthened. "We might want to consider," Sunstein startlingly told the Times recently, "the possibility of ways of requiring or encouraging sites to link to opposing viewpoints."
So who are these hyperidentified Freepers, and are they dangerous? Only about 50 people are at the conference, and a majority of them appear to be over age 50, with an impressive contingent of seniors as well. But there is also Elizabeth Cornette, 25, a grad student at the University of Kentucky, who says she's a daily Free Republic chatter. She says she identified herself as a conservative in 1981 (which would put her at around age 5), when Ronald Reagan was shot.
"I was sitting on a brown velour couch, wearing black watch, plaid walking shorts and navy blue kneesocks," she says. "I can remember it clearly. He was my hero." But for a pretty blond "Bushie" in her 20s, she says, being conservative can be lonely. "It's so hip to be liberal." For her, Free Republic is a refuge.
Members of the group resent the way they've sometimes been ridiculed and caricatured by the media -- "like a bunch of sinister crazy people," says Gloria Laird, a senior citizen from Florida.
While most of them, like Laird, appear to be nice, funny, friendly people, they do make it easy to poke fun.
Next page | The nicest gift: A Confederate flag!
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Journalism schools, he points out, are where all the kids who couldn't make it in business school go
Oh that's funny! Business school is the catch-all degree for all the jocks, and other wandering boobs. And gee, they have "business calculus". Oooooh! (shaking). How "difficult"! /sarcasm
Who cares? SALON.BOMB is on the way down the toilet, and they are screaming as the waters become violent.
Wave Bye Bye to Salon.Bomb.
What are you guys complaining about? This is a lovely article. It doesn't demonize Freepers, but it does poke fun, in a harmless, genial way. What more could you want?
Actually, the real room temperature IQ types go into Kinesiology (sp?) and Education. BUt you're right, business degrees have various flavors, and those who avoid math (Human Resources, General Management) are not typically the brightest, a theory that plays out every time I have to deal with HR.
I won't even get into the Communication majors, ugh!
LTS
FReepers must be doing something right.
Salon current stock price....$.25 per share....sinking fast!
Salon current stock price....$.25 per share....sinking fast!
12+ years of Reagan/Bush(dignity-success) vs. 12 years of... jimminy-billy carter(degradation-stupidity)!!
I know I might get slammed here, but in "intelligence" only, Carter and Clinton are probably the two smartest Presidents.
Carter received a Bachelor of Science degree from the United States Naval Academy and did graduate work in nuclear physics. During his naval career he rose to the rank of lieutenant (senior grade), working under Admiral Hyman Rickover in the development of the nuclear submarine program. After his father died, he resigned his commission and returned to run the small business of his father's, and grew it into a profitable general-purpose seed and farm supply operation. He went on to be a Georgia Senator and Governor.
Clinton Graduated from Georgetown University, attended Oxford University as a Rhodes Scholar, and graduated from Yale University Law School, then went on to be a Law professor at University of Arkansas before becoming Attorney General and Governor of Arkansas.
32 Posted on 06/22/2001 12:15:45 PDT by wwwdotbiteme [ Reply | Private Reply | To 29 | Top | Last ]
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I had the same reaction. The article felt positive to me. That which the author used to attempt mockery, actually showed the positive force of FR.
the only thing bad about dot com's going south as Salon is and will/is that there are no books or paper related left over . It's always great in the outhouse and bird trays
Heads up! I was there last weekend and the Salon guy was there starting on Saturday afternoon. He was not there Friday night or Saturday morning.
I may be wrong about this but it is my understanding that he called Commonsense and said he was a "lurker" and wanted to go to the rally.
He paid the money and showed up.
That was when he announced he was from Salon.
Misrepresentation? You make the call!
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Now Clymer has become shorthand on the Free Republic site (which has rules against profanity) for "asshole" and "journalist," since to Freepers they're synonymous.
This guy has potential to be a Freeper.
In a study that correlated choice of undergraduate major with performance on the GMAT -- a standardized test used for admission to MBA programs, business majors performed below the mean for all test takers. In fact they ranked at the bottom of the list of 23 disciplines. The top performers on average were students who majored in either mathematics or in philosophy. FWIW.
That is all we need to know about salon.bomb
I don't know that I'd call this article "lovely", but it wasn't bad. She got in a few good shots, but it wasn't a slam piece.
She says we're conservative, angry, and effective and she doesn't like that. Good.
Misrepresentation? You make the call!
Did he lick any doorknobs?
That is all we need to know about salon.bomb
That is all we need to know about salon.bomb
I had the same reaction. The article felt positive to me. That which the author used to attempt mockery, actually showed the positive force of FR.
This wasn't too bad.
It actually seemed to be written in a professional, non-partisan manner, at least to me. There was a little bit of condescension that came through, but this is probably because most of the people the author met at the conference were seniors, or at least "older" people, if the author is to be believed.
On the other hand, you could take out about five or six sentences from this article and believe there was an attempt to paint this conference of Freepers as pathetic.
I think the article is balanced, not near as over the top as I would have expected from Salon.
I did an Investors Business Daily's stock check up on SALN. It reinforces the idea that liberal "elite" journalists would never have made it in business school. The stock is trading at .25 down from a 52 week high of $2.25 -- a 89% hit. The diagnosis of the stock is an "E", using an A-F grade scale. When will they ever learn that liberalism is becoming a losing business proposition? FNC's rise and CNN's fall and companies moving out of Seattle are even further proof of this.
The bottom line is simply this. People do not like the propaganda of fear based on a whole slew of lies.
Kerry is a "he".
Hey Bob, how many journalists do you know that can conduct an audit and prepare financial statements?
Oh, by the way, guess what the lowest paying job coming out of college is in terms of average salary of graduates? Here's a hint, it's NOT accounting...
What are you guys complaining about? This is a lovely article. It doesn't demonize Freepers, but it does poke fun, in a harmless, genial way. What more could you want?
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Yeah, its almost complementary. It makes me proud. And, most people who read it will consider the source.
I didn't notice but he was sneezing a lot! Could just be a cold or allegy, right? (BTW, I was able to decode your meaning as I had my FR decoder set to JR22666RW on the Monday setting)
I thought we treated Kerry rather well. Some jokes were directed his way that were of the good natured variety. The debates/engagements that I observed were normal, good Freeper ones.
During the banquest, he sat at our table and was right next to OldGlory and MatchettPI.
Point of Accuracy: MattchettPI is not retired. She is very much a full time PI as well as a "dancing machine"!
Hi, Salon! How are your stocks doing these days? I heard that I could be the pricipal stockholder with the change that I dug out of my car seats.
The top performers on average were students who majored in either mathematics or in philosophy. FWIW.
That's pretty weird. My economics teacher in high school always used to tell us that if you go to school with a "real" major (I assume he meant the hard or soft sciences) and screw up, you switch to business. If you're too stupid for business, you switch to psychology. Finally, if you're just that darned stupid to even handle psychology, you switch to philosphy. Looks like he had no idea what he was talking about.
Looks like. But economics majors do well. Economics is the only social science where majors score above the average for all test takers on the LSAT, GMAT, GRE quantitative and GRE verbal. Philosophy is the only humanities with the same distinction.
PS Economics majors on average rank 5th on the GMAT, behing Mathematics, Philosophy, Engineering and Chemistry. After Economics comes English, Computer Science, Foreign Languages and History.
PPS -- Doesn't Georgia Tech have a hot comp sci department? Or am I misremembering that? Do you do any work with Genetic Programming?
Salon is sooooo funny, they should set them selves up as comedy, maybe they would get more hits.
Interesting article! It seems as though the "Freepers" have them by the throat!
"the possibility of ways of requiring or encouraging sites to link to opposing viewpoints."
Oh, don't those Fascist pigs WISH.
If this be a slam, I say let's make the most of it! I see nothing in this piece that is particularly offensive to Free Republic. In fact, had I not known about Free Republic and read this article, I'd be joining it right now!
"Journalism schools, he points out, are where all the kids who couldn't make it in business school go."
This reminds me of a story involving Pittsburg Steeler Hall of Fame QB Terry Bradshaw. Bradshaw was frequently accused of being really dumb by sportswriters and other athletes. Who can forget Thomas "Hollywood" Henderson's observation that "Bradshaw is so dumb he couldn't spell cat if you spotted him the "C" and the "T". Well, one enterprizing reporter asked Bradshaw during a press conference if it was true that he had majored in recreational sports while in College. Terry, without missing a beat, responded that no, he had found a MUCH easier major than that in college. He said acedemics in college were very easy because he was a JOURNALISM MAJOR! (Turns out that Bradshaw DOES have a degree in journalism.) You've just gotta love it.
So who are these hyperidentified Freepers, and are they dangerous
Well the group I identify with are armed with a sword and a breastplate. Does that scare him?
Undergraduate Accounting major (Magna Cum Laude)
MBA Finance
GMAT overall 77th percentile
notable 98th percentile math
What were your scores?
Soon to be buliten board only as they do not meet the listing requirements.
Johnson has reason to believe his network could tap into a larger group of disenfranchised
The real difference between these salon people and freepers is that freepers do this crap for free.
If the claim was that _all_ undergraduate business majors score below the average for all test takers on the GMAT -- you'd be a counterexample. But that's not the claim. The claim is that the mean for undergraduate business majors is below the mean for all test takers. It's a population study. It's not uncommon for people to misunderstand the results. Maybe these are the sorts of distinctions that crop up in the verbal secion?
I understand population studies as well as any other smart@ss that post on this board.
Maybe these are the sorts of distinctions that crop up in the verbal secion?
I think you mean section.
You still did not answer the question. What were your scores? And while you are at it, what are your undergraduate and graduate degrees in? Answering questions is the first part of effective test taking.
Yes, I meant "section". That was a typo but it could have easily been a spelling mistake. I spell badly. Remind me what turns on the personal comparisons?
I also spell poorly. Sometimes I even cut and paste to Word before posting here.
My objection to your post was exactly your objection to mine. It is wrong to utilize a population study to draw effective conclusion about any individual. Some group is always at the bottom and some group is always at the top. This, however, says nothing about the individuals in the study. So to slam all undergraduate business majors is wrong. My objections are simply that. Now if you want to go on to other statistical measures like mean I would be happy to be point out some of the limitations of these measures also. Peace.
This passage makes me snicker! The signer was a George Clymer; the reference, of course, was to venerable New York Times reporter Adam Clymer, slurred by George W. Bush last summer as a "major league asshole." Now Clymer has become shorthand on the Free Republic site (which has rules against profanity) for "asshole" and "journalist," since to Freepers they're synonymous. Speaking as a journo, I can tell you that NO ONE in journo world considers Adam Clymer 'venerable!' Venerable! He may have some respect among liberals - and none from those liberals he has offended personally with his personality - but venerable is just not quite the word.
I never made a claim about individuals. Neither did the authors of the study. You're going to have undergraduate majors in every discipline scoring in the nth percentile for any n on any of those tests. Thanks for the cut and paste tip. I should try that.
You're absolutely right, Gene. Kerry did NOT identify himself as being from Salon until 2 minutes before the 2nd session began. When he called last week he said he was a lurker, and really would like to come. He forwarded his registration form and I accepted it.
After lunch Saturday, he came up to me and introduced himself as Kerry Lauerman and that his plane had been delayed was it okay if he came to the afternoon session. (Still no mention of Salon.) I asked him then why he didn't register to post and stop just lurking and he said he "loved conservative sites" and just hadn't registered. I went back upstairs for the meeting and he walked back over to the bell captain by the pool to arrange his bags being taken to his condo (I think.)
I started to think about this fellow (now bear in mind that this filtered into a tired little brain at this point) that his fax had come from Washington, so I start to think maybe this guy is from the Post. So I say something to BobJ. I no sooner mention that to BobJ, then this guy walks up to me and says, "Should I tell the people I'm a writer?" I ask, "Who do you write for?" He says "Salon". This is about 2 minutes before the second session begins. Good timing, Kerry.
So, I say the best thing to do is to introduce him to the group, welcome him, and what did we all do? I think it was a welcoming applaud, correct?
He was treated with the utmost kindness, regardless of the fact that he was a little more than deceitful and deceptive in representing who he was and why he was there.
Perhaps that's a new concept for journalist and liberals - being upfront and honest in your dealings. Perhaps that's what surprises them and scares them with FReepers - we're totally upfront and honest in who we are. At any rate, he was neither sneered at nor maligned, but, Kerry, if you're reading this, you only had to tell the truth up front. What did you think we were going to do? Toss you out on your kiester? We welcome the opportunity to discuss the very issues discussed in Charleston: The Constitution, the rule of law and media spin. Remember that pocket Constitution I gave you? Just READ IT!
See Post #49
See Post #49
See Post #49
My apology. I had your post and What About Bob wraped together. I guess that is why I only scored in the low 50's in verbal skills. For what it is worth Bob did make inferences about individuals.
No problem. It's good to know an investment biker. There are a lot of threads where I wish we had your contributions. Cf http://www.FreeRepublic.com/forum/a3b3613561431.htm. I can't get any straight answers to basic questions about public finance.
Yeh, I remember those days. Bradshaw was so dumb he lucked into 4 Super Bowl Rings!
Bumpus for Commonsense
Bumpus for Commonsense
Carter had an above average I.Q., as did all of our Presidents. Clinton, on the other hand, was indeed above the average President in intelligence, just as his model in the skill of lying, Adolph Hitler was more intelligent than other World Leaders in his own time; but there is a difference between intelligence and virtue.
Having acknowledged that Clinton was more intelligent than most of the other Presidents, he still pales before the likes of our first four Presidents. He would not have been able to hold his own in a conversation among the Founding Fathers--if any of them would have been even willing to allow a scoundrel like that in the same room.
What is funny about the above piece, is that the journalist obviously thinks that modern American journalism--such as the New York Times--deserves respect. He thinks that he is exposing us, but he only exposes himself. Even some intelligent "Liberals," know that the press has become a standing joke.
William Flax Return Of The Gods Web Site
I guess I was expecting something else when I read the article. The usual smear stuff from Salon. But I found the article more boring than anything else. It was a bit condescending. It was also a bit misleading. The part about the pro - McVeigh remark was unjustified. This site has 70,000 users and thousands of daily posters. I am here nearly every day and read anywhere between 10 and 20 threads. I have yet to see anyone laud or praise McVeigh for his actions. In fact, just the opposite. Imagine if I went onto Salon and scoured through the thousands of posts there to find the odd Moasist or Stalinist apologist and then wrote an article about Salon using such a quote as representitive of the type of dialouge that goes on at Table Talk? Would that be dishonest? You bet it would be. But other than that I just found the article poorly written. It didn't flow.
Once again, I will only say that if FReepers were not making a difference, than the left would only ignore us. You should feel honored that he went to all the trouble he did. His subtrafuge is emblematic of the lying deceitful tactics of the people he writes for and to.
I say be of good cheer.
There! Take that Kerry!
Good job Julie. I am just warming up a rebuttal to some of the inane comments that Kerry made. He had an opportunity to show FReepers that he is not a typical Clymer journalist, and he blew it, big time.
If you are reading this, Kerry, do not bother to call me, as I asked you to do. I do not give interviews to people I do not trust to represent the truth and therefore, will have nothing more to do with you.
P.S. You picked the wrong profession, pal.
“I have sworn upon the altar of God eternal hostility against every form of tyranny over the mind of man.”
[Thomas Jefferson, letter to Benjamin Rush, 1800.]
Scrap the Code! Scrap the IRS! Abolish the VLWC!
We will never be a truly FRee people so long as we have the income tax and the IRS.
I have never seen any published record of Clinton's IQ test score, grammar school grades, HS grades, College grades, Graduate School or Rhodes Scholar grades.
The same for his medical records.
If I am wrong here, please point me to all his various academic records.
Hey, I suck at math. Not all of us can do it.(I did pass calc after 3 attempts.)
I think the article wasn't that bad except of this. a UPI story last month found one poster who sympathized with Timothy McVeigh, and another who called him a "modern-day Paul Revere."
The group has also expressed a level of vitriol toward Democrats, particularly the Clintons (including occasional death threats),
I think we could find outrageous Demonkrauts over at salon.com who sypathize with Reno's revenge operation in Waco.
Kerry did NOT identify himself as being from Salon until 2 minutes before the 2nd session began. When he called last week he said he was a lurker, and really would like to come. He forwarded his registration form and I accepted it.
After lunch Saturday, he came up to me and introduced himself as Kerry Lauerman and that his plane had been delayed was it okay if he came to the afternoon session. (Still no mention of Salon.)
Questions: Has Kerry been writing for Salon.bomb for a long time? I mean, has he published enough articles that he may have thought (hoped) that his name, which he apparently did not hide, would be familiar to enough Freepers that he figured his connection with Salon would be known without him specifically announcing it?
Personally, I have never visited Salon and never heard the name Kerry Lauerman before this thread. But I believe there are some Freepers who do visit the enemy camps from time to time to check up on them.
I am not trying to defend Lauerman, but before I judge him as deceitful I want to be pretty sure he is.
I've had calls from journlists from far more higher-readership news organizations than Salon who INVARIABLY identify themselves. I would expect even Brit Hume would identify himself as Brit Hume of Fox News if he called.
A very popular journalist of our major SC newspaper ALWAYS identifies himself as John Monk of The State newspaper.
Lauerman knew exactly what he was doing and that he was being deliberately deceptive.
Sounds like Salon is getting worried, huh.
Probably has something to do with them going belly-up with their liberal trash and Free Republic growing stronger.
Jealousy, we used to call that.
Lauerman knew exactly what he was doing and that he was being deliberately deceptive.
Yes, I agree with you. An honest pro will always properly identify him/herself and his employer and purpose.
I do not evaluate people's native intelligence by their school records. Scanning the deceptive bastard's political techniques, and the finesse with which he uses Hitlerian tactics, I can assure you that Clinton is very intelligent. That he uses his intelligence to try to destroy our heritage and values is not the point I was addressing.
It is a mistake to imagine that evil men are also stupid men. Of the foremost political brains of the Twentieth Century, I am sorry to say, the evil ones, Lenin, Stalin, Hitler, Mao and Clinton, probably had more pure brain power than any of the better known Western Leaders, with the possible exception of Churchill. There were a number of prominent Conservatives who could have held their own against the evil doers, without question; but the political climate of their times did not permit them to rise to the top.
Socialist systems eventually fail, not because their founders are always stupid; but because their followers tend to be stupid, and they stifle the normal incentives of bright people--if they don't kill those bright people--to fully utilize their brain power. The traditional market system, by unleashing the incentives of the whole population, will always out-perform the Socialists on any long term basis. It is as simple as grade school math.
William Flax Return Of The Gods Web Site
Jealousy
... the fuel of socialism. They can't get far without it.
Look for new internet laws such as a ban against untraceable postings, government permits needed to post, and new taxes to pay for free computers and internet access for liberals. The Demonkrauts know that a free market internet is trouble.
She is very much a full time PI as well as a "dancing machine"!
"Dancing machine?" An understatement, if I ever heard one. My wife is STILL complaining about her sore legs...poor thing nearly crippled herself trying to keep up with Matchett on the dance floor.
PING! Matchett CAN dance BABY!!!!!
Commonsense, You and your SC chapter's event ROCKED!
We treated Mr. Lauerman REALLY well. It is clear from this article that he had made his mind up before he got to Seabrook.
NOTE TO SALON: YOU SHOULD SAVE WHAT PRECIOUS RESOURCES YOUR FAILING WEBSITE HAS, SINCE THERE WAS NO NEED TO EVEN SEND THIS GUY TO THE CONFERENCE.
Doesn't Georgia Tech have a hot comp sci department? Or am I misremembering that? Do you do any work with Genetic Programming?
We're not too bad. We have a lot of money, a lot of great professors, and the goal of the CS department as espoused by the CS head and the president of Georgia Tech (Mr. Clough) is to be in the top 5 computer science schools in 5 years. All I can say is: I sure hope so! As far as genetic programming, that's what I'm really interested in, but so far I've only done ecology research.
Oh, and that's pretty interesting about the GMAT rankings. You have to have some serious brains to be a math major, or a chem major, or an economics major or what have you and get through it, but I'd have thought that the sheer number of people who take English as a major because they don't really know what they want to do (like my father) would have brought it down. Hmm. Seeing as how much time CS majors (including me) spend goofing around on their own projects (at least at this school), I'm not surprised it's not in the top 5.
Seems you made a good impression, judging from the positive tone (IMO) of the article. Good job.
The study was based on data for 1964-82. Maybe the litt crit infection had not yet undermined the quality of the education you could get from an English department. And Comp Sci was in its infancy. I'd hesitate in thinking the results for those two majors would be replicated if the did another study for the years 1992-2002.
A very large man sitting next to me launches into a tangent on how the media is generally biased because reporters are generally dumb. Journalism schools, he points out, are where all the kids who couldn't make it in business school go. "They're just not very smart," he says angrily.
Hey, I resemble that remark!
However, I feel that I need to clarify my remarks.
During the discussion on “Bias in the Media” I made the following comments:
Mainstream journalists may not be intentionally biased. They live in large urban centers, which are mostly liberal, they attended Universities and colleges that are mostly liberal.
Additionally, many journalists simply don’t understand the issues about which they are reporting, on average, they are not that smart.
There was a running joke when I was in college, that the Engineering students that could not comprehend calculus, switched to the School of Business. And the Business students that couldn’t hack Economics and Accounting switched to Education or Journalism, where they partied a lot, and made A’s.
…and I don’t believe I stated this opinion in an “angry” fashion. In fact, I recall feeling mild amusement that one of the subjects of my comments was sitting next to me, feverishly scribbling notes.
I was one of the freepers that counseled Commonsense to let him stay, and if he choose to, participate in our conference. We were gracious hosts, and extended to him the normal courtesies that would be expected from Southern Ladies and Gentlemen. But apparently, he still doesn’t get it.
I hope he finds the time to read the pocket Declaration of Independence / Constitution, as well at the other literature, we provided in our conference packet. Perhaps he’ll find time when Salon finally crumbles under the weight of economic reality. (Poor b*****d, he was probably compensated in stock options.)
Compensated in stock options. That's hilarious.
You were absolutely nonaccusatory in your comments. And, FYI, the very last thing I said to him as he finished with brunch, was: "Be sure to read that pocket Constitution we gave you, perhaps you'll learn something. It can be quite a pesky document to those who love socialism."
You know, Fox, you can only shake your head at the deception and ignorance that some repeatedly display, but we have to keep the effort going full force. Don't forget what I told you I replied to the person who sent me the email Thursday morning when he said he was sorry he couldn't be at the Rally because he was marching in the gay pride parade.
"The group has also expressed a level of vitriol toward Democrats, particularly the Clintons (including occasional death threats), that has normally reasonable voices on the left wishing they could shut the group up. Legal scholar Cass Sunstein uses the Free Republic as an example of what his new book, "Republic.com," describes as "group polarization," where people segregate themselves so effectively online with other like-minded thinkers that they create an echo chamber where the group's worst and most malevolent opinions get reinforced and strengthened. "We might want to consider," Sunstein startlingly told the Times recently, "the possibility of ways of requiring or encouraging sites to link to opposing viewpoints." "
Kerry,
Your words indicate that you are a democrat. Not just because you are reporting on the Free Republic from the perspective of a democrat, but because you quoted Legal scholar Cass Sunstein who is not only a legal scholar, but he too is a wild eyed, Pro-Big-Government, socialist democrat --just like you.
Salon.com is dead, and democrats are not happy about that fact. Like you, they are coming out of the proverbial wood work talking about the Free Repbulic and labeling it "dangerous" as you implied, or a "threat" to the country.
We are only a threat to people like you and control phreaks like Sunstein. I'll take a chance here and guess that you and her are Jews. I was born a Jew, too. Do you find it interesting that so many Jews are wilded liberals who endorse dangerous Big Government policies that limit liberty? I do.
I believe that rather than supporting socialism, communism, or Big Government, Jews should be on the front line of Cosnervatism shouting down these failed schemes designed to limit the liberty of the individual.
Why don't we see more angry Jews who are Conservative and who want to reduce the power of government so that it does not become dangerous as it has in so many other countries?
Why allow government to limit the freedoms of Americans when so many have died to establish a nation that was truly free?
Maybe Im wrong. Maybe you are a Conservative and maybe you are working for doomed Salon.bomb just for fun.
Carol
This is re-posted from Nick Danger's thread http://www.freerepublic.com/forum/a3b36f35d731f.htm :
A feminized mentality (that might more aptly be named, "Kerry LauerMALE") wrote:
"They're here, they're mad, get used to it. Lured by dreams of hobnobbing with their Florida recount heroes, Free Republic faithful have to make do with one another." By Kerry Lauerman
#### Awwwwwwwww .... look here everyone. This deceptively pleasant-appearing, baby-faced Salon.com representative, lured by dreams of being awarded a Nobel prize in journalism for writing what I'm sure he was hoping would be the hit peice of the year against Harris and Sauls, is unable to hide his angry disappointment.
He is the one who is "mad". He was the one who was "lured" there to see Harris and Sauls (since we already knew in advance they weren't going to be there, and went anyhow). Unlike his, our focus isn't on "ourselves" and other "personalities"; our focus is on how best to go about preserving America's Constitution (and the rule of law that undergirds it) so that future generations will be able to enjoy the God-given freedoms that it guarantees.
Seeing his agenda thwarted, this deluded/indoctrinated product of the feminized institutions of today's America, takes his hissy-fit out on the only ones left there to rail against, by writing his hateful hit-peice aginst us.
As I predicted to many I talked to, he didn't quote me on the two subjects he said he would "definately" be quoting me on. But he made it a point to come back a second time (the next day) to get my full name "so that he could properly attribute those specific quotes to me." Deceitful? You decide.
The first quote he deliberatly left out: "The only mentalities that make up most of today's DemocRAT party are: [1] Cynical opportunists, [2] Useful idiots , and [3] Garden-variety opportunist/useful idiots."
He probably votes for DemocRATS (or the equivalent), so he would know that he falls into one of those three catagories. Therefore, I can understand the reluctance to quote me. (As a compassionate conservative, I didn't want to put him on the spot by asking him to explain to us *why* he votes the way he does. His answer would have exposed the catagory into which he falls, and I didn't want to embarrass him publically).
The second quote he told me he was going to print, but didn't, was this: "A list of some of the known hotels and motels which currently carry FNN (the FOX NEWS NETWORK) will soon be posted on Free Republic and made available to organizations like CCRM (Citizen's Coalition for Responsible Media - http://www.fairpress.org). Citizens who want to watch the FOX News Network while traveling, will soon have the information that gives them the opportunity to choose where they may want to lodge. It will also give them the names of the establishments which don't give them that choice, so that they can contact them if they like, and request it."
I have some ###comments### about some of what he __did___ choose to write, however, and have excerpted them below. He wrote:
June 24, 2001 - SEABROOK, S.C. -- "I make it to the Free Republic conference Saturday just in time for the "Round Table Discussion on Media Bias.." "... It's not just that Freepers hate Salon. (But, boy, do they hate Salon.) They also hate, with the exception of Fox News, the rest of the media. "Feminized men and airhead women," clucks Janice Matchett, a retired widow from Florida. .."
#### I was quite amused to get home from work today, read this thread, and find out that I'm "retired". I must have reeeeeally hit a nerve, too, because not only did he get that wrong, he didn't even quote me correctly. The correct "cluck" [sic] would have been, "feminized _males_ and airhead _females_". (There ARE no real "men" or "women" in most of the mainstream media). And, like all liberals, he gives away his emotional immaturity when he shows that he can't tell the difference between *hating ideas* and *hating people*, poor thing.
He continued: "I'm instructed by someone to turn to Page 15 in a handy, pocket-size version of the Declaration of Independence (provided by the libertarian Cato Institute) to peruse the list of signatories. "See, even a Clymer signed it," she says, and the group breaks into laughter. The signer was a George Clymer; the reference, of course, was to venerable New York Times reporter Adam Clymer, slurred by George W. Bush last summer as a "major league asshole." Now Clymer has become shorthand on the Free Republic site (which has rules against profanity) for "asshole" and "journalist," since to Freepers they're synonymous.
##### He didn't even quote me correctly on this either. I did NOT say, "See even a Clymer signed it". I happened to randomly open the booklet to page 37 and playfully exclaimed, "Oh no! It looks as if we might have a problem here! Under Article VII it appears that a General Clymer signed it". I'm sorry to see that the Salon.com representative was so defensive and took my comments personally.
He continued: "... Freepers are angry -- boy are they mad -- and they don't just like to argue online, they like to get in people's faces. ... ... So who are these hyperidentified Freepers, and are they dangerous? ... Members of the group resent the way they've sometimes been ridiculed and caricatured by the media -- "like a bunch of sinister crazy people," says Gloria Laird, a senior citizen from Florida. While most of them, like Laird, appear to be nice, funny, friendly people, they do make it easy to poke fun".
#### Many liberals suffer from cognitive dissonance (the mental confusion resulting from holding two opposite beliefs simultaneously), and this is an example of it. [1] "Freepers are angry, mad, argue, and get in people's faces." [2] "Freepers [are] nice, funny, friendly people.
BTW. My good friend Gloria was not quoted correctly either. I know, because I was sitting right beside her at dinner when she was talking to him about the way the mainstream media portrays conservatives.
He continued: "..... Afterward, as the part of the party moved to an adjacent bar, and Matchett and Gloria Laird danced to Ricky Martin tunes..."
#### More correctly, Gloria took the opportunity to show some of us the steps to the "electric slide" and was awesome doing "YMCA".
Gloria and I had a great time with our FReeper friends from South Carolina and all around the country again this year!
A BTTT "Thanks" to EVERYONE who worked so hard to make it happen. We look forward to seeing some of you again on the cruise this fall.
140 Posted on 06/25/2001 19:50:33 PDT at: http://www.freerepublic.com/forum/a3b36f35d731f.htm by Matchett-PI (All feminized males are emotionally immature and thus are unfit for any leadership role.)
Actually, I believe that highly intelligent people are drawn to socialism because of it's top down nature. They feel the need to bring their wisdom (they confuse brains with wisdom) to the world. Due to their smarts they may end up in occupations that the free-market does not reward very well and bring that resentment to the table.
Conservatives are driven in a more practical manner. People drawn to conservatism are more likely to be down to earth and use common sense in their thinking. This is not to say that conservatives are dumb, just that they approach problems in a different manner.
You can see this in the attacks on Reagan and Bush. Both of these men are undoubtedly smart. However they are not intellectuals. They don't have that high I.Q, top-down way of solving problems.
My guess (and it is a guess) the distribution curve for "liberals" would be dish shaped (high a both ends, low in the middle). The curve for conservatives would have a normal (bell) shape with short tails.
In other words "liberals" are made up of the highly intelligent and the ... er ... not so bright. Conservatives would occupy the middle, missing the really high I.Q people and also missing the least smart people.
Re: Clinton's brain, I guess that he, like most sociopaths, has a superior I.Q (> 140). In other words a top-one-percenter!
talking about the Free Repbulic and labeling it "dangerous" as you implied, or a "threat" to the country.
I admire how honestly you express your opinions.
I think liberals always have two motives in mind: 1) their real motive, and 2) the motive they tell everyone because it sounds better. They say they want to feed the poor when what they really want is to be important. They say Free Republic is dangerous to the country when what they really are worried about is their loss of media control, and hence, again their current importance. The liberal's hidden motive is rarely pleasant.
Hitler was a socialist liberal. That statement really bothers liberals because it hits so close to home.
Wow, what a scumbag. Thanks for the bump!
You wrote: "Do you find it interesting that so many Jews are wilded liberals who endorse dangerous Big Government policies that limit liberty? I do." And what do you make of that?
Kerry Lauerman writes:
(Free Republic)"caricatured by the media -- "like a bunch of sinister crazy people," These are obviously Lauerman's thoughts! They were NEVER expressed by me.
Next time(ugh)I'll teach him the "Electric Slide" or "YMCA"
GREAT POST,Matchett PI!!!
In other words "liberals" are made up of the highly intelligent and the ... er ... not so bright. Conservatives would occupy the middle, missing the really high I.Q people and also missing the least smart people.
I think that you are way off on this. In my experience, Conservatives have significantly higher I.Q.s than "Liberals," and far, far more focused intelligence. The appeal of Socialism and every other form of Egalitarianism is neurotic, not elitist. The snooty aspect of the Academic Left is a coverup for a sense of inadequacy.
When I write of Lenin, Stalin, Hitler, Mao and Clinton, as having very high levels of intelligence, I am not describing typical "Liberals," but very unusual men, who used ideology as a tool. Of the lot, I suspect that all but Stalin probably had some sincere beliefs--although not necessarily the ones they used--but that is not what distinguished them. It was rather a willingness to stop at nothing--a total repudiation of every concept of traditional morality and ethical behavior, in pursuit of their goals.
There are Conservatives who operate on just as high level of intelligence; some probably slightly higher, because generally Conservatives really do tend to be markedly more intelligent than "iberals," but there are limits on what they are prepared to do, to obtain and hold power. We are, after all, trying to preserve what is valid in our heritage, and that cannot be done by trashing its values.
For more on the neurotic basis of the Left, see Compulsion For Uniformity.
For a slightly different approach to your suggestion of "Liberal" brain power, I might site the phenomenon of the sons and grandsons of highly successful entrepreneurs, who went to Harvard or Yale, or the like, and turned sharply Left. Since World War I, this phenomenon has greatly fueled America's shift to the Left. But it is not that the sons and grandsons were brighter than the ancestor who succeeded. I would suggest that, quite the opposite, unable to really measure up to the family icon, they turned to an egalitarian mindset as a compensation for their own senses of personal inadequacy. I think a comparison of performance levels will support this hypothesis.
Anyway, don't be fooled by the posing of Academic "Liberals." Truly bright people do not embrace irrational concepts, unless they are truly messed up.
William Flax Return Of The Gods Web Site
Here's a picture of Sauls' plaque for all to see.
For Faithful Freepers will be sailing the Seas.
We stick together through thick and thin
and as faithful Americans, WE WILL WIN.
Forces surround us, our demise they plan.
But they'll never penetrate our forceful band
that envlopes us and protects us as we push ever forward
Patriots we are, and we work for tomorrow.
VISIT TODAY'S CRUISE POETRY CONTEST THREAD
I think that you are way off on this ..
You may right :-D. I was surmising (writing off the top of my head) and have no special knowledge or figures to "prove" my points. Indeed I am sure somewhere there is a statistician laughing at my "dish shaped" distribution curve (I am sure such a thing is rare, if it exists at all).
In any case, we may disagree less than you think. I wasn't trying to say conservatives are dumb (FR is proof that is not the case), just that high "IQ smart", as opposed to "street smart", types may favor "liberalism". To me it's the difference between a numerical score and practical ability.
Here is the important thing:
Reeses on Carol-HuTex: "I admire how honestly you express your opinions." Reeses, what would you think if she ducked a chance to explain what she meant when she wrote "Do you find it interesting that so many Jews are wilded liberals who endorse dangerous Big Government policies that limit liberty? I do."
Those "high I.Q. smart" "Liberals," without practical ability, generally suffer from one of two pathological disorders that render them dysfunctional: They either are obsessed with hate of the past--often of their own families;--or they are obsessed with fear of the perils of ordinary life. I have taken to calling the type "dysrons," because in their dysfunctional conditions, they operate at a moronic level.
A good example would be the sort of White Democrats who turned out to support the relgious poseurs, Jesse Jackson and Al Sharpton, during the contrived Florida election crisis, last November.
William Flax Return Of The Gods Web Site
what would you think if she ducked a chance to explain what she meant
My guess is the question looks loaded. Are you Jewish and want to say something on the subject? Go ahead.
The latest generation of Jews are no longer so strongly socialist liberals. I think it's partly because they are no longer poor immigrants. Also the majority now marry non-Jews. The Jews are in the final stages of melting, becoming Americans. They are right on schedule if not ahead. Some conservatives are still aware of the old guard Jewish political culture. They still wonder why Jews would ever vote for big government socialists, like the gun grabbing Hitler, who started out with a utopian vision of making the world a better place.
"My guess is the question looks loaded." What's your guess about her comment that "Do you find it interesting that so many Jews are wilded liberals who endorse dangerous Big Government policies that limit liberty? I do." Do you think her comment is loaded? Loaded with what?
How can it be a loaded question? I'm just asking her to explain what she meant. I can't see how it could be loaded question unless there's something there she's afraid to explain. But then, you wouldn't think that was honest would you? What adjectives come to your mind to describe her comment and her unwillingness to explain it?
Salon Slams Freepers
Yeah, right, they're really slamming us hard. (/sarcasm) This column is a lot like a 7-year-old saying 'You're a big dumb-head!' to us. It's funny if anything.
Appears that Kerry of SoccerSalon.Mom knows it's over and when to call it quits. Many of these flakes will defect and shift to the Republican party, because nobody really wants to be a Sore/Loserman.
Now Clymer has become shorthand on the Free Republic site (which has rules against profanity) for "asshole" and "journalist," since to Freepers they're synonymous.
Yup, we're just a bunch of backasswards redneck hicks that hate all the "pretty boys" in the media, what with their support for race-mixing and ya know they're all communist homo-sexuals. We hate them media folk, why ah reckon if one o them city boys came across mah farm, ahd drop him with mah thirty-aught-six. Damn commies. I love Jesus, and hate black folk, and Jesus loves me and hates black folk. Hey! Bubba! Let's go hop in the truck and git us some Hebes and Papists! < We don't hate reporters in general, we hate biased left-wing liar reporters. This is just another tired attempt by the left to paint conservatives as unsophisticated reactionaries. Adam Clymer is not entirely honest, Mickey Kaus said so (so it MUST be true!) Adam Clymer is... a Clymer!
The network will soon be incorporated and Johnson will be named its president, for as long as it takes to successfully apply as a nonprofit. Says Robinson, "It's all volunteer here, except for Jim" (referring to Jim Robinson, the founder of Free Republic, who recently took a salary with the company -- which gets all its money from donations to drives such as the current NPR-style Freepathon).
I believe that rather than supporting socialism, communism, or Big Government, Jews should be on the front line of Cosnervatism shouting down these failed schemes designed to limit the liberty of the individual.
Why don't we see more angry Jews who are Conservative and who want to reduce the power of government so that it does not become dangerous as it has in so many other countries?
After their abuse at the hands of governments and private citizens, the protection of a government was a very welcome thing to Jews. If you had just escaped the Holocaust, you might want a large government to protect you. Now that Jews feel safe in this country, more are turning towards the position of smaller government.
Carol, What adjectives would you use to describe your unwillingness to explain your comment?
To: Carol-HuTex I did an Investors Business Daily's stock check up on SALN. It reinforces the idea that liberal "elite" journalists would never have made it in business school. The stock is trading at .25 down from a 52 week high of $2.25 -- a 89% hit. The diagnosis of the stock is an "E", using an A-F grade scale. When will they ever learn that liberalism is becoming a losing business proposition? FNC's rise and CNN's fall and companies moving out of Seattle are even further proof of this. The bottom line is simply this. People do not like the propaganda of fear based on a whole slew of lies. 23 Posted on 06/25/2001 09:55:56 PDT by FranklinsTower
--
How does a commie/lib overcome his inability to make a profit? He passes legislation that allows him to take control of your business.
Carol
To: Carol-HuTex talking about the Free Repbulic and labeling it "dangerous" as you implied, or a "threat" to the country. I admire how honestly you express your opinions. I think liberals always have two motives in mind: 1) their real motive, and 2) the motive they tell everyone because it sounds better. They say they want to feed the poor when what they really want is to be important. They say Free Republic is dangerous to the country when what they really are worried about is their loss of media control, and hence, again their current importance. The liberal's hidden motive is rarely pleasant. Hitler was a socialist liberal. That statement really bothers liberals because it hits so close to home. 83 Posted on 06/25/2001 22:57:05 PDT by Reeses
--
Thanks Reese. Honesty is the Conservatives best tool. Sometimes, the communists use it against us, but we can always use their lies against them. Liberalism is based upon mistruths, half truths, and no truth at all.
For instance, the environmental movement is full of lies. Liberals know they are telling lots of lies to the public about the threat to the bioshere posed by human activity. However, they believe that it is better to tell lies to get certain desired results than to tell the truth, and not get those results.
To the left, the advancement of government power is everything. Without it, socialism will never become a reality here in the USA.
Using environmental legislation to expand the power of government so that socialism can be advanced is their current agenda. Taking guns away from Conservatives ranks high on their list of objectives.
No one can be allowed to rebel against them.
Carol
To: Carol-HuTex Carol, What adjectives would you use to describe your unwillingness to explain your comment? 101 Posted on 06/27/2001 12:08:51 PDT by ConsistentLibertarian
--
I dont know about you, CL, but I have a real life apart from this site, or my computers. You have nearly made yourself look silly in this thread by asking the same question over and over again as if I were sitting here refusing to answer you.
I just happened to read this thread tonight and found your question and snide remarks.
Keep in mind that I am not able to see all quesitons/replies, so I can't reply to every question.
Explain to me what motivated you to ask this same question so many times.
You said:"To: Carol-HuTex You wrote: "Do you find it interesting that so many Jews are wilded liberals who endorse dangerous Big Government policies that limit liberty? I do." And what do you make of that? 85 Posted on 06/26/2001 08:45:30 PDT by ConsistentLibertarian"
Explain "And what do you make of that".
What is it that you want to know?
Carol: You're reply is Clintonian. I'll let you stand judged by what you've already said and what you're unwilling to say.
LOL!
In sharp contrast with the $229.00 a night FReeper Meeting, what's Salon's stock up to now?
Last I heard it was around 10¢
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