Play the Music - Real Audio
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The site is called Anti-MTV.com, but it's not the work of social conservatives or whiny adolescents. Anti-MTV promotes heavy metal bands like Cradle Of Filth, Annihilator, Skinlab, Hatebreed, Fear Factory, and Pantera, with CD reviews, tour info, and streamed videos.
So why should conservatives care?
Because Anti-MTV also reviews politics and culture -- with a conservative slant. Consider The Uncivil Rights Movement, which counters Jesse Jackson's accusations of black disfranchisement in Florida. That's right, headbangers who defend George Bush and Katherine Harris -- by name. Or consider The Extremists, which challenges global warming and denounces PETA.
Many articles address the issues that interest music fans. But unexpectedly, the analysis is conservative. My Socialist America attacks Tipper Gore's censorial PMRC, calls Al Gore the "vice-socialist," and features a Stalin poster. Music censorship analyzed in the context of socialism rather than religious fundamentalism. Nor are barbs limited to Communism. "Democratic socialism" and "utopianism" are likewise skewered.
Headbangers rarely see issues dear to their heart examined in this particular philosophical/historical context. They don't get it in school. Nor from MTV. And few headbangers regard Fox News as "must see TV."
Which is why conservatives should applaud Anti-MTV despite its ... earthy language.
Metal bands wield influence, and what they don't know they can't communicate to fans. Fans who imagine that global warming is fact and only whites commit hate crimes. Anti-MTV may offend social conservatives, but if we're gonna have headbangers in our streets, wouldn't you rather they be headbangers who understand Constitutional law and environmental science? Headbangers who realize Bush did not "steal" the election, and environmental fear-mongering threatens our liberties?
Not that Anti-MTV is a GOP front.
Site owner Erik Barath's been in the business for 15 years. "I was in a band called I.N.C in my late teens and early twenties. I played lead guitar and wrote all the songs. We were considered thrash metal and played with Pantera, Testament and Megadeth." Professing an "undying love of metal," Barath founded Anti-MTV in response to MTV's scant metal coverage. Anti-MTV streams videos from emerging bands rarely seen on MTV. "MTV plays metal videos only after they can't ignore them anymore. We had the Slipknot videos first."
Barath has operated Anti-MTV for two years. "About a year ago, I decided to use this site for more than just heavy metal promotion. I'm sickened by the liberal indoctrination of our kids in public schools, so I decided to give the other side of the arguments to our youth. I am a proud conservative, not a moderate. My biggest fight nowadays is about global warming. This anti-American, anti-capitalist mindset is a great battle that is fought here at Anti-MTV."
John Stossel's recent ABC special inspired Barath's latest article: Global Warming Activism (The New Moonies) Barath's received hostility from the music community. "My articles don't jive with about 50% of our fanbase, but I often find them agreeing with me after I present the facts. Some are very nasty toward me because I'm a conservative. It's almost like a form of discrimination."
If Anti-MTV offends social conservatives, Barath responds: "Metal music is aggressive and sometimes violent. If Bill Bennett, whom I respect greatly, were to comment on that, I would tell him this is a metal site first, a political site second. Think how helpful it would be if MTV had as many positive and educational shows as we do articles.
"As far as family values is concerned, it's just lip service by my party [the GOP]. But on the flipside, I don't think our government can get people to follow what conservatives consider 'family values.' The family structure has died in our country. I don't know what can help other than fewer liberal ideals and programs. The education system is a disgrace and we can all give a big hand to the liberals and teachers unions. But I see their point. Ya gotta keep kids stupid for future votes. Anyone with knowledge of history and economics could never vote Democrat."
Barath denies being a libertarian. Married without kids, he sees no conflict between Anti-MTV's fusion of conservative politics and metal culture. "There is no image, music, movie or video game that is harmful to children if they have a solid foundation on which absorb these materials. My articles give some foundation to kids, but most must come from parents. I grew up listening to Satanic bands and never once thought of joining a cult or doing evil. I am a church attendee and believe in family values.
"I live in a lower middle class community and work out of my bedroom about 70 hours a week on this site. My neighborhood is a great place, with a 50/50 split of minority and whites living in such harmony. No one is rich, but everyone is rich in character. A place where parenting is paramount and education is the cornerstone for success. There isn't anything I wouldn't let my [future] kids listen to, because I plan on being there every step of the way, teaching them the value of life, love and family. With those tools, all outside messages are quite menial."
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Good article. Thanks for having the guts to post it.
While the lyrics of these bands would send most social conservatives' heads spinning, this article puts it into perspective.
Cradle of Filth is a guilty pleasure of mine, but ONLY when the kids are gone for the weekend.
Have rockers run out of 'causes' to promote now that Rockers Against Gingivitis snapped up the last dreaded disease? Conservative metal heads--never thought I'd see the day! I wonder if Pat Boone was an influence on this?
The backlash against the baby boomers have just began! We will see how oppressive against young people these former Hippies become once they are in charge. Welcome to the revolution man.
With friends like these...
Bump for evening reading...
Brothers of Metal! Brothers of Steel!
Seriously, I think metalheads may tend to be more conservative since metal was so popular in the eighties... when our last great conservative POTUS was in office. We metal warriors loved the Gipper!
Notforprophet
.
Anti-MTV isn't the only gathering site for conservative headbangers. One of the women behind RightGrrl.com is a metalhead.
And she's a SOCIAL CONSERVATIVE metalhead!
Has conservativism all of a sudden become libertarianism? I think you folks have the two confused.
Some of us Fangorian gorehound horror fans also love the Gipper!
Heavy Metal Rocks to the Right
AC/DC in their 1980 song "Hell's Bells" said:
'Cause if good's on the left,And here you were thinking this was some new phenomenon. :-)
then I'm stickin' to the right...
Erik Barath, of Anti-MTV, claims to be a conservative, not a libertarian. And he explicitly embraces family values, and respects William Bennett.
Conservative metal heads--never thought I'd see the day!
Conservative *and* a metal head since the late 70's - early 80's.
Oh God ... Now I feel old!
ProPain has a song that starts out "Need on my left, Greed on my right". How disgraceful for a metal group.
"Has conservativism all of a sudden become libertarianism? I think you folks have the two confused."
Is being anti-abortion libertarian? How about being for the strengthening of our borders?
Many "metalheads" are more socially conservative than you think.
I'm even (GASP) anti-drug legalization.
It's social justice that Rikki Rockett is out there saving the shales...
It's social justice that Rikki Rockett is out there saving the shales...
Hey CB! Please end your "a href" lines with </a>, PLEASE!
A few conservative metal songs from 'traditional' metal:
That's just off the top of my head. There are leftist groups too, like Anthrax ("Among the Living" has pro-globalist, anti-nuke, and Indian^H^H^H^H^H^H Native American reparations songs all on one album), but you don't have to go far to find a conservative metalhead.
ProPain has a song that starts out "Need on my left, Greed on my right". How disgraceful for a metal group.
A 'moderate' middle-of-the-road stance from a metal group? Say it ain't so! :-)
Probably even more disgraceful was the flipflop of Dee Snider (Twisted Sister) from taking on Al Gore head-to-head in a Congressional hearing to essentially endorsing him in 2000.
The backlash against the baby boomers have just began!
It's about time! I can't for the life of me imagine why kids have spent so much time idolizing a political movement that's decades old, and whose current philosophy can be summed up in the phrase, "you'll poke your eye out with that thing!"
Isn't your parents' generation, by definition, uncool?
I'm even (GASP) anti-drug legalization.
So I take it that you're embracing the all-powerful socialist state while claiming to be against it? Hypocrite. Next time you're at a concert, will you be reporting your fellow headbangers to the cops for sparking up a joint?
Supporting the drug war is supporting the worst totalitarian excesses of the socialist program, whether you're a Bennett clone or a Pantera fan.
Pantera, Metallica and Megadeth have all been on MTV, so they are hypocrites.
I'm sure I do end my HREF lines with that A slash. All of them.
Did I not?
I think Dee Snider is pretty much off the metal map and has been since "Were not gonna take it". I was surprised to hear Marylin Manson loathed the Clinton and that he was voting republican. Politics sure causes strange bedfellows, MM voting with the Christians. And blue collar union thugs voting with sodomites.
I don't think a metal group (or anyone else) is a "hypocrite" for being on MTV. I think it's a Good Thing for conservatives to appear on mainstream media outlets.
I don't think a metal group (or anyone else) is a "hypocrite" for being on MTV
How about if they swore they'd never be on MTV (like Metallica did)? Saying one thing and doing the opposite...
Every single on of your links is closed with <A/>, and not </a>. Simple mistake, you're forgiven. :)
Ridiculous! We just have a thread about conservative hard rock and NOBODY MENTIONED RUSH? Our hard-rocking friends from Canada lay out the best in libertarian principles in such classic songs as:
Tom Sawyer (individualism)
Red Barchetta (anti-socialism/anti-regulation)
Trees (anti-affirmative action)
Spirit of the Radio (anti-corruption)
Closer to the Heart (reform comes from within, not without)
2112 (anti-socialism)
...and a slew of others that you may feel free to add to!
And an album title called "A Farewell to Kings," to boot!
Here are the lyrics to Trees:
There is unrest in the forest
There is trouble with the trees
For the maples want more sunlight
And the oaks ignore their pleas
The trouble with the maples
And they're quite convinced they're right
They say the oaks are just too lofty
And they grab up all the light
But the oaks can't help their feelings
If they like the way they're made
And they wonder why the maples
Can't be happy in their shade
There is trouble in the forest
And the creatures all have fled
As the maples scream "Oppression!"
And the oaks just shake their heads
So the maples formed a union
And demanded equal rights
"The oaks are just too greedy;
We will make them give us light."
Now there's no more oak oppression
For they passed a noble law
And the trees are all kept equal
By hatchet, axe, and saw
...and here to Red Barchetta:
My uncle has a country place, that no one knows about
He says it used to be a farm, before the Motor Law
And on Sundays I elude the 'Eyes' and hop the Turbine freight
To far outside the Wire, where my white-haired uncle waits.
Jump to the ground
As the Turbo slows to cross the borderline
Run like the wind,
As excitement shivers up and down my spine
Down in his barn
My uncle preserved for me, an old machine ---
For fifty-odd years
To keep it as new has been his dearest dream
I strip away the old debris, that hides a shining car
A brilliant red Barchetta, from a better, vanished time
I fire up the willing engine, responding with a roar
Tires spitting gravel, I commit my weekly crime...
Wind in my hair ---
Shifting and drifting ---
Mechanical music ---
Adrenalin surge ---
Well-weathered leather
Hot metal and oil
The scented country air
Sunlight on chrome
The blur of the landscape
Every nerve aware
Suddenly, ahead of me, across the mountainside
A gleaming alloy air-car shoots towards me, two lanes wide
I spin around with shrieking tires, to run the deadly race
Go screaming through the valley as another joins the chase
Drive like the wind
Straining the limits of machine and man
Laughing out loud
With fear and hope, I've got a desperate plan
At the one-lane bridge
I leave the giants stranded
At the riverside
Race back to the farm
To dream with my uncle
At the fireside...
ENJOY!
"...will you be reporting your fellow headbangers to the cops for sparking up a joint?"
Actually, I've done just that. The cops didn't seem to care, unfortunately.
When idiots are infringing on ME and causing ME to get stoned, I have a problem. That's the main reason I go to very few concerts anymore.
Take your "hypocrite" crap elsewhere.
I suppose you're right about Dee and Twisted Sister; still, it's not every band that can boast that their music has been used by the US government as an offensive weapon! (Noriega, 1988)
It's interesting that you pointed this out. I'm a product of High School in the 80's and I grew up on most of that stuff.
There are even some new bands that have a right-leaning message. Has anyone ever heard of Seputura? They are a metal band out of Brazil. Their latest album named Nation takes on a very anti-tyranical tone. Go here for an example of some of their lyrics from the song Politricks.
Oh, and Salb, Rush is the best lyrically and musically.
Don't forget:
"Eye Of The Beholder" and "And Justice For All"
Has conservativism all of a sudden become libertarianism? I think you folks have the two confused.
"The enemy of my enemy is my friend."
Never forget that. Ronald Reagan didn't.
Man, I agree. While I am now a proper middle-class husband and dad, with a job and responsibilities, etc., I was a long-haired 80's heavy metal headbanger. Man, those were the days, and I can tell you you are 100% correct - in my teen years, we headbangers were always clashing with the commie New Wave sissies, or later those rap punks. Ronald Regan was our political hero, because he had our country standing proud for the first time in ages; we hated the hippies and the scumbag baby boomers who ruined our country. It may seem odd to people to think that heavy metal types can be political, but some of the biggest political conservatives I have known have been from that crowd.
There is a large demographic of non-religious, "hard-rock and metal" conservatives. I am one of them.
Every day I listen to hard rock and metal, as well as conservative talk radio.
Between Godsmack and Michael Savage, I am a happy camper.
We must crush the Socialist Left!
Has conservativism all of a sudden become libertarianism? I think you folks have the two confused.
I don't think so.
...in my teen years, we headbangers were always clashing with the commie New Wave sissies, or later those rap punks. Ronald Regan was our political hero, because he had our country standing proud for the first time in ages; we hated the hippies and the scumbag baby boomers who ruined our country. It may seem odd to people to think that heavy metal types can be political, but some of the biggest political conservatives I have known have been from that crowd.
Bump and well said. You read my mind. FReegards from Headbanger wasp(W.A.S.P)69.
Pantera, Metallica and Megadeth have all been on MTV, so they are hypocrites.
Pantera and Megadeth were on MTV, what, like two times?
And Metallica didn't even make a music video until their third album. And, only James Hetfield (the singer) is conservative. The drummer, Lars Ulrich, is a damn dirty liberal.
I was surprised to hear Marylin Manson loathed the Clinton and that he was voting republican.
Yes. He has stated numerous times that he votes Republican because he "hates Communism."
Thanks for the post on the band RUSH. I just read about how the band, especially the drummer, were big fans of Ayn Rand, the author of Atlas Shurgged. What do you know about this?
And Metallica didn't even make a music video until their third album.
Correct me if I'm worng, but I thought their first video was for the song "One", off their "And Justice For all Album."
As you will recall, that was their FOURTH album, after Kill 'Em All, Ride the Lightning, and Master of Puppets.
I could be wrong, but I sure think I'd know if they did a video off Master of Puppets.
From Metallica's "Eye of the Beholder"
Do you see what I see?
Truth is an offence
You silence for your confidence
Do you hear what I hear?
Doors are slamming shut
Limit your imagination, keep you where they must
Do you feel what I feel?
Bittering distress
Who decides what you express?
Do you take what I take?
Endurance is the word
Moving back instead of forward seems to me absurd
Doesn't matter what you see
Or into it what you read
You can do it your own way
If it's done just how I say
Independence limited
Freedom of choice
Choice is made for you my friend
Freedom of speech
Speech is words that they will bend
Freedom with their exception
...
Do you fear what I fear?
Living properly
Truths to you are lies to me
Do you want what I want?
Desire not a thing
I hunger after independence, lengthen freedom's ring
Independence limited
Freedom of choice
Choice is made for you my friend
Freedom of speech
Speech is words that they will bend
Freedom with their exception
Doesn't matter what you see
Or into it what you read
You can do it your own way
If it's done just how I say
You're totally right.
I always forget about the first album...
I always forget about the first album...
One of their best, IMHO. The first four were better than all the rest combined...
I didn't put Rush in the "Metal" category (if there's a keyboard involved, it isn't metal IMO), but other than that, no question.
One of my all-time favorite CDs is "And Justice For All" by Metallica. Definitely their best album, IMHO. Also, almost everything Metallica has released since that album has sucked.
I agree! Besides Load and Reload, have they done anything else original (that is, besides covers, live stuff, symphony stuff)? I can't listen to either of those albums. They are pretty forgettable.
I agree! Besides Load and Reload, have they done anything else original (that is, besides covers, live stuff, symphony stuff)? I can't listen to either of those albums. They are pretty forgettable.
How disgraceful for a metal group.
Now, THERE's an oxymoron.
I meant anything else original since the black album, sorry.
Poker Face isnt Heavy Metal, but they do have kicking, rocking Political-Patriotic tunes... Check out a sampling of their schtuff...
Play the Music - Real Audio
Of Wolf and Man
Well, as far as I know, RUSH are big on conservative and libertarian principles, especially those focusing on individual liberties over societal "good." Yes, they were big fans of Ayn Rand - 2112, their 20-minute opus, was based partially on Anthem and I think they have a song called Anthem. Many of their lyrics also deal with fantasy and/or science-fiction imagery. They are a trio that has been together for over 25 years now. You should check their stuff out, it's pretty sweet.
ping for later read
The backlash against the baby boomers have just began! We will see how oppressive against young people these former Hippies become once they are in charge. Welcome to the revolution man.
Yep. They're in for a surprise...
2 words: Nursing Home
Conservative metal heads--never thought I'd see the day!
It happened long ago... I'm one of 'em, although the hard rock I played and recorded was more old-school metal, ala Blue Oyster Cult, etc.
:)
And don't forget Ted Nugent :) Not really "metal," by today's definition, but gonzo for freedom < g >
I don't think I've met a liberal metal fan in years...all the ones I know are conservatives. A surprising number of them are my age (boomers). I have been a head banger since before the term was invented, and I've been a conservative all my life. Our kids can't understand why my hearing is still acute after so many years of jamming every day while driving, but they are not hard core metal lovers. I have a terrible Latin temper, and when I am angry, if I can get in my vehicle, drive out of town, crank it up and sing along, I will be calm enough to deal with the situation reasonably in an hour or less. Last week AC/DC and Twisted Sister saved my ass from going nuclear in a situation that could have gotten me arrested for my anger over how some F***ing establishment idiots were treating my husband. Thank God for heavy metal noise! By the way, does anyone else use it for an anger management tool, or am I just really weird?
Agreed-Ted is "The Man"!
I wrote "...will you be reporting your fellow headbangers to the cops for sparking up a joint?"
You replied
Actually, I've done just that. The cops didn't seem to care, unfortunately.
And have you done the same when they were smoking cigarettes? If I'm not mistaken, most public concert venues ban tobacco smoking too nowadays. If you don't report the tobacco smokers (especially the underage ones) aren't you shirking in your patriotic duty to the all-powerful state?
Take your "hypocrite" crap elsewhere.
The truth hurts, doesn't it? It's the drug war that's the hypocrisy, not the message of freedom, my friend. Sounds as if you'd be right at home in the old USSR, where being an informant on your fellow citizen was expected and required.
Given your love of socialism, is your current favorite band is Rage Against the Machine?
>> How about if they swore they'd never be on MTV (like Metallica did)? Saying one thing and doing the opposite... <<
"Hypocrite" is one of the most overused words. "Saying one thing and doing the opposite" is not always hypocrisy.
What you're describing is "changing one's mind." What, you NEVER changed your mind?
'And don't forget Ted Nugent'
Yep, Ted is da man!
What's the difference between using a captial A and a small a?
I think you may want to learn a bit more about Sepultura.
I'm a big Meat Loaf fan. Not heavy metal, but seems to embrace similar iconography.
I heard rumors that Meat Loaf is a Republican. Wonder if it's true?
Technically Justice is the fifth release. You're forgetting the two EP's, Creeping Death and the $7.98 EP.
Up The Irons !
Marvin Aday -Meatloaf (sp)? said in a magazine interview a couple of years ago that he is a conservative.
Actually, spandex and drug use aside, the metal crowd has always tended to the more conservative. Take a look at Iron Maiden lyrics and you'll see opinions of the military that John Wayne would salute. Let's not forget one of FRs favorite conservatives: the Detroit Madman - Terrible Ted Nugent (spandex, no drugs). In general metal performers come from blue collar backgrounds, these are guys from steel mill towns and other bastions of "flyover country". There are a few exceptions, especially in the hair metal crowd (mostly from LA), but overall these guys have blue-collar hard hat values, because if it wasn't for heavy metal that's who they would be.
I can only judge whether Metallica werre hypocrites based on what they said and did publically. The last we heard from the mighty Metallica on the subject of MTV videos prior to their actually doing it, was that that they wouldn't. They never said they changed their mind or why, until perhaps after the video was made. Thus, as a fan, I had it in my mind that they wouldn't, and without reason to believe otherwise, saw that they did do it. It was hypocrisy for sure. If they changed their minds, they could have eliminated the appearance of hypocrisy by discussing their change of mind publicly.
Where do you draw the line between changing one's mind and hypocrisy? One could easily say "I said X, but before doing the opposite of X, I changed my mind. Then, before I professed X a second time, I changed my mind. Then before I did the opposite of X a second time, I changed my mind. Then, before I said X yet a third time, I changed my mind."
You could explain away all hypocrisy as a "change of mind" based on your definition (unless the statement and action were exactly simultaneous).
Re: Rush. Amen to all that!
>> The backlash against the baby boomers have just began! <<
For more backlash against hippie boomers, see: ManhattanSharks.com
>> You could explain away all hypocrisy as a "change of mind" <<
I do "explain away" most accusations of hypocrisy. It's an accusation tossed about with reckless abandon, by almost everyone against anyone they dislike.
I define hypocrisy as: (1) Advocating a standard, AND (2) explicitly applying the standard to oneself, AND (3) claiming to meet that standard, AND (4) secretly violating that standard.
Hypociry is not a double standard (otherwise, a father setting a bedtime for a child, that he himself did not follow, would be a hypocrite).
Hypocrisy is not falling short of one's standard (otherwise, many dieters would be hypocrites). One must claim to meet that standard, and fail to meet it secretly.
If one openly violates his own standard, openly admitting that he either falls short, or that his standard does not apply to him (a double standard), then he is not a hypocrite.
IAE, there are about a few hundred thousand greater crimes, sins, and vices than hypocrisy.
I agree--your assessment of metal as a white, middle class art form is correct. In fact, back in the '80's I was one of those blue collar metal heads bashing out Dokken, Dio, Ratt, et. al. in the garage band(s). We never discussed or involved ourselves in politics, so I'm surprised to see metal getting politicized but glad to see it going in the conservative direction.
And does anyone remember the scene in Annie Hall where she calls the Woody Allen character over to kill a bug in her bath and picks up a copy of National Review lying around and asks if she is going out with a conservative rocker?
What about what Meticalla did falls short of your standard? They:
(1) Advocated a standard (not doing MTV videos is good)
(2) explicitly applied the standard to themselves (therefore, we won't ever do an MTV vidoe)
(3) claiming to meet that standard (last public statement on the matter is theat they never had nor would)
(4) secretly violating that standard (no public info about doing an MTV video until after they started filming).
Geoff Nicholls (the guy that's played keyboards for Dio in various incarnations for over 20 years) is gonna be pretty pi$$ed when hears that one. Let's not forget Deep Purple, plenty of keys in there.
Though I agree, Rush is more "hard rock" than "heavy metal". I always think it's about polish: if there is some, it's not heavy metal.
Metal chick checking in! I woke up many a morning with "Metal Neck". I used to have all my old show ticket stubs, but not sure where they are now. Saw Iron Maiden, Judas Priest, AC/DC, Anthrax, Metallica, Megadeath, King Diamond, Ozzy, Motley Crew, Van Halen, Dokken, Ratt, Twisted Sister, Overkill, Ronny James Dio, and many many more....
I was a head banging, mosh pittin, stage diving fool! Plus, I had really big hair & tight fitting clothes (usually animal print). It was either jeans & combat boots or big hair, spandex & spiked heels. My mother called my outfits "costumes".
My youngest daughter and I used to go to concerts together sometimes. She wore the jeans and combat boots, but I wore jeans with regular shoes. She also always used temporary hair color to put a big pink or purple streak in her hair.
I'm just trying to figure our where the controversy is here: haven't heavy-metalheads ALWAYS been known as conservative/libertarians? I mean, way back in the stone ages when I was dating musicians (before I got smart), this was true.The bane of my life has always been that the musicians who play the music I like (i.e., blues, R&B), are politically out to lunch. Unfortunately, I just can't abide metal - I think it's great that non-musical people get to participate in the business, but, come on.There is NO TALENT required to do metal. None.
Nope not unusual at all. I find metal kind of vacuums out the aggression, uses it up without hurting anyone. My cure all for bad moods is pretty close to your - long road without stop lights/ signs, heavy metal, half a pack of smokes. One of the reasons I could never live in a bigs city, I need country roads.
There is NO TALENT required to do metal. None.
Well, that may be true (I don't think it is, but I won't argue), however, when you do mix talent and metal, what you get as a result is awesome. Randy Rhoads (Ozzy's original guitarist when he went solo) and Cliff Burton (Metallica's original bassist) are examples. You DO need talent to play Metallica. I have no talent and I tried. I can't.
Bumping a cool thread
Just because you don't like it does not mean that the artist lacks talent.
WHOA. You start off so nice. Then get mean.
A - Heavy metal is one of the bastard step-children of the blues.
B - You should actually listen to some before you start making blanket statements. Yes, because of it's volume metal is a place for folks of limited talent (like Antrhax) to hide. But, because of the speed you can get some serious intricacies that are missing in other forms. Check out the first two minutes of Metallica's Disposable Heroes, amazing guitar work. Tony Iommi (Black Sabbath) could go lick for lick with BB King any day, though as a jazz officianado Iommi would probably rather jam with John McLaughlin.
I think you're just afraid of the volume. There's some serious talent in the metal community, probably has one of the best signal to noise ratios of any subsection of rock and roll.
"Given your love of socialism, is your current favorite band is Rage Against the Machine? "
If it weren't for hyperbole, you'd never have much to say would you?
Fire one up "for freedom", man. Adjust the tin-foil and watch out for the black helicopters.
Woody Allen has always used National Review as a sort of straw man to represent any conservative idea. In an early Allen flick (the title escapes me) he has a somewhat sinister, and puritan-looking character reading NR on the subway.
No,no,no,no. Heavy-metal, like rap, is the affirmative action program of popular music. Musically gifted & talented people need not apply.Listen, I DATED these guys - they couldn't tell you the difference between a pentatonic scale from a catfish scale. All the blues musicians I have ever known couldn't have told you either, but they still KNEW the difference musically in their right-brained hearts nonetheless, and could show it on their guitars & in their vocal chords, because they FELT it.Too bad they all voted for Clinton/Gore. Sure, I like some metal, & I definitely like some hip-hop. But for really outrageous, chills-up-my-spine musicianship, I look elsewhere.
LOL. AC/DC also had the anti-Klinton song Burnin Alive.
Most metalheads don't like whiny pansies. Many that's why a large number of them aren't Goreites. IMO, I think most are libertarian, but I think a large number of them are conservative.
BTW
"Eye of the Beholder" - Metallica. (Strong anti-censorship and anti-thought police)
By the way, does anyone else use it for an anger management tool, or am I just really weird?
I've gone thru days of continuously playing "Some Heads Are Gonna Roll" by Judas Priest when some authority-figure types were screwing with a friend of mine. BTW, Judas Priest is another Right-leaning band
Which "these guys" are you talking about. Here's a quick list of folks in metal that were classically trained:
Angus Young (AC/DC)
Geoff Tate (Queensryche)
Dee Snyder (Twisted Sister and whatever his new band is)
Randy Rhoades (Ozzy's first guitarist, who was taking a course in advanced classical composition when he died)
Tony Iommi (Black Sabbath - trained in classical and jazz guitar)
These are just off the top of my head. There's a lot more talent/ training in metal than you're willing to admit. Now I will admit you don't NEED talent to play metal. Ronnie James Dio himself said metal will never die because you only need to know three chords to play it. And there's a few folks out there that really push the envelope of how little talent you need. But that doesn't change the fact that a lot of metal musicians HAVE more than their fair share of talent and use it to produce some incredible stuff. I think you're just looking in the wrong places, or the volume/ speed is keeping you from hearing the subtleties that exist in most metal. If you take the time to sit and listen to it, you'll find the level of musicianship in metal is on par with blues. To a large degree heavy metal is just Birmingham England's version of the blues.
Affirmative action in popular music is boy bands, the only need there is the "right" look.
Don't forget Cliff Burton, original bassist for Metallica. He was also classically trained. Didn't he have a degree in some music-related field of study from Berkeley?
Well now I know what CD is going in my car for the way home. That song sticks in the head so hard it's not funny. Condiser me tune tagged.
I don't remember what Cliff's training was. I know he was well read (wrote The Thing That Should Not Be, straight out of Lovecraft's Cthulhu mythos, and a few others with solid literary references), as is Iron Maiden's Steve Harris (Rhyme of the Ancient Mariner and others). There's another stereotype that needs attacking: dumb metalers. I've wasted a lot of time watching and reading interviews with rockers and metalers seem to have a much easier time speaking in full sentences than a lot of their counterparts in other genres... When they're not stoned that is.
"Affirmative action in popular music is boy bands, the only need there is the "right" look." Touche. (Although, gag, I have to admit I have merrily hummed along to more 'NSync songs than I care to admit.) I do believe you have a point, though.I just wish some of these metal guys would SHOW their classical training, or at least some HEART when they play.Is that too much to ask? One of the first things you learn in art school is that it is just as important what you DON'T put into a a piece (a painting, a poem, a sculpture, a song) as what you do put in. All the full throttle in metal tends to obscure any kind of coherent emotion. Manual dexterity on the fretboard may be a sign of technical virtuosity, but it isn't necessarily a sign of artistic merit. SOUL too often gets left off the set list when metal guitarists go center stage.
regarding Anthrax... I always thought them to be somewhat conservative... with songs like "Keep It In The Family", which is strongly anti-rascist... I dunno, I am not an expert on them.
Also Rush are rock gods among men! Rock with brains, rock with attitude, thinking man's rock music!
What!?!?!?!?!?
You forgot Kill 'em All!?!?!?!?
.Foul Blasphemer!!!!!!
:-)...JFK
Please, spare us the musical bigotry. Do you need a list of extremely taleted metal musicians? Here are a few...
Yngwie Malmsteen, Marty Friedman, Alex Skolnick, Randy Rhodes, and I could name a whole hell of a lot more. Just because you dont like the music, it doesnt make you any sort of expert on the subject of any music. I dont really like C&W, but there are many talented musicians playing it...JFK
Angus is not what I'd consider "classically trained". He got his licks from noodling with his brothers Malcolm and George, and studying the blues by ear. The early history of AC/DC is definantly one of working your ass off to get to the top. Those guys played their guts out in those old Aussie pubs to get where they are today. Allthough I wouldn't consider them metal, I still say AC/DC has the biggest balls of them all!
As for metal...Up The Irons baby! Maiden all the way!
Ok. That's the second time I've seen a Dokken fan admit their love in public.
Metal, therefore, must be on its way back, but maybe its only In My Dreams.
Manual dexterity on the fretboard may be a sign of technical virtuosity, but it isn't necessarily a sign of artistic merit. SOUL too often gets left off the set list when metal guitarists go center stage.
Valid criticism. Most examples of this type of plastic expertise, however, gen'ly don't do well among the fans. There's this guy named Steve Vai, for instance...
Glad to know there are others who do the same thing. I had put the lid down on my adrenalin rush so hard, I thought the top of my head was going to come off-(but seeing someone go out to fetch security to take you away will do that). When I got into my car, I realized I had bitten my lip bloody trying to keep from decking this rude bitch. By the time I got back to town, I was almost sane again. I gave my radar detector quite a workout and blew out one of my speakers, though...I think that just the fact that the words are all about rage against injustice is a big part the "vacuuming" factor you are talking about.
"Manual dexterity on the fretboard may be a sign of technical virtuosity, but it isn't necessarily a sign of artistic merit. SOUL too often gets left off the set list when metal guitarists go center stage." - BTW, I don't mean to slam only metal muscians about this, it's also a problem with "blues" acts - this is the exact same complaint I have always had with wannabe SRV's like Kenny Wayne Shepherd. They confuse technical mastery of the fretboard with true musicianship. Just because you can say what you want to say loud & fast doesn't necessarily mean that what you're saying is worth listening to.
Geoff Tate, IMHO, is far and above the best voice in Rock. I could easily see him belting out 'La Donna E Mobile' at the Met.
There is NO TALENT required to do metal. None.
Rather a blanket statement, and in most cases patently incorrect. Unless you consider bands like 'Poison' the summa and totam of the Metal genre.
I did not know that about Judas Priest, glad to hear it. I must have played "Dirty Deeds (done dirt cheap)" 20 times during that ride, and "TNT" half that many. I'm really glad I didn't deck anyone, no matter how good it would have felt. We're going to accomplish a lot more by lodging a complaint against the bastards and having an inquiry opened. Maybe I can help prevent these people from abusing their "authority" with others. Heavy metal relieves stress and strengthens resolve.
I'm glad you posted this and will link to it. Rough language doesn't bother me a bit- grew up with soldiers & sailors ( yeah, I agree we need a more civil society, too, and need to watch our tongues in public ), and I'd rather listen to honest talk, with cussing, than lies with oh-so-polite phrasing.
You're right. It was a blanket statement, especially since some of my best friends.....yadayadayada. Really, some good acts have come out of the metal "tradition", ummhmmmm...I'm trying to think of one, I'll have to get back to ya'. But you're right, it was a horribly prejudiced, bigoted judgement to make. Mea Culpa. (But metal still sucks, what can I say?)
While I'd like to be enthused...
It had to happen sooner or later. Kids and Rock-n-Roll are rebellious. Once Liberalism established itself as dominant in the culture(incrementalism over 40 years...now look at us) someone, somewhere was bound to rebel against IT.
God bless Ted (Nugent, not Turner)
Thank God for heavy metal noise! By the way, does anyone else use it for an anger management tool, or am I just really weird?
Yup. A Brit friend (who shocked me when he first told me he too was a metal head) and I were discussing this over a few ports back in 1983. Both us listened to metal to calm frayed nerves and put things into perspective.
I listen to metal when I exercise, and for work when I need to remain focused. I used to be embarrassed because at age 43, 90% of my LP and CD collection is made up of metal or hard rock. This thread makes me feel better.
Awesome, simply awesome. Good find Commie Basher, I haven't hit the site yet, but hopefully I can download some new music. It's about time that music with a conservative slant made it out of the redneck bars.
Hey, I was'nt trying to pull a 'Rev. Jesse' on you. Most metal fans despise bands like Poison and wooden technicality like Steve Vai more than you. As to the technical difficulty of a genre or piece being a trustworthy gauge of its artistic merit, that's laughable IMHO. If that were true, then the best pieces on the 6 string would be Paganini's pieces transcribed.
If you hate Metal, that's fine. I hate Jazz. But I would'nt make the statement that all Jazz players are 'fumblefingers' who've never been taught to clearly voice a note.
"Most examples of this type of plastic expertise, however, gen'ly don't do well among the fans. There's this guy named Steve Vai, for instance" I thought that Steve Vai was the ranking dean emeritus of metal. Do I detect some dissension in the ranks?
I'm ten years older than you, and still a head banger. I get some strange looks, but I like my music and really don't give a s**t what anyone else thinks. The last concert my husband and I went to a few years ago was AC/DC, and there were a LOT of people our age and older there.
I thought that Steve Vai was the ranking dean emeritus of metal.
Yeah, he's a regular legend in his own mind. No one can play a scale like him. Lol.
Metal is an art form, like any other, and it can be good, bad or great depending on the artist who is performing it. "And Justice for All..." by Metallica is a very good example of great metal.
I find myself being more attracted to a jangle kind of a metal sound nowadays, ala My Bloody Valentine, Swervedriver, Voyager One etc. I would like to find some bands who have that kind of sound who are also politically aware (i.e. not liberal). Any suggestions anyone?
My wife and I went to see KISS on their Farewell Tour in March this year. They were playing at a casino resort here, and the hotel was offering a room special. The next morning at the breakfast buffet, 85% of the patrons were 30, 40 and 50 somethings sporting KISS t-shirts.
"If you analyze it I believe the very heart and soul of conservatism is libertarianism. I think conservatism is really a misnomer just as liberalism is a misnomer for the liberals–if we were back in the days of the Revolution, so-called conservatives today would be the Liberals and the liberals would be the Tories. The basis of conservatism is a desire for less government interference or less centralized authority or more individual freedom and this is a pretty general description also of what libertarianism is."- Ronald Reagan
"Yeah, he's a regular legend in his own mind. No one can play a scale like him. Lol" Campion M.B. - well, amen & alleluia! If there's FINALLY some dissension, then metal can EVOLVE like every other form of music (it won't be stuck in November, 1983, the way it has been for so long!) There's HOPE for all of you guys! (Come out to the light, metalheads, a whole new world awaits you!)
I love it! I have the feeling that when a lot of us are really old, our younger neighbors will be calling the sheriff to complain about our loud metal and other rock music, drinking parties, and grass smoking. Sounds great to me!
Let me add, that in all the musical genres of the past 30 years, only one has had lyrics which truly dealt with political / cultural / religious issues. That genre is metal, and its message has almost invariably been conservative. Folk and Country predate this 'modern' era of music.
They confuse technical mastery of the fretboard with true musicianship. Just because you can say what you want to say loud & fast doesn't necessarily mean that what you're saying is worth listening to.
I read some comments posted to a guitar site several years ago in which people voted for their favorite guitarist then wrote a little about their choice. One fellow voted for David Gilmour and said "Gilmour can say more in 3 notes than Malmsteen can say in 300."
Yngwie Malmsteen...
Saw him play in college. Yngwie was only 24 at the time.
He's 10X more arrogant and impressive than you've heard.
The second song of the night was "Far Beyond The Sun". I felt Like Saul on the road to Damascus.
Yngwie taught a bunch of young, dunderpated guitarists like - how to use a harmonic or diminished scale.
I have to admit I've largely gave up on metal since the advent of 'Slaughter'. The only 'metal' bands whose music I've continued to purchase is King's X, and Tool. Metallica lost me with the black album. They went from 8 minute pieces with unusual time sigs and repeated changes to a 3 minute song, one riff pop band.
Most examples of this type of plastic expertise, however, gen'ly don't do well among the fans. There's this guy named Steve Vai, for instance...
Vai only played commercial metal to pay the bills.
If you hear his solo albums, you'll see there's more to him than that. The Zappa influence comes through, in a metal way ;)
"Gilmour can say more in 3 notes than Malmsteen can say in 300." I second that emotion.
"The only 'metal' bands whose music I've continued to purchase is King's X..." Yowsa. You've got good taste. I did say I do like some metal. Are you from Texas?
Vai only played commercial metal to pay the bills
You're prob right, but I can't accord any respect to a musician who puts his name on an album to 'pay the bills'.
That, and the stunting his commercial releases did to the genre.
The only 'metal' bands whose music I've continued to purchase is King's X
Ty Tabor is one of the most underrated guitarists around. Kings X can rock with ANYBODY.
Wow, another Ty fan? Although this label is constantly used, they are, without a doubt, the most underappreciated band of the last 20 years. That's the prob. with metal. Is King's X truly 'metal'? I think so, but I would'nt consider AC/DC 'metal', they're more like hard rock.
No I'm not a Texan, I lived in LA during the metal heyday, and they were always popular out here. Ty just released another solo album, btw.
Hey maybe you can tell me, what ever happened to Eric Johnson? Is he still alive?
You are right about that-I think what many of us like about metal (aside from the music itself) is that it has a message conservatives can relate to and that speaks for what we believe in. The fact that it is angry music should give politicians pause-there are lots of angry people out here, and we are workers and taxpayers....
"Which "these guys" are you talking about. Here's a quick list of folks in metal that were classically trained:"
Dont forget Trent Reznor - founder, lead singer, and virtual one man band of NINE INCH NAILS.
Trent was a classically trained pianist, and from what I have read, a very promising one.
He also taught himself how to play guiter.
P.S. Marilyn Manson is very conservative - just not very religious. (Doesnt care for the dogma...)
Have seen him in concert twice - great shows!!
"The only 'metal' bands whose music I've continued to purchase is King's X..."
I've got the first three CDs. Gretchen Goes to Nebraska is excellent, but I haven't been able to find anymore of their stuff locally. How does the later stuff compare to Gretchen...?
Check out Stuck Mojo:
"I loathe them/I hate them/for their sickly toxic presence
For the country I love/they show no God Damned reverence/no character/no pride/men without a sense of dignity/collectivist mindset/a danger to our liberty"
--Drawing Blood
I could be mistaken, but those three songs on "Among the Living" kinda set the pace.
But, hey, people from Anthrax were also Stormtroopers of Death... "Speak English or Die" with tongue firmly planted in cheek :)
Nobody is disputing Rush. Rush is to music what Patrick McGoohan is to television.
I agree totally. I went to see Machine Head with a "Buchanan for President" bumper sticker on my car and the metalheads were hitting me up for them and putting them on their cars.
Let's also not forget that "Ride the Lightning" is anti-death penalty.
Steve Vai, Steve Stevens, I think George Lynch, Satriani. Skolnick kicks ass!
Marylin Manson needs to get over the fact that he is NOT Blackie Lawless. Never has been, never will be.
Just listened to the solo in Unforgiven by Metallica. I'm blown away.... again.
Strangest thing I've ever heard. I have piles of good sound metal music theory articles in my bookshelf.
Can't play any of them, since I have the fretboard dexterity of a penguin, but I have enough training in other instruments to know it's not BS. You do have to train your ear to hear the details, and certainly there were plenty of Wyld Stallyns for every Metallica.
"Wow, another Ty fan?" HI, you two, I'm back from dinner. Yeah, I wonder if Ty & Co. can be considered "heavy metal". I don't think so (but then, I'm prejudiced- they just sound like Texas to me) About Eric Johnson, I know that Texas guitarists have a nasty habit of ending up in mental wards or slamming into the sides of mountains, but as far as I know Eric Johnson is alive and well & still making music.At least I sure as heck hope he is.
What? Pantera does'nt sound like Texas? ;]
Prob. my lack of searching, but EJ seemed to have dropped off the face of the earth after that 'Cliffs of Dover' Album.
I'd put King's X in the 'pop/metal' category, though I don't like the putting in a box approach.
Let's also not forget that "Ride the Lightning" is anti-death penalty
I would'nt agree with that. I think they're just putting the listener into the mind of the convicted. In the same vein, I don't think 'Creeping Death' is anti-God, though 'Master of Puppets' sure is.
I've always been more of a Mustaine fan anyway- Peace Sells, but Who's Buyin'?
Really,I'm not kidding, you've gotten me a bit paranoid here; this is a little bit scary - where the heck IS Eric Johnson? We HAVEN'T heard about him in a long time. Does anyone know? Is he OK?
I'll do a search, but the last I heard of him was not long after that album. He was doing studio work I think.
All their stuff is a fine cut above. I'd suggest you pick up Dogman- its a little heavier.
All their stuff is a fine cut above. I'd suggest you pick up Dogman- its a little heavier.
Ok, EJ seems to be still kickin'. Just can't find his stuff in the local Best Buy (never find the good stuff there anyway).
Here's a live album with a release date of 2000.
AHA! You wouldn't be his manager, would you? This is a tad suspicious.
Lol. You know me...:D
Just spiking your interest. Gotta give Texas some credit- they do seem to produce an inordinate amount of fine guitarists.
King's X / Ty fan club bump.
No.6: There actually does exist "piles of good sound metal music theory articles"? Oh boy, I don't EVEN want to know about it. I give up. (I am still slogging through classical music theory - I have to learn about metal music theory too? YIKES!)
You're full of refritos,you know that? But you are right : you've "Gotta give Texas some credit- they do seem to produce an inordinate amount of fine guitarists." No question. (It's in the water, BTW.)
That's not the problem, it's the position of the slash (/) that you have wrong. It is "<", then "/", then "a", then ">". Hence, </a>.
You might want to check out HTML Bootcamp for help.
Ok. That's the second time I've seen a Dokken fan admit their love in public.
I was a Dokken fan in the 80s, but find it a bit hard to get enthusiastic for them 14 years on. Few 80s bands can still grab my gizzard, but I still listen to Judas Priest (ever notice how many of their songs ended in "er"?), early Motley Crue, Metallica, and Motorhead.
Other favorites are UFO, MSG, Scorpions, Sabbath, BOC and of course, Rush (have every LP or CD - even the new stuff).
Refritos? Love Texans, but I'm not familiar with all the 'down home' talk. Is that like Frito Pie? Lol. (Oh- did you mean beans?)
That's ok, I came out of the closet and professed my appreciation of Dokken a long time ago.
Only 'glam' band I give any respect to. (well maybe Ratt- don't tell anyone). George Lynch has a lot to do with that.
Love the early Crue and of course RUSH. Though again, hard to classify them as 'metal'. They lost me with that 'Time Stand Still' album. Too synth heavy. Besides, Aimee Mann on vocals? Some of Peart's lyrics started to get a little lib wacky anyway.
Thanks for the link, great tune !
Hey, don't make fun of our beans - our beans gave us Blind Lemon Jefferson, T-Bone Walker, Albert Collins, Lighting Hopkins, Johnny Winter,Rocky Erickson, SRV, Jimmie Lee Vaughn, well, ya know, I could go ON & ON, but I wouldn't want to brag, or anything.Texas beans = great guitar.
5th albulm, "Garage Days" was thier first, this albulm was given out while they were up and coming and playing clubs, I got mine at GBGB's in NY a long time ago.
Take away all my silver
Take away all my gold
And hand me a stack of paper.
Paper money don't hold.
Paper money don't hold.
Well, you act as though you don't remember,
The way it all used to be.
Now one man, he locks up the money
Another man holds the key
--Paper Money by Montrose
I ask you, what other hard rock band has come up with such a brilliant critique of the Federal reserve system, while at the same time calling for a return to the gold standard?
You must not be looking hard enough. Most modern virtuosos are to be found in the metal genre.
AC/DC also had the anti-Klinton song Burnin Alive.
OMG! You're right! I even have the Ballbreaker album (listening to it as I write this), but I'd never listened closely to the lyrics for that particular song. LOL!
They be smokin' your hide, come runnin' wild
Tell you nothin' to fear, cause the buck stops here!
He came from a little town called Hope
And someday, maybe, it'll go up in smoke
...
Somewhere, there's a little town called Hope
and someday, maybe baby, he'll inhale that smoke!
>> (3) claiming to meet that standard (last public statement on the matter is theat they never had nor would)
(4) secretly violating that standard (no public info about doing an MTV video until after they started filming). <<
By the time Metallica appeared on MTV, they had changed their minds. And everyone could see them on MTV. It wasn't something they could hide. Obviously, they didn't appear on MTV in secret. Everyone could see them on it.
>> And does anyone remember the scene in Annie Hall where she calls the Woody Allen character over to kill a bug in her bath and picks up a copy of National Review lying around and asks if she is going out with a conservative rocker? <<
No. I only remember Woody Allen saying, "Why don't you call Buckley [to kill the bug]?
Dude now I'm just a liberal despisin' short haired metalhead with a wife and son! I'm relieved to see so many here that all think along the same bandwith. ROCK ON!
Wow, thanks! I had never REALLY listened to that song. I am putting the Ballbreaker album in my car to listen to on the way to jobsites today. Rock on, all!!
A lot of that comes with maturation. It's important to remember that most metal musicians got their first record contract in their teens. As they get older they start toning down the scream factor and putting some real effort into it. You've gotta dig through the volume, cause it's still heavy metal and still loud, but a lot of bands (Black Sabbath, Iron Maiden, Judas Preist and Queensryche all come to mind immediately) have done some amazing stuff, especially around the 4th or 5th album (Queensryche peeked on their 3rd). There are, of course, those that never grow up (Def Lepard is a good example, still a bunch of drunks).
Not saying you need to run right out and blow a couple hundred on metal CDs, just don't label them all as talentless hacks. A lot of them are right up there with the blues musicians who's style they've over amplified.
I've never been able to stomache Anthrax enough to speak on their lyrics. That was in the talentless sub-discussion. I saw an interview with Anthrax in the late '80s where they really captured why I hate them, asked how they write their music the lead guitar player said: "we thrash our instruments as fast as we can and hope that develops into a rhythm". Given what I've heard from them that's a pretty acurate description.
Not in the interview I heard. My understanding is that his parents made him study classical guitar for a couple of years, this is defended by his fondness for playing Malguana (hope I spelled that right) during the pee break/ monster guitar solo. I think he learned the blues stuff that's such an important part of metal from his brothers, but his main guitar technique came from classical training... or I've been lead horribly astray.
You obviously haven't hit a hard rock radio station in a while. Metal has evolved far and wide since '83. First the speed metal that was only in it's infancy took on a life of it's own with the successes of Metalica, Megadeth and a few otehrs. Then death metal spun out from that, and industrial. Let's not forget the Red Hot Chili Peppers and their wonderful invention: Funk Metal (basically speed metal done with a base player that's really into funk), this got added to by Living Color (all black metal band, great talent, faded away far too fast). These days the top acts in metal are folks like Tool and Sepultura, the brand of metal they play didn't even exist in '83.
I think the stagnation we saw in the mid '80s was because of timing. There was that new '80s invention: Hair Metal which had turned metal into top 40 material (a sin I tell you) and appealed to women and non-working class stiffs a lot more than traditional metal. Unfortunately we old gaurders that had grown up on the Black and Blue Tour (Black Sabbath and Blue Oyster Cult) hated hair metal, so we kept the old gaurd bands going (probably past their shelf life in many cases). Then, because of their fondness for cocaine and cheap whiskey, the hair bands started (often literally) dieing off. So we came out of 1988 with metal in pretty much the same shape it was in 1980. By '89 though shelf-life syndrome had rotted most of the old gaurd and these others that had been waiting in the wings (Metalica, Peppers et al) took over.
On a personal note, I'm not that fond of the current metal sound. Too much emphasis on what I call "bowel movement base" (you'll understand that label after listening to 2 songs by Tool). Interestingly what we're seeing these days is a return of the old gaurd with new albums and re-unions by Iron Maiden (Brave New World, best album they've done since Powerslave), AC/DC (don't really like what I've heard from their new one), the original Black Sabbath (making the bands first good live album ever), Blue Oyster Cult (Curse of the Hidden Mirror, solid, grows on you). And let's not forget my favorite of the "new" bands, because they sound so much like Black Sabbath, and stole their name from Frank Zappa: Monster Magnet.
So, yes, metal is evolving. But it never loses sight of the fact that it is a bastard step child of the blues, and so periodically returns to that structure of fast loud blues.
You can add Ozzy to the list of rightish types. One example is "Thank God for the Bomb":
Like moths to a flame
Is man never gonna change
Time's seen untold aggression
And infliction of pain
If that's the only thing that's
stopping war
Then thank god for the bomb
War is just another game
Tailor made for the insane
But make a threat of their
annihilation
And nobody wants to play
If that's the only thing that
keeps the peace
Then thank god for the bomb
When war is obsolete
I'll thank god for the war's defeat
But any talk about hell
freezing over
Is all said with tongue in cheek
Until the day the war drums
beat no more
Then thank god for the bomb
From http://members.aol.com/ozzyhead1/lyrics2.htm
Sorry, I have to disagree with your take on Skolnick. He filled in for the departed Cris Oliva (RIP) ( Savatage ) and I got to see him play with them twice, plus you can hear him on the "Live in Japan" CD. I'll say he's good but nothing to write home about IMHO. Al Pitrelli is a much better player. And lets not forget about John Petrucci from Dream Theater.
Turn the T.V. on, don’t you touch that dial
Watch the video’s, on the latest styles
Smash or trash, just 95 cents a call
Get your fix, fix your head, right said Fred
Real Worlds, comin through just for you
Our voice, comin through just for you
Pledge your faith
The tunes are blastin
The latest fashion
Watch the ratings soar
As morals come down crashing
We’re the demigods
And we’re here to stay
On EMPTY V. U.S.A.
The T.V.’s on and Uncle Tom is waiting
Just for you
Made his fame from Buttheads name
Thanks to the likes of you
Cobain is dead, but not for long
We got his a** Unplugged, pardon the pun
Real Worlds comin through just for you
Top ten comin through just for you
Our voice comin through just for you
EMPTY VISIONS, EMPTY V
Empty Visions
M.O.D.
Dictated Aggression - 1996
He's prabably painfully overproducing another album, but he sure is great live !!
I would'nt agree with that. I think they're just putting the listener into the mind of the convicted. In the same vein, I don't think 'Creeping Death' is anti-God, though 'Master of Puppets' sure is.
I agree with Boru's take on "Ride the Lightning", I don't know what it has to do with anything I said though.
Master of Puppets, the song, is clearly about the horrors of drug addiction, can you explain why you think it's anti God ? Probably based on their time with Mustaine. LOL
"I love the Bomb."
-- John Milius, conservate director/screenwriter, Big Wednesday, The Wind And The Lion, Conan The Barbarian, Red Dawn
You think Queensryche peaked with Rage for Order ? I kind of like Operation Mindcrime myself.I also think Pyromania was Def Lepard's last good work. The hysteria over Hysteria was horrible misplaced as far as I'm concerned.
Aside from the lyrics, with I'm not familliar with, Rush's most recent studio release is much more guitar based than I thought it would be. A pleasant suprise. Also the newest triple live disk has a live disc recorded in the late 70's and is the best part of the package IMO.
Crap, I forgot about rage (subconscious perhaps? really lame album). I was trying to say they peaked with OM. I only counted the first EP and Warning (which is pretty solid).
Master of Puppets, the song, is clearly about the horrors of drug addiction, can you explain why you think it's anti God ? Probably based on their time with Mustaine. LOL
Interesting, I had never heard that interp. before. I think if you listen to the lyrics, and look at the album's cover art, you can see why I'd think that 'Master of Puppets' is about God, not H.
Alright, don't push it lady ;]. We've got a few guitarists out here in Cali as well. We'll take your guitarists, but keep your beans in Tejas. :]
Mustaine gem:
"What do you mean I don't support your system?
I go to court when I have to"
Here is a funny Yngwie Malmsteen story:
I was at a music store & this older woman was looking around in the metal section. When asked if she needed help by the young man working there...she said, "I am looking for Wingy Monster". The poor lad was stumped, he had never heard of Wingy Monster. Being a Yngwie fan, I stepped up & asked her which "Wingy CD" she was looking for & then showed her where they were....then I told her how to pronounce his name.
lyrics and meanings, someones interpretation anyway
James about the song:
"I believe in capital punishment, but it was more about the idea of being strapped in the electric chair even though you didn't commit the crime."
No talent to do metal?!?! Woman go get yourself any of the first four Black Sabbath Albums and get your head fixed.
I also think Pyromania was Def Lepard's last good work.
Here, here!! High 'n Dry and Pyro are legends.
Hows it going Inspector ?Def Lepard did one of those story tellers on VH-1 a while back and someone asked to hear some of the good stuff (from Hi and Dry) and Joe siad the fans don't know that old stuff and they don't play it in their shows now. They should do a washed up rocker tour with Bon Jovi. ROFL
Wingy...snicker....JFK
Wow. You're right. I'm suprised I was that dense. It is an anti-drug song. 'Chop your breakfast on a mirror' is pretty clear.
My thanks.
You probably are not dense, you just weren't listening closely. : )
By the way, does anyone else use it for an anger management tool, or am I just really weird?
Are you kidding ??? Speed metal is WAY better than twisting yourself into a pretzel to get rid of stress. I used listen to that stuff while working out ... NICE BURN .... and you come home tired and relaxed.
What's Rob Zombie considered?
Oh man, that's a tough one. Musically there's a lot of industrial/ death metal influence in Rob's stuff. Overall I'd give Rob the throne that Marilyn Manson wants so bad: Alice Cooper's old spot as the head man of shock rock. Shock rock is one of the earliest subsections of metal, but since so few artists have worked within it (Alice, Rob, sometimes Iggy Pop, and Manson keeps thinking he is but he just doesn't understand the difference between shock and offend, Nick Cave kind of sits on the melodic side of shock) it's not well publicized, and not very well understood. I don't think there's room in shock rock for more than 1 or 2 artists at a time, there just aren't that many people that want to be creeped out by what they listen to.
Anybody that digs metal should definitely find and watch VH1's top 100 Artists of Heavy Metal. Their Top X Artists of Y series is really cool to start with because they got other musicians in the genre to discuss the "inducties". The metal one is one of their best, proof once again that metal musicians tend to be a little brighter. Not all of the comments are positive. My favorite is Cooper commenting on Manson (why I thought of it just now): "Androgenous look, girls name, bizaar stage show... I wish I'd thought of that."
Reread you Master lyrics sheet. The song has some pretty strong references to cocaine ("chop your breakfast on a mirror"). I think the cover art was more inspired by Disposable Heroes (my favorite song on the album) than by the title track, which makes sense. Given rocks link to drugs any cover that borrowed from the lyrics of Master would be labeled "pro-drug" and get the band in a lot of trouble.
I like this site, bookmarked for sure!
OZZY RULES
"I like this site, bookmarked for sure!"
I agree. I may not be a metal fan, but everyone who reads this thread has to admit that metalheads are sharp,articulate, respectful of other opinions & all-around-totally -cool.I'm impressed. (But, SORRY, I will pull my OWN toenails out before I listen to TOOL again!)
I also think Pyromania was Def Lepard's last good work. The hysteria over Hysteria was horrible misplaced as far as I'm concerned.
LOL! I inteviewed Phil Collen just before Hysteria was released, and I had only heard one or two of the tracks on a demo supplied by the record company. He damned near had apoplexy when I remarked it was a bit poppy, top 40ish. Collen was the death of Lepard.
Everything after Pyromania was a damn sight wimpier compared to the band that I saw open for Ozzy at the Orpheum Theatre in Memphis in August 1981. They blew Ozzy off stage that night, and that's when Randy Rhodes was playing. Ozzy spat the dummy, stormed off stage (ending the show five songs into the set), and the theatre was trashed by the bikers in the audience.
Unter gleben glaucken globen....
N.I.B.
Damn right, it's tough to choose just one, but N.I.B. must be my absolute favorite Black Sabbath song.
Oh yeah!
Some people say my love cannot be true
Please believe me my love and I'll show you
I will give you those things you thought unreal
The sun, the moon, the stars all bear my seal
Oh yeah!
Follow me now and you will not regret
Leaving the life you led before we met
You are the first to have this love of mine
Forever with me until the end of time
Your love for me has just got to be real
Before you know the way I'm going to feel
I'm going to feel... I'm going to feel...
Oh yeah!
Now I have you with me under my power
Our love grows stronger now with every hour
Look into my eyes you'll see who I am
My name is Lucifer please take my hand!
Oh yeah!
Follow me now and you will not regret
Leaving the life you led before we met
You are the first to have this love of mine
Forever with me until the end of time
Your love for me has just got to be real
Before you know the way I'm going to feel
I'm going to feel... I'm going to feel...
Oh yeah!
Now I have you with me under my power
Our love grows stronger now with every hour
Look into my eyes you'll see who I am
My name is Lucifer please take my hand!
How in the WORLD do you top that!?
Probably even more disgraceful was the flipflop of Dee Snider (Twisted Sister) from taking on Al Gore head-to-head in a Congressional hearing to essentially endorsing him in 2000.
Must be why VH-1 let him host a "greatest metal bands of the 80's" show a while back. They ranked Twisted Sister as #2. I can think of a lot of metal bands that were better than Twisted Sister.
Dee Snyder is a d*ck!
I always liked Snowblind.
I wish there was a rightist MC-5. Now that would be cool.
N.I.B. Bump
Oh Yeah !
Snowblind
They performed it at Ozzfest, cool stuff!!
Oh hell yeah bump!
LOL
My proxy views AntiMTV as tasteless. Go figure.
Yeah...Greatest Metal bands of the 80's and the didn't even mention
Gracias, amigo.
"Darkness is just a speck, in The Light."
A couple of other tidbits:
I haven't listened to anything by Metallica since 'Ride the Lightning.' That was one hell of an album. "Fade to Black" "For Whom the Bell Tolls" "Trapped Under Ice" - all great.
If you like your metal straight-up 4x4 with a southern hook, my all-time favorite is The Cult's 'Electric' album. "Love Removal Machine" "Li'l Devel" - Completely rocks from first song to last. Overall The Cult was a good band, but 'Electric' is great, IMO.
OOOH! (The picture is supposed to be Tool, I gather?It looks like they are tourists in the vaults below Santo Pietro in Rome.) Know what, I just wish I could turn all you guys onto something called a melody. You'd finally recognize that your adolescent infatuation with amateur muscicians who can only do the three-chord drill is a waste of time.There are quite a few folks out there who can do SO MUCH more, and you're missing it all.
By the way, this was a GREAT post. Musicians are WAY too quiet on this site, and we all know they're out there! Speak up, guys!
bump for a later read.
Are you high? Tool? "Adolescent infatuation with amateur muscicians"?? That's Black Sabbath! Geezer, Tony, Ozzy & Bill. Oh man... Christ, I hope you were trying to be funny.
Actually, that's a picture of Black Sabbath - Tool are a *bit* younger than that.
No kidding!!
I'm not trying to be funny SCGOP! I really mean what I'm saying, like I think YOU really mean what you say.I think metal is as exchangeable as one aspirin commercial for another. About as artistically important, also. I understand you actually BELIEVE that Black Sabbath has changed the face of music in this country. And that Ted Kennedy is a feminist, too. Sorry, I just don't share your vision, here.
Whatever.
Alright. There seems to be some confusion when it comes to the differences between a conservative and a libertarian.
A libertarian is someone who is socially liberal and fiscally conservative. For example, a libertarian stands against all forms of government and societal control, norms, and mores. He would be the classic anarchist. Libertarians stand against those that would put an end to prostitution, pornography, drugs, gay rights, etc. They may or may not stand for family values, depending on one's definition of family values. If it is restrictive, they shall not be for it. Libertarians believe government is for one thing and one thing only, the ensure against invasion and to ensure that people are kept safe from other people exercising their rights. A classic example of a group of libertarians would be the Hell's Angels. The free spirit, the believer of chaos over order and obedience, would be a libertarian. Howard Stern is a libertarian. Many conservatives around the country feel he is obscene. There is a clear difference. Conservatives are for tradition, norms and mores, while libertarians are against.
Lol. That album was my favorite throughout pretty much all of High School. Gotta love 'Love Removal Machine'.
PS, just extended my X library. Why I denied myself is a question I can't answer. Too many great tunes to name, but 'Fade' is near the top of the list.
By the way, does anyone else use it for an anger management tool, or am I just really weird?
No, you are in good company. Judas Priest "Screaming for Vengeance" is a good listen for coming through some bad emotion.
Heavy Metal is a perfect mix for controlled rage, like ice hockey. Is it any wonder why the NHL uses HM music as bumps when the game pauses?
I can't think of one of my metal-head friends that even leans slightly left. This runs the spectrum from mild-mannered housewives, to pot-smoking bums living in the back of pick up trucks in between gigs, to pilots, to bankers, etc. They all think socialist, goodie-goodie, poverty-pimp government functionaries are a threat to their existance.
I understand you actually BELIEVE that Black Sabbath has changed the face of music in this country.
Not just America, the whole bloody world. There's nary a rock musician out there that doesn't list Sabbath as a favorite if not an influence. They are still as popular today with the fourth generation of metal heads as they were with the first generation. Not even the Beatles or Stones can lay claim to that kind of following.
Doesn't suprise me, I have listened to metal/Punk since the early 80's dating back to bands like the Misfits and Black Flag all the way to Rage Against the Machine and I am a rabid anti-socialist
How can anyone mention conservatives and rock and neglect to mention the motor city madman Ted Nuggent!
opps disregard above post I read further and saw him mentioned
To quote "Drowning Pool", which I have blaring right now(hope my neighbors don't wake up): "Let the bodies hit the floor, Let the bodies hit the floor."
This site is now on my favorites list after reading some of "The Master" and his perceptive social commentary. There's a massive amount of socially aware "metal-heads" out there, myself included. While my shaved head and goatee, not to mention tattoos, may be intimidating in some situations, we are people to have on your side. I am fervent in my beliefs and in my hatred of the anti-thesis of those beliefs. Some of the people on this thread may not like it, but when we're all in the fox-holes together, we should be able to look past the "decoration" of self, or expression of mind, to see the rifle sites.
Even in my country, Kenneth Clarke, a leftish Tory, calls us hard-right conservatives, "headbangers". I listen to classical, but I'd prefer to be a headbanger than ever agree with Clarke.
Regards, Ivan
FREE BRITANNIA
Alright. Is that a 7-string Ty is playing on "Charlie Sheen?" "Fade" is good, no doubt, but my favorite on the CD is "Move Me." Incredible musicianship throughout. You mentioned Ty had a new release? I didn't know that. What's the title?
"There's nary a rock musician out there that doesn't list Sabbath as a favorite if not an influence. They are still as popular today with the fourth generation of metal heads as they were with the first generation. Not even the Beatles or Stones can lay claim to that kind of following."
Know what, from what I can gather, I think you are right about that. I don't understand it, but I'm willing to concede what you're saying. I have a question for all you metalheads though. Pick your favorite version of "Little Wing". Which is your favorite version - performed by whom? (This really would be a good seperate thead, but I wouldn't know how to go about doing that on FR.)
Asking you to declare who your favorite "Little Wing" artist is, BTW, an old CIA trick. It's a window into your soul, so to speak, it says EVERYTHING.
240 Posted on 09/30/2001 03:43:04 PDT by StoneColdGOP
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