HAVE A SEAT MR. POLLARD! SIT A SPELL!
Disclaimer: Opinions posted on Free Republic are those of the individual posters and do not necessarily represent the opinion of Free Republic or its management. All materials posted herein are protected by copyright law and the exemption for fair use of copyrighted works.
There's a story of a Jew whom the Romans decided to feed to the lions. They dug a hole in the Coliseum and buried him in it, standing up, with only his head and neck showing. Then they let out a lion that had been starved for two days and, of course, the lion with his mouth drooling went straight for the Jew and began to circle his prey. When the lion drew close, the Jew bit it. It yelped and ran away. From the Coliseum stands, someone yelled, "Jew, fight fair!"
The Jews of Israel have had to fight, first to dislodge the British who regarded Palestine, the ancient Roman name given to Israel in a vain effort to erase its rightful name from history, as a protectorate. After World War II, the British Empire went into decline and, in one of the great miracles of modern times, the ancient nation of Israel was reborn in the wake of the outright murder of six million Jews by the Nazis. When its independence was declared and surrounding Arab nations attacked, there were those who yelled, "Jews, fight fair!"
They fought as any people for whom fighting for their very lives must fight. This time there was no repeat of the Warsaw Ghetto uprising where the world learned that Jews can and will fight against great odds.
In 1987, a former navel intelligence officer, Jonathan Jay Pollard, was sentenced to life in prison without any chance of parole, for having passed classified information to the Israelis. He is the only person ever to be so severely punished for spying on behalf of an American ally. What Pollard did, in essence, was to provide Israeli intelligence with information being denied to them by the United States; information that was critical to their ability to defend themselves against the same Arab nations that have repeatedly attacked them. Nations that call for their destruction.
Pollard was never accused or indicted on a charge of treason. In comparable cases where people who committed the offense of spying for an ally in time of peace, and then pled guilty and cooperated with the government, they have been given a median sentence of four to five years, serving on an average between three and four years. Why does Pollard remain in prison to this day?
In his book, The Hunting Horse (Prometheus Books, published in 2000), author Eliot Goldberg points out that, in 1983, President Reagan had signed an agreement with Israel for the bilateral exchange of information. It was the same kind of information that Pollard felt compelled to provide Israel. As an intelligence expert, he knew it was being deliberately and knowingly denied.
"Specifically, wrote Goldberg, "Pollard agreed to plead guilty to one count of conspiracy to violate a federal statute that prohibits a person from communicating to a foreign government information relating to the national defense—either with intent (or reason to believe) that the information will be used to the injury of the United States or to the advantage of a foreign nation."
Conspiracy, not treason. Since the 1980's the United States has discovered one truly treasonous spy after another, including high-ranking members of the Central Intelligence Agency and the Federal Bureau of Investigation. They sold out their nation to a degree so much worse as to have compromised our entire national security system. But Pollard remains in jail for having passed along classified information the US, as a matter of national policy, refused to share with an ally.
What we do know is that the US worked closely with Iraq's Saddam Hussein during his eight year war with Iran, the sworn enemy of this nation, providing him not merely with weapons of war, but with the components of deadly gas warfare. What we do know is that, during the Reagan administration, the US secretly worked to provide weapons of war to Iran, a scandal that was to become known as Iran-Contra.
In his book, Under Fire, Lt. Col. Oliver North, wrote that Casper Weinberger, then Secretary of Defense, "seemed to go out of his way to blame the Israelis for every problem in the Middle East." It was a letter from Weinberger to District Court Judge Aubrey Robinson that led to the unusually harsh sentence given Pollard. Was Weinberger lying when he claimed Pollard had posed a severe threat to our national security? Yes.
It is worth recalling that it was Casper Weinberger who, under oath before Congress, lied repeatedly about the Iran-Contra affair. It is Weinberger who would have gone to jail had the father of the current President not pardoned him.
What has emerged has been the existence of a top secret US policy to keep the various wars in the Middle East at a level where neither combatant could win. What has emerged is the realization that US Middle East policy has always been subject to the approval of Saudi Arabia. It is not so much peace in the Middle East that has been the objective, but the flow of oil upon which this nation is so utterly dependent.
It was for this reason that George H.W. Bush put together a coalition to punish Iraq for its invasion of Kuwait, surely to be followed by one of Saudi Arabia, if it were to prove successful. It was for this reason, with total victory in its grasp, the US failed to end the regime of a man, Saddam Hussein, who represents the greatest threat to peace in that area of the world today, rivaled only by Iran.
Here's where it gets really murky. When one talks of traitors to this nation, cannot this term be applied to all those, including powerful members of Congress, who have fought to keep this nation from gaining access to a huge reserve of oil on US territory, the Alaskan National Wildlife Reserve? Why would anyone want to keep this nation from achieving a degree of security based on our own oil? Cannot this term be applied to a President who effectively made it impossible for the US to have access to a huge reserve of high-grade coal in Utah, when this nation is dependent on coal for the generation of 52% of its electricity?
Today, the fanaticism of Islamic fundamentalism, fueled and financed out of Iran, that most threatened the stability of the Middle East and poses a threat to the United States. These are the same people who took American diplomats hostage in Iran, holding them for over a year. These are the same people who blew up the World Trade Center in New York. These are the same people waging a war of terrorism in the midst of Israel, despite having signed peace agreements in Oslo more than eight years ago.
United States foreign policy in the Middle East has been a total failure. That failure dates back to the administration of Jimmy Carter who would not support our then ally, the Shah of Iran, giving rise to the Khomeini revolution. It is a policy that pays lip service to Israel as an ally and then compelled it to stand idle as Iraqi Scud missiles fell on its cities. And the voice in the Coliseum cries out "Jew. Fight fair!"
Fairness and justice demands that Jonathan Jay Pollard's sentence be commuted and that he be allowed to immigrate to Israel. President George W. Bush can send a message to our Middle Eastern enemies by righting a wrong done to an American who sacrificed his freedom because of a failed and foolish foreign policy being played out today in the streets of Jerusalem.
I believe Mr. Pollard was an American citizen when arrested. He should count himself fortunate not to have been executed.
I believe that it's time to hang Jonathan Pollard.
As far as I'm concerned Jonathan Jay Pollard can grow old and die...in prison.
Set him free by lowering him from his prison cell using a rope around his neck.
No, it's not. The traitor should have been hung (or shot, I'm flexible on this) but since he wasn't he should rot in jail until he dies. Ditto others like the Walkers, Robert Hanssen, etc.
I thought that they fed Christians to the lions. And, if memory serves, we prosecuted a whole host of people who were passing secrets to the Soviets during WWII at a time when they were our allies.
Pollard SOLD the information. It would be a little different if he had given it away, but not much. A traitor is a traitor. Execute the traitor. DD
I doubt Mr. Caruba realizes the implications of his position. Essentially, he is saying that Mr. Pollard, as a Jew, was correct in putting loyalty to Israel, a foreign country, above loyalty to America. Should we assume that all other Jews working in sensitive positions in this country will do the same?
If not, why not?
Hang the bastid!
I thought that they fed Christians to the lions.
The Romans were flexible. They fed all kinds of people to lions. Actually, the Jews apparently never suffered the empire-wide official persecutions that Christians did. There were localized popular pogroms and riots (some of which were apparently started by the Jews). And of course, there were a number of wars centering on Palestine in which millions of Jews died.
There was never any official persecution of Jews in the pre-Christian Empire for practicing their religion. The officials despised the Jewish religion, but they recognized the right of Jews to practice it.
This lack of executions for treason (or some softened, politically correct variant) has got to stop.
Barak apparently didn't offer Clinton enough cash.. good thing, too.
I believe that it's time to hang Jonathan Pollard.
He should be hanged right along side those so called friends (Israelis) that have sold our secrets to China. Israel is no friend and as long as we know tow to them, this nation is in peril.
We should release Pollard because Israel really really really wanted the information?
I have a suggestion. Every time a column is published calling for Pollard's release, we should comply and release a sizeable chunk of his body.
It's Time To Free Jonathan Pollard...
from his Earth-bound confinement. Yes.
Caruba is an Israel Firster.
Pollard is fortunate to have received life as a sentence treasonous activities such as the Rosenbergs years ago were given the death penalty.
It is hard to believe that Caruba claims to be an American.
No, Mr. Pollard should have been hanged. However, he should spend the rest of his life rotting in jail. The only way I'd send him to Israel would be in small pieces in separate overnight packages.
Demands??????? Demand nothing...Since the 1930s, a preponderance of American traitors have been jews. It takes real real gall to have the arrogance to demand anything. A traitor is a traitor. Hang him now and high.
I think you're on to something.
There's a story of a Jew whom the Romans decided to feed to the lions.
Any Jews who were fed to the lions (other than those converted to Christianity) were criminals.
And there's no such building as "Coliseum."
"What Pollard did, in essence, was to provide Israeli intelligence with information being denied to them by the United States; information that was critical to their ability to defend themselves against the same Arab nations that have repeatedly attacked them. Nations that call for their destruction."
When considering the Pollard case combined with the fact that many of Arafat's PLO/PA 'policemen' are CIA-trained assassins, one has to wonder the U.S. is actually an ally of Isreal. Surely the fact that the U.S.S. Liberty was routing tactical information to Egypt, in the middle of a war against Isreal, strengthens such suspicions.
I see the bile-spitters have gathered 'round. They throw the word "Treason" around lightly. If a proper respect were to be given the Constitution among 'em, they're mindless hatred might be the less and their wisdom the more.
Without a war declared, there is no treason.
Caruba neglects to mention that the selfless Mr. Pollard was only willing to impart the information he stole in exchange for cold hard cash.
Caruba's argument is this: although Pollard is an American citizen who held a job as a military intelligence officer he had a right to (a) stand as a godlike judge over the US and dictate to America what exactly its national security policy should be; (b) demonstrate more loyalty to a foreign country than to the US; (c) disobey his chain of command despite the oath he swore as an officer of the US military; (d) get paid for his treason, dishonesty, hubris, ingratitude and total lack of honor and decency.
American Jews cannot argue that Israel does not create a dual loyalty in them and in the same breath claim that Pollard should not have been punished for his dual loyalty.
Pollard should have been hung - as it stands he should die in his cell.
He was an American who violated his oath and betrayed his country.He can be freed when he is cold,stiff and in a box,same as John Gotti will leave.It's funny that this screed you posted mentioned the Warsaw Ghetto uprising,every time I see film footage from Israel now it reminds me of that uprising.
OED. high treason - Violation by a subject or citizen of his allegiance to his sovereign or to his government.
War or peace has absolutely nothing to do with whether the weasel Pollard was a treasonous traitor. He was and is, by any definition which is not invented and self-serving.
Pollard's sentence was clearly meant to send a message to Israel to knock off the spying. He was made an example.
No matter how you look at it, it was a very stupid move by the Mossad to risk pissing off their only friend. I wonder if such intelligence gathering missions have been scaled back in the aftermath. I hope so.
No. A thousand times No.
I am sympathetic to Israel but we cannot reward treachery.
If we let Pollard go we may as well declassify everything for we will have made it far easier for people to make the decision to betray.
Surely the fact that the U.S.S. Liberty was routing tactical information to Egypt, in the middle of a war against Isreal, strengthens such suspicions.
First of all, Israel wouldn't be able to stay afloat if the US didn't subsidize its defense to the tune of $3 billion annually of my and other taxpayers' hard-earned money. Thank goodness not all Israelis have this supremely ungrateful attitude toward the US.
Your lie about the USS Liberty is not a "fact" - i.e. no one has ever substantiated this oft-repeated fiction, especially not the one source which would be able to: the IDF.
The US has gone to the wall for Israel again and again - only to be repaid with US technology confronting us in the hardware of the PRC. The US has been extremely tolerant of Israel's excesses, understanding the extreme circumstances in which Israel finds itself.
Attitudes like yours strain that forbearance to its breaking point.
What part of "We the People" do you not understand?
You quote from the monarchist's dictionary, and we are free men, not royal subjects.
Surely the fact that the U.S.S. Liberty was routing tactical information to Egypt, in the middle of a war against Isreal, strengthens such suspicions.
So is that why Israel deliberately attacked it and tried to sink it?
Thanks for setting the record straight, Romulus.
This supposedly "historical" anecdote is about as honest and insightful as the rest of this miserable article.
And if he passed the same secrets to Canada, woould you be so frothing at the mouth with a noose in your hand?
FYI
awake...There is one thing that stands between Israel and it being thrown into the Mediterranean by the Arabs. That is the U.S. They have had their hands in the U.S. treasury for so long that they believe it to be a birthright. When the day of reckoning arrives, and it will, these same people will DEMAND that we send our military to save Israel.
YES !!!!!!!! DD
The Jews of Israel have had to fight, first to dislodge the British who regarded Palestine, the ancient Roman name given to Israel in a vain effort to erase its rightful name from history, as a protectorate. After World War II, the British Empire went into decline and, in one of the great miracles of modern times, the ancient nation of Israel was reborn in the wake of the outright murder of six million Jews by the Nazis. When its independence was declared and surrounding Arab nations attacked, there were those who yelled, "Jews, fight fair!" *************
The British conquered Palestine when General Lord Allenby defeated the Turks.After World War 2 the British,America's ally in the Cold War,were the targets of terrorist attacks by the Zionists and were targeted for boycotts outside the protectorate.The name by which it was known for the longest time was Palestine (1900 years),what is meant by 'rightful name',who determines that? Oh,BTW,the British Empire was already in decline after World War 1.In any event,the bastard traitor Pollard is where he belongs and will be 'returned to Israel,if that is his and his family's wish,when he is dead.It should not occur one day sooner.
Give the traitor eternal freedom by sending him to his maker.
You are the weakest link.
Section. 3.You provide the greater comfort to those afoul of the Constitution, and a traitor in that regard!Clause 1: Treason against the United States, shall consist only in levying War against them, or in adhering to their Enemies, giving them Aid and Comfort. No Person shall be convicted of Treason unless on the Testimony of two Witnesses to the same overt Act, or on Confession in open Court.
Delusional.
Your playing semantics with the word "treason".
OK. Fry him for "espionage" then!
Screw Jonathan Pollard!
I see that the USS Liberty has already been mentioned on this thread. I guess that means it's time for someone to bring up the ADL.
It is a honor for the US to so provide that support. A great honor.
Fools you are, those who think only the US keeps Israel from obliteration.
Israel will never be obliterated, but fools will be forgotten.
LOL, and thanks for the laugh!
That would stop that calls for his release.
However, I'll stick to the principle. He should not be released in whole....or in part.
Nice bait and switch, bvw - but let's remain on topic.
Well, we can't use Black's Law Dictionary, either, since its similarly tainted with English sources.
No, you like your sources to be true-blue American - the very opposite of your preferences in naval intelligence officers.
So we'll turn to the 100% all-American Hill Dictionary of Law. It states that treason is not simply traitorous talk, but:
Treason requires overt acts and includes the giving of government security secrets to other countries, even if friendly, when the information could harm American security.
Well, there you have it. Pollard is a treasoner any way you slice it, regardless of your dishonest cavilling.
bvw...You rant. You have no recourse. You know it so get over it. Hang Pollard.
And if he passed the same secrets to Canada, woould you be so frothing at the mouth with a noose in your hand?
But that information did get passed directly from the Israelis to the Russians.
Long may JP rot...and GWB sure as all hell ain't gonna' let him out.
The only act I respect Bubba for was his double crossing of Bibi on this matter.
The pack dogs are circling, cowards every one of 'em. They'd trounce the man in the pen already, an easy prey. Each one yelps for execution!
Why are they not gathered in Harlem with their nooses and frothings?
Yellow-bellied cowards.
You're aware that a significant body of Constitutional law has been established since 1789, I suppose.
This argument is tantamount to the gun-grabbing claim that firearms are only for individuals enlisted in government-sanctioned militias.
It's gratifying to see that your ideal of intellection is a gimmicky game show (moderated, I might add, by a fellow-countrywoman of the dictionary editors whose work you spurn).
It is often the case that private citizens who have ties to other countries feel strongly about them and try to influence American policy in ways that benefit the other country -- there's nothing wrong with that, it's a free country as they used to say, and you can advocate anything you please (short of inciting to riot I suppose). But, Pollard was not a private citizen, he was a naval intelligence officer and then a civilian employee. When Pollard accepted an office of profit and trust under th e Constitution of the United States, he took an oath to support and defend the Constitution of the United States. The United States, entrusting him with its secrets and paying him a salary, had every right to expect his undivided loyalty to the United States. If he felt he could not give that undivided loyalty to the United States, he could have resigned.
No, Pollard determined to spy for money, turning over secrets entrusted to him to a foreign power. It doesn't matter that it was friendly Israel, it could have as easily been China, Cuba or France. He betrayed the United States that trusted him. He received a lenient sentence: he is still alive. He and his supporters should be content with that. He should never see a day outside of his prison cell again.
The only part of you awake is deluded and mad.
bvw...Get a grip on yourself old man. I know the truth is a hard pill to swallow but give it a try. No matter how much you protest, no matter how you duck and dive, Pollard is a traitor and should hang.
I don't know of anyone in Harlem whose sold his country down the river in exchange for cash like the vile Pollard did.
"Yellow-bellied cowards"? As opposed to brave souls like yourself, I suppose.
When Pollard accepted an office of profit and trust under th e Constitution of the United States, he took an oath to support and defend the Constitution of the United States. The United States, entrusting him with its secrets and paying him a salary, had every right to expect his undivided loyalty to the United States. If he felt he could not give that undivided loyalty to the United States, he could have resigned.
I agree with that. But his sentence has been served and it was harsher than others of the same type of crime.
Clinton's in Harlem these days, wide awake one.
Let Pollard rot in prison. He did more willful damage to the United States than perhaps any other person that has ever lived.
It is not just that he was a spy for Israel alone. Israel sells secret info about the United States to the highest bidders (or to whatever country will give Israel the best deal).
Well-reasoned and intelligent response, bvw.
Because I actually cite a proper legal dictionary for the definition of the word you are reinventing from moment to moment, I'm mad? Fascinating theory.
You starting out shilling for a traitor and soon realized that you're way out of your depth. No shame in just admitting it.
Casting around baseless insults is the least graceful way of conceding that you've lost the argument.
The pack dogs are circling, cowards every one of 'em
Pollard and his groupies are the true cowards. Instead of renoucing their American citizenship and going over to Israel to enlist in the IDF, Pollard, stabbed his legal country of citizenship in the back, for cold hard $.
Then this punk snivels about the consequences for his actions and whines about inhumane conditions in solitary.
Let this traitor out into the general population of the prison he contaminates. He'll run back to solitary in the wink of an eye!
Point taken. I was thinking of people who actually live there, not those who show up for an occasional press junket.
But yes, Clinton is indeed a traitor and he does spend some time in Harlem. I wish the DOJ was as zealous in pursuing his crimes as well as it pursued Pollard's - but just because Clinton is as guilty as sin doesn't mean Pollard should get off.
I'm sure there are murderers walking around in the US now who've escaped the law - but I don't feel that the murderers who are actually doing time are being treated unfairly and should be released. Quite the contrary.
The pack dogs are circling, cowards every one of 'em. They'd trounce the man in the pen already, an easy prey. Each one yelps for execution!
Sometimes the pack dogs are right in thrashing the skunk.
Perhaps one day the CO's will let the skunk out of his cage, and into the yard (so to speak), long enough to play with the dogs.
But his sentence has been served and it was harsher than others of the same type of crime.
No, the sentence has not been served -- it was life without parole. It may or may not be harsher than most for the crime, but under the governing statute it was within the permitted range of sentences for the crime. The short answer is Pollard knew the risk he was taking committing espionage, he bet that he wouldn't get caught and lost, he bet that he wouldn't get the harshest possible sentence and he lost. He cut a deal to protect his wife. Sometimes, adults have to accept responsibility for their actions and live with the consequences of the free choices they have made. This is one of them. Pollard should never emerge from prison alive.
The Federal beast has grown in every aspect since 1796, both good, weakening and rotten. Among those weak and rooten ways is in the "liberal" misunderstanding of founding terms of law. We have Wars without declaration -- military actions without letter of Mark or Reprisal. We have treason treated lightly and "Federal" crimes invented without Constitutional grounding.
Yes, there are people out there who would demand that my sons be sent to die for the socialist State of Israel in case it ever got into real trouble.
Israel's been bleeding my paycheck for years - why not my family?
This supposedly "historical" anecdote is about as honest and insightful as the rest of this miserable article.****************
Bump!
I can't agree more. The I's continue to display a real arrogance. They take the billions for granted while we get nothing in return. Yes - yes they remind us that they are our only true friend in the region - but most of the hatred directed at the U.S. from the region is the result of the relationship with the I's. So its all circular.
Granted. But the purpose of a law against treason is to prevent American citizens from committing acts which place America in danger.
The most obvious breaches of the law occur when Americans pass military intelligence to declared enemies during times of hostility.
But giving anyone military secrets at anytime could easily result in danger to the US.
Pollard didn't give a damn about America's security, but sold secrets he had sworn to keep in exchange for cash. Why should America give a damn about him or his opinion of what a proper punishment is? He certainly disregarded America's safety and America's opinion about what proper security precautions were.
Let him rot.
awake...Not that bvw would give one whipstitch about them, but I also would have liked to have seen, Walker and Hanssen, walk the plank instead of life. When the Israeli apoligists here start whiningg for their release, I will give further study about Pollard. Until then, somehow I do not think their interest is strictly humanitarian.
"Surely the fact that the U.S.S. Liberty was routing tactical information to Egypt, in the middle of a war against Isreal, strengthens such suspicions. So is that why Israel deliberately attacked it and tried to sink it?"
Appearantly so, what else were they going to do? Jonathan Pollard's 'crime' of passing on 'sensitive' information concerning the PLO is equally justifiable.
He did more willful damage to the United States than perhaps any other person that has ever lived.
I should know more about this, but haven't looked at it closely ... what did he give up? I know about the Walkers and Hanssen ... thanks ...
First of all, even if your unsubstantiated lies about the USS Liberty were truth instead of fantasy, two wrongs still wouldn't add up to right.
Your moral reasoning is as flawed as your history.
In Benedict Arnold's case, we were at war and he switched sides mid-war. His was an act of Treason.
Pollard sold secrets to our allies who -- as he understood -- were due them. That is an act of insubordination, accepting bribes and theft, but not treason. It was a grevious act and led to harm; a harsh sentence was called for.
He has served a harsh sentence -- years in solitary -- no cake-walk.
Eric Margolis - Jonathan Pollard Was No Jewish Patriot
According to CIA sources, Pollard provided Israeli intelligence with names of important American agents inside the former Soviet Union and Russia who had supplied information on East Bloc weapons and war plans. How the agent's names were linked to the secrets they supplied - a major breach of basic intelligence security - remains a major mystery. Some of the enormously sensitive secrets stolen by Pollard were reportedly either sold, or bartered, by Israel to the Soviet Union.
A number of key CIA agents in the East Bloc were reportedly executed as a result of Pollard spying. KGB likely gained access to top-secret US codes - either directly from Israel, or through spies in Israel's government. In short, Pollard's treachery caused one of the worst security disasters in modern American history...
Pollard is no Jewish patriot. He is a grubby little traitor who sold out his country, and fellow intelligence officers, for money, then claimed he was being persecuted by anti-Semites.
Victim he is not. To the contrary, Pollard is a poster boy for anti-Semitism. His treason exposes all American Jews to hate, and accusations of doubtful loyalty.
Jonathan Pollard is a Judas - not a second Dreyfus - and should stay in prison.
Pollard caused enormous damage to US national security. He gave Israel top secret US military, intelligence, and diplomatic codes; names of nearly one hundred of US agents in the Mideast, who were then 'turned' by Israel; NSA code- breaking techniques and targets; intercepts of foreign communications; and US war-fighting plans for the Mideast.
So, every intelligence officer (and every military officer more generally) is free to execute his own foreign policy, based on what he "thinks" our allies are "due?"
I suppose that you would be fine with passing sensitive intelligence data to our allies and clients in Saudi Arabia, Pakistan and Egypt as well. After all, they're entitled.
And if he passed the same secrets to Canada, woould you be so frothing at the mouth with a noose in your hand?
I'm not screaming for his head on a platter or anything, but I don't give a flying &%$# who he was passing secrets to. While he's not a traitor in the legal sense of the word (just like a lot of crazy people aren't considered "insane"), he is definitely a traitor in the popular sense of the word. This pompous jerk betrayed his country (the U.S.), by selling secrets to a foreign country (Israel). Israel is a foreign country.
I don't know if the nature of these secrets have been made public, but the severity of the sentence leads me to believe that it was pretty heavy duty stuff.
I think he should (and will) spend the rest of his life in prison-in the UNITED STATES. I don't want to kill him, but I wouldn't mind personally smacking him around a few times for his presumptuous arrogance and his disloyalty.
You can whine all you want to, but the facts in Pollard's case haven't changed. The facts are that he was duly tried, convicted, and sentenced under the law, and that's all there is to it. Not fair? I don't see how it isn't fair. What isn't fair is that Pollard betrayed his country and mine, and did untold damage to U.S. security. Why anyone would want so badly for him to be transferred to the country that benefitted from his betrayal is beyond me. There's something mighty fishy about that. These people have their priorities mixed up, if you ask me. There is no middle ground when it comes to national security. If you're an American citizen, the U.S. must come before any other country in the world, no matter what your country of birth or ethnic heritage.
So keep dreaming if you want to, but that boy ain't going anywhere. It will never happen. He will spend the rest of his life in the good ol' U.S. of A.
Its time to line Jonathan Pollard up against the wall with a blindfold and a cigarette. Put the Walker ring up there beside him.
"Pollard sold secrets to our allies who -- as he understood -- were due them. That is an act of insubordination, accepting bribes and theft, but not treason. It was a grevious act and led to harm; a harsh sentence was called for. He has served a harsh sentence -- years in solitary -- no cake-walk."
Compared to the treason which was committed during the Clinton administration,..............the acts of Pollard are morally miniscule & his continued incarceration is an expression of anti-Jewish bigotry.
Insubordination???? Surely Sir..You jest. Free use of the English language does not give one licence to rewrite the law on their own terms.
I agree that Pollard is a traitor, but hanging him would be extreme. First off, when was the last time we hanged a traitor? Hansen caused far greater harm to the US, yet we are not hanging him.
Secondly, we are on very friendly terms with Israel, so spying by them (while stupid) is not in the same league as spying by the Chinese. Even if he did work for an enemy, we probably would have done a spy swap by now.
All that said, I wouldn't let him out of jail until the Mossad commits to severly limiting its activities in this country. I'm afraid that one more big incident will put the 4 billion provided to Israel at risk. Israel needs to treat the USA like the friend that it is, even if we don't always provide them with classified information (that perhaps we should).
A number of key CIA agents in the East Bloc were reportedly executed as a result of Pollard spying. KGB likely gained access to top-secret US codes - either directly from Israel, or through spies in Israel's government.
Star chamber kangaroo court words: "reportedly", "likely".
We have rogue, unaccountable, black, un-constitutional agencies putting folks at risk and in star chamber hearings anyone can be blamed for our allowing this bastard business to continue.
his continued incarceration is an expression of anti-Jewish bigotry
I was wondering how long it would take you to get there.
"...He is the only person ever to be so severely punished for spying on behalf of an American ally."
What the hell was "an American ALLY" (read Israel) doing spying on her Ally (read America)?
Compared to the treason which was committed during the Clinton administration,..............the acts of Pollard are morally miniscule & his continued incarceration is an expression of anti-Jewish bigotry.
Accusing anyone who supports his continued incarceration as being an anti-Jewish bigot makes you sound just like Seinfeld's uncle on the TV show, and just as ridiculous. The acts of Jonathan Pollard got him duly tried, convicted and sentenced under the law, and his continued incarceration is an expression of AMERICAN JUSTICE! His release would constitute a travesty of that justice that is designed to protect you and me. Lobbying for his release is an expression of anti-American bigotry. Surely you can find a better martyr than this LOSER.
anyone can be blamed for our allowing this bastard business to continue
Pollard took a job with a "star-chamber agency," accepted his paycheck from that "star-chamber agency," then accepted $4.5 million from another country's "star-chamber agency" to provide information he had sworn not to disclose.
He chose his actions at every stage. He's a dirty, money-grubbing traitor, period.
Storm...There is no wiggle room. In the past, compatriots of mine in the intelligence field, died without any notice or honor. Here we have an insider that betrayed, from within, for money, he should have been hung, same as the Walkers, Hannsen and others. There is NO extenuating circumstance, none, ever.
throw away the key,and keep him in jail for life!
As a former Naval Officer I am intimate with the details of this case as we use it often for security training. (He's right up there with the Walker clan.)
It is not up to the individual to decide who they think should have clearance and need to know as regards classified materials and information.
IMO: Pollard should rot in jail simply because as a trusted guardan of national secrets he took it upon himself to decide to disseminate that information against classification, safekeeping, and handling regulations. The fact that Israel is supposed to be a 'friend' has no bearing on this case nor does it mitigate his crimes in the slightest.
Correction, Pollard got $50,000 not $4.5 million. Was thinking of another traitor.
Caruba's kidding, right?
Every time a person of Jewish descent is prosecuted it is not Anti-Semetic, just as every prosecustion of a person of color is not Anti-African American ...
Treason is an act of betrayal in time of conflict, so this hardly qualifies. Part of the reason behind his lengthy sentance were the multiple counts and time duration of his treachery. Just as a serial rapist can be given life without parole in lieu of a ludicrous sentence (400 years etc.) so can anyone who commits any other crime.
He knew the rules and he broke them intentionally: end of story.
The point is, NONE of those others were hanged.
However, I do wonder why so many supporters of Israel rally to his side as aggressively as they do. He is NOT a paragon of virtue!
If an Israeli citizen was incarcerated in Israel for spying for the US, I wouldn't give a damn if they let him rot for all time. A traitor is a traitor... I wouldn't respect traitors that benefit us any more than ones that don't. I just don't get the support he receives at all and I don't think it helps US - Israeli relations one bit.
I see that the USS Liberty has already been mentioned on this thread. I guess that means it's time for someone to bring up the ADL.
Yes it was, by the Israel-First side.
Compared to the treason which was committed during the Clinton administration,..............the acts of Pollard are morally miniscule & his continued incarceration is an expression of anti-Jewish bigotry.
Why is Pollard's religion such an important component to you? Would his acts have been morally massive if he were Buddhist? If you can't do the time, don't do the crime.
Jonathan Pollard is a treasonous, double-crossing, compromised pile of fecal matter who's sell out is reputed to have been directly responsible for deaths of US agents whose cover was blown. This is according to numerous officials in the US intelligence community. This is fact. There is no excuse for it. He is lucky to still be breathing. Anyone who defends this piece of detritus is a complete idiot, or thinks anything done for "the cause" is OK.
The only thing wrong with the Traitor Pollard being in jail for life is that the Traitors Klinton aren't in there with him for the same sentence minimum.
stolar...My intent perhaps was not clear, hang Pollard, Walkers, Hanssen and whomever else is hanging around. Spying is a dirty business, for whatever reason or cause,anyone in that arena is aware of the penalties.
Our secrets are the property of our allies ? Really ?
I think if you'd bother to ask, you'd find the US is selective about sharing. And so is every other country.
From the Margolis Article:
With remarkable chutzpah, Israel, which receives $4-5 billion in US aid annually, refuses to return documents stolen by Pollard, or allow US intelligence to debrief Mossad agents who ran Pollard in order to learn the full extent of the disaster. .
DUE TO ISRAELI REFUSAL TO HAND OVER THE STOLEN DOCUMENTS OR ALLOW US TO DEBRIEF TO MOSSAD AGENTS WHO "CONTROLLED" POLLARD, IT IS STILL UNKNOWN AS TO WHAT THE FULL EXTENT OF THIS TRAITOR'S DAMGAGE IS.
"Lobbying for his release is an expression of anti-American bigotry. Surely you can find a better martyr than this ....."
Disproportionate 'justice' is anti-American & a sign of Anti-Jewish bias despensed by a politically motivated government..................
"Lobbying for his release is an expression of anti-American bigotry. Surely you can find a better martyr than this ....."
Disproportionate 'justice' is anti-American & a sign of Anti-Jewish bias despensed by a politically motivated government..................
Disproportionate 'justice' is anti-American & a sign of Anti-Jewish bias despensed by a politically motivated government..................
Reagan, Bush Sr., Clinton and Bush Jr., have all been President since this jerk got his hand caught in the secrets cookie-jar. All have had the opportunity to pardon him.
Are you seriously going to tell be all 4 are anti-semitic?
Yes, the refusal of their government to come clean is what's really telling for a so-called "ally." People were killed by his actions, just like Hanssen and Ames, so he's lucky to have a life sentence. Do you think the Walkers, Hanssen and Ames can claim some kind of racial prejudice 10 years down the road?
I'm a big Buffalo Bills fan. I hope every year they will finally win the Super Bowl.
Last year, one of my favorite players, Doug Flutie, was traded to the San Diego Chargers.
Flutie is now a paid player for the San Diego Chargers. This year the Bills will play the San Diego Chargers. Even though I want the Bills to win every game, and I have a high admiration for Flutie, I would find him the scum of the earth if he gave the Bills the Chargers game plan in exchange for a few shekels and a misplaced sense of loyalty.
It's the same thing here. Pollard is scum!
Every "secret" is a liability and risk to liberty. It's only "secret", if We, the People, don't know it.
Some secrets are necessary for the military and diplomats. The fewer the better, as each is costly to acquire and keep and -- as I said -- poisonous to liberty.
Our true national strength is in our American openess. We are not good secret-keepers, nor should we be -- every secret is a burden, every secret held by a man makes him liable to compromise for the sake of keeping it.
Any Federal organization or agency that encultures secrets is a risk to liberty and tax dollars for the sake of the burden of those secrets, and the culture of unaccountability it engenders.
The real and large risk to liberty is why we must understand the diference between peace and war. We have different rules for war, they are necessitated by the greater danger of that war. Those stricter rules, the secrecy, the spying, the deceits, the obscuring, the harsh accounts, are only part of war.
We are not at war.
And I love liberty. We used to be a nation that loved liberty.
Although War's great necessities mean we are not free during war, we must respect liberty enough again to love Peace.
I agree!!
Oh wait, I thought you said: "It's Time To Fry Jonathan Pollard."
Never mind.
Keep Pollard in jail. He is lucky he was not executed, the Rosenbergs were executed in the 50's for spying and giving secrets to Russia and probably Israel.
Israel is not an ally of the US people, they are disgracing the US Govt before the whole world as it correctly sees that the US is the chief aid sponsor of Israel's crimes against humanity it is inflicting almost daily now.
We should stop the military aid and $3 Billion yearly give away to Israel and cancel the joint Arrow Ballistic missile project which Israel will only alter to accomodate nuclear warheads and then aim them at any armed forces in the region, including those of the USA. Remember the USS Liberty.
Ariel Sharon is even now charged in a Belgian Court with war crimes in the massacre of around 3,000 civilians in the Sabra and Shatila refugee camps in 1982, after Israel occupied West Beirut, something it had promised the USA not
to do.
Sharon was subsequently found responsible by the Israeli cabinet meeting of Sept. 16, 1982 and therefore dismissed as Defense Minister of Israel.
It is now a matter of Infamy that Sharon has been elected by the citizens of Israel to imposed the "final solution" upon the Palestian population, as of now he useing the daily peacemeal solution, and in an attempt to beg for more U S Aid the Israeli Army command now reports it may take up until the year 2006 to accomplish this solution. Useing the year 2006, this seems a little far-fetched, but it is also an appeal for more aid to Irael from world-wide Jews- or Christians who have been deceived enough to contribute, as well as, of course, the #1 contributor- the good old USA taxpayers Treasurey.
I agree with your sentiment. Secrecy is poison to a democracy. How can we the voters make informed decisions if we are misinformed?
However, your assumptions of an anti-Jewish bias behind the viewpoints of the posters here does not reflect well on you. For some the betrayal of their country is a very serious matter. Go back and read the threads on Hansen and you will see the same type of posts. There may well be a few true bigots on the thread but you end up being a bigot yourself by assuming that all those that disagree with you (and Israel) are anti-Semites....that my friend is prejudice. You end up hurting your cause when you unfairly attack the many for the beliefs of a few.
And considering that we the taxpayers of the US pay 4 billion to Israel a year, we have a stake and some right to make judgements on its actions (IE its spying on us). Don't like that, then don't take the money.
Sorry. I just managed to do the same thing to you that I was talking about. I was reading these posts so quickly I got blurry eyed. My comments about assuming anti-Jewish bias should have been directed at the messianic-Zionist guy not you. Sorry. But that guy does seem to have a serious chip on his shoulder...looking for anti-zionism EVERYWHERE.
I think he is in a lockup for sexual predators.
The game is that the prison gets more $$$ for the predators, as opposed to run-of-the-mill federal prisoners.
I think not then-Senator Hillary interfered with Pollard being sent to a real prison, (and the general population) when the prison officials tried to trade Pollard for a sexual predator. Never mind the prison Pollard is in is both chartered and set up to handle the sexual predators.
The pack dogs are circling, cowards every one of 'em. They'd trounce the man in the pen already, an easy prey. Each one yelps for execution! Why are they not gathered in Harlem with their nooses and frothings? Yellow-bellied cowards.
I think you are pretty well self-describing your fellow Jews who are all for ethnic cleansing in Palestine-a nation of people who are for the most part unarmed and defenseless against a modern occupying military power such as Israel.
After they finish off the Palestinians they will likely get to Harlem next, and when they get brave enough to take the hoods off there will likely be a dinky little skull cap underneath.
Ironic isn't it- in the Jewish produced clips for years they have shown the Germans calling them "varmits"..now Americans in turn see themselves referred to as "dogs" because they think a Jew got what he deserved for spying and treason.
I have paid my dues to this nation, I owe allegiance to only one nation - the USA, not Israel, not UK, not Albania, not Nato, not the UN.
"It's the same thing here. Pollard is scum!"...........IN YOUR OPINION.
Since ALL born-again Christians have primary allegiance to 'The King of the Jews' does that make us all scum as well? Since the Bible tells us that G_d himself is behind the movement to restore His Chosen People to their ancient homeland, are we 'scum' because we will oppose our government as it attempts to pursue policies which are in opposition to our God?............
Christians of today must stand with the Jews in the United States as some of them did during the rise of NAZIism.
Bombs and machines guns do not the defenseless make.
It wasn't that long ago that Israel's militias armed with single shot ancient long guns were fighting the combined Arab armies.
Who's not standing with Israel? Just because posters on this thread think Pollard should be punished for being a traitor doesn't mean that they don't support Israel. Israel was wrong to spy on their only friend, it was stupid and they should be called on it. But that doesn't mean that they should not be supported if all Hell breaks loose in the region. Criticism does not equal hatred. It can be constructive.
Since ALL born-again Christians have primary allegiance to 'The King of the Jews' does that make us all scum as well?
Of course not. Jesus was indeed the 'King of the Jews'.
It's just that some of you people carry support for all things Jewish to include unsavory types like Judas Iscariot and Jonathan Pollard.
"Of course not. Jesus was indeed the 'King of the Jews'."
NOT QUITE, Jesus IS TO BE the King of the Jews,..........and the formation of that kingdom on earth will be His Millenial reign as the Jewish Messiah. (The Zionist movement is motivated by G_D regardless of human failing)
As time goes on the Bible-believing Jews will begin to understand the duality of Biblical prophecy. A portion of their confusion as to His identity during the period of His ministry has to do with many prophesies which are soon to be fulfilled. The true 'Born-Again' followers of Jesus Christ will support the believing Jewish people during the difficult period ahead. The 'false' Christians will ally themselves with the Vatican and the other enemies of 'His Brethern', the Jews.
"Criticism does not equal hatred. It can be constructive."
TRUE, if it is ethically & logically defensible............
In this case, Pollard has served his time by any standard & now it is time to cut him loose.
The Vatican is the enemy of the Jews? Thats news to me and I'm sure to the Vatican as well. Got a little info for you, Jesus told Peter to found his church, and that church was the Catholic church. Don't bother responding ... I won't be reading it. I've read enough from "REAL" bigots today to last me a lifetime.
The scumbag took our secrets, that we paid for with our tax dollars, and we are NOT entitled to see because after all we are not to be trusted - and gave them to a FOREIGN power. To hell with him.
Disproportionate 'justice' is anti-American & a sign of Anti-Jewish bias despensed by a politically motivated government..................
I just replied to a poster on another thread who thinks it's OK for teachers and teenage students to have sex with each other that he won the Free Republic Dumb Idea of the Day Award. After reading your post, I now realize that I acted too hastily--the day's not over yet, obviously.
'Disproportionate' is in the eye of the beholder, apparently. In your case, selling out one's country (the U.S.-that's you and me) to benefit Israel (a foreign country--I only spell it out because you seem to be confused in your mind as to which is which) is not worth a life sentence in an American prison. In your case, I'm quite sure, it isn't worthy of jailtime at all; indeed, in your case, it probably isn't even a crime, but worthy of a medal of some sort.
Your screen name can leave no one in any doubt as to which side your bread's buttered on, which is a good thing, since I don't like ambiguity, either. So let me be perfectly unambiguous with you. No matter what you think, no matter how many times you cry "Wolf!" ("anti-Jewish"), no matter what you want, no matter what you wish would happen, the facts are these: Jonathan Pollard is a convicted criminal. He betrayed his country (the U.S.-just to keep you straight). He will spend the rest of his life in an American prison. He will never see the country that encouraged and benefitted from his treachery for as long as he lives. Those facts will not change. Everything else is totally irrelevant. If you can't live with those unalterable facts, well, then...too bad.
In this case, Pollard has served his time by any standard & now it is time to cut him loose.
No, he hasn't served his time "by any standard". His sentence is LIFE in prison with NO possibility of parole. His sentence ends when his life ends. So, there's really only one way to shorten his sentence.
Pollard is as much a traitor as the Jews who turned other Jews over to the Nazis.
When someone sells out the Iraeli secrets to another country, are they set free or tried and sentenced?
You can't be a citizen here, yet loyal to another country, period. If you are, then you lied under oath at some point.
If you were to do the things Pollard did, I would also wish for the same sentence for you .
wimpy..Very well said...Amen brother
When the Arabs rise to throw Israel into the sea, who will it be that they look to for succor? China? Russia?.. We are called dogs and other unkind names because to us a traitor is a traitor, regardless of the stripe he may carry. When the time comes, we will be excoriated if we hesitate to rush to the aid of Israel, by these same people that call us curs.
"No, he hasn't served his time "by any standard". His sentence is LIFE in prison with NO possibility of parole. His sentence ends when his life ends. So, there's really only one way to shorten his sentence."
Exactly, he recieved a disproportionally stiff sentence, which deserves to be suspended.
The 'false' Christians will ally themselves with the Vatican
Finally, a window into your sick little world. You're a moronic bigot.
Thank goodness not all Protestant and Jews share your evil mentality.
Bump.
Without a war declared, there is no treason.
what is ,is ? typ. leftest B.S.
Just the Constitution. Perhaps you are unfamiliar with it? Free men should hold it dear.
Main Entry: trea·son Pronunciation: 'trE-z&n Function: noun Etymology: Middle English tresoun, from Old French traison, from Latin tradition-, traditio act of handing over, from tradere to hand over, betray -- more at TRAITOR Date: 13th century 1 : the betrayal of a trust : TREACHERY 2 : the offense of attempting by overt acts to overthrow the government of the state to which the offender owes allegiance or to kill or personally injure the sovereign or the sovereign's family
read and learn if you want to keep your "freedom".
What is most disturbing is the fact that Pollard was not alone. There are apparently, Mossad agents within the intelligence community of US government. This was brought out at the time. Pollard never told who else was there working with him.
He is lucky USA is not like Israel otherwise he would be tortured for the information.
Treason against the United States, shall consist only in levying War against them, or in adhering to their Enemies, giving them Aid and Comfort.
Pollard did not levy war against the US. The US has no offfically declared enemies now, as far as I know, and certainly Israel has never been one. Therefore Pollard can not have given an Enemy aid and comfort.
That's just the Constitution ... means something to me, but evidently many want ignore it, to forget it, to scoff at it.
Pollard is no traitor.
Does that mean we don't have to continue giving $3billion in aid?
I always thought some Jews will always consider themselves Jews above everything. But is Pollard really using this as a defense? I guess I'm naive but why would our "friends" go to this length?
That's up to your Representative and Senator. Vote in ones who won't, that's your choice as a free citizen.
Personally I'm ambivalent about the "aid". It has a lot of baggage, and Israel may not be helped so much as hobbled with it. It may have far more benefit for the US than Israel, being at least a "buy-in" in that region.
is Pollard really using this as a defense?
Not that I'm aware of, but his defenders are. They justify his actions because he felt loyalty to Israel. Unfortunately, carried to its logical conclusion, this would mean that in any conflict or disagreement between the US and Israel, Jewish Americans serving in positions of trust could not be trusted.
I don't believe this, but it is the inevitable conclusion to be drawn if you agree with the author of the article.
"Not that I'm aware of, but his defenders are. They justify his actions because he felt loyalty to Israel. Unfortunately, carried to its logical conclusion, this would mean that in any conflict or disagreement between the US and Israel, Jewish Americans serving in positions of trust could not be trusted."
OF COURSE,........ all true Born-Again Christians & Jews are expected (by the author of the Bible) to support the Chosen People in such a situation. .........and He will say in that day, "as you have done it unto the least of these MY BRETHERN you have done it unto me"
"In his book, The Hunting Horse (Prometheus Books, published in 2000), author Eliot Goldberg points out that, in 1983, President Reagan had signed an agreement with Israel for the bilateral exchange of information. It was the same kind of information that Pollard felt compelled to provide Israel. As an intelligence expert, he knew it was being deliberately and knowingly denied."
So the UNITED STATES GOVERNMENT was actually screwing Isreal over, and Pollard leaked promised information? And angered some of the anti-Jewish people in the UNITED STATES GOVERNMENT as a result? And consequently he has been given a disproportionatly stringent sentence? NO, never in AMERICA!
Okey-dokey. Then born-again Christians and Jews should be excluded from sensitive positions in our government. Their "higher allegiance" may be proper under God's law, but not under that of the United States.
BTW, doesn't the same God have negative comments about lying, stealing and betraying those who trust you? Surely a tru born-again Christian would resign his position if his religious beliefs came into conflict with his duties. He wouldn't stay in his position and use it to betray his country.
Just out of curiosity, why is that you (Starmaker) only post aritcles and never respond to people when they have a problem with said article? Please, fill us all in.
"Okey-dokey. Then born-again Christians and Jews should be excluded from sensitive positions in our government."
Well, maybe 'our government' no longer serves the will of the majority of the voters...............and is no longer 'OUR GOVERNMENT'?
Maybe the USA really is no longer 'one nation UNDER GOD'. It is clear from the Bible that it is the will and purpose of the only true God to restore the Jewish people to their ancient homeland..................
(and we have sworn our allegience to Him above any national identity)
Fine. I respect your right to believe that. Just don't sneak into a position of trust and then misuse that trust so you can be true to your beliefs. That's exactly what the Communist spies during the 40s and 50s did. They also believed that they were doing the right thing, working for the future good of humanity.
"Fine. I respect your right to believe that. Just don't sneak into a position of trust and then misuse that trust so you can be true to your beliefs.".................
SINCE THIS COUNTRY WAS PREDOMINATELY FOUNDED BY BELIEVERS IN THE GOD OF ISREAL, ..........just exactly which group has 'snuck' into positions of responsibility? If anyone thinks people in government do not use their 'positions of trust' to further their belief system they haven't been watching the 'enlightend ones' down at the Council on Foreign Relations very closely.
Please show me the Biblical quotation that justifies you in lying, cheating and stealing if your opponents do the same.
Bump
havn't a clue from what part of the constitution you grabed that supposed quote from,but even your quote says nothing about "officially" declared enemy. an enemy is;
Main Entry: en·e·my Pronunciation: 'e-n&-mE Function: noun Inflected Form(s): plural -mies Etymology: Middle English enemi, from Old French, from Latin inimicus, from in- 1in- + amicus friend -- more at AMIABLE Date: 13th century 1 : one that is antagonistic to another; especially : one seeking to injure, overthrow, or confound an opponent 2 : something harmful or deadly 3 a : a military adversary b : a hostile unit or force
why are you so hot to release this traitorous scum? i bet i know, in the name of justice.
havn't a clue
Tell you what. Print that out in 48 pt type bold, cut it out and tape it to your forehead. That'd be a great favor for everyone.
"why are you so hot to release this traitorous scum? i bet i know, in the name of justice.".................
That might be a good place to start. You see, there is this principle of 'equal treatment under the law', and maybe you've heard of all the communist spies that have recieved a 'slap on the wrist' by our government recently?
i'd rather tape it to your head, but i'm not about to look up your ass to find it.
what about the ones that have recieved harsh ( just) treatment. we are supposed to be talking about convicted traitors here, not those let off by the klintoon-istas.
Yep! Time to free the traitor so that he can be dealt with appropriately.
>i>...punished for spying on behalf of an American ally.
An American Ally? Gee, I must have missed the signing of the Alliance...
Hey mijo, get this: The US Constitution is widely available. It's found many times on the web. It's at your local library, at your local school, college and courthouse.
And you know what mijo? You know what?
I posted the pertainent section by its number above. You missed it.
Take your time mijo. Do some research and check your facts before you speak up to the whole dang world.
And you know what mijo? You know what?
your starting to studder, bub. calm down, take a deep breath, etc.. tomorrow the sun will rise.( even for the traitor " pollard" )
Treacherous disloyal Israeli spy against AMERICA, J. Pollard
How did the rally in Israel go that they held for Pollard?
"one has to wonder [?] the U.S. is actually an ally of Isreal"
Did you mean "why"? A lot of people are wondering that. Or did you mean "if"? It's always nice to see the gratitude the US gets for its $91+ billion and 50 years of diplomatic support.
I would think that a messianic zionist would spell the name of the country correctly. What would a messianic zionist be, btw?
The USS Liberty was brought up by "messianic zionist" in his foam-flecked rant. If you wish to add the ADL, feel free.
"IT IS STILL UNKNOWN AS TO WHAT THE FULL EXTENT OF THIS TRAITOR'S DAMGAGE IS."
It is known to have been extensive. Israel traded some of it to the USSR in exchange for a relaxed policy on refusniks. I have seen it asserted (but cannot remember the source) that this information included identities of some of our agents in Moscow. It was rated as our worst case of espionage (in terms of amount of material) at the time, although Hansen may have beaten that record.
"OF COURSE,........ all true Born-Again Christians & Jews are expected (by the author of the Bible) to support the Chosen People in such a situation."
Lion, is that you? You've got to be a put-on. .........
...a former navel intelligence officer, Jonathan Jay Pollard,...
No, he wasn't, but in case he was, it's time to free Pollard and...
1. Peel him.
2. Quarter him.
3. Leave him in the sun to become part of the trail mix.
Speak for yourself, Stolar. I don't support Israel--not until she straightens out her act. And just to make it completely clear: Israel is a foreign country like all others and I can make up my mind about her and express that opinion and those who don't like it...well, you get the idea.
Mijo, better drop the Constitutional argument. The kings of England had a long history of abusing people with charges of treason, so the FF made it very specific and hard to prove, as quoted. So you are right in principle and wrong on the details. Drop the details.
"When someone sells out the Iraeli secrets to another country, are they set free or tried and sentenced?"
The guy who told the world about the nuclear capacity Israel had been lying about for years (Vanunu?) was given life without parole in solitary where he sits even as we write. Why wasn't he executed? Because Israel "does not believe in capital punishment". What that means is they don't believe in bothering with trials before assassinating whomever they please (60 recently at last count).
Israel would not last six months if the US truly turned off the monetary and military faucet. Perhaps we could extend a no fly zone over all of Israel, punk a few dozen of your/our fighters and leave you to the whims of the Arabs. Face it, without the US wallet you're a group of convicted losers whose only ace in the hole is that you're fighting the only group on the planet that is a more screwed up group of losers than you are.
Jonathan Jay Pollard, was sentenced to life in prison without any chance of parole, for having passed classified information to the Israelis.
And the Israelis traded some of that classified information to the Soviets. Pollard new what he was doing. He is a traitor. He is U.S. citizen not an Israeli. Let him rot.
No, Pali boy, it means they tried him and found it was worthy of a life sentence, not death,
BTW, the soldiers that were caught and stomped to death with their guts hanging out in the Palestenian jail received no trial.
There is drool on the side of your mouth, your hatred for the Jews is showing.
Sounds like a squid round there. Ba-Pffft! Don't think that bullet quite reached the target. Probably jammed for the next round too.
There's only one possible response to your post and while I am not allowed to make it, you know what it is. Any oriface at all will do.
What Pollard did, in essence, was to provide Israeli intelligence with information being denied to them by the United States; information that was critical to their ability to defend themselves against the same Arab nations that have repeatedly attacked them. Nations that call for their destruction.
The United States is a close ally of Israel. If this were simply a matter of conscience, Mr. Pollard could have gone up his chain of command or appealed to the Judicial or Legislative branches for relief. Failing that, he could have resigned his position and emigrated to Israel. Instead he violated the law and passed sensitive and classified information to Israel. I agree the sentence is probably far too harsh and I utterly reject those haters of Israel who spew their vitriol and evil on this site. Nonetheless he broke the law and the government had every right to prosecute him for it. He was not exactly spying against Nazi Germany ...
Since the 1930s, a preponderance of American traitors have been jews.
Since the 1930s, a preponderance of haters of Jews have been Nazis. Do you know where they will stand in the Judgment ?
"FROM THE DESK OF:
CAPTAIN WILLIAM L. McGONAGLE, USN (RET.)
MEMBER, CMOH SOCIETY
October 24, 1998
AN OPEN LETTER TO PRESIDENT CLINTON
Re: Jonathan POLLARD
Please DO NOT release Jonathan POLLARD, a convicted traitor of the United States, to the Government of Israel, as part of the Middle East peace process, or for any other reason.
Please DO NOT release Jonathan POLLARD to the Government of Israel where he could continue to cause irreparable security harm to the United States of America.
Please DO NOT release Jonathan POLLARD to the Government of Israel until and unless the Government of Israel acknowledges, in writing and publicly, that the Government of Israel's armed forces (air and naval) deliberately attacked USS LIBERTY (AGTR-5) (A Technical Research Ship) on June 8, 1967.
Israeli aircraft conducted surveillance of the ship within moments of our arrival on station off the coast of the Sinai on the morning of June 8, 1967.
The ship was soon identified as USS LIBERTY by Israeli Naval Headquarters, by referring to "JANE'S FIGHTING SHIPS" 1966 OR 1967 issue, which showed a photograph of the ship and listed in detail its characteristics.
In fact, an identification "tower" was placed on their Battle Plot with an "A" on the tower to identify the ship as an American ship.
The plot was not kept up to date, and was removed when the watch changed at noon that day.
The ship was overflown on several occasions before the attack commenced.
An Israeli Naval Officer went to the American Embassy Naval Attache' to obtain information that the ship was indeed USS LIBERTY, but the US Naval Attache' did not have our operating schedule, so he could neither confirm or deny that the ship was the USS LIBERTY.
When the attack began about 2:00 p.m. (local time) the ship was subjected to relentless and repeated murderous fire from the attacking aircraft (which were unmarked - a violation of international law).
The gun crews of the two (2) bow .50 cal. machine guns were killed during the initial strike on the ship.
We could not man the starboard bridge level .50 cal. machine gun, because our life boat was burning (1) deck below and the heat did not allow anyone to approach the gun.
We could not man the port bridge level .50 cal. machine gun, because two (2) 55 gallon gasoline drums were burning furiously one (1) deck below.
Again the heat of the flames prevented anyone from approaching the gun.
WE WERE DEFENSELESS against the onslaught of eight (8) or more firing passes by at least four (4) aircraft, and the strafing and launching of five (5) torpedoes by three (3) motor torpedo boats.
That a larger number of casualties was not reported is a tribute to the fighting spirit of the officers, crew, civilians, and Marines, when they had nothing to defend themselves with, during our awesome hours of peril.
ADDITION BACKGROUND:
USS LIBERTY (AGTR-5), a Technical Research
ship was sailing legally and peacefully, in international waters in the
Eastern Mediterranean Sea, twelve and one-half (12.5) nautical miles from
the nearest land off the coast of Sinai, during the Arab-Israeli SIX Day
war, when it was attacked, without warning or provocation, by four (4)
unidentified jet fighter aircraft, firing rockets, machine guns, and napalm.
The ship was then strafed and torpedoed by three (3) Israeli motor torpedo boats.
One (1) torpedo exploded in the Research spaces of the ship, where it caused the majority of the fatalities.
The Government of Israel shortly after the attack acknowledged that their armed forces conducted the assault.
The apology for the attack was accepted, but the reason for the attack as "misidentification" was never accepted by the US Government.
Thirty-four (34) officers, sailors, a civilian, and a US Marine were killed or died of their wounds as a result of the attack.
One hundred seventy-one (171) additional crew members received wounds as a result of the attack.
The Government of Israel did compensate the families of those killed, the individuals that were wounded, and eventually paid reparations for the damage done to the ship and its equipment.
The ship remained afloat, in spite of the extensive hull damage from the torpedo explosion, and after hull repairs in Malta, the ship returned to Little Creek, VA, apparently to avoid undue publicity that the ship probably would have received had it returned to its home port of Norfolk, Virginia.
No high level Executive Branch members welcomed the ship home to the USA, as was the practice in later years, such as the Battleship IOWA, and other incidences.
Except for a few high ranking naval officers, no one has felt our pain of not knowing exactly why the ship was attacked.
Over thirty-one (31) years after the attack, the crew is entitled to know the details concerning the attack by the Government of Israel and also the details of the role the US Government in the entire affair.
Why were our aircraft recalled to their carriers on two (2) occasions before they reached our location to assess the situation, and what official ordered the recall after "Hot Line" communication was established with Moscow to alert Nasser that the planes were being sent to see what the condition of USS LIBERTY was?
None of the planes ever reached our location.
For over seventeen (17) hours we received no assistance from US forces in the Mediterranean.
This is the only US Navy ship attacked by a foreign nation, involving a large loss of life and so many personnel injured that has never been accorded a full Congressional hearing.
About a year after the attack, USS LIBERTY was dismantled and scrapped.
The ship was awarded the Combat Action ribbon, and the Presidential Unit Citation, and many crew members received individual combat awards (Navy Cross, two (2) posthumously, Silver Star, Bronze Star, etc.).
I was the Commanding Officer, USS LIBERTY (AGTR-5) at the time of the attack, and was presented the Medal of Honor, by the Secretary of the Navy, at the Navy Yard on June 11, 1968, for my performance of duty during the attack and post-attack recovery period.
Please DO NOT delay release of Jonathan POLLARD, until after the elections on November 3, 1998, if it is your intention to release him, with or without due consultation with US military and security experts.
If you are going to release him in any case, please let the people know of your intentions and executive action before they vote in the upcoming elections.
Very respectfully,
William L. McGonagle
Captain, USN (Ret.)
He should NOT grow old and die in prison...they should drop the pellets on his ass. The guy spied on the US. For that he should be put to death.
Since the 1930s, a preponderance of American traitors have been jews.
You should document your assertion or withdraw it. Since you have introduced it in the case of Mr. Pollard and he was only tried and convicted of passing classified information to an ally you must use this same standard for all the cases since the 1930s.
Please check out what the Israel did to the U.S.S. Liberty during the "Six day war". Fourty three american sailors murdered by Israeli pilots to keep the world from finding out about Israeli troops executing Egyptian prisoners of war. Reasearch this atrocity, then tell me Pollards' a hero,
Disclaimer: Opinions posted on Free Republic are those of the individual posters and do not necessarily represent the opinion of Free Republic or its management. All materials posted herein are protected by copyright law and the exemption for fair use of copyrighted works.
[
Top
|
Latest Posts
|
Latest Articles
|
Self Search
|
Add Bookmark
|
Post
|
Abuse
|
Help!
]
FreeRepublic , LLC, PO BOX 9771, FRESNO, CA 93794 Forum Version 2.0a Copyright © 1999 Free Republic, LLC |