Posted on 11/19/2001 6:09:34 AM PST by Notwithstanding
In 1998, Ramerman and two priests, the Rev. James Callan and the Rev. Enrique Cadena, as well as many parishioners, split from Corpus Christi in Rochester. It resulted in the formation of Spiritus Christi, a 1,500-person congregation independent of the diocese that celebrates Sunday Mass at Hochstein Music School downtown. Ramerman's first Mass as a priest is 8 a.m. today. While she is considered an Old Catholic priest, Spiritus Christi remains an independent church. The auburn-haired mother of three now goes by the title of the Rev. Mary Ramerman. Parishioners need not call her "father," the traditional name associated with Roman Catholic priests. Rather, just call her "Mary," she said.
Moments later she was adorned with an embroidered stole to wear over her gown, and the near-capacity crowd of 3,000 leapt to its feet and applauded, rejoicing in the historic ordination of a female priest.
For the members of Spiritus Christi Church in Rochester, Ramerman's ordination yesterday was the most public demonstration of their rebellion from the Roman Catholic Diocese of Rochester -- a movement begun three years ago over issues such as same-sex marriage and the role of lay people at the altar.
Although an act of defiance, it was also a joyous occasion to celebrate members' belief that Ramerman's ordination is part of the future, that someday the Vatican will be forced to accept women into the priesthood.
"The message we are sending is that Catholics are ready for this, and there is no need to be afraid of it," said Ramerman, 46, after a three-hour ceremony that drew reformist Catholics from as many as six countries. A public-television camera crew also documented the event for the show, Religion & Ethics.
The ordination was performed by Bishop Peter Hickman of Orange, Calif., who heads the Diocese of Ecumenical and Old Catholic Faith Communities, part of the Old Catholic movement, a loose collection of churches that rejects the pope's authority.
It is unclear how many American women have been ordained priests in the Old Catholic tradition. Hickman has ordained only one other -- the Rev. Kathy McCarthy of Palm Desert, Calif., who also attended yesterday's ceremony.
To the Rochester diocese and Vatican, Ramerman's ordination represented nothing more than the ordination of a minister in a breakaway Protestant church.
Still, Rochester Bishop Matthew Clark took the step of publicly warning diocesan priests not to attend the event. To do so risked punishment in the form of restraints on certain administrative powers and privileges.
Lay Catholics also were discouraged from attending.
But the diocese would not seek to punish them, said the Rev. Daniel J. Condon, diocesan chancellor. Diocesan officials added that it was not in the best interests of Catholics to bear witness to a "schismatic act."
The Rochester diocese spans 12 counties in western New York and has about 338,000 members.
Prior to the ceremony, Mary Burke, a parishioner of St. Jude the Apostle church in Gates, stood on a sidewalk near the Eastman Theatre, a camera draped around her neck. Burke, a Roman Catholic who opposes the ordination of women, was there to take pictures of people -- Roman Catholic lay people or priests -- "who shouldn't be here," she said.
"If Jesus wanted a woman to be a priest, it would have been there in the Bible and it's not," Burke said.
"The Holy Father is the supreme head of the church. He's spoken infallibly and the answer is no, it can't happen."
One of those Burke photographed was the Rev. Fred Daley, a Roman Catholic priest from St. Francis de Sales Church in Utica, which is not part of the Rochester diocese.
Daley said he wanted to attend the ceremony because of Spiritus Christi's innovative outreach programs for drug addicts and the poor.
When asked about Bishop Clark's declaration that priests in the Rochester diocese avoid the event, Daley said: "The people of Spiritus Christi are great people who are filled with the holy spirit. It's too bad these things can't be worked out in the spirit of Christian love."
In 1998, Ramerman and two priests, the Rev. James Callan and the Rev. Enrique Cadena, as well as many parishioners, split from Corpus Christi in Rochester.
It resulted in the formation of Spiritus Christi, a 1,500-person congregation independent of the diocese that celebrates Sunday Mass at Hochstein Music School downtown.
Ramerman's first Mass as a priest is 8 a.m. today. While she is considered an Old Catholic priest, Spiritus Christi remains an independent church.
The auburn-haired mother of three now goes by the title of the Rev. Mary Ramerman. Parishioners need not call her "father," the traditional name associated with Roman Catholic priests. Rather, just call her "Mary," she said.
The priesthood doesn't mean her life is changing dramatically. Ramerman already had served Spiritus Christi as a pastoral assistant, offering opening prayers, delivering homilies and saying the final blessing.
But under the Old Catholic tradition, she is now able to consecrate the Eucharist, anoint the sick and absolve people of sins after their confessions.
Ramerman is realistic about her ordination. It will not eliminate what she perceives to be gender discrimination in the Roman Catholic Church.
She added, however, that it was an important step in opening the Roman Catholic priesthood to women.
"I'm one more step in their future," she said. "There's no way I can celebrate this day without carrying them with me in my heart."
Meanwhile, another woman at Spiritus Christi is getting ready to make more history.
Bishop Hickman will return to Rochester in April to ordain Spiritus Christi's family minister, Denise Donato, as a deacon, and then later as a priest.
Includes reporting by staff writer Jay Tokasz.
No doubt they are filled with something, not quite sure it is the Holy Spirit, though.
Michelle
Well Father Mary can go through the motions anyway.
The infallibility of the Church and the Pope is totally refuted here: "The Infallibility of the Church"
The Pope would not have had to make several recent apologies for the past policies of the Catholic Church if they were in fact infallible.
need not call her "father," the traditional name associated with Roman Catholic priests. Rather, just call her "Mary," she said.Of course not, she isn’t a Roman Catholic priest. She isn’t a Catholic priest. She is an “Old Catholic” minister, or a schismatic phony, whichever.
as an independent Catholic bishopNo such thing. This is an “Old Catholic” bishop, not an independent Catholic bishop. There is nothing Catholic about this guy.
ordination yesterday was the most public demonstration of their rebellion from the Roman Catholic Diocese of Rochester --Whatever happened to the schism word? Is it still in the dictionary? This is not a rebellion, they are a different church, even from the wacky liberal Diocese of Rochester.
The ordination was performed by Bishop Peter Hickman of Orange, Calif., who heads the Diocese of Ecumenical and Old Catholic Faith Communities, part of the Old Catholic movement, a loose collection of churches that rejects the pope's authority.And who traces its schismatic roots back centuries. I doubt the Pope even knows who this guy is, much less cares.
To the Rochester diocese and Vatican, Ramerman's ordination represented nothing more than the ordination of a minister in a breakaway Protestant church.Right, so stop calling her Catholic. If you wrote an article on the latest Lutheran ordination, would you call people Roman Catholic, or a rebellion from the Roman Catholic Diocese of Rochester?
She added, however, that it was an important step in opening the Roman Catholic priesthood to women.LOL. She thinks very highly of herself.
OK, rant off.
patent +AMDG
The infallibility of the Church and the Pope is totally refuted here: "The Infallibility of the Church"Hardly.
The Pope would not have had to make several recent apologies for the past policies of the Catholic Church if they were in fact infallible.The apologies were for actions that Church members took, things they did, not doctrines that were infallible. The Pope is only infallible in very limited circumstances, when he teaches, as Pope, a doctrine on faith and morals that must be definitively held by all the faithful. If you are trying to extend infallibility to the actions of every Church member, well that is just silly. The Pope is not acting infallibly when a Bishop goes off and does X. The Pope isn’t acting at all.
Even when it is the Pope acting most of what he does isn’t infallible. There are only a handful of things this Pope has done in 20 + years that have been infallible, and the apologies weren’t included, nor were the actions he apologized for. Infallibility is not even remotely refuted by these apologies, and only someone with no understanding of what infallibility is could make this claim.
patent +AMDG
Your link takes me to a place where someone has written a lot of stuff about a false premise. I don't believe that Catholics believe that the Church is infallible. It is the Pope who is considered infallible, by real Catholics, when he is speaking "ex cathedra".
It does not mean the pope makes no mistakes or is sinless. When you are serious about wanting to knwo what you are talking about I am happy to point you to some reading so that you can speak with credibility about why you disagree with the doctrine of infallibiity.
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