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Theories About bin Laden's End
AP | 12/15/01 | CALVIN WOODWARD

Posted on 12/15/2001 10:34:30 AM PST by kattracks

WASHINGTON, Dec 15, 2001 (AP Online via COMTEX) -- Theories about how the end might come for Osama bin Laden will soon get their test if fighters in the Afghan mountains are right in their belief he is still there to be found.

Various methods and motivations are in play, any one of which might result in his death. There is, most obviously, the increasingly focused torrent of U.S. bombs, combined with slowly progressing ground forces.

His end might come in ways not imagined, thanks to the $25 million reward being dangled.

Some people familiar with the ways of terrorists say bin Laden might die by his own hand, or by request to a trusted lieutenant, if faced with death from those he considers infidels.

Lexington Institute military analyst Dan Goure believes bin Laden's interest in martyrdom would recommend a fight to the death on his part. If he is the final al-Qaida member to die, so much the better for the legend.

"The best he can hope is that this is going to be like Custer's Last Stand," he said.

Suicide is forbidden by Islamic law. But more radical groups interpret the Quran to sanction suicide missions against enemies to gain martyrdom. Fanatics may even commit mass suicide in the cause of holy war or to avoid capture, torture or death by the enemy's hand, scholars say.

Arab press reports have suggested bin Laden has sought and received an edict from clergy close to him, permitting him to take his life if he faces capture or death from opposition forces.

Goure disagrees with the common view that bin Laden's capture would be less preferable for America because of the headache of putting him on trial and because it might be less satisfying to the U.S. psyche than killing him.

"The best we can hope, I suspect, is that he is found alone, begging for his life, and we take him out in chains."

All that supposes bin Laden is within reach.

Scenarios for his escape include the possibility ships owned by al-Qaida could spirit him far away if he makes it out of landlocked Afghanistan. U.S. warships are checking merchant vessels on the chance they are carrying al-Qaida terrorists.

President Bush has professed indifference over how bin Laden gets "justice," as long as he gets it. "Dead or alive - either way," he said.

The challenge of hunting al-Qaida fighters in caves is compounded by the difficulty of figuring out who is dead among the chambers.

Bodies found after a raid provide ready verification. But confirmation of bin Laden's death could take some time if he is killed in a bomb strike that leaves behind mass casualties, or if he commits suicide in a secret or inaccessible area.

One distinctive body feature being kept in mind by U.S. officials: bin Laden's height, about 6 feet, 5 inches.

Three senior al-Qaida leaders are known to be dead: Egyptians Mohammed Atef, Tariq Anwar al-Sayyid Ahmad and Muhammad Salah, all killed by U.S. airstrikes last month.

The United States learned of Atef initially through intercepted communications of people discussing his death. U.S. officials confirmed reports that the wife and children of bin Laden aide Ayman al-Zawahri were killed, through a death notice in an Egyptian newspaper.

While officials realize some al-Qaida figures could try to fake death to escape, that behavior is not expected.

Recent history is uneven on the fate of men wanted for slaughter.

Ugandan strongman Idi Amin lives in exile in Saudi Arabia; Haiti's Jean-Claude "Baby Doc" Duvalier went to France. Pol Pot, whose Khmer Rouge rained death and brutality on Cambodians, died in 1998, apparently of heart failure, in the custody of a ruthless rival.

As a consequence of military action, former Panamanian leader Manuel Noriega is in a U.S. prison and former Yugoslav president Slobodan Milosevic faces trial on charges of war crimes and genocide.

The United States has made clear it would not tolerate undisturbed exile for bin Laden, blamed for the deaths of more than 3,000 people in the attacks on New York and Washington.

By CALVIN WOODWARD Associated Press Writer

Copyright 2001 Associated Press, All rights reserved



TOPICS: Extended News; News/Current Events
KEYWORDS:
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1 posted on 12/15/2001 10:34:30 AM PST by kattracks
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Comment #2 Removed by Moderator

To: kattracks
I will wager money that he is never found.
3 posted on 12/15/2001 10:43:13 AM PST by Buckeroo
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To: Buckeroo
I say he is a coward but will prefer death to capture.
4 posted on 12/15/2001 10:48:28 AM PST by umgud
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To: Buckeroo
Maybe not, but in that case I'm sure there'll be sightings in other countries that harbor terrorists, so we can go looking for him there. Just as we are in Afghanistan.
5 posted on 12/15/2001 10:49:32 AM PST by kattracks
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To: nomasmojarras
The idea that Al Quaeda would have a nuke, but waste it in an unpopulated area of Afghanistan and kill 200-300 US troops, at most, is absolutely comical.
6 posted on 12/15/2001 10:49:37 AM PST by John H K
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To: Buckeroo
I hope our leaders are savvy enough to capture him but never admit to it. We then have a "boogy man" to chase through all of the other s**thole countries in the world that harbor terrorists.
7 posted on 12/15/2001 10:52:51 AM PST by Straight Vermonter
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Comment #8 Removed by Moderator

To: Buckeroo
I will wager money that he is never found.

If memory serves me correct --

Caesar and Pompeii were contesting for rule of the Roman Empire, and Pompeii was beaten, and driven from Rome. So he escaped to Egypt. The Egyptians, figuring that harboring him only meant trouble, promptly assassinated him the minute he got off the boat.

Something similar may happen to Osama bin Hot Potato.

9 posted on 12/15/2001 10:59:04 AM PST by JoeSchem
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To: Buckeroo
I'm with you on that theory, Buckeroo. I think it is in the US government's interest that UBL remain at large.

He may have already been snatched up by Special Operations folks for all we know. Or, he may have already been killed. It is my opinion, that the official story is that he'll always be at large. For that reason, the US will continue to prosecute its 'war on terror' for a long, long time.

10 posted on 12/15/2001 11:03:56 AM PST by Fred Mertz
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To: kattracks
I will say something more. I wager that bin Laden lives in the USA. That he left Afghanistan weeks ago and illegally migrated to the USA via Mexico. He may live in Scottsdale, Arizona now ... living the "highlife" of one of the finest communities in America.

America could care less, the government tells you what you want to know.

11 posted on 12/15/2001 11:07:08 AM PST by Buckeroo
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To: umgud
Again, I will wager that bin Laden is never found. Proceeds of the wager shall go to FR for maintainence and support of the website.

How much do you want to wager?

12 posted on 12/15/2001 11:22:21 AM PST by Buckeroo
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To: Buckeroo
Well,my favorite race baiter taking bets on Osama,imagine that.
13 posted on 12/15/2001 11:26:27 AM PST by cardinal4
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To: cardinal4
Taking a wager on one of mankind's largest killers is hardly race-baiting. Maybe you can clarify your comment? Is your continued opinion that "ALL_MUSLIMS" are terrorists?
14 posted on 12/15/2001 11:31:41 AM PST by Buckeroo
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To: Buckeroo
That was not my opinion and you know it!Im only badgering you now because Im really pissed at being called a racist.Call me jerk,drunk,whatever but dont call me racist!I hate that!I believe that the common denominator in the attacks was Islam.
15 posted on 12/15/2001 11:35:24 AM PST by cardinal4
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To: Buckeroo
And you are correct,I did say all muslims were terrorists and I was wrong.It was said in the heat of the moment(back to back suicide attacks)and Ive regretted it ever since.I think its because I feel bad about saying it,that makes me NOT a racist.
16 posted on 12/15/2001 11:38:37 AM PST by cardinal4
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To: kattracks; Victoria Delsoul; susangirl; coteblanche; harpseal; Travis McGee; Snow Bunny; onyx...
"Theories about how the end might come for Osama bin Laden will soon get their test if fighters in the Afghan mountains are right in their belief he is still there to be found. "

Ain't that the truth!




Osama Paki-pool Update:
Osama bin DEAD-pool

Pick a day! Any day! Or flag me for a QikPik!

Update

In the past week, sightings of Osama bin Laden in Afghanistan have surpassed those of Elvis in Vegas.
Is it almost over for the Scumbeard of the Year? Or are these all wild goose chases?
What day do you think he's learn the truth about the 72 virgins and the 28 little boys?

Or are you even in the game? Still plenty of open dates, so flag me on this thread (not my mailbox) if you want in.
As you've noticed, since he doesn't look like he'll make it to Pakistan,
I went ahead and changed the name of the pool. Sue me.

KayEyeDoubleDee raised a good question the night... What's the effective time zone for the pool?
I should have established this earlier, so I think the only fair thing to do is say that it's
whatever Time Zone bin Laden is killed in (or appears in Pakistan, which seems increasingly unlikely.)

ANNOUNCEMENT

from Recovering_Democrat

SABERTOOTH'S POOL IS NOW GOING TO BE CONSIDERED THE POOL FOR THE WINNER.
RECOVERING DEMOCRAT WILL DONATE $25 TO FR IN THE NAME OF THE WINNER OF **SABERTOOTH'S** POOL!

(sorry folks. I didn't know there was a pool already going! I meant to do something ORIGINAL.
No need to have two going at once, so I'll rely on Sabertooth to provide the name of the winner! Thanks ST! rd)

Hey, thank YOU, RD! As far as I'm concerned, if you thought of it yourself, it's original. And I doubt I was the first
But it was your great idea to give $25 in the name of the winner to Free Republic.
If you don't mind, I think I'll match that, in addition to posting a glory thread with the winner's name on it… Sabertooth johniegrad

November, 2001

November 16: First day of Ramadan!
November 17: 68-69TonkinGulfYatchClub - Nope.
November 18: johniegrad - Nope.
November 19: OPEN
November 20: OPEN
November 21: OPEN
November 22: Azzurri -- Thanksgiving - Nope.
November 23: Sabertooth - Nope.
November 24: Jefferson Adams - Nope.
November 25: Victoria Delsoul - Nope.
November 26: airborne - Nope.
November 27: harpseal - Nope.
November 28: snippy_about_it - Nope.
November 29: Tunehead54 - Nope.
November 30: Travis McGee - Nope.










December, 2001

December   1: alancarp - Nope.
December   2: onyx - Nope.
December   3: AfghanAirShow - Nope.
December   4: Straight Vermonter - Nope.
December   5: Pokey78 - Nope.
December   6: proudofthesouth - Nope.
December   7: null and void -- Pearl Harbor Day - Nope.
December   8: MaeWest - Nope.
December   9: justlurking - Nope.
December 10: glock rocks - Nope.
December 11: KayEyeDoubleDee - Nope.
December 12: Washi - Nope.
December 13: FreedomFarmer - Nope.
December 14: irish guard - Nope.
December 15: hattend - Tick… tick… tick…

Not sure when Ramadan ends, but around here somewhere.

December 16: nunya bidness - On the bubble.
December 17: abner
December 18: anniegetyourgun
December 19: Collier
December 20: mdittmar
December 21: Nick Danger
December 22: okie01
December 23: peteram
December 24: RasterMaster -- Christmas Eve
December 25: Go Gordon -- Christmas Day
December 26: Loyalist
December 27: Brian Allen
December 28: Snow Bunny
December 29: Alabama_Wild_Man
December 30: CIApilot
December 31: Miss Marple -- New Year's Eve

January, 2002

January   1: Freeper 007 -- New Year's Day
January   2: spectr17
January   3: lainde
January   4: Woodman
January   5: Semper911
January   6: be-baw
January   7: aruanan
January   8: PoisedWoman -- Elvis's Birthday
January   9: Diogenesis.
January 10: JeanS
January 11: is_is
January 12: garycooper
January 13: Torie
January 14: JohnHuang2
January 15: coteblanche -- Martin Luther King's B'day.
January 16: Sunshine55
January 17: lmr
January 18: eastforker
January 19: LibWhacker
January 20: Gritty -- Anniversary of Dubya's Inagural
January 21: bwteim
January 22: Mike Darancette
January 23: Shooter 2.5
January 24: kylaka
January 25: butter pecan fan
January 26: itwasntme
January 27: WRhine
January 28: nevergore
January 29: veronica
January 30: InfraRed
January 31: Ernest_at_the_Beach

February, 2002

February   1: mvonfr
February   2: afuturegovernor -- Ground Hog Day
February   3: JennysCool
February   4: deadhead
February   5: VietVet
February   6: Slyfox
February   7: GeronL
February   8: Calpublican
February   9: OnAMission
February 10: gwmoore
February 11: EaglesUpForever
February 12: nonliberal - Lincoln's Birthday
February 13: America's Resolve
February 14: beowolf - Valentine's Day
February 15: I_Had_Enough
February 16: vinci
February 17: aquawrench
February 18: 2Jedismom
February 19: ScottK
February 20: b4its2late
February 21: My Favorite Headache
February 22: Amore - Washington's Birthday
February 23: katze
February 24: HAL9000
February 25: YaYa123
February 26: cajungirl
February 27: Slicksadick
February 28: Poohbah



March, 2002

March   1: abclily
March   2: womanvet
March   3: The Raven
March   4: WhatWouldReaganDo
March   5: jrewingjr
March   6: illbenice
March   7: SunnyUsa
March   8: DKNY
March   9: lilsparky
March 10: Pablo64
March 11: VRWC For Truth
March 12: Sungirl
March 13: katnip
March 14: Bloody Sam Roberts
March 15: X-FID
March 16: Happygal
March 17: Hillary's Lovely Legs - St. Patrick's Day
March 18: AFVetGal
March 19: Lancey Howard
March 20: GOPJ
March 21: Bogey78O
March 22: Abn1508
March 23: Tex-Con-Man
March 24: seeker41
March 25: JerseyHighlander
March 26: CJ Wolf
March 27: Apple Pan Dowdy
March 28: JerseyHighlander
March 29: bvw
March 30: Rainbow Rising
March 31: Darth Sidious

April, 2002

April   1: mlocher
April   2: Big Guy and Rusty 99
April   3: Grizzfan
April   4: WIMom - Brady Boomer Founder
April   5: CheneyChick - Brady Boomer Founder
April   6: vikingchick - Brady Boomer Founder
April   7: fhayek
April   8: kmiller1k - Brady Boomer Founder
April   9: one_particular_harbour - Brady Boomer Founder
April 10: rintense
April 11: Fighting Irish
April 12: HiTech RedNeck
April 13: MattinNJ
April 14: Faraday
April 15: LLAN-DDEUSANT
April 16: BOBTHENAILER
April 17: OPEN
April 18: rockfish59
April 19: Dan from Michigan
April 20: OPEN
April 21: OPEN
April 22: OPEN
April 23: OPEN
April 24: OPEN
April 25: CounterCounterCulture
April 26: OPEN
April 27: OPEN
April 28: operation clinton cleanup
April 29: dennisw
April 30: OPEN

And here are a few of Freepers who think that
they know something that the rest us don't…

October 10, 2001: susangirl - She's actually got a cool theory, which you can read HERE.

May   1: Free Vulcan

May 17: Flipyaforreal

September 11, 2002: terilyn

October 26, 2004: kixx

September 5, 2011: widgysoft












If you're unsure what the whole "Paki-pool" idea was about, click this link to a thread posted by Travis McGee on October 25th...

Will Osama Appear In Pakistan?

The operating theory is was that Osama bin Laden had a plan all along to show up in Pakistan, have himself declared the "Imam al-Mahdi" (a long-prophesied Islamic savior-figure), and start a civil war in an attempt to gain control of Pakistan's nukes.

Sound crazy? So is he. Crazy evil. It's still an interesting read.

Here's another:
   Black Flags of Islam  

Portents of the Imam al-Mahdi, the Moslems' prophesied deliverer of Jerusalem?

Click on the Black Flags for the link




17 posted on 12/15/2001 11:42:30 AM PST by Sabertooth
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To: cardinal4
I apoligise for my blind opinion based upon your previous posts. You are not a racist. You simply want everyone that disagrees with your posts to include Muslims out of your way. Thanks for pointing that out.
18 posted on 12/15/2001 11:44:22 AM PST by Buckeroo
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To: Sabertooth
13:19 EDT 12/19/2001.
19 posted on 12/15/2001 11:46:22 AM PST by bvw
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To: cardinal4
You are correct that all muslims are not terrorists. The real breakdown; 1) About half are non to very slightly religious and don't give 2 s***s except that they get worked up about the impotence of their culture. 2) About 35% are religious but don't have the guts to give the terrorists more than lip service. 3) 15% are involved one way or the other mostly by minor financial help or moral support. It appears that < 5% have the whole package including the rage.
20 posted on 12/15/2001 11:49:02 AM PST by Righty1
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