Posts by DeviantMind

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  • At War With EVIL (FReeper GaryMontana)

    10/18/2002 11:52:19 AM PDT · 111 of 121
    DeviantMind to Smile-n-Win
    I will commend you on your post, as it is the first I have had the chance to read that actually did what I was hoping: address my response in a mature, positive, constructive and intelligent way.

    I will concede the point that semantics may have interfered in the interpretation of the original post, as well as further posts. A very well written, and thought out response on your part.

    Now on to your comment on my change of attitude. I realize that my original post was harsh, and I know I have a tendency to be harsh when posting online. That was part of the reason for my attempt to at least make -one- positive comment directed to Mr. Montana, and no, I wouldn't blame him for not believing it. That is his choice.

    As for your argument on Islam being a faction within the "religion of Monotheism," I can understand your train of thought. Since Monotheism is "a doctrine or belief that there is only one God," and Islam, Christianity, Judaism and a few other minor religions share this belief, it can be argued that they are simply "factions" within the larger whole. It would be more to the point that they are sub-cults within a larger cult, but your argument is sound.

    The reasoning behind my statement that a religion cannot declare war falls under the pretense that, with one known exception, there are no major religions (Islam included) that have one specific seat of power (a holy site is not synonomous with a seat of power) or a hierarchial power structure crowned by a single individual who has world-wide power in that religious group. A religious group (faction, religiously based government, religiously driven terrorist cell, etc) may carry out acts of war, but without a presiding body of leadership, a single religion cannot do so.

    You have commented that a group of Muslims have declared war on the non-Muslim world. THAT I most certainly agree with, as it was specifically noted that it was a group within the whole, not the whole.

    What do I propose we do? This is where I begin agree with Mr. Montana. Tighter security on immigration and tourism (ie- Imigrant and Non-imigrant Visas) is needed, to start. The U.S. needs to start enforcing the policy of tracking down those who violate the terms of their Visas. Only recently did INS begin to do fingerprinting of incoming foreigners. This should have been done years ago, and sadly we are focusing only on the Arab individuals. While our current problems were orchestrated by Arabs, there is nothing that says people of other ethnicity won't jump on the bandwagon. I believe we need to put a tighter grip on ALL incoming non-Americans. This obviously leaves out the domestic threats, but I am still considering what should be done about this. When I come up with something, I'll be sure to share it.

    As an aside, I would like to apologize to Mr. Montana, not for arguing against his post, but for the manner in which I did it. A friend of mine here read my posts, and said that I was very harsh when I'm online, and in hindsight I agree. So, despite the fact that I'm sure my apology won't be believed or accepted, I apologize to Mr. Montana and everyone else involved in this thread for the harshness of my posts, if not for the content.

    Devon Weir
    DeviantMind (whose name does NOT mean he hates America, believes in societal suicide or anything of the sort)
  • At War With EVIL (FReeper GaryMontana)

    10/17/2002 10:43:01 PM PDT · 108 of 121
    DeviantMind to blam
    "There is not nor has there ever been anyone registered as 'madcat' or 'madcat 202'. (...and it really does not matter)"

    This is untrue. For about a year I logged on under that name. Now, do you have anything of substance to say, or do you insist on arguing over irrelevant points?
  • At War With EVIL (FReeper GaryMontana)

    10/17/2002 3:01:23 PM PDT · 106 of 121
    DeviantMind to DeviantMind
    My apologies for the dual posting. Could a moderator please remove one of the duplicates? Thank you.
  • At War With EVIL (FReeper GaryMontana)

    10/17/2002 2:58:38 PM PDT · 105 of 121
    DeviantMind to blam
    In truth, the reason that there are no other posts you recognize as being from me is simple: having not logged on for a long time (no internet access), I had forgotten my old log-in and password. It was either Madcat or Madcat 202, but without a password both of those are useless. I decided, also, that a new name would be appropriate.

    I find it disappointing that you need to justify yourself by attacking the length of our time on these forums. You have done an outstanding job of steering the conversation away from the point and onto a stage which requires me to defend myself. Bravo, you have displayed the single most used tactic of the uninformed activist.

    And of course, the fact that yours was the only post I have read which warranted my response most -CERTAINLY- means I have an agenda. Would you be so kind as to inform me of what it is?

    I post to threads which interest me. Yours interested me. This is my right, and I will continue to exercise it. I certainly hope that the moderators of this website will keep in mind that I have not attacked any members, have not instigated any flame wars or anything of the sort when they read this thread. All I did was post my opinion on someone else's article. To attempt to deny me the right to do so is highly un-Constitutional, and hypocritical of all that you folks seem to stand for.

    So, is there anyone here who wishes to return to the topic at hand and continue what SHOULD have been an intelligent, educated, mature and highly interesting conversation?
  • At War With EVIL (FReeper GaryMontana)

    10/17/2002 2:58:07 PM PDT · 104 of 121
    DeviantMind to blam
    In truth, the reason that there are no other posts you recognize as being from me is simple: having not logged on for a long time (no internet access), I had forgotten my old log-in and password. It was either Madcat or Madcat 202, but without a password both of those are useless. I decided, also, that a new name would be appropriate.

    I find it disappointing that you need to justify yourself by attacking the length of our time on these forums. You have done an outstanding job of steering the conversation away from the point and onto a stage which requires me to defend myself. Bravo, you have displayed the single most used tactic of the uninformed activist.

    And of course, the fact that yours was the only post I have read which warranted my response most -CERTAINLY- means I have an agenda. Would you be so kind as to inform me of what it is?

    I post to threads which interest me. Yours interested me. This is my right, and I will continue to exercise it. I certainly hope that the moderators of this website will keep in mind that I have not attacked any members, have not instigated any flame wars or anything of the sort when they read this thread. All I did was post my opinion on someone else's article. To attempt to deny me the right to do so is highly un-Constitutional, and hypocritical of all that you folks seem to stand for.

    So, is there anyone here who wishes to return to the topic at hand and continue what SHOULD have been an intelligent, educated, mature and highly interesting conversation?
  • At War With EVIL (FReeper GaryMontana)

    10/17/2002 2:10:36 PM PDT · 99 of 121
    DeviantMind to blam
    When did the date of subscription begin to be more important than the substance of a person's statement, or their ability to hold constructive arguments and conversations?
  • At War With EVIL (FReeper GaryMontana)

    10/17/2002 12:56:14 PM PDT · 97 of 121
    DeviantMind to texson66
    The Crusades sought to take away "the Holy land," as it were, in case you forgot.

    And you may not be aware, but Islam considers Christians and Jews to be "People of the Book." It's the HUMAN variable of the equation that causes the problem
  • At War With EVIL (FReeper GaryMontana)

    10/17/2002 12:08:26 PM PDT · 94 of 121
    DeviantMind to texson66
    The Crusades were about obtaining land. The religious aspect was merely a pretense to garner support. It was political and expansionalist.

    But if you would like another example, how does the Inquisition sound? Christianity at its best.
  • At War With EVIL (FReeper GaryMontana)

    10/17/2002 12:06:07 PM PDT · 93 of 121
    DeviantMind to 7thson
    oh, for the most part I like what is being said. I Just disagreed with the lack of differentiation between "Islam" and "Arab."

    The fact that many Arabs are Muslim has caused many to assume that all attacks are per Islamic belief.

    And the reason I come, despite disagreeing... is because I can at least respect some of the people here, even if there are a few who cannot resist the temptation to be insulting.
  • At War With EVIL (FReeper GaryMontana)

    10/17/2002 12:01:48 PM PDT · 92 of 121
    DeviantMind to Red Jones
    very well, I'll use resources. For support on my argument, consult the Q'uran (or Koran, if you prefer Anglicized spellings), Patterns of Global Terrorism from 1996-present (which show that just as many terrorist attacks are by non-Islamic groups as there are by Islamic militants). Speak with any Muslims you may know in your community, and get first hand accounts on their views of the attacks.

    If you prefer, I will have a properly formatted, annotated bibliography drawn up.

    DM
  • At War With EVIL (FReeper GaryMontana)

    10/17/2002 11:57:05 AM PDT · 91 of 121
    DeviantMind to Smile-n-Win
    I'll begin by addressing the comment about my name. I chose it to represent the fact that I am not one to simply fall in line, to accept without questioning or to walk along like a lemming until I fall off a cliff because I was too ignorant to find things out for myself. Deviant, a derivative of "deviate" suggests that I choose to take the road less traveled, rather than follow every other footstep on a particular path.

    Now, as far as Islam declaring war on America, that is a fallacy. I never stated that the individuals who have been making the attacks were not Muslim. That may very well be true, and in some cases we have that as fact. My point was that the accusations that -ISLAM- has declared war are ludicrous. A system of religious beliefs cannot declare war. Nations wage war, men declare war, factions fight wars, religions do not. To say that a religion declared a war is saying that an intangible concept has attacked a tangible nation-state. Again, ludicrous.

    With the exception of the Catholic church, there is not a single known religion that boasts a seat of power, or a hierarchy of leadership presided over by a single, living individual. Islam most certainly does not have this. It is true that there are nations in the world that are considered "Islamic States," but these are autonomous, and often have as much difficulty negotiating with one another as they do with the United States.

    To the person who claimed I hate the United States. Grow up. If I hated the United States, I would move. There are plenty of countries in the world that I could go to where I would be able to avoid breathing toxic fumes from the same airspace as simple minded, ignorant conformists. But I am a born citizen of these United States, and take great pride in the fact that I live here. I am also proud to say, with moderate certainty, that the individuals who founded this country were not close minded snobs who spoke out against anything that did not fit within their precious paradigm.

    And to the challenge to prove the post wrong, I don't have to. You've done that for me by being unwilling, but most importantly _unable_ to locate any reliable evidence to support your claims. An effective debate flows with one individual making a statement, the second party challenging the statement and then the claimant presenting evidence to support his claims. When the claimant is unable to do so, he loses credibility, and thus the debate is over.

    A note: I respect the right that each of you have to believe what you want, and to say what you want. However, I also have those same rights, and will enjoy them as I see fit. This includes calling people out when false statements are spewed across a public form.

    A second note: to Mr. Montana, who wrote the post that started this thread, I do want to say one thing. While I disagree with what you said, and have enjoyed pointing out the inherent flaws in your argument, I AM impressed with your writing. You seem like an intelligent and talented, albeit uninformed and bigoted person. Kudos.

    Devon A. Weir
    aka DeviantMind
  • At War With EVIL (FReeper GaryMontana)

    10/14/2002 12:59:35 AM PDT · 16 of 121
    DeviantMind to neutrino
    Hooray for another beautiful example of why ignorance is the predominant disease in the United States. Not only has he shown a complete disregard for accuracy, Mr. Montana has also made one of the most abbrasive blanket statements to grace this site yet (which is quite a statement in itself).

    I challenge each of you who has praised his string of ludicrous cliams to find factual support for them. In fact, I challenge Mr. Montana himself to present all of you with factual resources to support his statements. Sadly, this will not happen because people who speak in such a way as Mr. Montana do not have factual, reliable sources, and those sources that are provided generally are written by people of similar, bigoted viewpoints.

    People, how hard is it for you to grow up and realize when someone is wrong? Just because someone uses the language well does not mean you have to agree with them. Try agreeing when a person is correct, rather than when they sound nice.