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Posts by father_elijah

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  • Catholic Caucus - Prayers for Priests

    04/16/2002 10:41:27 AM PDT · 18 of 146
    father_elijah to history_matters; Dr. Brian Kopp; Askel5; patent
    A very moving thread. Thank you with all my heart for these prayers and for calling others to pray for priests.

    Dear Catholic Caucus and other dear FR friends, I have only a minute to say we have succeeded in redeeming 43 Christian slaves. We will get them to safety as soon as night falls.

    Thank you all of you for your prayers.

  • Catholic Prayer Request for Father Elijah

    04/12/2002 3:59:00 PM PDT · 28 of 81
    father_elijah to Salvation
    Thank you for these many prayers. We were able to get a working line via sat phone. I just wanted to send a quick word that we are safe and beginning our work for the Lord here.
  • Blockbuster Book "Goodbye! Good Men" Exposes Gay Subculture in Catholic Church Hierarchy

    04/12/2002 3:54:21 PM PDT · 42 of 49
    father_elijah to Dr. Brian Kopp
    This is so upsetting I hardly know what to do now, so I pray:.

    St. Michael the Archangel, defend us in battle; be our defense against the wickedness and snares of the devil. May God rebuke him, we humbly pray. And do thou, O prince of the heavenly host, by the power of God thrust into hell Satan and all the evil spirits who prowl about the world seeking the ruin of souls. Amen.

  • The Neverending Story (The Christian Chronicles)

    04/10/2002 12:39:16 PM PDT · 3,249 of 65,537
    father_elijah to Havoc
    God bless you and keep you, Havoc. The foundation of everything I say is my relationship with Jesus Christ, our Living Lord and Savior.

    Peace be with all.

  • Catholic Caucus: Ecce!

    04/10/2002 12:36:57 PM PDT · 79 of 116
    father_elijah to patent; Askel5; Romulus; Salvation; goldenstategirl; constitutiongirl; tiki; redhead...
    This doesn't fit this thread exactly, except I need your prayers and the prayers of Our Lady Mary, Queen of All Saints.

    We are getting horrible news from the Sudan, and tomorrow morning I will be leaving with several others for Kenya and then parts unknown. Please pray for the Church and for persecuted Christians. And please say a prayer for me and my confreres.

    God bless you! I hope to be back with you here soon.

  • Catholic Caucus: Ecce!

    04/10/2002 12:29:47 PM PDT · 78 of 116
    father_elijah to sandyeggo
    The one book that I have gone back to over and over again is Orthodoxy by G.K. Chesterton. I failed to mention that, and it was the first thing I was going to say!
  • The Neverending Story (The Christian Chronicles)

    04/10/2002 10:46:20 AM PDT · 3,117 of 65,537
    father_elijah to DouglasKC
    So when Jesus said to the penitent thief on the cross "This day you will be with me in Paradise?" what do you think that meant and where do you think that penitent thief is?
  • The Neverending Story (The Christian Chronicles)

    04/10/2002 10:37:50 AM PDT · 3,103 of 65,537
    father_elijah to DouglasKC
    Not even close. When I talk to Mary in the kingdom of God I'll ask her if I should consider her my mother. I'm sure she'll blush and humbly say "Who taught you that nonsense?".

    I hope you won't be too surprised when she says, "Of course I'm your Mother. Go to your room!"
    ; ^)

  • The Neverending Story (The Christian Chronicles)

    04/10/2002 10:28:47 AM PDT · 3,094 of 65,537
    father_elijah to Wordsmith
    Which of course will continue to be the dividing line between the "traditional faiths" on the one hand - Catholicism, Orthodoxy, Anglicanism - and the "bible-only faiths" on the other. I doubt father_elijah believes at all that there needs to be explicit Scriptural evidence for every element of faith. Every disagreement here comes down to this essential divide between us.

    I heartily agree with your well written observation.

  • The Neverending Story (The Christian Chronicles)

    04/10/2002 10:25:40 AM PDT · 3,093 of 65,537
    father_elijah to history_matters
    I stepped away and came back to find your angry and inappropriate words. You must cease from this and make amends. Immediately.
  • The Neverending Story (The Christian Chronicles)

    04/10/2002 9:36:48 AM PDT · 3,035 of 65,537
    father_elijah to biblewonk
    You can't help but notice that this is not asking Mary to pray for us at all, but is asking her to do things with her own power. Kind of a subtle change isn't it?

    Everything Mary has comes from God. And her will is one with His Will. Every Orthodox and Catholic Christian knows that. The pity is that Evangelical Christians are cut off from their Mother Mary because of their steadfast anti-Catholicism and thereby are not able to keep the teaching of honoring father and mother. If you are in Christ Jesus, then she is your mother too and she deserves all the honor you can muster.

  • The Neverending Story (The Christian Chronicles)

    04/10/2002 9:31:05 AM PDT · 3,033 of 65,537
    father_elijah to Havoc
    Seems none of you are capable of reading unless it suites your purposes.

    Actually this does not describe us as much as it describes you. Curious that you take bits and pieces of the Hebrew Bible and let them trump the clear teaching of Jesus Christ.

  • The Neverending Story (The Christian Chronicles)

    04/10/2002 6:03:42 AM PDT · 2,858 of 65,537
    father_elijah to ksen; saradippity; american_colleen; allend; patent;
    The title of Queen for the Blessed Mother of Jesus Christ is by virtue of Christ being the rightful Davidic King and His mother rightfully fulfilling the office of Queen Mother. In reviewing the office of the Queen Mother in the House of David, you will find how petitions are brought to her to bring to the attention of the king. The Queen Mother's presence is a sign of the fulness of the Davidic kingdom and its continuity and her office a legitimate means by which to address the king and seek his favor. So it is with the Blessed Mother of Jesus who by right holds the Davidic office of Queen Mother and by her glorious Assumption into heaven takes her righful place beside her son Christ the King of all that is and all that will ever be.
  • The Neverending Story (The Christian Chronicles)

    04/10/2002 5:45:15 AM PDT · 2,854 of 65,537
    father_elijah to Havoc
    Your post is such a sad misuse of your zeal for the Lord Jesus Christ. You cannot see how obedience flowers from Love for Jesus Christ because you allow your emotions against the Holy Catholic Church to up-end all of your faculties. As your post exposes your heart with regard to the Catholic faith, I will pray for your healing and deliverance from that spirit of rage which corrupts the gift of righteous anger into fury against Christ's Holy Catholic Church. By the wounds of the divine Saviour Christ the Lord, may you be healed in body, mind, and spirit.
  • Catholic Caucus: Ecce!

    04/09/2002 8:22:41 PM PDT · 49 of 116
    father_elijah to Diago; Askel5; patent; Dr. Brian Kopp; ELS; sandyeggo
    Please see posts #47 and #48, and recommend titles to sandyeggo. I'm sure others would benefit from your suggestions.

    Peter Kreeft's works are immeasurable aids too. For a beginner the Summa of the Summa is a good intro. to St. Thomas Aquinas and Thomistic thought.

    And I can't help but recommend Michael O'Brien's brilliant novels especially Father Elijah: An Apocalypse.

  • Catholic Caucus: Ecce!

    04/09/2002 8:14:58 PM PDT · 48 of 116
    father_elijah to sandyeggo
    I believe it is good to have a variety of books to read -- some long, some short, some scholarly, some anecdotal.

    There are two books I think every lay Catholic should read immediately, and they are both by Scott Hahn: The Lamb's Supperand Hail Holy Queen. I also recommend Mother Angelica's mini-books (some are available from the EWTN website). Then there is Fr. Benedict Groeschel: The Cross at Ground Zero, Arise from Darkness, and most especially Healing the Original Wound: Reflections on the Full Meaning of Salvation.

    Preparing Yourself for Mass by Romano Guardini is a really helpful work for cradle Catholics, converts, reverts, and even cradle Episcopalians (who ought to be Catholic...LOL).

    Now here I will show tremendous bias: get ahold of the Paulist Press's one volume on the writings of St. Francis and St. Clare. Also read St. John of the Cross, St. Teresa of Avila, St. Therese of Liseux, and read St. Faustina's Diary.

    Patrick Madrid has written some books that may be helpful in the area of apologetics. And I think everyone should read Bud Macfarlane Jr.'s novels available through www.catholicity.com.

    I would also recommend subscribing to a few good Catholic magazines like Crisis, Magnificat (a wonderful monthly compendium of all of the texts for the Liturgy of the Hours, Daily Mass together with a wealth of information), New Oxford Review (which has published in the current issue a most excellent short story by our own Dr. Brian Kopp, ....

    I offer those as beginning ideas, and encourage you to read the Scriptures alongside any other reading you do -- especially read the Psalms daily. Now I've gone from suggestin' to meddlin'. God bless you!

  • Catholic Caucus: Ecce!

    04/09/2002 7:37:49 PM PDT · 46 of 116
    father_elijah to Lemonhead; Campion; B Knotts; sandyeggo; NYer
    ping! Take heart!

    Mary, Queen of All Saints, pray for us!

  • Catholic Interest Groups See in Scandal a Chance to Further Their Causes

    04/09/2002 7:35:46 PM PDT · 85 of 118
    father_elijah to SMEDLEYBUTLER
    Thank you for your excellent post. I was about to post a tome when I glanced down and saw your succinct and well phrased post. Again, many thanks.

    Mary, Queen of All Saints, pray for us.

  • Catholic Interest Groups See in Scandal a Chance to Further Their Causes

    04/09/2002 7:33:28 PM PDT · 84 of 118
    father_elijah to Lithasis
    Your post is nothing but cyber-vomit. Vade retro, Satanas.....
  • Catholic Caucus: Ecce!

    04/09/2002 7:28:31 PM PDT · 45 of 116
    father_elijah to kcrack
    ping! Take heart!

    Mary, Queen of All Saints, pray for us!

  • Honoring God's Work [Against Iconoclasm]

    04/09/2002 7:17:00 PM PDT · 41 of 51
    father_elijah to Wordsmith; OxfordMovement
    A most excellent post. Deep thanks to you, Wordsmith.

    Praying for an end to what separates us and for a rich sharing of the bond of peace in Christ Jesus.

  • The Neverending Story (The Christian Chronicles)

    04/09/2002 11:07:54 AM PDT · 2,362 of 65,537
    father_elijah to Invincibly Ignorant
    Not arrogance -- confidence. Not special knowledge -- just a realization that some people have a copy of the owner's manual but they don't have the car to drive; and when you've got the car -- that owner's manual takes on a whole new meaning.
  • The Neverending Story (The Christian Chronicles)

    04/09/2002 10:57:43 AM PDT · 2,351 of 65,537
    father_elijah to Havoc
    I also know what talking to the dead is - and that it is a sin.

    So are you saying Jesus was guilty of sin for speaking to Moses at the time of His transfiguration? Not so!

  • The Neverending Story (The Christian Chronicles)

    04/09/2002 10:46:13 AM PDT · 2,336 of 65,537
    father_elijah to Havoc
    You confuse philosophy with the mystical theology of the Church, and you cite Scripture in a way that in no way demonstrates an error in my theological position. I understand that you do not have the fulness of the hermeneutics of the Roman Catholic Church to draw upon, nor do you have the venerable framework of the Orthodox Christians to assist the boundaries of your position.
  • The Neverending Story (The Christian Chronicles)

    04/09/2002 6:29:15 AM PDT · 2,236 of 65,537
    father_elijah to DouglasKC
    There is no question as to what the word translated "commandment" is referring to. No ambiguity. Paul defines love for your neighbor as consisting of those commandments of God. You gotta agree with that... :-)

    Actually, there is a lot of room to debate how you read the word "commandment" in Greek. For example, one can take the use of the word in the Septuagint and then look at its use in the Pauline Epistles and then relate this to the root Hebrew/Jewish understanding of Torah. I've already touched on this earlier on this thread.

  • The Neverending Story (The Christian Chronicles)

    04/09/2002 6:24:32 AM PDT · 2,235 of 65,537
    father_elijah to Havoc
    So, you can't defend it, you just preach it to the congregation because it sounds warm and fuzzy. Is that it?

    In a word, No.

    There is no need of defense. The virtue of obedience is secondary to the Lord's new commandment to Love as he loved us.

  • The Neverending Story (The Christian Chronicles)

    04/08/2002 11:48:15 PM PDT · 2,222 of 65,537
    father_elijah to angelo
    I found FreeRepublic because of a younger priest who was a lurker. He showed me FR because he knew that I was an anti-Marxist and I believed the Clintons were going to leave us with neither a Republic nor a Constitution. So while I was back in the US, he signed me up, got me going, and the rest is history. I have considered it a great blessing to know that there were others who fervently loved our country and our Constitution. Getting to interact with people of other faiths as well as Catholics was a big added bonus. I also found FR had some of the most articulate exponents of the Orthodox Christian faith -- and I value that highly, posters like FormerLib, Wordsmith, and The Reader David.
  • CFAA calls for denial of sacraments to Governor Gray Davis

    04/08/2002 11:36:04 PM PDT · 57 of 58
    father_elijah to Gophack
    My ideas are:

    1) Pray for the bishop before you write.
    2) Tell the bishop how important it is to you that he is a successor to the apostles;
    3) Thank him for exuding a good an holy character -- which the faithful need to see in a bishop.
    4) Tell him that there is great confusion over pro-abortionists receiving the sacraments of the Church;
    5) Ask him to speak out with apostolic clarity so the confusion can be put to an end -- since confusion does not come from God but from the enemy;
    6) Assure him of your support if he would make a declaration that pro-abortionists and others who undermine the teachings of the Church may not receive the sacraments;
    7) Specifically ask him to call Gov. Davis to account because if the high and powerful need not follow the teachings of the Church why should the ordinary Catholic follow anything a bishop says.
    8)Close by thanking him for being your bishop, and promise to pray for him daily.

    Those are my suggestions. Feel free to use any or none. And God bless you, Gophack, for taking the time to write to your bishop. What you are going to do is very important.

  • The Neverending Story (The Christian Chronicles)

    04/08/2002 11:11:04 PM PDT · 2,221 of 65,537
    father_elijah to Havoc
    I have written what I have written.

    He who has eyes, let him see.

    Christ's blessings be with you.

  • The Neverending Story (The Christian Chronicles)

    04/08/2002 9:41:48 PM PDT · 2,209 of 65,537
    father_elijah to angelo
    I find that very funny indeed. Antinominianism?

    I do undestand that the tension is seen between legalism and antinominianism, but the moral order that arises from the love of Jesus Christ is hardly license in any fashion nor is it a rejection of moral order. Moral order finds its meaning int he love of Christ displayed on the Cross and the crosses we bear for love of him. It is ordered, patterned, and beautiful, but it is not cut and dried, it is not a checklist, and it means a very deep attention to the full theological meaning of Love on the Cross and how that is lived in the Body of the Risen Christ. The tension is actually between the cross and the empty tomb and the only thing that makes sense of it is divine Love.

  • The Neverending Story (The Christian Chronicles)

    04/08/2002 9:17:02 PM PDT · 2,202 of 65,537
    father_elijah to JHavard
    I am glad you are a real father.

    You may know that I am a survivor of the Holocaust. After the Nazis experimented on me I could not be a real father. But through their cruelty I found hope and salvation in Jesus Christ, and I learned that what they had done to me for evil, I could offer up to God for Him to make a greater good from it. I could choose to be a eunuch for the Lord as He said in the 19th Chapter of Matthew. It was deeply meaningful to me that after the teaching on eunuchs immediately Jesus took children into his arms and blessed them. And so it is promised that we who follow in this way will see sons raised up to us in abundance. As the Apostle Paul said so have I become a "father in the Gospel" to many. And so the Lord is kind and gracious and allows me to be a spiritual father to many.

    We will no doubt disagree for time and eternity about whether the Lord was directing his teaching "Call no man Father or Master" at the Pharisees or if he was declaring a new commandment. For my part as well as that of my Church, we believe that argument was with Christ's opponents and not with his friends or followers.

  • The Neverending Story (The Christian Chronicles)

    04/08/2002 8:54:13 PM PDT · 2,195 of 65,537
    father_elijah to DouglasKC
    To unpack this, I would want to begin with the word "command" and the word "commandments" and how they relate to the Hebrew word "torah" and the understand of God's commandments as "Teaching" or "Instruction" rather than legal code.

    I normally read the New Testament in Arabic because of my work. For example, in the Arabic translation of "Joh 14:21 He who has My commandments and keeps them, he it is who loves Me. And he who loves Me shall be loved by My Father, and I will love him and will reveal Myself to him." if I were to translate back into English it would read "He who holds fast to what I have taught you and thereby lives out my teaching, he is the one who loves me. And whoever loves me, My Father will love, and I will love him and manifest myself to him." This sense is really throughout the New Testament in Arabic, Hebrew or the very old Syriac and Chaldean lectionaries in Aramaic and Chaldean.

    I know this must sound like it is coming from another planet, but it is a way of thinking that is as old as the Negev. In short, the New Testament references to obeying or obedience to commandments could just as easily be translated differently -- as they in fact are in most Semitic and north African languages. And I would underscore that the Torah of God is not so much a legal code for men as it is a divine instruction to God's people that is fulfilled and manifested in earnest in Jesus Christ.

  • The Neverending Story (The Christian Chronicles)

    04/08/2002 8:42:11 PM PDT · 2,193 of 65,537
    father_elijah to JHavard
    I'm a follower of Jesus Christ, a Catholic priest (an ancient one at that), and a disciple of Mother Teresa of Calcutta. That about covers it for now.
  • The Neverending Story (The Christian Chronicles)

    04/08/2002 8:35:15 PM PDT · 2,189 of 65,537
    father_elijah to JHavard; DouglasKC; Havoc
    It is different though, but your history is against you.

    LOL to you. Catholics and Protestants have such different vocabularies that there are times when we have to strike out into another country. The language of love is the language of the mystical theology of the Catholic Church. It rarely enters into a discussion of theology with Protestants, but it is the very place where we might come to understand each other better.

    I recommend The Ascent of Mount Carmel by St. John of the Cross to get a taste of it. For some Protestants its language may be as wild as science fiction, but it will share something more substantial about the heart of Catholic faith in Jesus -- more so than the Scholastic language we usually employ.

  • The Neverending Story (The Christian Chronicles)

    04/08/2002 8:30:00 PM PDT · 2,188 of 65,537
    father_elijah to DouglasKC
    Do you have a better definition of love father?

    Yes, I do. Look at Jesus' crucified upon the cross and see how much He loves us.

  • The Neverending Story (The Christian Chronicles)

    04/08/2002 8:27:01 PM PDT · 2,187 of 65,537
    father_elijah to Havoc; DouglasKC; american_colleen
    Oh you do make me laugh! Thank you!

    No, never a hippie!

    Which pretty much obliterates the notion that it's all about love and then we can do whatever we please.

    It is all about love, Havoc. Every bit of it -- from creation right the way through to the last verses of Revelation. Christian love is never about people doing whatever they please. Love is a very different motivation than obedience. But this is one of those points that are very difficult for Catholics and Calvinists to discuss or perhaps Catholics and Bible-only Christians. Obedience alone as a motivation for following Christ is not the fullness of the Gospel or of our faith in Christ. Loving Jesus is the motivation for following him and walking in his Spirit. Obedience is what is required of a slave or even of a young child. But Love is what unites and moves friends who walk together on the Way that is Jesus Christ himself.

  • Catholic Caucus: Ecce!

    04/08/2002 8:14:28 PM PDT · 40 of 116
    father_elijah to Askel5
    Shall we not love thee, Mother dear,
    whom Jesus loves so well?
    And to his glory year by year
    thy joy and honor tell?

    Bound with the curse of sin and shame
    we helpless sinners lay,
    until in tender love he came
    to bear the curse away.

    And thee he chose from whom to take
    true flesh his flesh to be;
    in it to suffer for our sake,
    by it to make us free.

    Thy Babe he lay upon thy breast,
    to thee he cried for food;
    thy gentle nursing soothed to rest
    the incarnate Son of God.

    O wondrous depth of grace divine
    that he should bend so low!
    And, Mary, O what joy 'twas thine
    in his dear love to know!

    Joy to be Mother of the Lord,
    and thine the truer bliss,
    in every thought and deed and word
    to be for ever his.

    And as he loves thee, Mother dear,
    we too will love thee well;
    and to his g lory year by year
    thy joy and honor tell.

    Jesus, the Virgin's holy Son,
    we praise thee and adore,
    who art with God the Father One
    and Spirit evermore.

    -------------------------
    Words: Henry Williams Baker, 1868

  • The Neverending Story (The Christian Chronicles)

    04/08/2002 8:10:15 PM PDT · 2,178 of 65,537
    father_elijah to Havoc; DouglasKC
    Sorry. No sale. The statistical numbers on the appearance of "obey" and "obedience" in a concordance do not alter the extraordinary value of the New Covenant and Jesus teaching of the new commandment of "love" together with the revelation that God is Love. The Holy Spirit who leads the Church into all Truth has made it abundantly clear for the Church that Christ Jesus brought the Good News of God's Love written in His own Blood.

    Love is not defined so much by scripture as it is defined by Christ's death on the cross to save you and me.

    Christ's blessings be with you.

  • Catholic Caucus: Ecce!

    04/08/2002 8:00:22 PM PDT · 37 of 116
    father_elijah to father_elijah; Askel5; eastsider; All
    Sing of Mary, pure and lowly,
    Virgin Mother undefiled;
    sing of God's own Son most holy,
    who became her little child.
    Fairest child of fairest Mother,
    God the Lord who came to earth,
    Word made flesh, our very brother,
    shares our nature by his birth.

    Sing of Jesus, son of Mary,
    in the home at Nazareth,
    toil and labor cannot weary
    love enduring unto death.
    Constant was the love he gave her,
    though he went forth from her side,
    forth to preach, and heal, and suffer
    till on Calvary he died.

    Sing of Mary, sing of Jesus,
    holy Mother's holier Son.
    From his throne in heaven he sees us,
    thither calls us every one,
    where he welcomes home his Mother
    to a place at his right hand,
    there his faithful servants gather,
    there the crownèd victors stand.

    Joyful Mother, full of gladness,
    in thine arms thy Lord was borne.
    Mournful Mother, full of sadness,
    all thy heart with pain was torn.
    Glorious Mother, now rewarded
    with a crown at Jesus' hand,
    age to age thy name recorded
    shall be blessed in every land.

    Glory be to God the Father;
    glory be to God the Son;
    glory be to God the Spirit;
    glory to the Three in One.
    From the heart of Blessèd Mary,
    from all saints the song ascends,
    and the Church the strain reechoes
    unto earth's remotest ends.

    ------------------------
    Words: Roland Ford Palmer, 1914

  • Catholic Caucus: Ecce!

    04/08/2002 7:51:38 PM PDT · 36 of 116
    father_elijah to Sursum Corda; Unam Sanctam; dighton;
    ping!
  • The Neverending Story (The Christian Chronicles)

    04/08/2002 7:41:32 PM PDT · 2,168 of 65,537
    father_elijah to DouglasKC
    Obedience to God and Christ is love...

    I disagree especially with reference to the Scripture you quoted. I believe the most one can say is "obedience to God and Christ is evidence of love."

    John 13:34
    A new commandment I give to you, that you love one another; even as I have loved you, that you also love one another.

    Ephesians 2:15
    by abolishing in his flesh the law of commandments and ordinances, that he might create in himself one new man in place of the two, so making peace,

    1 John 2:7
    Beloved, I am writing you no new commandment, but an old commandment which you had from the beginning; the old commandment is the word which you have heard.

    2 John 1:5
    And now I beg you, lady, not as though I were writing you a new commandment, but the one we have had from the beginning, that we love one another.

    The Apostle John also said, "Little children let us love one another, for love is of God."

  • The Neverending Story (The Christian Chronicles)

    04/08/2002 7:16:17 PM PDT · 2,161 of 65,537
    father_elijah to Havoc
    The new covenant requires obediance every bit as much as the old.

    No, the category of obedience is incorrect. The New Covenant requires love which is willing to follow Jesus through the empowerment of the Holy Spirit.

  • The Neverending Story (The Christian Chronicles)

    04/08/2002 7:09:33 PM PDT · 2,159 of 65,537
    father_elijah to Havoc
    Obedience to the Law is very different from the freedom in Christ to walk in the Spirit. It is a another way of reflecting on the language of Christ that he no longer calls us servants but "friends".
  • Regarding the Sins of Catholics, and a Paradigm Shift in Catholic Apologetics

    04/08/2002 7:05:36 PM PDT · 14 of 164
    father_elijah to Dr. Brian Kopp
    Well done. To underscore the point -- the falling apart of the Anglican Communion can be traced to their tragic decision with regard to contraception. Everything unravelled from that point on. A great pity.
  • The Neverending Story (The Christian Chronicles)

    04/08/2002 6:51:26 PM PDT · 2,145 of 65,537
    father_elijah to OLD REGGIE; pegleg; Titanites
    If you want to see God telling them what to do, you will no doubt see that in very stark terms. That is not what the early Christians saw, nor is it what the living theologies of three of the most ancient Christian churches have to say.

    The Peshitto and the lectionaries of the Syrian Orthodox and the Chaldeans are very venerable. And you will get vigorous arguments from their scholars as to which is more reliable - the Koine Greek text or theirs. Then there are the Armenians who are always ready to challenge the idea that Koine Greek is the most exact language and make a good case that their Armenian version is more reliable -- a version which also points up the difference in discourse between Zechariah and Mary. These many old translations provide multiple attestation in different locales of the same sense of the difference between Mary and Zechariah's response. You can also consult the sermons of the early church fathers and find this same distinction drawn.

    All of that provides the background in which to understand a culture that is different from our own and which employed a language different than English and certainly different than NT Greek.

    You won't find much in the early church fathers to support your view that God told them what to do and they obeyed. These three stories -- Zechariah, the Annunciation to Mary, and the Damascus Road experience of Paul all point to a theology of the person in the early church that can be summed up as a theology of participation. Under the Law, we were called to obey. Under the New Covenant, we are called to participate through the cleansing of the Blood of Christ and the enlightening power of the Holy Spirit.

  • CFAA calls for denial of sacraments to Governor Gray Davis

    04/08/2002 3:40:35 PM PDT · 51 of 58
    father_elijah to Grampa Dave; kidd; Gophack; saradippity; EODGUY; Dr. Brian Kopp; Diago; Diago; Diago; Askel5...
    We must start with prayer first!Let us all pray sincerely and whole-heartedly for Bishop Weigand.

    Let me suggest that Davis will only be denied the Sacraments after
    lay people print up leaflets saying

    "I'm sorry, Gov. Davis. You are not a Catholic. You are an abortionist! Therefore you can't take communion anymore in any Catholic Church!"

    and put them on every car at every Mass at every parish
    . There is precedent for this kind of lay action accomplishing such a goal.

    Now many apparatchiks of the AmChurch will say "Who are you to say this?" But don't worry about them. They are already six steps into Hell as it is. But if lay action sets the tone -- I am talking about huge widespread lay action -- the bishops who are tired, frightened, angry, and afraid -- will eventually follow.

    I never thought I would live to see such a day, or imagine that I would write something like this post. But when the flock is without a shepherd, I guess the sheepdogs still need to do their job.

  • The Neverending Story (The Christian Chronicles)

    04/08/2002 3:20:35 PM PDT · 2,091 of 65,537
    father_elijah to OLD REGGIE
    Greetings. If you read the Peshito -- the New Testament in Aramaic -- or the lectionaries of the Chaldeans or Syrian Orthodox, Christians the difference between Zechariah and Mary are clear. It can also be seen in the translations of the New Testament into Hebrew and into Arabic. Zechariah's expression contains an expression of doubt. Mary's expression contains a request for information. In English translations the distinctions are hard to see, but in the Semitic languages it is very clear indeed. Zechariah responds with doubt. Mary responds with a question. One deserves punishment. The other is a welcome inquiry. It is pretty simple really.

    Paul's situation is really quite different, but he has a choice of whether or not to go into the city. He has a choice to go in faith and find what is promised, or he can literally wander blind for the rest of his life.

  • Catholic Caucus: Ecce!

    04/08/2002 3:06:26 PM PDT · 32 of 116
    father_elijah to ELS
    Another for the Solemnity of the Annunciation:


    Waterhouse's oft-forgotten Annunciation.
  • Catholic Caucus: Ecce!

    04/08/2002 10:38:12 AM PDT · 24 of 116
    father_elijah to father_elijah
    Forgive an old priest who can't type....one more time.


    A Blessed Feast of the Annunciation to One and to All!
  • Catholic Caucus: Ecce!

    04/08/2002 10:25:31 AM PDT · 22 of 116
    father_elijah to codie; al_c; SoothingDave
    A Blessed Feast of the Annunication to One and to All!