Posts by Medium Rare

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  • US importing Indian anthrax 'kits'

    12/01/2002 8:27:11 PM PST · 10 of 11
    Medium Rare to Fred Mertz
    The price was quoted at 25-30 rupees per test. The Rupee closed at about 48 to the dollar last Friday. That would make the cost per test between 52 and 63 cents.
  • FBI's Theory On Anthrax Is Doubted (Evidence points to a state sponsor)

    10/31/2002 8:30:38 PM PST · 55 of 59
    Medium Rare to okie01
    See the following article.

    Source: Baltimore Sun, December 12, 2001.

    Anthrax matches Army spores

    Bioterror: Organisms made at a military laboratory in Utah are genetically identical to those mailed to members of Congress.

    By Scott Shane, Sun Staff

    For nearly a decade, U.S. Army scientists at Dugway Proving Ground in Utah have made small quantities of weapons-grade anthrax that is virtually identical to the powdery spores used in the mail attacks that have killed five people, government sources say.

    Until the anthrax attacks led to tighter security measures, anthrax grown at Dugway was regularly sent by Federal Express to the Army's biodefense center at Fort Detrick, in Frederick, where the bacteria were killed using gamma radiation before being returned to Dugway for experiments.

    The anthrax was shipped in the form of a coarse paste, not in the far more dangerous finely milled form, according to one government official.

    Most anthrax testing at Dugway, in a barren Utah desert 87 miles southwest of Salt Lake City, is done using the killed spores to reduce the chance of accidental exposure of workers there.

    But some experiments require live anthrax, milled to the tiny particle size expected on a battlefield, to test both decontamination techniques and biological agent detection systems, the sources say.

    Anthrax is also grown at the U.S. Army Medical Research Institute of Infectious Diseases at Fort Detrick, where it is used chiefly to test the effectiveness of vaccines in animals.

    But that medical program uses a wet aerosol fog of anthrax rather than the dry powder used in the attacks and at Dugway, according to interviews and medical journal articles based on the research.

    The wet anthrax, while still capable of killing people, is safer for laboratory workers to handle, scientists say. Dugway's production of weapons-grade anthrax, which has never before been publicly revealed, is apparently the first by the U.S. government since President Richard M. Nixon ordered the U.S. offensive biowarfare program closed in 1969.

    Scientists familiar with the anthrax program at Dugway described it to The Sun on the condition that they not be named.

    The offensive program made hundreds of kilograms of anthrax for bombs designed to kill enemy troops over hundreds of square miles.

    Dugway's Life Sciences Division makes the deadly spores in far, far smaller quantities, rarely accumulating more than 10 grams at a time, according to one Army official. Scientists estimate that the letter sent to Senate Majority Leader Tom Daschle originally contained about 2 grams of anthrax, about one-sixteenth of an ounce, or the weight of a dime.

    But its extraordinary concentration - in the range of 1 trillion spores per gram - meant that the letter could have contained 200 million times the average dose necessary to kill a person.

    Dugway's weapons-grade anthrax has been milled to achieve a similar concentration, according to one person familiar with the program.

    The concentration exceeds that of weapons anthrax produced by the old U.S. offensive program or the Soviet biowarfare program, according to Dr. Richard O. Spertzel, who worked at Detrick for 18 years and later served as a United Nations bioweapons inspector in Iraq.

    Lab security measures

    No evidence linking the Dugway anthrax to the attacks has been made public, and there might well be none. Army officials say the anthrax there and at Fort Detrick has long been protected by multiple security measures. The FBI has extensively questioned Dugway employees who have had access to anthrax, according to people familiar with the investigation.

    Agents also have questioned people at Fort Detrick and other government and university laboratories that have used the Ames strain of anthrax found in the letters. Still, the analysis of the genetic and physical properties of the anthrax mailed to Daschle and Sen. Patrick J. Leahy has caused investigators to take a hard look at Dugway's anthrax program.

    First, the genetic fingerprint of the mailed anthrax is indistinguishable from that of the Ames "reference strain," which is the strain used most often at Fort Detrick and Dugway, according to a scientist familiar with the genetic work.

    Researchers led by Paul Keim at Northern Arizona University have compared the two samples and found them identical at 50 genetic markers - the most sensitive genetic identification method available. That does not mean the mailed anthrax necessarily originated from an Army program, because Ames anthrax has been widely used at government and university laboratories in the United States and overseas.

    Shipped without records

    While some sources have estimated Ames might have been used in as few as 20 labs, one scientist who has worked with anthrax said the total cannot be known exactly, but is probably closer to 50.

    "Until the last few years, a graduate student would call up a friend at another lab and say, 'Send me Ames,' and they'd do it," the scientist said. "There wouldn't necessarily be any records kept."

    Ames is similar to but distinct from the Vollum1B strain of anthrax used in the old U.S. offensive biological weapons program.

    The genetic testing proves the mailed anthrax was not left over from the old program, most scientists agree. Even more provocative than the genetics are the physical properties of the mailed anthrax. While some scientists disagree, many bioterrorism experts argue that the quality of the mailed anthrax is such that it could have been produced only in a weapons program or using information from such a program.

    Link to Dugway base

    If true, that would greatly limit the field, increasing the likelihood of a link to the only site in the United States where weapons-grade anthrax has been made in recent years.

    Dugway, which is larger than Rhode Island, has been a military testing ground since World War II, when military officials selected it for its remote location in Utah's Great Salt Lake Desert.

    The Dugway anthrax program was launched in the early 1990s, shortly after the Persian Gulf war reawakened U.S. military commanders to the threat from biological weapons. Iraq is known to have built a major bioweapons program that included anthrax in its potential arsenal.

    According to Dugway's Web site, the proving ground's Life Sciences Division has an aerosol technology branch and a biotechnology branch, both of which use a Biosafety Level 3 laboratory designed to contain pathogens.

    Anthrax and other dangerous germs at Dugway are guarded by video cameras, intrusion alarms, double locks and a buddy system that does not permit workers to handle the agents alone, according to one scientist.

    But Dugway does not have a gamma radiation machine, which is why its anthrax has been shipped to Detrick for irradiation.

    Dr. David L. Huxsoll, who headed Detrick's biodefense program in the 1980s, said vaccines and detection systems must be tested against aerosolized anthrax if troops are to be prepared for biological attacks.

    "When you're building a program to defend against biological weapons on the battlefield, you have to be prepared for an aerosol exposure," he said.

    Not a treaty violation

    Milton Leitenberg, an expert on bioweapons at the University of Maryland, said he was not aware of the Dugway anthrax production.

    But he said making a few grams of weapons-grade anthrax for testing defensive equipment would not violate the international convention on biological weapons. The treaty bans the production of bioagents "of types and in quantities that have no justification for prophylactic, protective and other peaceful purposes."

    "There's no specific limit in grams or micrograms," Leitenberg said. "But if you got up in the hundreds of grams, people would be very, very skeptical."

    The FBI's investigation, called Amerithrax, has focused on the possibility that the anthrax terrorist might be a loner in this country with some scientific training. The Sun reported Sunday that in two months, none of the hundreds of FBI agents on the case had contacted the Army retirees who produced anthrax in the 1950s and 1960s. Yesterday, one of those anthrax veterans, Orley R. Bourland Jr. of Walkersville, got a call from the White House Office of Homeland Security seeking information. The FBI had not made contact with several veterans interviewed yesterday.

  • FBI's Theory On Anthrax Is Doubted (Evidence points to a state sponsor)

    10/31/2002 5:23:53 PM PST · 54 of 59
    Medium Rare to Alamo-Girl
    While it is true that Patrick's involvement started many years ago, it has continued to this day through his consultant status with the CIA and Battelle.

    I don't know when the one trillion spores per gram was perfected. I hadn't heard of it until the mail incidents. If you have information as to when it was perfected I would certainly apreciate you sharing it.

    In the meantime, consider the following.

    According to the BIOHAZARD NEWS publication, "a 1997 article in a scientific journal reported that Russian scientists had implanted into the anthrax microbe genes that cause food poisoning, producing a strain that was resistant to Russia's anthrax vaccine." (Could Alibek have planted the story?)

    At any rate, U.S. authorities requested a sample from Russia with which to test the U.S. vaccine but were unsuccessful when Russia denied ever having produced such a strain.

    Thus was born the "Jefferson Project." The CIA was tasked with developing more deadly anthrax bacteria to use in testing U.S. vaccines. The CIA chose its often used contractor Battelle (BMI) to host the project.

    Production was to be at Battelle’s state of the art facility for making aerosol products for commercial and military use. Some researchers believe this may be the facility at which William Patrick perfected the process that resulted in the one trillion-spore concentration rather than at the army’s Dugway, Utah facility, which is also controlled by Battelle.

    The aerosol facility is located in West Jefferson, Ohio hence the name of the project. No results of the project have been announced.

  • FBI's Theory On Anthrax Is Doubted (Evidence points to a state sponsor)

    10/28/2002 11:04:06 PM PST · 30 of 59
    Medium Rare to Alamo-Girl
    The article is a mixture of truth and disinformation obviously meant to lead to the conclusion that a foreign government is responsible, i.e. Iraq.

    The U.S. is the only producer of the one trillion spores per gram aerosolized anthrax. The process is patented (secret patents) by William Patrick. The anthrax has been produced by Battelle Memorial Institute at the army facility in Dugway, Utah and in Battelle's own facility at West Jefferson, Ohio. Both Patrick and Ken Alibek are consultants to Battelle and the CIA on bio/chemical weapons and specifically anthrax.

    If you go to the Washington Post site you will see a link beside this article that purports to show all the possible sources in the world.

    The map in the graphic shows a number of sites around the world including one that corresponds to Fort Detrick. The only problem is that none of those sites are known to have the capability of producing the one trillion spores per gram.

    The only two sites that have that capability (Battelle's two sites in Utah and Ohio)are missing from the map.

    I would call that disinformation by omission.

  • FBI Terrorizes Hatfill

    08/27/2002 11:34:29 AM PDT · 153 of 159
    Medium Rare to Wurlitzer
    the Constitution covers such behavior if we would only apply it..



    08/21/2002 7:09:52 AM PDT · 2 of 2
    Medium Rare to Medium Rare
    Check out the stock ownership of "non-profit" organizations near the end of the article.

    08/20/2002 8:30:12 PM PDT · 1 of 2
    Medium Rare

    08/14/2002 3:13:00 PM PDT · 21 of 21
    Medium Rare to First_Salute
    As old as my article is, it still has some relevant information.
  • Bojinka The Dog That Didn't Bark

    06/25/2002 6:54:46 PM PDT · 57 of 58
    Medium Rare to exodus
    Thanks. Jim.
  • Bojinka The Dog That Didn't Bark

    06/25/2002 6:41:30 PM PDT · 56 of 58
    Medium Rare to dead
    The theory is patently absurd

    No more absurd than FDR sacrificing over 2,000 of our military at Pearl Harbor to get us into World War II.

  • Bojinka The Dog That Didn't Bark

    06/25/2002 6:34:27 PM PDT · 55 of 58
    Medium Rare to CJ Wolf
    CNN did not mention the most important part which was the hijacking of domestic flights and crashing them into buildings. Of course the only ones that knew that at the time seem to have been the CIA, FBI, State Department and Department of Justice (which cited Project Bojinka when prosecuting the terrorists for the first part of the plot to blow up 11 planes over the Pacific Ocean simultaneously).

    Who are you shilling for?

  • Bojinka The Dog That Didn't Bark

    06/25/2002 6:26:21 PM PDT · 54 of 58
    Medium Rare to nickcarraway
    Clinton was president from Jan. 1993 to Jan. 2001.
  • House Democrats Sue President Bush Over Withdrawal From ABM Treaty (Desperation Tactics 2002)

    06/11/2002 9:12:27 PM PDT · 39 of 47
    Medium Rare to Lurking Libertarian
    The US successfully used this doctrine to keep the USSR from getting out of treaties signed by Czarist Russia, and it is equally applicable now to bind Russia to treaties signed by the USSR.

    That was a succession of governments in the same country. The dissolution of the USSR was more than a change of government, it dissolved a country.

  • Man who killed burglar faces manslaughter charge

    05/28/2002 8:40:25 PM PDT · 38 of 63
    Medium Rare to mdittmar
    I was merely pointing out that it happened in Washington, not California as you stated.
  • Man who killed burglar faces manslaughter charge

    05/27/2002 6:27:11 PM PDT · 5 of 63
    Medium Rare to Euro-American Scum
    This happened in Chehalis in the State of Washington.

    05/18/2002 12:33:35 AM PDT · 8 of 8
    Medium Rare to the
    That's great!! Just what I needed for my article. Thanks

    05/17/2002 5:36:04 PM PDT · 6 of 8
    Medium Rare to the
    Don't see it. Are you sure it posted?

    05/17/2002 2:23:11 PM PDT · 4 of 8
    Medium Rare to the
    Can you edit that to show CFR on the badge and just large dollar signs on the cookie jar?

    05/17/2002 10:09:01 AM PDT · 1 of 8
    Medium Rare
  • SEC Broadens Its Investigation Into Revenue-Boosting Tricks

    05/16/2002 5:26:43 AM PDT · 3 of 6
    Medium Rare to machman
    Ah, how we all long for the Clinton years

    I thought most of the 1990's were Clinton years when all of this started and "prospered."


    04/29/2002 8:51:35 AM PDT · 1 of 1
    Medium Rare

    04/25/2002 11:13:17 PM PDT · 13 of 15
    Medium Rare to NotJustAnotherPrettyFace;Uncle Bill
    When J. Edgar Hoover died Nixon appointed L. Patrick Gray as acting FBI Director. Shortly after the Watergate scandal broke. When Gray was fingered for destroying evidence in the Watergate coverup, he withdrew his name for Senate confirmation and resigned.

    Nixon then appointed Ruckelshaus as Acting Director. He served from April 27, 1973 until July 9, 1973 when Clarence Kelley was confirmed by the Senate as the new director.

    Kelley was Chief of Police of Kansas City at the time but prior to that had spent 21 years as an FBI agent.


    04/25/2002 9:02:59 PM PDT · 12 of 15
    Medium Rare to Black Agnes
    Couldn't find any of that on the web. We can rely on the FBI to look into that (sarcasm).

    04/24/2002 10:52:18 PM PDT · 9 of 15
    Medium Rare to NotJustAnotherPrettyFace
    Are those articles available on-line? If so, please provide the links here

    No. But if you will give me your E-mail address by private reply I will send them to you.



    04/24/2002 7:11:22 PM PDT · 2 of 15
    Medium Rare to Black Jade;Alamo Girl

    04/24/2002 6:12:23 PM PDT · 1 of 15
    Medium Rare
  • Engaging the Irritating Europeans

    04/23/2002 1:54:54 PM PDT · 24 of 29
    Medium Rare to Alamo-Girl
    From your response it is obvius you have seen the numerous articles admitting the U.S. has continued production of "weaponized" anthrax and other biowar agents. Of course the claim is that this is only for purposes of testing defensive measures (as permitted by the treaty).

    The only difference between offensive and defensive production is the quantity.

    Some government "experts" have said it would take eight to ten thousand spores of inhaled anthrax to fatally infect a person. However, one expert at Ft. Detrick said it could take as few as 100 to 200 spores.

    Even at 10,000 spores, the envelope addressed to Sen. Leahy had enough anthrax to kill 250 million people with optimum delivery capability. The envelope contained 2.5 grams at one trillion spores per gram.

    Since the quantity produced by the U.S. program is a closly held secret, we don't know how much has been produced, and they are not about to tell us.

    Maybe someone should ask Gov. Ridge. He seems to be a fount of information (sarcasm).

  • Engaging the Irritating Europeans

    04/23/2002 12:05:21 PM PDT · 22 of 29
    Medium Rare to Navy Patriot;Alamo_Girl
    That is not the only factual misrepresentation in the article.

    Despite earlier dismissals, the latest reports on the anthrax sent to the U.S. Capitol suggest a sophistication exceeding anything seen in now-defunct U.S. and Soviet biological weapons programs. And the FBI has been sitting on evidence that one of the hijackers was treated for what the physician now believes was cutaneous anthrax

    First, the U.S. bioweapon program is not defunct. It has been proceeding apace since Nixon's public and hypocritical announcement we were ending it.It is not reasonable to assume that the U.S. state of the art has not progressed since 1970.

    We have only one unconfirmed news report (repeated ad nausium in the media) that the mailed anthrax is any more technilogically advanced than the one trillion spores per gram the U.S. (alone) had in 1970. And that report was deliberately vague about how it was more advanced.

    Also one would have to believe that our best testing methods were not used in the orignal assay that announced the anthrax was identical to the 1970 U.S. military anthrax. Or did we suddenly in several months upgrade our testing ability ?

    Secondly, the Florida physician, after coaching and coaxing by government officials, finally relented and said it might have been anthrax.

    In my opionion, this is disinformation intended as part of the propaganda campaign to generate public support for attacking Iraq. There may very well be good reasons for a preemptive strike against Iraq, but the anthrax attack is not yet one of them.

  • Remember Anthrax?

    04/21/2002 5:28:52 AM PDT · 35 of 36
    Medium Rare to Mitchell
    The point is to get Iraq and anthrax metioned together in a critical mass of news stories so that the eventual "official" connection doesn't come out of the blue (which would make it lack credibility for a lot of people).

    You are right on the mark there. However, I'm not sure the article is that factual. The writer (who is only an editorial writer, not a science writer) picks and chooses from the spate of (deliberately) conflicting mis and dis information pieces put out recently.

    The Weekly Standard is one of the "neo-con" organs beating the drums for war with Iraq. I think this article has to be taken with more than the proverbial grain of salt.


    04/03/2002 8:22:13 AM PST · 26 of 44
    Medium Rare to Black Jade
    Big bump post #10
  • Saudi prince buys $1 billion more Increases stakes in Citigroup, AOL, Priceline

    04/02/2002 9:30:31 PM PST · 33 of 36
    Medium Rare to Black Jade
    The Royal House of Saud does have various investments in Citigroup. Citibank was also used to launder Osama Bin Laden's money

    Let us not forget that Fuad el Hibri was in charge of Citibank operations and credit in Saudi Arabia at one time. He was also managing director of Porton Down, the British biowar facility that received the Ames strain of anthrax from the U.S.

    El Hibri, of course, is currently the CEO of Bioport, the U.S. counterpart of Porton Down as far as anthrax vaccine is concerned.


    03/27/2002 7:00:40 PM PST · 39 of 41
    Medium Rare to boston_liberty
    Headquarters Department of the Army Washington, DC, 1 August 2001 FM 3-19.40 MILITARY POLICE INTERNMENT/RESETTLEMENT OPERATIONS

    That too. There are several things that dovetail into the overall plan. There is the earlier "compact" that allows National Guard units to be used in any "member" state. The guard from another state would be more willing to enforce the orders than one made up of home town guardsmen.

    National Guardsmen have been included in the Urban Warrior training going on for the last several years.

    There is this compact which triggers all kinds of things including suspension of statutes and ordinances when a governor declares any emergency.

    Then there is the Model Health Emergency Act coming down the road, which isn't really needed to incarcerate civilians but will be used for forced vaccinations. What will be in those vaccines is the $64,000 question.


    03/27/2002 6:47:58 PM PST · 38 of 41
    Medium Rare to bjcintennessee
    This, however, sounds more like a potential assault on US citizens who might not adhere to the government's 'emergency' plans.

    Yes. The first (but not the last) use of the camps may very well be to "quarantine" those who refuse the vaccines in a declared "health" emergency.

  • A Northern Alliance for Chechnya

    03/26/2002 6:12:34 AM PST · 9 of 13
    Medium Rare to KirkandBurke;Black Jade
    What a tangled web we know the rest of the quote.

    There are two interests involved here, keeping the Russian oil pipeline that traverses Chechnya open and the same with the flow of narcotics.

    As I previously posted, according to CFR sources, there appears to be a quid pro quo between the U.S. and Russia. The U.S. was to look the other way as Russia solidifies its position in Chechnya and Russia would not object to U.S. domination of Afghanistan and a portion of Caspian Sea oil.

    I believe that agreement is still in effect.

  • Osama's family under probe in France

    03/26/2002 6:00:21 AM PST · 25 of 26
    Medium Rare to Black Jade
    Methinks they (the bin Ladens)doth protest too much.
  • Anthrax-CIA connection?

    03/25/2002 7:18:42 AM PST · 56 of 79
    Medium Rare to Black Jade
    Thanks for the ping. I have read most of the posts on this thread and it is obvious who is trying to deflect suspicion from the CIA.

    The "Ames strain" as the identifying characteristic is a red herring. While it is true that the mailed anthrax was of the Ames strain, the characteristic that pins it to the U.S. military and CIA is the one trillion spores per gram concentration of the mailed anthrax. No other country in the world has been able to achieve more than half that concentration.

    The process was developed by William Patrick who holds five secret patents on the process. He has extensive ties with the CIA and military at Ft. Detrick.

    There are only abut five locations from which the anthrax could have come. All have direct or indirect ties to the CIA.

    If Saddam or any other foreign entity came into possession of the anthrax, it was furnished to them by one of the five locations.

    Finally, Rosenberg has backed off of her original position in that she is supporting the "rogue" U.S. expert theory. If the CIA was involved, it would have been with the approval or at the direction of higher authority.

    I don't buy the "rogue" theory for a second.

  • U.S.-Chinese high-technology trade

    03/23/2002 7:55:12 AM PST · 12 of 17
    Medium Rare to Black Jade
    Bump post #9
  • Pakistanis shot, Bosnians, Jordanians arrested in Macedonia raid (US/NATO Embassy Attacks Thwarted)

    03/19/2002 4:47:59 PM PST · 129 of 174
    Medium Rare to Black Jade
    Thanks for the ping. I almost gave up wading through all that infantile racial name calling.

    You quote, "They are even involved in the training of the Kosovo Protection Corps," said Trajanov, adding that it was here that the roots of the so-called NLA lay.”

    Is that in addition to the training Dyncorp is giving on behalf of our state depaatment?


    03/18/2002 12:12:35 PM PST · 12 of 41
    Medium Rare to Medium Rare;Black Jade;Alamo Girl
    Heads up!

    03/18/2002 12:06:16 PM PST · 11 of 41
    Medium Rare to headsonpikes
    Wishful thinking does have a tendency to divorce one from reality.

    03/18/2002 11:17:19 AM PST · 7 of 41
    Medium Rare to DLfromthedesert
    Well, just elect state reps and governors you can trust

    The problem is determining ahead of time which politicans can be trusted. The odds aren't all that good.


    03/18/2002 11:12:53 AM PST · 6 of 41
    Medium Rare to 11B3
    Gee, I hope you're right. Somehow I don't think it's aimed at the Muslims. How many of them are there in the other forty-nine states?

    03/18/2002 10:31:32 AM PST · 1 of 41
    Medium Rare
  • Vancouver port riddled with crime, senators say: Gangs, triads, narco-terrorists cited by B.C. polic

    03/16/2002 4:40:56 AM PST · 11 of 27
    Medium Rare to Black Jade
    For more corruption, murder and suicides read the following report on the Vancouver Stock Exchange.

  • U.S. and Libya inch toward end to 20-year estrangement

    03/15/2002 5:58:24 AM PST · 6 of 11
    Medium Rare to steve50;Black Jade
    The CIA and its predecessor the OSS have, from the very beginning, been the enforcement arm of the elitists that control the Council on Foreign Relations and its several hundred spinoffs.

    03/14/2002 6:03:59 AM PST · 101 of 102
    Medium Rare to Black Jade
    Sometimes punctuation does make a difference. A new sentence starts with:

    "William S. Cohen, Steven J. Green; Maria Elena Lagomasino; and Geoffrey J.W. Kent. Norman Brownstein and Eric Hippeau have resigned from the Global Crossing board."


    03/13/2002 5:45:38 AM PST · 9 of 11
    Medium Rare to Black Jade
    Thanks. Another irony is the fact (little noted in the media) that Ken Lay is a member of the Trilateral Commission, Rockefeller's spinoff from the Council on Foreign Relations. I wonder what they discuss at those meetings.

    Also, since I wrote the article, we hear that Enron paid $400 million for a "study" of a potential pipe line transiting Afghanistan with a large share of the money going to the Taliban and bin Laden.

  • A new terror-war front: the Caucasus

    03/08/2002 5:56:56 AM PST · 5 of 7
    Medium Rare to Black Jade
  • Lockerbie bomb 'was loaded at Heathrow'

    03/07/2002 4:35:23 AM PST · 16 of 23
    Medium Rare to Black Jade
    Why is it always a "rogue" element of the CIA that does the black operations that become public? It seems to me the real "rogues" in the CIA are the ones who try to blow the whistle.
  • Terror Threat Inches Tbilisi Closer [US pushes Georgia to Work With Russia Against Terrorism]

    03/04/2002 7:50:22 PM PST · 18 of 18
    Medium Rare to Black Jade
    I think you hit it on the nose.