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Thank you for the detailed information. I have a special interest in boloid and volcanic influence on earth history.

Since you have put considerable effort into Antarctic study, I was wondering if you have any thoughts, feelings, conjectures on the apparent thawed state of parts of Antarctica that seem to be shown on the Piri Reis (sp?) map.

INDEED.

exactly when did conservatives not give a damn about conservation? The Pope is NOT jumping on the global warming bandwagon. He is, however, saying that the environment is important in the future of mankind.....duh!

In his address, called "If You Want to Cultivate Peace, Protect Creation," the pope said peace with the natural environment is the beginning of peace with all of God's creation, including people.

"Respect for creation is of immense consequence, not least because creation is the beginning and the foundation of all God's works, and its preservation has now become essential for the pacific coexistence of mankind," the pope said.

The reason I brought up socialism and Marxism is because that is the most common misconception that people have about Christianity— especially that Catholicism embraces Marxism and hates Capitalism. Take Michael Moore, for instance, and his propaganda.

The Pope is concerned with the souls of man and morality. It is immoral to pollute the earth and injure animals and create a land that would not sustain future generations. Since the earth is essential for the survival of man, how could that be out of his bailiwick? Although man has dominion over the earth, the Pope’s point is that with that we also have an obligation and responsibility. There actually is nothing controversial about the Pope’s views in a sane world with rational people.

True, specifics can be disputed, and, indeed, the search for Truth in ongoing and never ending. There are absolutes, though, underscored by Natural Law, that are fundamental to the Catholic Church that can never change.

Science, though, is always changing and I am sure that the Pope understands the science behind cloning, abortions, ecology, euthanasia, etc., all which have moral aspects which the Church can not ignore. To base a Catholic opinion on the reigning science of the day will happen since all Catholics unable to study or understand prevailing science will need guidance on the morality of the situations. I am sure the Pope understands the human fallibility and the immorality of man who use “science” to try and control people’s productivity, manipulate human emotions, and endeavor to enslave and destroy man’s soul.

I just have found the Pope’s thinking to be profound and clear and I have never disagreed with anything he has written so far (not that I have read everything). He certainly has put many years into critical thinking, time that I will never have nor will I have the inclination to do. Most people do not have the time nor resources to reflect on life and God the way the Pope has had.

Since Classical education has been dumped by most educational institutions, most people with their post modern German thinking are not even worth listening to—their moral relativism goes against Natural Law and God’s Laws and the Constitution of this country.

Is the Pope a global warmist, or is this run of the mill ecological stewardship stuff.

Pro-homosexuality? What do you mean? I know they pray for homosexuals, but they’re not pro-homosexuality as far as I’ve seen! It seems to me that Benedict 16, long before he was the Pope, disciplined a priest and a nun for being to lenient in working with gays in California!

I don’t remember when it was, maybe 10-12 years ago. He felt they were getting too lenient with them, and called them on it. I remember some gay group was crabbing about him at the time. It seems that they take a love the sinner-hate the sin position in dealing with gay people.

Ah, yes, it is.

No. The science is not corrupt. It is the politicians.

The central lesson of Climategate is not that climate science is corrupt.

Ah, yes, it is.

Science is not corrupt. That's just a method for determining natural laws. Scientists are corrupt.

So, you obviously grew up to be become an Earth Scientist? ;-)

So how was the wine???

I liked it. Time to feed the catz and go to bed.

Re-analyzing data and scientists correcting each other is the normal mode of scientific progress. It happens all the time. That is how science advances.

But usually there aren't trillions of dollars in plunder riding on a particular result.

aughta boy!

I haven't found the original of what the Holy Father said in this instance...

Links to the English translation were provided in posts #55 and #56. It's not too long -- about 6 pages of text when printed.

BTW Norman I sort of half-retracted my original statement in post #50, if you want to look.

Savage,

When the Pope goes outside of his bailiwick, it is the duty of Catholics to examine what he says with filial piety, with seriousness, and with an intention to conform as much as conscience, etc will allow, BUT specific suggestions about specific courses of action may properly be disagreed with.

I am all over care for the environment and for good teaching about such responsibility. I haven't found the original of what the Holy Father said in this instance, though I have read several of his other works, and I have no quarrel with what Popes have been saying since De Rerum Novarum about socialism and Marxism. In fact, I'm a little surprised that socialism and Marxism came up in your rebuke of me.

Well it’s converted from Italian of course :)

I think what really happened with the Antarctic glaciation timeline is that:

1) Antarctica was already more-or-less over the South Pole as early as 60 million years ago and a few glaciers developed on the higher mountain ranges particularly about 42 million years ago; but,

2) It was also connected to South America and Australia at the time so that the ocean currents were mixed with mid-latitude/tropical ocean currents in gyres in the Pacific and the Atlantic/Indian Oceans which keep it reasonably warm - still frigid in the Winter but the snow and ice melted in the Summer.

3) About 34 million years ago, enough separation occured between South America and Australia, that the Antarctic Circumpolar Current developed which isolated Antarctica in an extreme polar climate.

4) It rapidly glaciated over after this.

5) About 27 million years ago, some jostling of the small cratons between South America and Antarctica closed off the Antarctic Circumpolar Current again and the glaciers melted back considerably.

6) About 14 million years ago, the Circumpolar Current was re-established and Antarctica glaciated over again.

7) About 2.5 million years ago, the Earth cooled off even more (due to events in the Arctic ocean which are still not explained other than Greenland and the Arctic Archipelago were slowly drifting north), and Antarctica glaciated over even more than previously more-or-less similar to today.

That is my timeline of events and I have spent a lot of time researching this. I could quote about 50 sources but I hate doing that.

Antarctica was also glaciated over between 330 to 290 million years ago, 430 to 420 million years ago and 640 to 600 million years ago when Continental Drift also placed it near the South Pole. It is the unlucky Continent.

B16 must be surrounded by gaia worshippers.

And herein lies the problem. I seriously doubt the Pope used populist rhetoric like “saving” the planet and “going green.” The press spins this and we feed off of their spin.

No thanks