Marijuana Fight Envelops Fisherman's Wharf (San Fran)

The New York Times from Drudge ^ | July 3, 2006 | JESSE McKINLEY

[A CA Guy]

SAN FRANCISCO, July 3 — The newest attraction planned for Fisherman's Wharf, San Francisco's most popular tourist destination, has no sign, no advertisements and not even a scrap of sourdough. Yet everyone seems to think that the new business, the Green Cross, will be a hit, drawing customers from all over the region to sample its aromatic wares.

For some, that is exactly the problem.

"The city is saturated with pot clubs," said T. Wade Randlett, the president of SF SOS, a quality-of-life group that opposes the planned club. "Fisherman's Wharf is a tourism attraction, and this is not the kind of tourism we're trying to attract."

Emboldened by a series of regulations passed last fall by the city's Board of Supervisors, some neighborhoods are resisting new marijuana dispensaries, which they say attract crime and dealers bent on reselling the drugs. In the debate over the new rules last year, several neighborhoods successfully lobbied to be exempted from having new clubs.

Other neighborhoods managed to get clubs shuttered, including a previous version of the Green Cross, which was forced out of a storefront in the city's Mission District after neighbors said they had seen a rise in drug dealing, traffic problems and petty crime, a charge the Green Cross denies.

And while the law was passed with seriously ill patients in mind, like those with AIDS and cancer, some critics say that now even people with commonplace aches and pains can get a doctor's recommendation.

[A CA Guy]

What can I say, anyone here really want to hear the pro-dope advocates tell you anymore that legalizing stuff makes it better and reduces criminal activity?

Here it was made legal and it sprung up pot shops and crime all over the place.

If they do want to continue to allow medical pot, they should have limited dispensaries under better control, all this rise in crime isn't good.

IMO this is just a peak at the problems we'd have if it were all legalized. Just the same, watch the pro-drug crowd overlook the facts and still fight for their dope.

The doctors giving a recommendation to people with commonplace aches and pains is again the dopers getting on back of the really sick folks to get their drugs. These doctors need to be prosecuted IMO.

The law needs to require IMO at least one government approved doctor to verify recommendations for pot and any doctor who prescribes the pot a lot and that appears to be some sort of activist themselves should be possibly removed from being allowed to recommend this stuff at all.

I have no problem with dying people and really bad off people getting some of this stuff in limited fashion and in limited places, but I think you know the law has failed when you get patients and doctors allowing those not that sick to participate in their sacrament of recreational drug use.

The crime popping up is a deal breaker for sure.

[Ostlandr]

Like I keep saying: Let's to a land swap with China, Taiwan for California. Each nation gets rid of a rogue province, China gets millions more socialists and we get millions more capitalists.

And for the record I have no problem with medical marijuana. I just think it should be done legally, by perscription.

[31R1O]

I think that the problem arises from the quasi legal status. In other words there is still money to be made. In my opinion if it were legal for any adult to own and grow their own plants the situation would be different. That doesn't mean do away with DUI and public intoxication laws at all. All that I'm saying that as long as there is a potential black market, the crime and such is going to be an issue.

[xpertskir]

"pro-drug crowd"

AKA "limited government intervention and freedom club"

While I do believe that the government really should not be chosing which drugs are legal(alcohol, oxycontin, ephedra, Valium) and which are dangerous and need to be criminalized(marijuana, LSD, psilocybin, ectasy).

While it is the duty of the state to keep its property owners safe IMO they are overstepping their bounds in classifying substances for personal use as arbitrarily legal or illegal.

[xpertskir]

"pro-drug crowd"

AKA "limited government intervention and freedom club"

While I do believe that the government really should not be chosing which drugs are legal(alcohol, oxycontin, ephedra, Valium) and which are dangerous and need to be criminalized(marijuana, LSD, psilocybin, ectasy).

While it is the duty of the state to keep its property owners safe IMO they are overstepping their bounds in classifying substances for personal use as arbitrarily legal or illegal.

[RonF]

Well, no - it wasn't made legal. If it had been made legal for recreational users, they wouldn't be faking illnesses and getting scrips to go to these pot clubs. And if it was made legal for medicinal purposes only (by which I mean legal at the Federal level), then it would be purchasable at your local CVS/Walgreens/Osco and the pot clubs would go away.

The crime comes from it being legal at the local level, but not at the State or Federal level.

[A CA Guy]

If you read the article, it was done by prescription Ostlandr.
I also have no problem with dying people and real massive problems having access to this stuff. The problem seems to be that people who are not that sick want to practice their sacrament of recreational drug abuse and it is ruining everything it touches.

That was why in my comments I suggested we limit harshly where people can get it.
We need to have an approved doctor who isn't a possible activist verifying the prescriptions and conditions.

China does have some drugs sneak in. A whole bunch comes in from Afghanistan and that could get Afghanistan spanked by China in the future.
I have friends who travel to China on business and for pleasure and hands get cut off at times in connection with drugs and other crimes. Not a great place to be caught using or moving drugs. (though I'm sure their upper class gets what they want)

[A CA Guy]

The pot houses are legal. They are attracting drug dealers to sell their stuff near by.

The problem has grown with the pot houses, so I think we need to limit them to maybe one every few miles.

Also we need to see to it that drug activist doctors can't get away with prescribing for anything shy of the worst cases.
If we see a doctor make a lot of prescriptions for pot, could be they are activist right?

Seems they have to get control of the whole thing, right now you have recreational abusers taking advantage of the current system, along with drug dealers.

[BlueDragon]

Let's see...an increase in traffic at Fisherman's Warf?
How was THAT determined??? Ever tried driving in North Beach? Or any where in S.F.? It's long beeen a good place to get one's car stolen, anyway.

(there was an old joke, attributed to Henny Youngman, addressing S.F.'s long existing parking problem, recently repeated here on another thread ---- he said "I've finally found out how to get a parking spot in San Francisco. Just buy a car that's already parked!")
An increase in "crime"? Like there was something less of an amount of "petty" crime, before that joint moved in?
HA! Just how could anyone say with certainty, "oh, it's the pot dispensary"? Have those committing "petty crimes" been found to have visited the dispensary, much less, "there has been an increase in small crimes, and it is all the pot clubs' fault"? Are they out picking pockets to buy pot? Are they stealing loaves of bread because they have the munchies?
If folks are commiting crimes, it's more because they are criminals, rather than they are either stoned on pot, or trying to get that way. Folks rob liquor stores to buy harder drugs, for the most part ---at least compared to pot.
Booze contributes more to crime, overall, than pot does.
And no, I don't smoke the stuff.
Still, Fisherman's Warf does seem a lousy place for a pot dispensary. What's the need for it to right there? To sell to the occassional geriatric tourist whom suffers chronic pain? Yea, right, like I really believe it's all so innocent.

[pabianice]

warning

[pageonetoo]

Here it was made legal and it sprung up pot shops and crime all over the place.

What specific crime increased? There are no numbers provided, only a casual suggestion, by an interested group.

I have no problem with ...

Like it really matters if you have no problem with it, gal. Waaahhhh, you sound like a charter member of the WCTU! What business of yours, is it is I wanted to sit on the lawn across from the Lincoln Memorial on July 4th, and waft the billowing clouds of burning bud. I will probably even partake a toke or three... along with thousands of others.

I went there a couple years ago. I watched a line of 20 (or so) Park Police winding their way through the clouds (I meant crowds). They hassled a few kids, but mainly were confiscating coolers with booze in them. There were signs clearly posted that you can't drink on Park property...

[A CA Guy]

arbitrarily?

The Food and Drug administration review which drugs are safe, habit forming and which may lead to social problems.

They are pretty good experts and it seems there has been some relief for those really very ill with pot. Problem IMO is that here we have seemingly dopers getting drug activist doctors prescribing left and right.

There are various safe guards in society we placed there through the government (us) which are very good.
Our work environment could be filled with lots of cancer causing drugs and life ending things if there was no government control over what is legal. It is the same exact thing with drugs in our personal life.

I would say everything is give and take, but we can't allow chemical use in our personal life or at work without review, we'd get IMO a ton more people killing themselves and damaging others and I bet the bottom line would be a hell of a lot more public tax dollars out the door.

[pageonetoo]

OOPS! Should read: What business of yours, is it IF I wanted to sit on the lawn across from the Lincoln Memorial on July 4th, and waft the billowing clouds of burning bud.

(btw, they told me they had a good place to dispose of the confiscated beer, etc. They had a party planned later!)

[A CA Guy]

The neighborhood are noticing legalization has brought more crime and drug dealers around the area with these pot shops.

[A CA Guy]

What specific crime increased?

Drug dealing and violent crimes like robbery were mentioned in the article.

What business of yours, is it is I wanted to sit on the lawn across from the Lincoln Memorial on July 4th, and waft the billowing clouds of burning bud. I will probably even partake a toke or three... along with thousands of others.

All those drugged Democrats could get other people hurt or killed with their intoxication in public.

[tertiary01]

Let's swap your state first. We could get rid of those who think like you and we would be miles ahead as a nation.

[Getready]

look up marinol...it is "thc" by prescription for
cancer patients, gives some cancer patients the munchies...

The dopers are just dopes, that's all.
Everybody pays in final analysis. They look fine today, 10
years from now they'll not remember their name. Very
sad indeed that people don't know that "pleasure" is NOT
always perfect.

[xpertskir]

"arbitrarily?

The Food and Drug administration review which drugs are safe, habit forming and which may lead to social problems."

Yes it is seemingly arbitrary...look at the side effects of prescription drugs. Just because all the "effects" side and otherwise are on the box do not make them any safer than drugs that come in baggies.

[xpertskir]

These threads always piss me off.

Conservatism is based in thousands of years of human experience, Liberalism is based in theory.

So those of you without experience choose not to post.

[Ostlandr]

My point exactly. This is similar to the abuse of alcohol under prescription by lax doctors during Prohibition.

My granddad taught me "If the law is wrong, change the law."
The Libs prefer to ignore inconvenient laws.