Skip to comments.Chaos in southern Ukraine: Deadly fire, choppers down and street fighting
Posted on 05/02/2014 8:28:00 PM PDT by Mariner
Slavyansk, Ukraine (CNN) -- Deadly street fighting, helicopters shot down and civilians being used as human shields.
That was the picture that emerged Friday in southern Ukraine as violence escalated amid reports that dozens of people were killed in a fire and still more were shot dead or wounded in street fighting, raising the question of whether the country can stave off a possible civil war.
The violence -- pitting pro-Russian separatists against Ukrainian forces and those who support the government in Kiev -- prompted an emergency meeting of the U.N. Security Council, with Russia demanding an end to what it called Ukrainian aggression and Western powers accusing Moscow of funding the violence.
Russia and the West have squared off diplomatically over the fate of Ukraine, after Moscow annexed Crimea in March following the ouster of Ukrainian President Viktor Yanukovych. He was pushed from office after months of protests by people upset that he had turned away from Europe in favor of Russia.
(Excerpt) Read more at cnn.com ...
The first is that Russia has stirred all this crap up and has infiltrated Ukraine with hundreds of SpecOps inciting, arming and organizing ethnic Russians in an attempt to overthrow a legitimate Urkainian government.
The other is that a bunch of Western "Fascists", aided by NATO Security Services overthrew the legitimately elected government and are intent to mortgage Urkranian assets and culture to Berlin.
I have to admit I tend toward the second explanation, but also respect the perspective of others.
I will be looking forward to what Hillary has to say about this matter.
So far the Ukrainian military has been ineffective. If this offensive fails and the “separatists” remain in control of key areas of eastern Ukraine, a separate “republic” will be established and Russia will take control the way Turkey took part of Cyprus.
If I was in Ukraine, I might have some ability to sort out what side to be on. Since I’m not there, I don’t have a clue.
Anyone that thinks Russian operatives weren’t on the ground in the Ukraine, should rethink this issue. Okay, perhaps the West was hip deep in it. They wanted the Ukraine to align with the West economically, and Russian wanted it the other way around.
Did the E.U. line up troops on the Ukraine’s borders when the president favored Russia? Did the E.U. invade Russian space and annex it?
Did the E.U. demand the Ukraine split?
Sorry, I feel very little respect for Russia in all this.
Vlad can play innocent all he wants, and folks can damn the politics and protests all on the Ukraine and the West if they want. There is no equity here, when you get down to it.
Russia has been threatening military intervention. It already annexed Crimea. I’m not feeling all the love some folks are toward Russia.
Take the word “legitimate” out of your first premise (just to make it neutral on the question) and I’d say both are what is happening.
But no matter what there is a lesson to be learned here — participating in rebellions is dangerous activity.
If they treat Obama like this during all of these debacles,can u imagine what Putin will do if Hillary is elected?
> I will be looking forward to what Hillary has to say about this matter.<
But we already know what she has to say: “What difference, at this point, does it make!”
They've actually done about as well as can be expected. A significant number of Ukrainian military units had been suborned by Russia. Most of its personnel are conscripts. The equipment is decrepit. Looking back to the mission in Somalia, US specs ops personnel (Rangers, SEALS and Green Berets) lost 2 choppers and 19 men against a bunch of militia rabble, whereas the Ukrainians have lost men mainly to defections, despite (1) difficulties with Benedict Arnolds, (2) equipment issues, (3) training issues and (4) sheer lack of combat experience.
The Ukrainian’s I’ve been in touch with just want to be left alone. They don’t want us there. Neither do they want to live under Russian control. Ukrainians are a fatalistic bunch. Most Ukrainians are for Ukraine.
I think it's likely they'll annex, in some form, all of Eastern and Southern Ukraine to Odessa (Russian built that city from the first spade of dirt onward) and into Transwhatever.
They'd be crazy not to.
If they lost control of "regions" there's a lot more to it than sneaky Russians infiltrating into the Ukraine.
PERFECT criticism and thank you. I noticed AFTER I posted.
Okay, and what about all the Ukrainian families that have lived there for generations, and consider themselves loyal Ukrainians?
This sort of thing is best left as is. This comes up out of the blue and one side wants their views listened to. And then fifteen years later another side wants their listened to.
Leave things as they are.
Russia lived with this for several decades. They should have accepted it and moved on.
Russia started this, they wanted a civil war, and it looks like they may get it. Sad.
I think Russia formented this unrest and then capitalized on it. I’m no fan of Russia.
And I will say this although I may get slammed for it...for those people wishing for CWII in this country, take a look at this conflict. It ain’t the 1860’s anymore. A third party could well be invited (or uninvited) to this country to “help out”.
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