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Families of sailors who died in Navy collisions hope for answers in court
stripes.com ^ | 5/6/2018 | DIANNA CAHN

Posted on 05/07/2018 11:38:43 AM PDT by rktman

The fleet was undermanned and overworked; readiness was eroding because of a culture that demanded getting the job done no matter the obstacle.

(Excerpt) Read more at stripes.com ...


TOPICS: Government
KEYWORDS: collision; usnavy
Hmmm. Seems like we were always undermanned and overworked when I was in.
1 posted on 05/07/2018 11:38:43 AM PDT by rktman
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To: rktman

Undermanned and over-worked?!

Who knew the Navy was organized by the SEIU?


2 posted on 05/07/2018 11:44:06 AM PDT by PGR88
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To: rktman

Sadly, the answer is, “Someone or some people screwed up.”

I don’t think there is peace at the end of this rainbow.

Unless a murder is suspected, I don’t think most of these family inquiries help them gain peace of mind.

Try to think of your loved one’s service to the nation, dying in the execution of that service, and revere them for the good citizen they were.

It’s either that, or you’re going to successfully determine they died in vain and you’ll be miserable because of that the rest of your life.


3 posted on 05/07/2018 11:49:34 AM PDT by DoughtyOne (01/26/18 DJIA 30 stocks $26,616.71 48.794% > open 11/07/16 215.71 from 50% increase 1.2183 yrs..)
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To: PGR88

We were on port and stbd while deployed in VN. Firing GFS days and HI at night. Plus Unreps for ammo and oil. Over worked?


4 posted on 05/07/2018 11:51:47 AM PDT by Oldexpat
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To: Oldexpat
Rough sea high line details were awesome right? Especially when the tanker next to you loses steering.. It happened. Good times huh? Port/stbd watch and then your other duties when not on watch. 🇺🇸🙀
5 posted on 05/07/2018 11:56:29 AM PDT by rktman (Enlisted in the Navy in '67 to protect folks rights to strip my rights. WTH?)
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To: rktman
readiness was eroding because of a culture that demanded getting the job done no matter the obstacle.

Seems like that was our job description too in the 1970's. "Do more better with less".

6 posted on 05/07/2018 12:06:48 PM PDT by pfflier
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To: Oldexpat
So you only worked half days? Skate.

Really, Port & Stbd watches 7 days a week are not so bad. It's all the additional training, maintenance, repairs, drills, special evolutions, qualifications, inspections, collateral duties, meetings, chow reliefs and other crap that can easily add up to another 6+ hours a day. Something has to bend, and when your CO is more concerned about Equal Opportunity Training, Sexual Harassment, Gender Identity and other crap than your actual primary duty, it's combat readiness that suffers.

7 posted on 05/07/2018 12:30:25 PM PDT by ETCS
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To: rktman

The guidance systems were hacked. Probably North Korea or Russia. The U.S. gov’t knows and is not telling us. That’s my guess.


8 posted on 05/07/2018 12:32:57 PM PDT by CivilWarBrewing (Get off my back for my usage of CAPS, especially you snowflake males! MAN UP!)
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To: CivilWarBrewing

My guess too, nothing about this story has made sense.


9 posted on 05/07/2018 12:46:49 PM PDT by gibsonguy
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To: rktman
I'm an old Army guy and thus know absolutely nothing about the Navy.But I'm wondering if a collision like that *always* leads to disciplinary action...if not a court martial? Is there anything like an “innocent,unforeseeable accident” in the Navy?
10 posted on 05/07/2018 1:06:46 PM PDT by Gay State Conservative (You Say "White Privilege"...I Say "Protestant Work Ethic")
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To: Gay State Conservative

From what I gather these were avoidable but compounded mistakes built up. Then again, I wasn’t on board so...........


11 posted on 05/07/2018 1:54:27 PM PDT by rktman (Enlisted in the Navy in '67 to protect folks rights to strip my rights. WTH?)
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To: CivilWarBrewing

Guidance systems being hacked or not is irrelevant. The naval personnel should have been looking out the windows - the excuse that the guidance system caused it holds as much water as blaming the GPS system in your car as the cause of you driving into a wall or a lake.

Tell me again how you can hack someone’s eyeballs at sea?


12 posted on 05/07/2018 2:19:23 PM PDT by Spktyr (Overwhelmingly superior firepower and the willingness to use it is the only proven peace solution.)
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To: Spktyr

I agree with you that nothing beats good ol’fashioned eyes on watch, but I also don’t think we’re being told everything regarding a hacked navigational system.


13 posted on 05/07/2018 6:13:08 PM PDT by CivilWarBrewing (Get off my back for my usage of CAPS, especially you snowflake males! MAN UP!)
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To: CivilWarBrewing

Naval regs *require* specific members of bridge crews to keep looking around with their eyeballs no matter what the conditions. Period. Navigational systems are to be held secondary to personal observation. A hacked navigational system would be a reasonable suspect if the ship ran aground or into terrain - but that’s not what happened. They ran into a FREIGHTER in good visual conditions. That should never have happened even if the navigation system was completely turned off or showing a Pac-Man replay.

I know it’s hard to believe and you want to find other causes but our Navy really *is* that bad after 8 years of Obama.


14 posted on 05/07/2018 9:36:32 PM PDT by Spktyr (Overwhelmingly superior firepower and the willingness to use it is the only proven peace solution.)
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To: rktman

The collisions were likely due to insufficient training of the ships’ officers and crews.

Obama got rid of the Navy’s 2nd Fleet out of Virginia, about 2010-2012 (I think), which was previously used to train new officers and crews in the operation of their ships. As a result, the training regimen was reduced.

Just read an item here on FR on Sunday, 5/6/18, that said the 2nd Fleet was being re-activated and would serve in the North Atlantic arena.


15 posted on 05/07/2018 11:03:20 PM PDT by octex
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To: Spktyr

Exactly right! The folks on watch are supposed to be eyeballin’ and watching the radar as well.


16 posted on 05/07/2018 11:40:24 PM PDT by octex
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