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AU REVOIR, MARIANNE...AUF WIEDERSEHEN, LILI MARLEEN The End of America's European Romance
Frankfurter Allgemeine Zeitung | May 15, 2003 | Ralph Peters

Posted on 06/03/2003 2:31:12 PM PDT by Redleg Duke

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To: Redleg Duke
AU REVOIR, MARIANNE...AUF WIEDERSEHEN, LILI MARLEEN The End of America's European Romance

Good Post!

Insofar as the Title of your post,
I can only hope it will come to pass.....
(What the hell did those two ever do outside of starting two "world wars"?")

(Before any others may criticize with me, let me tell you this:
I have both French and German "blood in my veins" as well as Welsh, English, Scots, Italian, and a dab of Jewish.
I'm an American, By the Grace of God!
Not a Hyphenated-american)

41 posted on 06/03/2003 4:03:14 PM PDT by Fiddlstix (http://www.ourgangnet.net)
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To: Redleg Duke
Amazing article, Redleg Duke. Thanks for posting it!
42 posted on 06/03/2003 4:04:47 PM PDT by nutmeg (USA: Land of the Free - Thanks to the Brave)
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To: Redleg Duke
Thanks for finding this and posting it!
43 posted on 06/03/2003 4:05:47 PM PDT by Grampa Dave
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To: Fiddlstix
bump for later reading.
44 posted on 06/03/2003 4:11:40 PM PDT by The Iguana
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To: Redleg Duke
Gaul does not give orders to Rome.

Classic
45 posted on 06/03/2003 4:13:07 PM PDT by ffusco (Maecilius Fuscus, Governor of Longovicium , Manchester, England. 238-244 AD)
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To: Redleg Duke
"Robodan Mugabevich"

BRILLIANT
46 posted on 06/03/2003 4:15:13 PM PDT by adam_az
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To: Redleg Duke
The street may feel this way, but our government has another agenda. Agenda 21 globalism in which eventually you will not be able to travel nor buy or sell anything without permission. There will be no such thing as private ownership and no such thing as a non-government employee paid or not paid. Europe is galloping towards it now and so is D.C. as soon as they can figgure out how to void the constitution, either via the votes of third world hordes, or treaties, or the Supreme Court.

The government will kiss and make up with Germany and France, heck it already has. We have a much bigger threat than "old europe" and it is an unclean bird two party system with the same agenda, "sustainable development" collected in a city on the east coast called D.C.

47 posted on 06/03/2003 4:24:43 PM PDT by MissAmericanPie
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To: americanbychoice1
What happened, did you lose your password? :D

Nice hearing from you....thought you might have stopped by last month.

I'll be in the US in two weeks... researching where I will move.
48 posted on 06/03/2003 4:34:00 PM PDT by tictoc (On FreeRepublic, discussion is a contact sport.)
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To: MissAmericanPie
Piffle
49 posted on 06/03/2003 4:34:43 PM PDT by MEG33
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To: knews_hound
Bump to cut and paste for e-mails.

50 posted on 06/03/2003 4:40:06 PM PDT by jokar (There I said it)
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To: Redleg Duke
OMG!!!!

STUNNING ARTICLE!
51 posted on 06/03/2003 4:44:16 PM PDT by ConservativeConvert
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To: MEG33
How very liberal of you. No reason, no logic, no debate, no facts, just piffle. wbw
52 posted on 06/03/2003 4:45:45 PM PDT by MissAmericanPie
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To: Redleg Duke
Thanks for posting this! Can you provide a link to the original article?
53 posted on 06/03/2003 4:46:18 PM PDT by clintonh8r (You can have no better friend and no worse enemy than a US Marine.)
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To: MissAmericanPie
The government will do business with Germany and France, but that is very different from "kissing and making up." George Bush never forgets a slight. You have, no doubt, heard the relevant expression: "Beware the anger of a patient man."
54 posted on 06/03/2003 4:47:51 PM PDT by Capriole (Foi vainquera)
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To: Redleg Duke
Thank you for posting this!

Now I need to go find all I can about Ralph Peters. Despite his unfortunate voting record, something tells me I'll like the other stuff he's written, too!
55 posted on 06/03/2003 4:51:45 PM PDT by Fawnn (I think therefore I'm halfway there....)
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To: Redleg Duke
The French, They are a Funny Race!

The French, They are a Funny Race!

By Nicholas Stix

April 27, 2003
Toogood Reports

Immediately after the onset of the war on Iraq, our French "allies" decided — yet again — to punish us. Foreseeing the inevitable coalition victory, Pres. Jacques Chirac announced to the world, that the American and British "belligerents" had no right to administer postwar Iraq, or to profit from contracts rebuilding the country. According to Chirac, the French, on the other hand, who had for years illegally armed Saddam Hussein, and who had not sacrificed any blood or treasure to remove him from power, were uniquely deserving of such contracts.

The moment the war was won, the French attempted, with the help of the Russians, to blackmail America, by refusing to lift prewar U.N. sanctions on Iraqi trade — sanctions which they had fought, tooth and nail, while Saddam Hussein was in power. The U.S. needs the trade to generate money to help rebuild the country. The French are concerned solely with getting full value for their prewar investments in, and inflated arms loans to Iraq — and then some.

Beaten back by a hailstorm of ridicule from pundits such as Charles Krauthammer of the Washington Post and William Safire of the New York Times, and realizing that we would have either ignored them, or proposed the dissolution of the sanctions, and forced them to veto the proposal, on Tuesday the French backed down from their demand that U.N. sanctions remain in force. But they have not given up their plan to milk postwar Iraq. As William Safire observed on Thursday, the French, along with their new best friends, the Russians, want to keep Iraqi trade under U.N. control, since the corrupt U.N. regime has for years permitted them to get rich, while impoverishing the Iraqi people.

In response to the shameless preening and hypocrisy of the French, in recent months joke writers have not been able to keep up with the demand for French jokes. On the David Letterman Show, former Sen. Bob Dole, a World War II veteran, quipped regarding surrendering Iraqis, "There were so many hands in the air, I thought we were in France."

Unlike our Gallic former allies, Americans have shown a healthy historical sense, in recalling how the French killed the Nazis with kindness during World War II. But the history of French vanity is considerably older than that. Indeed, the myth that the French are suave, urbane, and diplomatic, has long been one of France's leading exports.

Those Suave, Clever ... Germans?

As historian Gordon Craig chronicled in his monumental work, Germany, 1866-1945, following Prussia's defeat of the Austro-Hungarian Empire, in the 1866 Seven Week War, France, which had remained neutral during the war, clumsily and belatedly demanded she be given Luxemburg and Belgium as war booty.

French foreign minister Drouyn de Lhuys was adamant in his demands, and felt honor-bound to pursue them. Meanwhile, the clever Prussian Minister-President Otto von Bismarck, suckered French Ambassador Benedetti into putting the French demands into writing, and later revealed them to the world, leaving the French humiliated and emptyhanded.

The French were again tripped up by their vanity, on the way to losing the 1870-71 war against Prussian-dominated, newly unified Germany.

In trench warfare in World War I, the French Army heroically fought the German Reichswehr to a bloody stalemate, but it took American "doughboys" to save the day.

The French promptly lost the peace. The insatiable French hunger for revenge and reparations, preordained the economic collapse of Germany's fledgling Weimar Republic, and prepared the ground for Hitler and national socialism.

While living in West Germany from 1980-85, I crisscrossed the continent. In East Germany and Hungary, I saw countless pre-war buildings that were pockmarked with gunfire. But not in Paris. The stunning, pre-war architecture was in such pristine condition, you wouldn't know that France had even fought a war. So much for the official story, according to which the French were all Resistance fighters.

At the University of Tuebingen, I had only one French classmate, a gregarious Parisian named Antoine. I once asked Antoine why French university students so rarely studied abroad. Came his self-assured response, "Because we know that we have the world's greatest university system."

A Zone Of Their Own

During and just after World War II, FDR and Truman let themselves get snowed by Charles de Gaulle, and the next thing you knew, the French had been transformed from patsies into "allies." When the real Allies carved up postwar Germany, along with American, British, and Russian zones, respectively, they even gave the French a zone of their own. But contrary to the French tradition, rather than milk our conquered enemies through "reparations," we rebuilt their countries.

In the early 1950s de Gaulle, who was then losing French Indochina (which in 1954 became Vietnam), managed to talk Ike into subsidizing one-third of the costs of the West's most inept military's fight against Ho Chi Minh, and into holding American foreign policy hostage to French colonialism. In 1966, de Gaulle showed his "gratitude" to his American patrons, by deciding to pull French forces out of NATO, just to spite the U.S. But de Gaulle insisted on France remaining a "member" of NATO, with a say in its structure, even though the organization's sole purpose was military defense. (Once the Soviet Union fell, and NATO became a dinosaur, France fully rejoined it.)

More recently, in the run-up to the war in Iraq, French Foreign Minister Dominique de Villepin sandbagged U.S. Secretary of State Colin Powell, by claiming for months to be negotiating in good faith, when in fact the French had planned all along to make fools of the U.S. Ultimately, it was the suave yet steely Colin Powell, who gave the French a lesson both in diplomacy and its limits.

A Mayonnaise Republic?

One wonders how, since Napoleon's 1821 death in exile on St. Helena, anyone could have taken the French seriously as a world power, outside of contests of cooking and baking prowess. (I am generally unimpressed with French wines, preferring those from Germany's Wuerttemberg region — where I lived — the best of which, unfortunately, are not exported.)

These days, two groups of Americans still speak fondly of the French. One is comprised of American socialists and communists, who have embraced the myth of European sophistication and principle (which merely masks cynicism, greed, and an envy which expresses itself as anti-Americanism), and who, in their contempt for George W. Bush, approvingly cite anyone who insults the President. The other group is composed of "paleoconservatives" and "paleolibertarians" — overlapping, allied schools of thought, each of whose distinctiveness is lost on neoconservatives — who are merely reacting to their neoconservative archenemies' French-bashing. ("My enemy's enemy is my friend.") If anything, the neocons would find the centuries-old French tradition of centralized government much more sympatico, than would paleos of any stripe.

And yet, when all is said and done, I refuse to give in to the temptation to hate the French. That would be so petty, so silly, so ... French. Granted, the French have afflicted the world with Robespierre, Sartre, Foucault, centralized government, and by setting the standard in European arrogance. And yet, I am grateful to them for Escoffier, Descartes, Montesquieu, croissants, and — as a Miller High Life ad once noted, sardonically ("Got to give it to you, Pierre") — mayonnaise. Above all, I remain grateful to them for Lafayette, and for the lady who, her torch held high, watches over New York Harbor.

Grateful from a safe distance, that is.

56 posted on 06/03/2003 5:03:29 PM PDT by mrustow (no tag)
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To: Redleg Duke
"...France and Germany seem to have failed to understand the character of Texans. They don't speak artfully, but they act resolutely. They aren't relativists."

What you talkin' bout, Ralph?
57 posted on 06/03/2003 5:05:20 PM PDT by SwinneySwitch (Freedom is not Free - Support the Troops!)
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To: Capriole
I tend to base things on evidence not folksy sayings to do with patient men. The only thing the politicans of both parties have been patient about is how to inflict globalism on a free society.

Given recent events and revelations it would appear that either their patience is wearing thin or they are feeling so good about their chances, given that a majority of citizens are happy to be led, view the luke warm battle between the political parties as they would a football game, given to hero worship and their team winning right or wrong, that they feel no need to hide the agenda any longer.
58 posted on 06/03/2003 5:09:31 PM PDT by MissAmericanPie
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To: Redleg Duke
The only criticism I make of this, and I don't disagree with a single word, is that it lumps all Germans as adopting Schroeder's view about America.

About 49% of those (according to the last national election) don't share his view.

I think that number might grow, and we if insist that all Germans must suffer the fate that Schroeder will earn, we might harm the very real and vital German conservative movement.

Germany can be saved. I don't have any real hope for France.

59 posted on 06/03/2003 5:14:52 PM PDT by Dog Gone
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To: tictoc
"We Americans are all Texans now. You have left us no choice..."

Great line. It would be well to remember, however, that we received a lot of cooperation from New Europe in our Iraq adventure. Geo-politically Europe will remain impotent until it substantially increases its defense spending. Economically, however, Europe remains important and we can't afford to write off the entire Continent.

A German-French-Russian condominium would represent a potent threat to our interests as Russia still possesses a formidable military industrial complex and we could be frozen out of helping to expolit Russia's energy assets. POTUS' recent offer to help build a pipeline from Russia that would supply US energy markets is a step in the right direction.

The US needs to treat France's dream of a "Fortress Europe" seriously and to steer Europe toward a more benign model.
60 posted on 06/03/2003 5:15:24 PM PDT by ggekko
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