Pope Francis Denies the Existence of Hell

Rorate Caeli | 03-29-2018

[ebb tide]

Christianity does not reject Catholic Sacred/Holy Tradition.

Bergoglio does:

6. The Church’s mandate to evangelize in relation to Judaism

40. It is easy to understand that the so–called ‘mission to the Jews’ is a very delicate and sensitive matter for Jews because, in their eyes, it involves the very existence of the Jewish people. This question also proves to be awkward for Christians, because for them the universal salvific significance of Jesus Christ and consequently the universal mission of the Church are of fundamental importance. The Church is therefore obliged to view evangelisation to Jews, who believe in the one God, in a different manner from that to people of other religions and world views. In concrete terms this means that the Catholic Church neither conducts nor supports any specific institutional mission work directed towards Jews.

From the traditional Mass of the Pre-Sanctified this past Good Friday, we prayed:

Let us pray also for the faithless Jews: that A lmighty God remove the veil from their hearts, so that they too might acknowledge Jesus Christ Our Lord.

Let us pray.

Almighty and eternal God, who does not exclude from Thy mercy even Jewish faithlessness: hear our prayers, which we offer for the blindness of that people; that acknowledging the light of Thy truth, which is Christ, they may be delivered from their darkness. Through the same Lord Jesus Christ, who lives and reigns with Thee in the unity of the Holy Ghost, God, world without end. Amen.

[af_vet_1981]

Have a care lest the vitriol heretofore reserved for Pope Francis spills over against the Jewish people as a traditional scapegoat. One sin is not equal with the other.

John Paul II was born Karol Wojtyla on May 18, 1920, in the Polish town of Wadowice, where he had Jewish friends and neighbors and was an eyewitness to the Holocaust. A few months before the war ended, Wojtyla rescued a starving 13-year-old Jewish girl at a train station by carrying her to the rail car in which he was traveling, feeding her and covering her with his coat. Later, he would affect even more Jewish lives.

Pope and Chief Rabbi
While Wojtyla was a bishop, he took part in the historic Second Vatican Council convened by Pope John XXIII, which modernized aspects of church practice and doctrine. The Council also radically changed the Church’s relationship with the Jewish people when it issued the Nostra Aetate declaration in 1965, which cleared Jews of responsibility for the death of Jesus, renounced its traditional claim that Jews had been rejected by God, condemned anti-Semitism, and called for “mutual understanding and respect” between Catholics and Jews. As Pope, John Paul II would turn these words into actions.

After his election as pope in October 1978, John Paul often devoted his energy to improving relations between Jews and Catholics. He frequently met with Jewish leaders, repeatedly condemned anti-Semitism, commemorated the Holocaust, and established diplomatic relations with Israel.

One of his first acts toward reconciliation occurred during his visit to Poland in 1979 when he knelt and prayed at Auschwitz. Seven years later, on April 13, 1986, he made an even more dramatic trip, this one just across the Tiber River, to Rome’s Great Synagogue, becoming the first pope to visit a Jewish house of worship. There he warmly embraced Rome’s chief rabbi, Elio Toaff, and described Jews as the “elder brothers” of Christians.

“In his speech, everyone felt his love, his affection,” Toaff recalled. “He made a tie between Judaism and Christianity and, in doing so, he found a way to move us all.’

On the 50th anniversary of the Warsaw Ghetto uprising, Pope John Paul II issued this appeal:

As Christians and Jews, following the example of the faith of Abraham, we are called to be a blessing to the world (cf. Gen. 12:2 ff.). This is the common task awaiting us. It is therefore necessary for us, Christians and Jews, to be first a blessing to one another (L'Osservatore Romano, August 17, 1993).

Pope John Paul II at Western Wall
In 1994, John Paul established full diplomatic ties between the Vatican and Israel. He said, “For the Jewish people who live in the State of Israel and who preserve in that land such precious testimonies to their history and their faith, we must ask for the desired security and the due tranquillity that are the prerogative of every nation . . .”

The Pope also was instrumental in the publication of “We Remember: A Reflection on the Shoah,” the 1998 document expressing the Church's “deep sorrow for the failures of her sons and daughters in every age.”

He visited Israel in 2000, publicly apologizing for the persecution of Jews by Catholics over the centuries, including the Holocaust, and depositing a note pleading for forgiveness in a crack in the Western Wall.

[ealgeone]

Mormons are Latter Day Saints, an offshoot of American Protestantism from the 19th Century.

Yet the Mormons, like Roman Catholicism, have elevated non-inspired texts to equal status of the inspired texts.

Christianity, and there is a difference, relies upon only the inspired texts.

Christianity is historic, 20 Centuries old and Catholic/Orthodox.

You partly have this correct.

Christianity is 20 centuries old....Roman Catholicism showed up somewhere in the 300s.

We do not see witness in the NT of what Rome claims. There is no worship of Mary, no purgatory, no requirement of clerical celibacy, no papacy or the elaborate leadership structure as seen in Rome, no Mass, no praying to the saints, no reliance upon a piece of cloth to keep you out of the hell-fires, etc.

Rome has departed from the truth.

[af_vet_1981]

Roman Catholicism showed up somewhere in the 300s.

False; the Apostle to the Gentiles wrote to the church in Rome in the First Century and it was part of the one holy catholic and apostolic Church.

Unlike a certain faith community that separated from Protestantism in the last one or two centuries.

[ealgeone]

I pray the Pater Noster. There’s six of them in the rosaries I pray. What’s your problem?

The overwhelming emphasis on prayer in the Rosary is to Mary which is not Scriptural. Prayer is to be directed to the Creator...not the created.

1, Make the sign of the Cross and say the Apostles Creed

2. Say the Our Father

3. Say THREE Hail Marys

4. Say the Glory be to the Father

5. Announce the First Mystery, then say the Our Father

6. Say TEN Hail Marys

7. Say the Glory be to the Father

8. Announce the Second Mystery, then say the Our Father. Repeat 6 and 7 and continue with the Third, Fourth and Fifth Mysteries.

Then after all of that, there is another prayer to Mary who is called the Holy Queen. http://www.rosary-center.org/howto.htm

This means there are at least 54 prayers to Mary compared to 7 "Our Fathers".

Are you wearing a Miraculous Medal and possibly the Green or Brown Scapular as you say these "prayers".

Are you a member of the Confraternity?

For Mary to be able to handle all of the prayer requests of the Roman Catholic she has to have the abilities approximating those of the Holy Spirit.

We know the Holy Spirit searches the heart of the believer and is praying for us in ways we cannot understand (Rms 8:26-27). No where in Scripture is this ability ever accorded to the created.

The Roman Catholic seems to be making the same claim for Mary...thus equating her with the Spirit.

Through the Hail Mary, the Scapular, the Medal, the Confraternity, the Roman Catholic is saying they're trusting in Mary more than the Father to help/save them.

What you've got here is a little truth mixed in with a whole bunch of false doctrine.

It's very similar to what Israel was doing when they incorporated Baal into their worship of God.

I ask you, ebbtide....would you place your faith in Christ and only Christ for your salvation as Paul wrote in Romans?

8But what does it say? “THE WORD IS NEAR YOU, IN YOUR MOUTH AND IN YOUR HEART”—that is, the word of faith which we are preaching,

9that if you confess with your mouth Jesus as Lord, and believe in your heart that God raised Him from the dead, you will be saved;

10for with the heart a person believes, resulting in righteousness, and with the mouth he confesses, resulting in salvation.

11For the Scripture says, “WHOEVER BELIEVES IN HIM WILL NOT BE DISAPPOINTED.” Romans 10:8-11 NASB

[ealgeone]

>>Roman Catholicism showed up somewhere in the 300s. <<

False; the Apostle to the Gentiles wrote to the church in Rome in the First Century and it was part of the one holy catholic and apostolic Church.

You cannot show the modern Roman Catholic church in the New Testament....hence it was a later development.

The Reformation was an attempt to correct the errors of Rome.

We're still trying after all of these years.

[ebb tide]

Did JP II ever say the Jews need not convert to attain salvation?

Do you agree with Bergoglio that Jews need not accept Jesus Christ to attain salvation?

What do you think St. Paul did during his time on earth since his conversion?

Do you agree with Bergoglio that atheists can go to Heaven?

[af_vet_1981]

ou cannot show the modern Roman Catholic church in the New Testament....hence it was a later development.

The Reformation was an attempt to correct the errors of Rome.

We're still trying after all of these years.

The New Testament contains a book from the Apostle to the Gentiles to the church at Rome in the First Century.

You cannot show any of your Reformation faith communities in the New Testament, which leaves them without legitimacy or provenance.

I agree that such are still trying after all these years to re-form, recreate, or reconstruct a religion. There are thousands of such attempts without revelation, without apostles.

[af_vet_1981]

You label the Apostle Paul “St. Paul,” Pope Francis “Bergoglio,” and Pope St. John Paul II “JP II.” This suggests to me either an ignorance of what St. Paul wrote or unwillingness to learn and live it.

[ealgeone]

The New Testament contains a book from the Apostle to the Gentiles to the church at Rome in the First Century.

You mean the one where Paul wrote about all have sinned...which would include Mary (Rms 3:23).

The one where he talks about salvation through faith in Christ (Rms 5) and through Christ alone and which is a free gift (Rms 3:24) by which is not dependent upon works? (Rms 3:27-28)

The one which teaches the Holy Spirit is always praying for us? Rms (8:26-7)

The one that Paul wrote to saying:

8But what does it say? “THE WORD IS NEAR YOU, IN YOUR MOUTH AND IN YOUR HEART”—that is, the word of faith which we are preaching,

9that if you confess with your mouth Jesus as Lord, and believe in your heart that God raised Him from the dead, you will be saved;

10for with the heart a person believes, resulting in righteousness, and with the mouth he confesses, resulting in salvation.

11For the Scripture says, “WHOEVER BELIEVES IN HIM WILL NOT BE DISAPPOINTED.”

What Paul does not say is very telling. Romans contradicts so much of Roman Catholic theology.

As I noted...the Roman Catholic church is not found in the New Testament.

[ebb tide]

This suggests to me either an ignorance of what St. Paul wrote or unwillingness to learn and live it.

It suggests no such thing.

[af_vet_1981]

To all that be in Rome, beloved of God, called to be saints: Grace to you and peace from God our Father, and the Lord Jesus Christ. First, I thank my God through Jesus Christ for you all, that your faith is spoken of throughout the whole world. For God is my witness, whom I serve with my spirit in the gospel of his Son, that without ceasing I make mention of you always in my prayers;

...

Salute one another with an holy kiss. The churches of Christ salute you. Now I beseech you, brethren, mark them which cause divisions and offences contrary to the doctrine which ye have learned; and avoid them. For they that are such serve not our Lord Jesus Christ, but their own belly; and by good words and fair speeches deceive the hearts of the simple. For your obedience is come abroad unto all men. I am glad therefore on your behalf: but yet I would have you wise unto that which is good, and simple concerning evil.

Romans, Catholic chapter one, Protestant verses seven to nine,
Romans, Catholic chapter sixteen, Protestant verses sixteen to nineteen,
as authorized, but not authored, by King James

[metmom]

Preach it, brother!

[metmom]

All the Catholic theology about Mary, save the virgin birth, is fabricated and not found in the NT.

Hence, Catholicism does NOT bear any resemblance to NT churches, which, BTW, for the most part met in homes.

[metmom]

The NT church in Rome to which Paul wrote does not by default equate to Roman Catholicism.

[ealgeone]

Yes....and?

[ealgeone]

The NT church in Rome to which Paul wrote does not by default equate to Roman Catholicism.

To allow that train of thought one would have to ignore the rest of the NT and then practice some serious eisegesis.

[metmom]

And that is exactly what we see has happened.