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Relics and Early Church Grit
Cream City Catholic ^ | 8/3/18

Posted on 09/15/2018 2:33:13 PM PDT by marshmallow

At the northern tip of Via Giulia in Rome, you’ll find the church of San Giovanni dei Fiorentini. The large dome that crowns this church is one of many that accent the Roman skyline.

If it’s hot, airy churches like San Giovanni provide the weary pilgrim with a spiritual and physical oasis. Most likely, you’ll be sweaty and your feet sore from treading the miles of cobblestone streets in the Eternal City. Walk up the worn marble steps of San Giovanni and enter. Head down the left aisle and, at the end, you’ll notice a striking silver reliquary in the shape of…a foot. Inside this reliquary is the foot of Saint Mary Magdalen. (This is Rome, folks, so get used to seeing bones encased in elaborate gold and silver surrounded by vigil candles and corpses under altars and many other things that will certainly strike some Americans as odd or macabre. The Church has been doing this for ages.)

Spend some time in prayer before the relic of this saint known first for her conversion and later, her unflagging loyalty to Christ when most of his closest friends bolted. Ensnared by sin, she was set free by the Lord, and never left Him again. During the crucifixion, perhaps some choice words were directed at her by people in the crowd. Maybe her past life was well-known. Regardless, she stayed at the foot of the cross. There’s an inscription near the relic stating that the feet of Mary Magdalen were the first to enter the tomb of Christ after the Resurrection. According to tradition, she later lived as a hermitess for the rest of her life, absorbed in prayer and love. She wasn’t a martyr, but she must have been one of the most fearless saints of......

(Excerpt) Read more at creamcitycatholic.com ...


TOPICS: Catholic; History
KEYWORDS: tickytackytrolling
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1 posted on 09/15/2018 2:33:13 PM PDT by marshmallow
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To: marshmallow

“Spend some time in prayer before the relic of this saint”

“Little children, keep yourselves from idols.”

- Apostle John


2 posted on 09/15/2018 4:37:50 PM PDT by aMorePerfectUnion
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To: aMorePerfectUnion

No thanks, concern troll.


3 posted on 09/15/2018 4:47:11 PM PDT by Jacquerie (ArticleVBlog.com)
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To: marshmallow

Thank-you for this article.


4 posted on 09/15/2018 5:07:44 PM PDT by Biggirl ("One Lord, one faith, one baptism" - Ephesians 4:5)
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To: Jacquerie

I’m surprised you are so hostile to the words of the Apostle Jesus loved.

To each their own.


5 posted on 09/15/2018 5:46:23 PM PDT by aMorePerfectUnion
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To: marshmallow

How beautiful are the feet of them that preach the Gospel of Peace.

The Early Church and the Catholic Church are one and the same.

It is a family of love.


6 posted on 09/15/2018 5:50:50 PM PDT by blackpacific
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To: blackpacific
The Early Church and the Catholic Church are one and the same.

My understanding of the practices and teachings of the Roman Catholic church through history tells me that it has little resemblance to the early church. The genesis of the church is 120 disciples in the upper room endued with Holy Spirit power on Pentecost. At that time, there were no cathedrals or church buildings, no vestments, no rosaries, no relics, no altars, no holy water, no ash Wednesday, no Sacraments except for Baptism, Communion and Marriage, no preaching of Mary as a co-redemtrix, etc., etc., etc.

The rituals and doctrines embraced by today's Roman Catholic church are a result of changes and teaching that were added by councils and evolving tradition over many centuries.

7 posted on 09/15/2018 7:17:54 PM PDT by JesusIsLord
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To: JesusIsLord

The cathedrals are built around the Eucharist, which was given to us by Jesus Christ from the beginning. It is His Words, it is His Flesh, It is His Blood, It is the same now as it was instituted by Jesus Christ 2000 years ago.

Did you read in the article about the Church of the Three Fountains? St. Paul was beheaded so violently at his execution that his head went flying, bouncing with three large bounces across the ground. Every place his beloved head touched the ground , water sprang up. A church was built over the three springs. Should those early christians have not built a church over the three miraculous springs of water in St. Paul’s honor? What is wrong with honoring his memory, the Apostle who suffered so much for Jesus Christ and who labored so fearlessly for the spread of the Gospel?

How many cathedrals have you visited? Do you know what motivated the Christians who built them, the individual charisms of each monument? While they are ALL centered around the Eucharist, Jesus Christ living among us all days even to the consumation of the world, each has its own history to share with us. Would you rather the cathedrals be knocked down?

Notre Dame in Paris houses the Crown of Thorns and one of the Nails of the Crucifixion, Chartres houses the veil Mary wore at the Annunciation when God the Word became Flesh. Should we burn the veil like the satanic Freemasons did during the Reign of Terror? The cathedral in Valencia houses the Holy Grail, on display for over 800 years, yet modern man considers it lost due to his spiritual blindness. At the other end of the Camino is the Cathedral at Santiago, which houses the relics of St. James the Apostle. In fact, any place one of the 12 Apostles is buried, pretty much every one of them, is a Catholic cathedral. St. Peter is in Rome, St. James in Santiago de Compostela, St. Mark in Venice, St. Thomas somewhere in India, maybe as a homework assignment you can research where the remaining Apostles are buried? But that should be no surprise to one well versed in the Book of Revelation (Rev 21:14).

No, the Faith that I have today is no different than that of Mary Magdelan or of St. Paul or of St. Peter or of St. Agnes and the Church that I am a member of is not different than the one that Jesus Christ established for us. It is as plain as day for those who have eyes to see.

However, without the supernatural gift of Faith, none of this is certain.


8 posted on 09/15/2018 11:13:35 PM PDT by blackpacific
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To: blackpacific
the Church that I am a member of is not different than the one that Jesus Christ established for us.

This depends on what you mean by 'Church'. If by Church you mean all those who've placed their faith in Jesus Christ for the remission of sin, then I would agree with you. On the other hand, if by 'Church' you mean the doctrines, rituals and practices of today's Roman Catholic church, I would say you are being intellectually dishonest.

9 posted on 09/16/2018 5:40:22 AM PDT by JesusIsLord
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To: blackpacific

“Did you read in the article about the Church of the Three Fountains? St. Paul was beheaded so violently at his execution that his head went flying, bouncing with three large bounces across the ground. Every place his beloved head touched the ground , water sprang up. A church was built over the three springs. Should those early christians have not built a church over the three miraculous springs of water in St. Paul’s honor? ”

No! Never!! The honor of all things is God’s alone.

It is paganism from the Greeks that built temples to gods. Rome incorporated that pagan practice to placate heathen.

And every religion has these false stories the gullible believe.


10 posted on 09/16/2018 11:13:53 AM PDT by aMorePerfectUnion
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To: JesusIsLord

If you can distinguish between Sacrament and sacramental, there is no difference between Catholic Faith across the centuries.

The Sacraments are the same, the Sacred Deposit of Faith is the same, the Grace is the same, the Eucharistic Lord is the same.


11 posted on 09/16/2018 11:24:26 AM PDT by blackpacific
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To: aMorePerfectUnion
It is paganism from the Greeks that built temples to gods.

St. Paul is not a "god".

In my town there is a Baptist church called Judson Baptist. It was named, apparently, after the preacher who founded the place. How is it that Catholics erect a church in memory of a great preacher and teacher, and that's "paganism from the Greeks," but Baptists do the same thing and you have no quarrel with it?

12 posted on 09/16/2018 1:42:29 PM PDT by Campion ((marine dad))
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To: aMorePerfectUnion
The honor of all things is God’s alone.

That would be the same God who commanded "Honor thy father and thy mother"?

13 posted on 09/16/2018 1:43:33 PM PDT by Campion ((marine dad))
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To: Campion

“How is it that Catholics erect a church in memory of a great preacher and teacher, and that’s “paganism from the Greeks,” but Baptists do the same thing and you have no quarrel with it? ”

You are making an assumption that isn’t true.

Nor do Baptist believers bow down to nor pray to Hudson.


14 posted on 09/16/2018 2:10:06 PM PDT by aMorePerfectUnion
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To: Campion

“That would be the same God who commanded “Honor thy father and thy mother”?

Once a group bows the knee to the golden calf - or indeed, even the golden serpent - they will seek to justify idolatry with word games and in every way, rather than obey God.


15 posted on 09/16/2018 2:14:06 PM PDT by aMorePerfectUnion
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To: Campion
That would be the same God who commanded "Honor thy father and thy mother"?

Sincerely, what are you trying to say here? Could you expound a bit?

16 posted on 09/16/2018 2:25:48 PM PDT by JesusIsLord
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To: aMorePerfectUnion

latria yes, dulia no.


17 posted on 09/16/2018 9:03:21 PM PDT by blackpacific
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To: JesusIsLord

“The rituals and doctrines embraced by today’s Roman Catholic church are a result of changes and teaching that were added by councils and evolving tradition over many centuries.”

Here are examples for your comment...

1 . Prayers for the dead . …………-—————————……300 A.D.
2. Making the sign of the cross ………………………… …300 A.D.
3. Veneration of angels & dead saints …………-————…….375 A.D.
4. Use of images in worship………………………………… . 375 A.D.
5. The Mass as a daily celebration……………………………… 394 A.D.
6 Beginning of the exaltation of Mary; the term, “Mother of God” applied a Council of Ephesus……………. .-———————————————————— 431 A.D.
7 Extreme Unction (Last Rites)……………………………… ..526 A.D.
8. Doctrine of Purgatory-Gregory 1…………………………… .593 A.D..
9. Prayers to Mary & dead saints ……………………………… .600 A.D.
10. Worship of cross, images & relics ……………………… … 786 A.D.
11 Canonization of dead saints ………………………………… ..995 A.D.
12. Celibacy of priesthood …………………………………… …1079 A.D.
13. The Rosary ……………………………………………… … 1090 A.D.
14. Indulgences ……………………………………………… …..1190 A.D.
15. Transubstantiation-Innocent III …………………………… 1215 A.D.
16. Auricular Confession of sins to a priest …………………… 1215 A.D.
17. Adoration of the wafer (Host)…………………………… .. 1220 A.D.
18. Cup forbidden to the people at communion …………………..1414 A.D.
19. Purgatory proclaimed as a dogma……………………………..1439 A.D.
20. The doctrine of the Seven Sacraments confirmed …………….1439 A.D.
21 Tradition declared of equal authority with Bible by Council of Trent…………………………………………————————… 1545 A.D.
22. Apocryphal books added to Bible ………——————……….1546 A.D.
23. Immaculate Conception of Mary……………………………….1854 A.D.
24, Infallibility of the pope in matters of faith and morals, proclaimed by the Vatican Council ……………… 1870 A.D.
25. Assumption of the Virgin Mary (bodily ascension into heaven shortly after her death) ……………………………-—————————————————……1950 A.D.
26. Mary proclaimed Mother of the Church……………………… 1965 A.D.


18 posted on 09/16/2018 9:05:59 PM PDT by mrobisr
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To: blackpacific; aMorePerfectUnion

“latria yes, dulia no.”
So tell me the difference.
rcc’s pray to Mary and their god
rcc’s bow to Mary and their god
rcc’s kneel to Mary and their god
rcc’s offer sacrifice to Mary and their god
rcc’s serve Mary and their god
rcc’s get grace from Mary and from their god

So through all your word games there isn’t one bit of difference between your latria and dulia worship.


19 posted on 09/16/2018 9:30:35 PM PDT by mrobisr
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To: blackpacific
The word that curses you rcc's every time is the word serve, but you ignore that command and play the word games of worship. Greek doulia; Latin servitus, a theological term signifying the honour paid to the saints, while latria means worship given to God alone, and hyperdulia the veneration offered to the Blessed Virgin Mary. St. Augustine (City of God X.2) distinguishes two kinds of servitus: "one which is due to men . . . which in Greek is called dulia; the other, latria, which is the service pertaining to the worship of God". http://www.newadvent.org/cathen/05188b.htm “Greek doulia; Latin servitus, a theological term signifying the honour paid to the saints,” As noted by the definition below Greek-doulia/Latin-servitude is NOT honor paid, but servitude to the point of bondage and slavery. If you are a slave or in bondage or in Mary’s case hyper bondage then that is your master for a person can't have to masters. Matthew 6:24 Douay-Rheims 1899 American Edition 24 No man can serve two masters. For either he will hate the one, and love the other: or he will sustain the one, and despise the other. You cannot serve God and mammon. While this verse is referring specifically to money to understand the big picture of the verse is to understand that it is saying that you can't serve to masters in anything. Holy Scripture tells us that our ONLY bondage should be in God through Christ Jesus all other bondage leads to death. You shall serve the Lord your God ONLY and no other! Romans 6:16 Douay-Rheims 1899 American Edition 16 Know you not, that to whom you yield yourselves servants to obey, his servants you are whom you obey, whether it be of sin unto death, or of obedience unto justice. 1397. Douleia douleia: slavery Original Word: δουλεία, ας, ἡ Part of Speech: Noun, Feminine Transliteration: douleia Phonetic Spelling: (doo-li'-ah) Short Definition: slavery, bondage Definition: slavery, bondage. https://en.m.wiktionary.org/wiki/servitus Etymology Edit From servus +‎ -tūs. Pronunciation Edit (Classical) IPA(key): /ˈser.wi.tuːs/, [ˈsɛr.wɪ.tuːs] Noun Edit servitūs f (genitive servitūtis); third declension slavery, servitude 405 CE, Jerome, Vulgate Exodus.20.2 Ego sum Dominus Deus tuus, qui eduxi te de terra Aegypti, de domo servitutis. Exodus 20:2 I am the LORD thy God, which have brought thee out of the land of Egypt, out of the house of bondage. Exodus 23:25 Douay-Rheims 1899 American Edition 25 And you shall serve the Lord your God, that I may bless your bread and your waters, and may take away sickness from the midst of thee. Deuteronomy 6:13 Douay-Rheims 1899 American Edition 13 Take heed diligently lest thou forget the Lord, who brought thee out of the land of Egypt, out of the house of bondage. Thou shalt fear the Lord Deuteronomy 10:20 Douay-Rheims 1899 American Edition 20 Thou shalt fear the Lord thy God, and serve him only: to him thou shalt adhere, and shalt swear by his name. Joshua 23:7 Douay-Rheims 1899 American Edition 7 Lest after that you are come in among the Gentiles, who will remain among you, you should swear by the name of their gods, and serve them, and adore them: 1 Samuel 7:3 Douay-Rheims 1899 American Edition 3 And Samuel spoke to all the house of Israel, saying: If you turn to the Lord with all your heart, put away the strange gods from among you, Baalim and Astaroth: and prepare your hearts unto the Lord, and serve him only, and he will deliver you out of the hand of the Philistines. Matthew 4:10 Douay-Rheims 1899 American Edition 10 Then Jesus saith to him: Begone, Satan: for it is written, The Lord thy God shalt thou adore, and him only shalt thou serve. Luke 4:8 Douay-Rheims 1899 American Edition 8 And Jesus answering said to him: It is written: Thou shalt adore the Lord thy God, and him only shalt thou serve. 2 Kings 17:10-12 10 And they made them statues and groves on every high hill, and under every shady tree: 11 And they burnt incense there upon altars after the manner of the nations which the Lord had removed from their face: and they did wicked things, provoking the Lord. 12 And they ***worshipped*** abominations, concerning which the Lord had commanded them that they should not do this thing. ***also means to serve, bondage, and slavery, so IAW DR bible to serve is to worship per translation. This is the exact definition of dulia and hyperdulia*** 2 Kings 17:35 With whom he made a covenant, and charged them, saying: You shall not fear strange gods, nor shall you ***adore*** them, nor worship them, nor sacrifice to them. ***bow down*** Worship=service 2 Kings 17:36 But the Lord your God, who brought you out of the land of Egypt with great power, and a stretched out arm, him shall you fear, and him shall you adore, and to him shall you sacrifice. You notice that DR bible uses adore for both v.35-36. You shall not adore any other (to include the Roman goddess mary) except the Lord. 2 Kings 17:40-41 Douay-Rheims 1899 American Edition 40 But they did not hearken, but did according to their old custom. 41 So these nations feared the Lord, but nevertheless served also their idols: their children also and grandchildren, as their fathers did, so do they unto this day. Zephaniah 1:5 Douay-Rheims 1899 American Edition 5 And them that worship the host of heaven upon the tops of houses, and them that adore, and swear by the Lord, and swear by Melchom. Galatians 4:21-31 Douay-Rheims 1899 American Edition 21 Tell me, you that desire to be under the law, have you not read the law? 22 For it is written that Abraham had two sons: the one by a bondwoman, and the other by a free woman. 23 But he who was of the bondwoman, was born according to the flesh: but he of the free woman, was by promise. 24 Which things are said by an allegory. For these are the two testaments. The one from mount Sina, engendering unto bondage; which is Agar: 25 For Sina is a mountain in Arabia, which hath affinity to that Jerusalem which now is, and is in bondage with her children. 26 But that Jerusalem, which is above, is free: which is our mother. 27 For it is written: Rejoice, thou barren, that bearest not: break forth and cry, thou that travailest not: for many are the children of the desolate, more than of her that hath a husband. 28 Now we, brethren, as Isaac was, are the children of promise. 29 But as then he, that was born according to the flesh, persecuted him that was after the spirit; so also it is now. 30 But what saith the scripture? Cast out the bondwoman and her son; for the son of the bondwoman shall not be heir with the son of the free woman. 31 So then, brethren, we are not the children of the bondwoman, but of the free: by the freedom wherewith Christ has made us free. Jesus Christ brought us out of slavery according to the promise. To live in slavery to creatures is bondage and all those in bondage will be cast into the lake of fire.
20 posted on 09/16/2018 9:32:43 PM PDT by mrobisr
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