Posted on 09/27/2018 10:45:52 AM PDT by SeekAndFind
Christians should not support the weddings of Christian couples who fornicate and believe it is permissible even though the Bible calls fornication sin, John Piper has suggested.
Responding to a question on whether a Christian should attend the wedding of a couple already living together, Piper, founder of desiringGod.org and chancellor of Bethlehem College & Seminary in Minnesota, gave a nuanced response addressing various relationship situations but drew a line in the sand for professing Christians who see fornication as permissible in committed relationships.
"If they are moving away from fornication because they are now persuaded it is sin, and they are marrying as a declaration of repentance and faith in Christ and a commitment to righteousness, then they are right with God. We should join them in the penitent and happy celebration," Piper said.
"But it is possible that they are not at all persuaded that having sex together as an engaged couple is sin. Maybe they would do it all over again in the same way. Many in our day, tragically, are deluded about this because of how superficially they submit to Scripture. They don't submit themselves to God's authority in Scripture. They just do what they feel like doing, and assume God is okay with it — like sleeping together before they're married because they think they're committed to each other," Piper explained before drawing on Scripture.
"It is clear from Scripture that not only is adultery — sexual unfaithfulness in marriage — sin, but sexual relations before marriage is sin as well. That's clear. The very term sexual immorality as it's used in these verses makes it clear: Matthew 15:19; Hebrews 13:4; Ephesians 5:5; 1 Corinthians 5:11; 1 Corinthians 6:9; 7:1–2. All refer to fornication, or sexual relations before marriage," he said.
A Bible-believing Christian couple that believes fornication is permissible should be "disciplined" said Piper.
"If the couple that we're talking about here, whose wedding you're going to attend, has only stopped doing the act of fornication, but has not stopped believing that fornication is right, then they probably (if they belong to a Bible-believing church) are in a position where they should be disciplined — because we don't just discipline people for unrepentant actions of sinning, but also for unrepentant belief that sin is right or permissible," he noted.
"If they are professing Christians getting married, that makes the relationship all the more difficult and complicated since the Bible says we are to disassociate from brothers, professing brothers, who live in this kind of sin (1 Corinthians 5:11). But if they are not professing Christians, there may be numerous ways in which we can extend the grace of God toward them in the hope of conversion," Piper further added.
Piper cited 1 Corinthians 6:9 as evidence that patterns of behavior like fornication destroys the soul, which "is like murder — murder in our heart."
"'Those who do such things will not enter the kingdom of heaven,' Paul says (1 Corinthians 6:9). He's talking about fornication, not just homosexuality. What complicates the question being asked, then, is that if the couple approves of fornication — they don't think it's wrong for an engaged couple to have sex — and they are professing Christians, then the Bible says, 'Now I am writing to you not to associate with anyone who bears the name of brother if he is guilty of sexual immorality . . . not even to eat with such a one' (1 Corinthians 5:11)," he explained.
We do not know how God is going to work in the couple’s life beyond the wedding. That’s between them and God. Especially considering how many seemingly perfect Christian marriages tall apart.
And I am weirded out by Piper’s fixation on these matters. He always manages to strike an off chord with me.
John Piper is also a neverTrumper.
Fall apart*
Guess me and hubby iof 18 years should have just gone to Vegas instead of our wedding.
I am not supporting pre-marital sex, but this statement is incorrect. The Greek word is 'porneia' where the word 'pornography' comes from. It covers a range of sin, including fornication, but the far more common use was homosexuality and bestiality.
RE: John Piper is also a neverTrumper.
Actually no. John Piper DOES NOT SUPPORT Trump when he believes he is doing something morally wrong. That’s all.
How do I know? I heard him say so.
I think I would rather show up to a wedding in support of a marriage rather than essentially boycott a marriage because I’m judging them, where it’s not my place to judge. We are all sinners.
Man does not dictate my relationship with God. I am a Christian. God gave me free will and I use it. My relationship with HIM is personal and I do not need nor will I allow someone else to dictate my behavior. The 10 Commandments has been part of my life as long as I can remember and they will guide me through the rest of my life.
God loved David and he had hundreds of concubines...
Good Luck waiting for those perfect people.
How would you even find that out about a person?
Would a wedding RSVP come attached to a 10 part questionnaire that must be submitted for review?
Sin is between God and sinner. I am not the arbiter of anyone’s soul. I think attending the wedding would be a celebration of people who have decided to stop committing that particular sin.
It’s people like this that make it hard to be a conservative.
How about we let GOD judge it in the end? I’d bet this guy has a store supply level of Vaseline in his bathroom.
“Judgement is Pipers”
Said God, never.
“Piper’s fixation on these matters”
Nothing weird about it. He was asked a question on this matter.
“John Piper is also a neverTrumper.”
Lots and lots of those coming out lately. The rage and anger from these so-called “preachers” against Trump is insane.
Great way to bring families apart...
“How about we let GOD judge it in the end?”
Silly response. You’re confusing stating an opinion based on scripture with “passing judgement”.
Nowhere did Piper say these folks are “gonna burn in hell!”.
I’ve heard Piper speak many times of the years; your portrayal of him is inaccurate. He understands sin & the sinner, and the gift of Grace.
shucks. of=over
So, the only forgiveness should come from Christ Himself, but not from fellow Christians? We are all sinners, it’s just a matter of which sins we commit.
“A Bible-believing Christian couple that believes fornication is permissible should be “disciplined” said Piper.”
Sounds like he thinks they need a spanking. Weirdo...
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